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Guess you missed the memo. Batman already said no, he's going to Cincinatti to clena up the mean streets surrounding Paul Brown stadium.  Seriously, ever heard the saying "don't shoot the messenger"?
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Why is Lerner talking to HC. prospects before he hires a GM .. Going to hire a Coach and then the GM ????
I think Lerner is taking the approach that he needs to start working on finding a HC before the best ones all get scooped up. We are all talking and acting like Pioli is a given. While he may become our GM there is still the chance that he may not. At that point we would be well behind the 8 ball in the HC search if Lerner waits. And there is no reason why we cannot bring Mangini back in for a 2nd interview.
As for Gm, I would love to hire Pioli or Casserly. I would say no to Floyd Reese. Reese put the Titans in salary cap hell before he lost the poer struggle with Fisher.
Regarding HC, I am OK with Mangini but just don't feel the love for him. I would prefer McDanials, Schwartz or Spags (or Munchak - though he is a deep deep sleeper candidate). I do not have a prob with a 1st timer for HC but you need quality coordinators. Marinelli for DC anybody?
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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Just a general reply to those who mentioned Parcells as a possible President ....
Umm .. we have a Team President. His name is Michael Keenan. He was promoted this year. (In May) By all accounts, he is very good on the business side of things .... which is what a Team President handles in this particular team setup.
He handles the cap .... and contract negotiations and finalization ..... team financial matters ..... and such.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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All Pro
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Wouldn't it be sweet if Pioli came here and brought in his father in-law to be the HEAD COACH. This team would get turned around in no time at all. I highly doubt that would happen but if by some miracle it does I hope we can hire a young up and coming coach to be the hier apparent.
Ahh I did not read all the posts all the way thru. ( my bad)
I did not see anyone calling for Parcells to be the president.
I thought Obama already won that job. 
Einstein could not even fathom the mathematical improbabilities of the Browns woes.
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Just a general reply to those who mentioned Parcells as a possible President ....
Umm .. we have a Team President. His name is Michael Keenan. He was promoted this year. (In May) By all accounts, he is very good on the business side of things .... which is what a Team President handles in this particular team setup.
He handles the cap .... and contract negotiations and finalization ..... team financial matters ..... and such.
There is a team president, then a president of football operations.
Usually that can also be given to the GM. Sometimes it isn't given to the GM.
you had a good run Hank.
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At this point, I'd call B.E. just as much of a bust as Stallworth. One good season, especially when it wasn't even the current one, isn't worth squat to me.
Stallworth has trouble staying healthy, but B.E. is barely better than Quincy Morgan at holding onto the damned ball.... at least (when he gets on the field) Stallworth can do what the heck it is that a WR is supposed to do.
Bah, it doesn't matter.... I'm firmly of the belief that Lerner will find a way to completely screw this whole thing up. Hell, it already seems like we're repeating the last time around.
I have completely lost all faith in this organization and I do not think we stand a chance in hell of ever being more than the Bengals\Lions\Chiefs\<insert perennial loser here>.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Wow , I thought I was down on the team ! 
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Bah, it doesn't matter.... I'm firmly of the belief that Lerner will find a way to completely screw this whole thing up. Hell, it already seems like we're repeating the last time around.
I have completely lost all faith in this organization and I do not think we stand a chance in hell of ever being more than the Bengals\Lions\Chiefs\<insert perennial loser here>.
What has he done that he did last time?
I think Lerner is making all the right moves right now.
you had a good run Hank.
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I wonder if anyone is interested in Phil Savage?
not me.
"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
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Bah, it doesn't matter.... I'm firmly of the belief that Lerner will find a way to completely screw this whole thing up. Hell, it already seems like we're repeating the last time around.
I have completely lost all faith in this organization and I do not think we stand a chance in hell of ever being more than the Bengals\Lions\Chiefs\<insert perennial loser here>.
You know what? I'm starting to get this very same sinking feeling.
He should have never let Cowher rebuff him. He should have done whatever it took to get Cowher to sign. Whatever it took. He gave up too easily.
We need proven winners here or at the very least some experience with some success.
Yet we'll probably have a rookie GM, rookie HC, rookie OC, and rookie DC all over again. 
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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What has he done that he did last time?
Interviewing HC candidates before he has a GM comes screaming to mind.
I have maintained and believe whole heatedly that the Opie/RAC FO never had a chance, because RAC was basically the guy before Opie ever came on board. You must have a GM/HC combo that shares the same philosophies and thus vision for the teams future. More than anything that has come out in the past few weeks, the most obvious thing to me is that Phil and Romeo just didn't agree about schemes, philosophies, etc.
Everybody can blame either side if they want (and to some extent they should be blamed for not finding some middle ground), but the truth is Lerner and Collins should have let Savage bring in his own guy who he knew he could work with.
So to repeat what Purp said.............yeah it's sad to see Lerner making the same dumb decision he made last time, and it is disheartening.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Quote:
Bah, it doesn't matter.... I'm firmly of the belief that Lerner will find a way to completely screw this whole thing up. Hell, it already seems like we're repeating the last time around.
I have completely lost all faith in this organization and I do not think we stand a chance in hell of ever being more than the Bengals\Lions\Chiefs\<insert perennial loser here>.
What has he done that he did last time?
I think Lerner is making all the right moves right now.
Hmmm... pursuing hotshot personnel guy while interviewing coaches on his own sure sounds an awful lot like the last time to me.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Bah, it doesn't matter.... I'm firmly of the belief that Lerner will find a way to completely screw this whole thing up. Hell, it already seems like we're repeating the last time around.
I have completely lost all faith in this organization and I do not think we stand a chance in hell of ever being more than the Bengals\Lions\Chiefs\<insert perennial loser here>.
So does that mean you see the Pioli/McDaniels the same way I do? History repeating itself?
Sure looks that way to me if that's how things pan out.
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
Bah, it doesn't matter.... I'm firmly of the belief that Lerner will find a way to completely screw this whole thing up. Hell, it already seems like we're repeating the last time around.
I have completely lost all faith in this organization and I do not think we stand a chance in hell of ever being more than the Bengals\Lions\Chiefs\<insert perennial loser here>.
You know what? I'm starting to get this very same sinking feeling.
He should have never let Cowher rebuff him. He should have done whatever it took to get Cowher to sign. Whatever it took. He gave up too easily.
We need proven winners here or at the very least some experience with some success.
Yet we'll probably have a rookie GM, rookie HC, rookie OC, and rookie DC all over again.
Riz...your kidding, right?
If Cowher says no to Lerner, which is obvious he did, what do you want Randy Lerner to do, pull a gun and insist that Cowher sign on the dotted line?
I can hear the rumors now, claiming Lerner didn't do enough to bring Cowher to Cleveland.
My opinion is Cowher is testing the waters to see what his market value may be at this time. How serious Cowher is taking all this attention is anyone's guess.
Cowher does have a manager, right?...I'm sure he does...It could be that his manager is testing the waters with dollar signs in his eyes.
Getting back to the possibility of Cowher coming to Cleveland...until he is hired by someone else or flat out says no, he is not interested in coaching in 2009, there is nothing that says Randy Lerner and Cowher can't revisit the issue.
Browns fans need to be patient...these things take time. 
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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I don't know that is a troubling thing.
You can hire a strong HC who has the power, so in that case, that is the only way Lerner can go.
Once you hire a GM with various stipulations in the contract, you eliminate some of the coaching candidates that might be available.
I view it as just covering the bases at this point.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Hmmm... pursuing hotshot personnel guy while interviewing coaches on his own sure sounds an awful lot like the last time to me.
The ONLY way this makes sense to me is if he and Pioli already have a backroom deal in place and Lerner already knows who he wants surrounding him.
Otherwise? I'm with ya!
like it or not!
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Could it be he already knows who the new GM would want as HC? This whole McDaniels thing just stinks to high heavens!
Rookie GM and HC? They'd have to PROVE success before I'd endorse that! You think Randy isn't thinking about that too? And Pioli?
We'll see............
B-I-N-G-O...And Bingo is his na-mo...Or is it name-o???...hehehe...
"Bingo" from the top of the key...BIN---GO!!!!....Gotta be a Cavs fan...lol...
Lerner talking to Mangini tells me one thing...And it's a damn near GUARANTEE...
He's spoken to and has a meeting set up with Pioli...If anyone thinks the Mangini conversation didn't happen you're nutz...Lerner ALREADY KNOWS Pioli has NO PROBLEM with Mangini...
U guys must think Lerner's DUMB...Not u Pit...Others...
Go Browns!!!
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... U guys must think Lerner's DUMB. .. ... Yep ! 
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DnD,
I think he was dumb enough to hire a HC before a GM last time. So why is it such a stretch to believe that is happening (or could be happening) again??
I hold out hope that your right, and the deal is already in place with Pioli, but I just don't have much faith left in his ability to do this thing right...............I hope he proves me wrong.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Interviewing HC candidates before he has a GM comes screaming to mind.
Two things...
Pioli's ALREADY HERE...
Pioli's ALREADY HERE...
Do u honestly think Lerner who is a GREAT Stay outta the way owner is going to hire a HC by himself???...I didn't think so...U way 2 smartola to fall for that BS...
Pioli's a BROWN folks...Mark It... 
Go Browns!!!
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U guys must think Lerner's DUMB...Not u Pit...Others...
Thanks for the caveat Bud!
But if this isn't how things are going down? I'll begin to wonder myself.............
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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I say again bro, I hope your right, but if you show me the ability to do a dumb thing once then I'm not nearly as shocked when you do it the 2nd time..lol.
We've seen Lerner do this before with the RAC/Opie thing, and I am hoping history isn't repeating itself.
Again, I hope your right bro.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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DnD,
I think he was dumb enough to hire a HC before a GM last time. So why is it such a stretch to believe that is happening (or could be happening) again??
Read that again BigW...And again...
Lerner was as INEXPERIENCED as Crennel and Savage were in the positions they took...
Mark it baby...The dude's not a BILLIONAIRE cause he's dumb...
I'd bet my last buck he's got the blessing of Pioli...And I'd also bet Pioli's in on this talk with Mangini...
Go Browns!!!
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DnD,
I think he was dumb enough to hire a HC before a GM last time. So why is it such a stretch to believe that is happening (or could be happening) again??
Read that again BigW...And again...
Lerner was as INEXPERIENCED as Crennel and Savage were in the positions they took...
Mark it baby...The dude's not a BILLIONAIRE cause he's dumb...
I'd bet my last buck he's got the blessing of Pioli...And I'd also bet Pioli's in on this talk with Mangini...
You could very well be right. However, since I've seen this organization screw up this process for the past decade pardon me if I take a wait and see aproach..lol
I am sick of getting my hopes up bud. 
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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DnD,
I think he was dumb enough to hire a HC before a GM last time. So why is it such a stretch to believe that is happening (or could be happening) again??
Read that again BigW...And again...
Lerner was as INEXPERIENCED as Crennel and Savage were in the positions they took...
Mark it baby...The dude's not a BILLIONAIRE cause he's dumb...
I'd bet my last buck he's got the blessing of Pioli...And I'd also bet Pioli's in on this talk with Mangini...
But he has admitted he "is not a football guy".
I can't believe he'd screw it up twice but...
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he's a billionaire because his father was a billionaire
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He's also been able to stay a billionare which tells me the guy isn't dumb. Think about all the people who come into earn whatever, money and end up dead broke, Lerneer isn't one of those and he isn't dumb, I bet he knows more about things then he admits but he isn't clueless, far from it.
Pit and DnD make the points I actually agree with so I am not going to rehash stuff already stated.
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not questioning his intelligence, but financial acumen does not necessarily equate to success in football matters
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I don't think anyone has said that, and kinda hard to when Lerner himself admits that he isn't a football guy but he is smart enough to learn and has been. Thats the thing Lerner is a low key guy and one that is hard to judge because he doesn't put himself out there like a Jerry Jones, Al Davis, and others.
He is a project manager in a sense and he has a plan loaded with contingencies if not he wouldn't be in the position he is now, and that is a viable bussiness man.
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j/c Okay, here's the way I see it. Yep, I'm going for broke and sticking my neck out big time here, but so what. Here's the problem with the whole "McDaniel" thing IMO. Why? Look who's on the market right now. Cowher Marty Mangini Shanahan You see, a few short days ago, desperate teams were in need of a top HC candidate. Supply and demand made options look good for a guy like McDaniels. Now? Not so good. If he came here as OC/asst. HC, it would mean his ONLY move from here would be as a HC. And right now? The market is FULL of HC candidates. There's absolutulty no, none, nada reasons for going the rookie HC road. Here's my version of what's going down in my own reasoning................... Pioli as GM. Already a done deal. We just don't know about it yet. Pioli likes Mangini as HC, but can't publicly say that because of backlash from Pat fans and other obvious reasons. So he let's Lerner play the heavy and say that, "Pioli went along with the Mangini hire in exchange for final say on the 53 man roster." It looks like Randy hog tied Pioli to go along with it. What does that accomplish? It makes it look like Randy was dead set on hiring a proven HC candidate this time around and it would keep Pioli off the hot seat with Pat fans. It would be politicly correct, the best marketing ploy and give us a HC with some experience that's shown a propensity for turning a team around, yet young enough to be a long term solution. You see, our fan base won't buy another coaching experiment. And when Pioli makes a move away from the Pats, he won't "really" want to take a huge gamble either. It's a win/win for both Pioli and Lerner in that aspect. RAC stays as DC. Both Billicheck AND Pat players said that RAC ran that D, not Bill. And Pioli will get the help and players RAC "needs" to implement his D. And Coaches earlier post has told me that Phil refused to do that. Which is why Lerner offered to keep RAC in a diminished role, yet showed Savage the door. Makes sense to me. Since the HC market is flooded, McDaniels odds of landing a good HC job decreased immensly over the past 24 hours. So if he truely wants to make his mark, we have Quinn in the wings and peope he's comfortabe here to work with. Plus, if you give him the asst. HC title, he could only leave later for a HC position. Then he could pick and choose during an off season that may be far more favorable for him. So there's my scenario and basic reasoning behind it. Pioli GM/ Director of player personnel/president of player personnel/whatever Mangini HC RAC DC McDaniels OC/asst. HC Only time will tell. But as of now I see this as the most logical scenario in town. And if Mangini is announced as hired before Pioli? Take it to the bank! If I'm wrong, I'm dead wrong. But looking at it from a PR, business and football angle, I'm going with it. JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Since the HC market is flooded, McDaniels odds of landing a good HC job decreased immensly over the past 24 hours. So if he truely wants to make his mark, we have Quinn in the wings and peope he's comfortabe here to work with. Plus, if you give him the asst. HC title, he could only leave later for a HC position. Then he could pick and choose during an off season that may be far more favorable for him.
And why would he leave them for us?
I mean, he's the o-coordinator for Tom Brady and the offense which put up the most passing TDs prob ever last year. McDaniels is not leaving Bellicheck to follow Pioli and Mangini
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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Pioli's a BROWN folks...Mark It...
U have it marked in pencil. I'll wait til' it's in pen.
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I know you were just clicking on me but I have to echo Pit's sentiments as well since we did somewhat together come up with this scenario in conversation, though I will admit if this scenario is right I am damn good! Note I could care less about being right on a message board but I thought of portions of this scenaio minutes after Mangini was canned.
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I guess that will make us New England 2.0
I don't know about us getting McD for what would basically be a lateral move. I can defiantly see Mangini with RAC staying in some capacity.
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And why would he leave them for us?
I mean, he's the o-coordinator for Tom Brady and the offense which put up the most passing TDs prob ever last year. McDaniels is not leaving Bellicheck to follow Pioli and Mangini
That my friend is a simple answer.
To make "his own mark".
To build his own offensive legacy. Many on here, including myself, felt Cower "inherrited a franchise". We did not believe he actually "built" anything. The Rooney family was already an NFL legacy.
Here? How long has it been since we scored a TD again?
It would be a great mark on his resume. As of right now? Did NE make McDaniels or did McDaniels make NE?
Please give that just a tad bit of thought..........
Plus $$$$. And, as asst.HC there could be no lateral move so his next step would be a HC somewhere with "building an O" on his resume. Makes sense to me.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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[quote He should have done whatever it took to get Cowher to sign. Whatever it took. He gave up too easily. what part of no don't you understand? We need proven winners here or at the very least some experience with some success. Shanahan/Mangini Yet we'll probably have a rookie GM, rookie HC, rookie OC, and rookie DC all over again. Learner knows he needs to get this one right... it's not likey
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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I know you were just clicking on me but I have to echo Pit's sentiments as well since we did somewhat together come up with this scenario in conversation, though I will admit if this scenario is right I am damn good!
Note I could care less about being right on a message board but I thought of portions of this scenaio minutes after Mangini was canned.
Yes you did. The Mangini/Pioli scenario you concieved in our conversations. But I was a tad skeptical. And the events of the last 24 hours sealed the deal and gave me cause to believe that this full scenario was a logical one.
So now if it's wrong, do you get partial blame as well?
Not that I would ever do something like that mind you........
And I don't care about being right on a message board either. But WTH. Everybody guessing this and hoping for that.
I just thought why not step it up a notch?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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he's a billionaire because his father was a billionaire
Learner continues to be a billionaire because he is a businessman
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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J/C
The thing in all of this that worries me the most is the possibility of Crennell staying on as DC. As was mentioned in another thread by someone, what happens if the new HC is tough, demanding, and "old school" to the players? Do they run to RAC for sympathy and get it?
Say what you want about Crennell's defenses, I haven't seen enough in his 4 years to back that up. I don't care who his DCs were, as a defensive guru, he should have had enough input and ability to get this defense playing better, i.e. blitz schemes, attacking, etc.
In addition, why would a guy who's supposed to be so great and in such high demand as a DC, stay with an organization that fired him? To me, if he stays it makes him look like a week old fool. The man was fired, he should be let go and have a clean break made.
What's next, for crying out loud, keeping Savage on as assistant GM to Pioli or whomever the new GM is?
In short, I don't want Crennell anywhere near this team. Start over and start fresh.
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,732
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,732 |
If you're bringing in Mangini and Pioli, it might make the perfect home for RAC with a familiar, friendly environment. Stay tuned............
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Pioli “Very Interested” In
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