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i think it would be a terrible mistake!!!!! im not thrilled about going into the season with Steptoe Stallworth and sanders as our WR core.....Cribbs isnt a WR, and JJ is a huge ? mark.....no K2....who in the heck is Quinn/Anderson going to throw to?
#brownsgoodkarma
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Quote:
i think it would be a terrible mistake!!!!! im not thrilled about going into the season with Steptoe Stallworth and sanders as our WR core.....Cribbs isnt a WR, and JJ is a huge ? mark.....no K2....who in the heck is Quinn/Anderson going to throw to?
I'll answer your post by quoting a previous post of mine:
Quote:
1. JJ will most likely be back, the Browns have been talking to his agent (which doesn't mean he will sign, in my opinion he will).
2. We have an outside chance at Coles (and any other FA WR - which there isn't much left).
3. There are other possible trades.
4. And we also have one first and two second rounders coming up on Day 1 of the draft, all our other current picks and anything we get back in return for BE (IF the trade goes through).
I wouldn't worry...yet.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif) “...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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Legend
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I think it is all rumors. But then again, it's hard to tell what Mangini or anyone is thinking.
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i think getting coles will help BE a ton.....Edwards as number1, coles number 2, and Stallworth at 3.....Im not sold on JJ coming back untill i see him at camp!(i hope he does come back)
#brownsgoodkarma
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just clicking.
The Kiwanuka thing??? Interesting. Everett Brown and Kiwanuka...lol  hey a weakness becomes a strength  seriously getting Curry would be sick but who knows.
WR we would have a void as Stallworth would become our guy and how can we rely on him...if there wasn't a poison pill I would think we would release him and not pay the RB in mid March.
But if that deal is going to be done...I hope its done immediately so we can become players in a Nate Washington or TJ or Coles deal.
Crabtree would also be a strong consideration at #5 (not one I really would like to make but what can you do??? ) at least we are gaining more picks.
but maybe one would be there in the 3rd round (which I cringe at when mentioned as a trade we get cause I cannot relate any good picks with the 3rd round.
McCutcheon (the only one with value) then our great investments of:
Marquis Smith, Travis Prentice, JuJuDawson, James Jackson, Melvin Fowler, Chris Crocker, Frye, Travis Wilson, Then we got smart and started trading it away for the last two years 
On the kid Heyward Bey...you people loving him - if the drops BE had frustrated you...Wait till Bey...I think his rep for the dropsies is greater than BE had.
Iglesis in the 3rd would be a steal I like that kid. Butler from Penn State? Speed demon. Williams had a bad time he might drop to our 3rd round pick...
Many possibilities.
Coach B...on losing BE for nothing. We would utilize the Franchise Tag and get something for his rights 
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Quote:
i think it would be a terrible mistake!!!!! im not thrilled about going into the season with Steptoe Stallworth and sanders as our WR core.....Cribbs isnt a WR, and JJ is a huge ? mark.....no K2....who in the heck is Quinn/Anderson going to throw to?
Does it really matter?
Throwing it to Edwards now is like throwing it to an empty jersey.
you had a good run Hank.
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yeah cause he was the only one dropping passes last year  he had a down year and will turn it around...but with K2 gone we cant afford to get rid of him and draft and hope a rookie wr pans out!
#brownsgoodkarma
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yeah cause he was the only one dropping passes last year
he had a down year and will turn it around...but with K2 gone we cant afford to get rid of him and draft and hope a rookie wr pans out!
I hate to break this to you.
We are rebuilding, and from everything we've seen from Mangini and Kokinis...your boy doesn't have very good odds of being a part of that.
Braylon will never be that WR Cleveland was looking for. He doesn't want to be here and a large majority of the fan base doesn't want him here. Time to accept that and move on.
you had a good run Hank.
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You don't think that if we traded Edwards we wouldn't sign a free agent WR or draft one? We probably wouldn't just stand pat with our current receivers. Also, one of the only free agents we targeted signed with a different team.... Andre Goodman signs with Broncos. Quote:
The Denver Broncos and free-agent CB Andre’ Goodman agreed Sunday night to a five-year, $25 million contract that includes over $10 million in guaranteed money.
Goodman is a seven-year NFL veteran who started all 16 regular-season games for the Miami Dolphins last season and had a team-high five interceptions.
I don't know about you guys, but $10 million guaranteed sounds like a lot to give a player like Andre Goodman. If that was his asking price then I'm glad we didn't sign him.
It seems like corners are being overpaid.
How can you pay a corner that much and then have no pass rush? All corners will be bad if you can't rush the passer, which the Broncos can't really do (26 sacks this past season, converting to 3-4 defense.)
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We can't get rid of Edwards.
Without him this team could go 6 consecutive games without scoring a TD.
Indecision may,or maynot,be my problem
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trade all of the talent we have....yeah that spells success.....you people really are clueless around here.....whats the point of getting rid of our top wr, just to have to go get another one.....if we had a legit number 2 edwards would return to top form....last year was a totall train wreck but you cannot pin that on K2, and Edwards! the whole team sucked last year! so going with what your saying we should just cut the whole team and start from scratch.....?
#brownsgoodkarma
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yeah wise guy who was throwing the football during them 6 games?
#brownsgoodkarma
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Quinn,Anderson,Dorsey and Grabkowski
Indecision may,or maynot,be my problem
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I am asking you specifically since it's been mentioned serveral times on here and you either missed it, ignored it, or have some secret plan that you haven't shared. So, please explain this to me. BE has made it quite clear he isn't re-signing her after this season. So, what is the value of keeping him for a season and then letting him go with NOTHING IN RETURN? Whether it is this off season or next off season, we will have the same situation of replaciing him as the #1 WR. So, which would you rather do, try to replace him while getting talent in other areas to improve the team or let him walk and have to replace him while at the same time still trying to fill the holes in other places that you stil have because you didn't trade BE? Stop looking at the upcoming season in a vacuum and realize that there are longer term ramifications of keeping or trading BE. Then weight the long term positives and minuses to either move. Then explain to me how keeping BE is a solid football move LONG TERM knowing he is only here for the upcoming season.
EDIT: I hope that didn't come out as angry or an attack. It wasn't intended that way, but rather as discussion and you can't tell the tone of posts on here.
Last edited by CoachB; 03/02/09 02:27 PM.
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trade all of the talent we have....yeah that spells success.....you people really are clueless around here.....whats the point of getting rid of our top wr, just to have to go get another one
To get one that is consistent, can catch the ball, and not open his mouth at every sign of trouble...hopefully.
you had a good run Hank.
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pretty sure DA was already hurt but should have been benched sooner....quinn had broken finger on his throwing hand....and do i need to say anything about Dorsey or Gradkowski? those two guys are garbage
#brownsgoodkarma
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I for one don't want to get rid of Braylon Edwards because I think he sucks. I think he is a talented receiver who drops passes. But he has the potential to be a top receiver in the NFL as we saw in 2007.
I want to get rid of Edwards because of his attitude. And because he says things like this...
"I'm not Paul Warfield, Webster Slaughter or Jim Brown. I've given my all to this city for four years, and I realize it will never be enough. I went to the Pro Bowl last year and resurrected this team from the darkness, and nobody cared."
Oh, really, you resurrected this team from the darkness? What about the other 52 guys on the team? And the coaches? The front office?
Wait, there's more...
"My biggest problem is that I actually give a damn. I'm always rushing back from surgeries and injuries, never missing games or practices. But through this, I've learned how to overcome adversity. I'm also proud of how my foundation has taken off. I've been doing all this community service in Cleveland ...my charity efforts will only be in Detroit from now on."
Class act.
And one more...
"It is what it is...I've learned since being here that I'm very unappreciated. Not by the organization, just in the eyes of the fans and the city. Since Day One, I've been a marked man coming from Michigan. It's just gone that way."
I don't think he is under appreciated at all. In 2007, when he made the Pro Bowl and caught 16 TD's he was very appreciated. People were calling him a top 5 Wide Receiver in the league and cheering for him left and right.
In 2008, when dropped 8.2 million passes he was appreciated for what he was. A player who dropped passes. If he didn't want expectations for him to be so high, maybe he shouldn't have played so good in 2007.
We knew what he was capable of and he failed to deliver. Then pouted with a me first attitude.
Like I said before, I think Braylon Edwards is a talented football player. But, I don't want him around if his attitude doesn't adjust.
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everything he is saying is true!
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everything he is saying is true!
If you really, truly believe that, then there is no reason to have a conversation with you about Braylon.
you had a good run Hank.
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Quote:
To get one that is consistent, can catch the ball, and not open his mouth at every sign of trouble...hopefully.
Now if we only had fans that were consistent and didn't open their mouth at the first sign of trouble....
yebat' Putin
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We can't get rid of Edwards.
Without him this team could go 6 consecutive games without scoring a TD.
No way. Get Real!  
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All Pro
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anyone can be replaced. one possibility.... torry holt. Quote:
(The Rams)...could clear cap space by releasing offensive tackle Orlando Pace and wide receiver Torry Holt—two holdovers from the 1999 Super Bowl championship team. The Rams could free up $14 million in salary cap space, $8 million for Holt and $6 million for Pace.
yahoo
A man is not old until regrets take the place of dreams.
John Barrymore
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Quote:
Quote:
To get one that is consistent, can catch the ball, and not open his mouth at every sign of trouble...hopefully.
Now if we only had fans that were consistent and didn't open their mouth at the first sign of trouble....
Not gonna happen.
you had a good run Hank.
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he has never been giving a honest chance here....you guys have jumped on him from day one....and as much as you want to laugh or play it off the fact he went to michigan plays a huge part in all of this. but like always the minute someone disagrees with one of you the rest dog pile on him. step back and look at everything that has happened then give me an honest answer?
I dont see anyone really bashing wimbley he was paid big and isnt playing to the level he is paid....stallworth is another example of us choosing who we want to run out of town. Edwards is the most talented player we have on the team, and most cant stand him cause he isnt afraid to stick up for himself!
trading him would be a terrible mistake!
#brownsgoodkarma
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We can't get rid of Edwards.
Without him this team could go 6 consecutive games without scoring a TD.
Thats cute..because how many games did we go without a TD and Edwards in the lineup?
U making a funnie aren't U?
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So you agree that because of fans booing him he shouldn't do charity work in Cleveland? That he, by himself, resurrected the Browns? And that if he did do that no one cared? That his biggest problem is that he gives a damn? (I'd say his biggest problem is dropping passes, but that's just me.) That he has always been unappreciated, even when he caught 16 TD's and went to the Pro Bowl?
If you agree with all these things, then I have nothing left to say, because you clearly would be living in a different world then I do. And I don't understand what goes on in your world.
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im not agreeign with everything he says...but alot of it i do. i think he has made a few comments to get some heat...and taking his charity work out of cleveland dosnt really bother me too much....most of these guys do that as a tax break and dont really give much thought about it.
#brownsgoodkarma
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he has never been giving a honest chance here....you guys have jumped on him from day one....and as much as you want to laugh or play it off the fact he went to michigan plays a huge part in all of this. but like always the minute someone disagrees with one of you the rest dog pile on him. step back and look at everything that has happened then give me an honest answer?
I dont see anyone really bashing wimbley he was paid big and isnt playing to the level he is paid....stallworth is another example of us choosing who we want to run out of town. Edwards is the most talented player we have on the team, and most cant stand him cause he isnt afraid to stick up for himself!
trading him would be a terrible mistake!
I'm going to try and type this without getting incredibly frustrated at fans like you.
A majority of fans who believe Braylon should be traded, myself included, did not jump on him from day one. On the contrary, we really, really wanted him to succeed, like every other Browns player we pick up.
Unfortunately, he has opened his mouth about how the fans don't treat him well, how we should ALWAYS be cheering for him and should never criticize him. That is something a very immature and unreasonable KID would do, not a grown up.
Braylon is a spoiled brat that cannot stand being criticize and then points to the fact that he went to Michigan is why we don't like him. Nothing could be further from the truth. We don't like him right now because the kid cannot catch the ball when it hits him in the hands. We don't like him because he makes excuses for why he is playing bad. We don't like him because he takes all the credit but doesn't want any of the blame.
Braylon is an extremely talented player who could be the best WR in the NFL if he wanted to. Lack of focus, lack of drive, and his spoiled kid nature are, unfortunately, holding him back from being that player. If Braylon could shut his mouth and catch the ball and run crisp routes, then we'd all love him again, but the odds of that happening appear to be little to none. His play was one of the leading factors to last season and he is one of the main reasons Romeo was fired.
So, no, I think he has been given a fair shot. 3 out of his 4 years here he has been acting like a kid, always about himself never fort the team. If he could ever come back to that 2007 form and be the player that we drafted him to be, he could be one of the best WRer's of all time. It's unfortunate that his pouting is going to lead to him playing out his contract here, getting franchised and then traded, but he brought that on himself. We need his talent, but we don't need him.
you had a good run Hank.
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I'm not sure how many games we went scoreless.
After the Denver game,the rest of season just slipped by in some sort of alcohol induced stupor.
But I have the feeling we weren't very good.
Indecision may,or maynot,be my problem
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Here's my take B .... and if we trade him this year I'd be fine with it .. I believe Jeannie wants to get rid of all the "me" guys and BE amazingly enough may have actually beaten KW out for Mr. Me .. a few things in general ... WE ARE NOT REBUILDING ... and this is not top U B .... who ever believes that is NUTS ... we have a pretty decent team as is ... we have a good core of talent to build on .. Jeannie walked into a situation where he can win right away ... WERE NOT THAT BAD ... were not ready for teh SB run just quite yet ... but were alot closer than most are giving us credit for ... anyhow ... on to BE ... heres my breakdown ... 1. His trade value is VERY VERY LOW right now .. hes coming off a horrible season ... so were not going to get even close to max value for him ... 2. this is a contract year for him .. and that cuts two ways .. A. where ever he goes that team will risk "losing" him or "franchising" him next year ... they could work out a new deal .. problem is .. BE will not get what he feels hes worth .. as this guy is just a jack ass and prolly thinks he should be the highest paid reciever in the game ... So that will lower his value even more in a trade this year ... B. he will be HIGHLY MOTIVATED this year to prove hes worth what hes asking for ... we al know what that kind of motivation does to every FA in the history of the game ... when I draft my fantasy teams .. I LOVE guys in contract years ... the STATS on this are over whelming .. and I am pretty sure u know how i feel about how stats are used around here ...  3. He will have BQ throwing him the rock ... and thats good for two reasons .. A. he is way more accurate than DA ... so he will have more catchable balls thrown his way ... he will be hit in stride more often giving him a chance to make plays after the catch ... B. BQ knows how to take advantage of his height .. the "lob (jump ball)" will be thrown alot more ... as will the 'fade" route in the End Zone .. BQ is very good at those throws (witch really showed how bad DA was ... thats a "VICINITY" PASS .. and often times DA was not even in the zip code much less the vicinity .. *L*) ... so when u add all these things up .. BE SHOULD HAVE AN 07 TYPE YEAR ... therefore INCREASING his trade value ... as for the FA thing .. well we simply tag him and then trade him for what ever we can get ... but teams will be alot more willing to part with there #1 and possibly a 3 or 4 after he puts up another monster year like he had in 07 ... plus they will be alot more willing to fork over what this ego maniac wants ... thats just a very plausible scenario for why we would not trade him now and how it could realistically work out for us .. but if we trade him tommorow ... U would not here me say anything other than .. SEE YA .. tell KW we said Hi ... I believe he very well could be an addition by subtraction type player ... but for the 08 season .. and everything he is playing for .. he would tow the line this year and actually be a dominant guy on our team ... much like he was in 07 ... I expect a MONSTER YEAR out of him if he stays .. and if he goes .. thats fine to .. we can survive without him ....
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I'm not sure how many games we went scoreless.
After the Denver game,the rest of season just slipped by in some sort of alcohol induced stupor.
But I have the feeling we weren't very good.
Hey i was in the same alcohol induced stupor, but i have it on good word we weren't very good. 
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a few things in general ... WE ARE NOT REBUILDING ... and this is not top U B .... who ever believes that is NUTS ... we have a pretty decent team as is ... we have a good core of talent to build on .. Jeannie walked into a situation where he can win right away ... WERE NOT THAT BAD ... were not ready for teh SB run just quite yet ... but were alot closer than most are giving us credit for ...
Thank you for pointing this out again. I think all these sky is falling posts are not realistic.
#gmstrong
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I'm just still laughing at those who think we should trade away our biggest offensive weapon (like it or not, BE is our biggest threat) and sign a couple of over-the-hill WRs, who are available because their equally poor teams don't want them, for beaucoup bucks. Or hold out hope and put all our faith in a WR who's at the end of his career, coming off major surgery, and isn't even a sure thing to ever play football again. I guess they really don't want to win for another 5 years.
Any receiver can have the year Braylon did last year. That's not very difficult. Not too many, on the other hand, can have the production that he did in 2007. It's not just dumb luck. It's realization of potential. And considering that our best offensive player last year was probably Jerome Harrison, I'm not about to put a tremendous amount of weight on how last season turned out for BE, or most of our offensive players.
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I'm just still laughing at those who think we should trade away our biggest offensive weapon (like it or not, BE is our biggest threat) and sign a couple of over-the-hill WRs, who are available because their equally poor teams don't want them, for beaucoup bucks. Or hold out hope and put all our faith in a WR who's at the end of his career, coming off major surgery, and isn't even a sure thing to ever play football again. I guess they really don't want to win for another 5 years.
Because we've won so many games with Braylon, right?
Get me some WR'ers that catch the ball and you'll win. I believe the Steelers proved that.
you had a good run Hank.
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I am asking you specifically since it's been mentioned serveral times on here and you either missed it, ignored it, or have some secret plan that you haven't shared. So, please explain this to me. BE has made it quite clear he isn't re-signing her after this season. So, what is the value of keeping him for a season and then letting him go with NOTHING IN RETURN? Whether it is this off season or next off season, we will have the same situation of replaciing him as the #1 WR. So, which would you rather do, try to replace him while getting talent in other areas to improve the team or let him walk and have to replace him while at the same time still trying to fill the holes in other places that you stil have because you didn't trade BE? Stop looking at the upcoming season in a vacuum and realize that there are longer term ramifications of keeping or trading BE. Then weight the long term positives and minuses to either move. Then explain to me how keeping BE is a solid football move LONG TERM knowing he is only here for the upcoming season.
EDIT: I hope that didn't come out as angry or an attack. It wasn't intended that way, but rather as discussion and you can't tell the tone of posts on here.
Coach, wouldn't we use the franchise tag on him anyway? (And I'm wholeheartedly with Diam here that he's gonna have a monster year this year...motivated by contract year AND last year's embarassment...he might be a prima donna but I'm nearly positive he's going to be driven this offseason to make up for last year merely for his own personal pride, let alone $$$.)
Is this Kiwanuka + picks for BE thing true or not? If it's a 2nd rounder I'm more than on board with that. I haven't watched much tape on Kiwanuka because I don't really follow the Giants but I do know this much...
-He's athletic enough to play rush end AND 4-3 OLB. That's 4-3, not 3-4. Meaning he has the ability to cover space pretty darn well for a converted college DE.
-The Giants' linebackers are pretty close to 3-4 backers in the sense that they can all rush since they all play downhill and are a blitz heavy defense.
-He's never played in a 3-4...but he seems like the perfect kind of fit.
By pulling the trigger on this, we wouldn't be in as much of a hole as we would be if we lose out on Curry. We'd have some flexibility, and three 2nd round picks...which honestly makes me daydream a bit.
P.S. For everyone who isn't comfortable with Stallworth, JJ, Steptoe and Cribbs as receivers, I can almost guarantee you we'd sign/draft someone, if not both.
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Because we've won so many games with Braylon, right?
Get me some WR'ers that catch the ball and you'll win. I believe the Steelers proved that.
Of the 58 games where he's put on a Browns uniform, we've won 22 of them. Obviously not the greatest record in the world, but if you want to place the blame on our poor performance in 2005 and 2006 (his first two seasons) solely on him, then I'd probably have to point out that you had an agenda.
He also hasn't missed a game since he blew out his knee his rookie year. Someone blasted him for being quoted as saying he hasn't missed games or practices but, well, he hasn't. He's started all but 4 of those 58 games, too. Three of those were his first three games as a rookie, and the fourth was when he was benched for the first snap because he was late to that meeting following the OSU-UMich game.
Like I said before, WRs don't have seasons like he did in 2007 as a fluke. The talent is quite obviously there. Perhaps what was missing last year was an organization with any semblance of just that: organization. The Browns were a mess from top to bottom, and it was reflected in the poor play of every single person on the roster.
As Diam pointed out, he's coming into a contract year, he's going to want to perform as well as possible. Keep him around, franchise him at the end of the year and trade him then, or *gasp* maybe he will actually get his act together and be worth keeping around.
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The thing about Braylons play this past season that bothers me even more than the drops is that he gives up on too many routes. Especially slants and other patterns over the middle. This lead to multiple incompletions and a couple of interceptions last season.
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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P.S. For everyone who isn't comfortable with Stallworth, JJ, Steptoe and Cribbs as receivers, I can almost guarantee you we'd sign/draft someone, if not both.
I don't think anybody's comfortable with Stallworth at this point.
I'll believe that JJ is playing when I see him line up on game day in September, and regardless, he's no #1 receiver.
Cribbs is not a WR threat.
Steptoe sucks.
Torry Holt and/or Lavarenues Coles is not the answer, not even in the short term.
Drafting a WR with one of our top picks is a wasted pick, IMO, and the chances that we get a Marques Colston on the second day are quite slim.
We need a legit #1 reciever this season, and the only way we will have that is if we don't trade BE.
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Which is why I don't see it happening.
I see BE having a monster year and being motivated, then us franchising him, if he wants to stay, he re-signs, if not, we'll get a good offer for him.
I'm intrigued by such a move because, personally...I'm most concerned about getting the pass rush fixed. I'm borderline obsessed with getting a lurking, fearing, "I'm gonna eat your children" passrush than anything else.
I look at it from a team perspective.
Pass rush + guy like Coles or Holt = more wins than no pass rush + Edwards.
All the great defenses have an AWESOME pass rush. Some argue "stop the run." I think if you get off the field on 3rd down, you lower the number of rushing attempts against you, thus preventing your team from wearing down, and being more effective against the run.
I'm not discounting the importance of stopping the run, I just think they both work hand in hand. Think of how many times we had 3rd and medium, 3rd and long last year and the opposing offense converted because our pass rush was garbage.
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