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I just wish Mangini would come out and say....
Quinn will be our starter... I hate this nonsense...
Charlie Frye had more of an opportunity than Quinn was given. I'm a little confused on why some of you on this board have already deemed Quinn to be a failure.
I guess lets wait for the dust to settle. After the draft one of them will be gone and the other will most likley be named the starter.
I'd prefer Quinn. I've seen enough of DA to form my opinion that he is not franchise material.
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Trading for Jay Cutler would be a sucker move for the Browns.
Cutler threw for 4526 yds last season and has a career QB rating of 87 and Grossi thinks it would be a sucker move for the Browns?
Grossi complains that the Browns do not need "a whining, insecure flamethrower" but then tells us that Cutler being traded to Detroit, Tampa and the Jets would help those teams.
Tony says the Browns have a decimated receiving corp ("goodbye Winslow, Jurevicius and probably Donte Stallworth") and for that reason, we don't need Cutler...that's such a lame excuse for an experienced sportswriter to use. I'm beginning to think that Grossi has lost it...
The Browns new coaching staff is faced with Quinn who has started 3 games and Anderson who did not play well last season. With either Anderson or Quinn penciled in as the Browns starting QB, Mangini is faced with serious questions at the QB position that may not work out.
At least with Cutler, the Browns would have a proven QB running the offense and not be faced with question marks that might need to be addressed after the 2009 season.
A reasonable deal such as swapping Quinn for Cutler and swapping picks in the second round (our #36 for their #48) or if absolutely necessary.....Quinn and our #50 for Cutler, would be the most I would be comfortable with.
There is no reason for a 3rd party as Grossi suggests....jmho
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
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I'd prefer Quinn. I've seen enough of DA to form my opinion that he is not franchise material.
I agree with that, even while it means the determination on Quinn cannot be made yet. DA had his shot. As did Frye.
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I'd prefer Quinn. I've seen enough of DA to form my opinion that he is not franchise material.
I agree with that, even while it means the determination on Quinn cannot be made yet. DA had his shot. As did Frye.
Did you hear the news?
The Browns have new management and a brand new coaching staff.
While some fans may believe "they have seen enough" of Anderson, the people who actually count, Mangini, the new QB coach, the new OC...could have a different opinion of Anderson than our fan "experts". 
jmho
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
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I'm a little confused on why some of you on this board have already deemed Quinn to be a failure.
So am I.. but then I'm also a little confused at how some are so convinced he's the savior...
I would just like him to get a chance to get on the field and stay on the field so we can find out WHAT he is...
yebat' Putin
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I can agree to let it go at that. It will be as fun to see Quinn in Denver as their new Elway while DA is DA in Cleveland.  If this new coaching staff can pull it off, no problem with me. I just want the wins. And it's going to require infusion of talent and scheme in the offense, not just a decision on the QB. Anyhow,...I think they will trade Anderson, and stay away from Cutler. The really good thing is, I haven't heard of any rumbling from either of the Q or A camps, and I would be OK to keep both this year. Now if they do bring Cutler in, either of the other "kept" 2 is then gonna start his crybaby routine. I say stay away from the whole deal,....of course we don't know at all what the new coaching staff is planning yet either.
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I'd prefer Quinn. I've seen enough of DA to form my opinion that he is not franchise material.
I agree with that, even while it means the determination on Quinn cannot be made yet. DA had his shot. As did Frye.
Did you hear the news?
The Browns have new management and a brand new coaching staff.
While some fans may believe "they have seen enough" of Anderson, the people who actually count, Mangini, the new QB coach, the new OC...could have a different opinion of Anderson than our fan "experts".
jmho
Thanks mac for such insight that no one on the board knew! 
I've never called myself an expert or felt like I knew more than others. Everything I state is just my opinion. We will find out soon enough who Mangini wants because I seriously doubt both Quinn and Anderson will be on this team after the draft.
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Just clicking..here's more news... http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5...mp;confirm=true There is no way for Jay Cutler to reconcile his differences with the Denver Broncos.
The damage to his relationship with the team is beyond repair. He knows it. Josh McDaniels, his main protagonist, knows it. Broncos owner Pat Bowlen and other members of the team's hierarchy know it, too.
Brandt: How to fix this
"Cutler's cap number is not great the next three years. If the Broncos offered Cutler more money, I would not be surprised to see all this bad blood go away," Gil Brandt said in Tuesday's live chat with fans. Chat transcript ... Cutler wants out. Although the Broncos publicly maintain they're not yet at the point of granting his wish, it seems as if the time will eventually come (perhaps within the next month) when they ship the Pro Bowl quarterback to another team.
It is the only solution to a drama that has dominated NFL offseason discussion in a way that rivals last year's soap opera starring Brett Favre.
And it is hardly a coincidence that the situations have a common thread: Bus Cook, who was Favre's agent, also represents Cutler. When Favre reached a point where he no longer could work with Packers general manager Ted Thompson, Cook did his part to pry his unhappy client out of Green Bay and worked out a trade that resulted in the regrettable season that Favre spent with the New York Jets in 2008.
Cook is the same agent who was involved with the acrimonious relationship between yet another quarterback, Steve McNair, and the Tennessee Titans -- so acrimonious that the Titans banned McNair from working out at their facility during the offseason and resulted in his finishing his career with the Baltimore Ravens. And Cook is the same agent who was involved with the battle that wide receiver Randy Moss had with the Oakland Raiders before he wound up with the New England Patriots.
I am having serious doubts that this entire Cutler mess stems from his outrage over the fact McDaniels engaged in discussions with his former employer, the Patriots, for a possible three-way trade that would have sent Matt Cassel to Denver and Cutler elsewhere.
I'm convinced it began after Bowlen fired coach Mike Shanahan and also parted ways with offensive coordinator Jeremy Bates. After that, Cutler realized he no longer had anyone who believed in him as the Broncos' starter, who appreciated his gunslinger-style skills and would design a playbook and call plays that would take full advantage of them.
Where will Cutler land?
Here are some teams, listed in alphabetical order, that might be interested in trading for Jay Cutler:
» Chicago Bears: They can't really believe they're solid with Kyle Orton.
» Cleveland Browns: They're not convinced that Brady Quinn or Derek Anderson is the answer.
» Detroit Lions: They have the top overall pick in the draft, as well as the 20th overall choice, and their starting quarterback job is in the shaky hands of Daunte Culpepper.
» Minnesota Vikings: They reportedly showed interested in Cutler, even after acquiring Sage Rosenfels from the Houston Texans.
» New York Jets: Agent Bus Cook delivered Brett Favre to them last year. Does Cook do it again with Cutler?
» San Francisco 49ers: They claim they're going with Shaun Hill as their starter but could do so much better.
» Tampa Bay Buccaneers: They don't have a legitimate starter.He certainly didn't see McDaniels as that person. Nor should he have. As offensive coordinator of the Patriots, McDaniels ran a scheme that had no room for the type of high-risk passing that is the hallmark of Cutler's game. Cutler and his good friend, Broncos tight end Tony Scheffler (another Cook client), took a close look at the type of offense the Patriots ran under McDaniels.
It didn't take long for them to reach the same conclusion: "This isn't what we do."
McDaniels didn't see Cutler as a good fit, either, which was why he did the logical thing and entertained an overture from the Patriots that would have reunited him with the backup quarterback he helped turn into a star after Tom Brady's season-ending knee injury last year.
McDaniels was hired, in large part, for his offensive vision. He was hired for the ideas that played a role in allowing Brady to have the off-the-charts season he had in 2007 and Cassel to cash in a spectacular season for a minimum payoff of $14.65 million and a starting job with the Kansas City Chiefs.
McDaniels knows exactly the type of quarterback he needs at the controls of his system -- someone who will stay within himself, who will be methodical and precise, who will allow big plays to unfold within the structure of the offense rather than gambling that he can squeeze the ball between defenders or simply throw it to a spot too far down the field for anyone to get to … except his receiver.
The quarterback McDaniels needs is not Cutler and will never be Cutler. And Cutler is every bit as aware of this square-peg-in-a-round-hole dynamic as McDaniels.
Cutler is not looking to find some sort of common ground so that he and McDaniels can work together, because it doesn't exist. He and Cook will do everything they can to apply as much pressure as possible on the 32-year-old, first-year coach until they get what they want -- a one-way ticket out of Denver.
Despite what he might say publicly, McDaniels is going to comply -- but on his terms. Before he boots a quarterback with three years left on his contract out the door, he has to make sure he can bring in one who is right for his program. The Cleveland Browns just might be able to accommodate him; their new coach, Eric Mangini, doesn't seem very keen on keeping Brady Quinn around.
Meanwhile, McDaniels is going to at least try to create the perception that he has everything under control -- that no one, including Cutler or Cook, is going to stand in the way of getting his program off the ground with the offseason workouts that began Monday (without Cutler).
This will only last so long, of course. Cutler seems fully prepared to make the situation as ugly as possible, and we know -- from the experiences with Favre, McNair and Moss -- that is likely to happen. Ultimately, the Broncos will have to pull the trigger on a trade.
It is the only solution.
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2nd String
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some of you on this board have already deemed Quinn to be a failure.
I don't know anyone that thinks of Brady as a "Failure", because he just hasn't seen the field. It is purely from a Business sense that Brady would be More Valuable to us in a trade than DA. If there is a team out there that wants DA over BQ, please "Let Him Speak Now or Forever Hold His Peace!"  JMHO Go Brownies!!!
Who Let Da Dawgs Out? Woof, Woof, Woof!!!!!
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Hmmm ... is there an echo in here .... because I seem to recall a certain poster ... whose name starts with "Y", who suggested just this very possibility .... Quote:
» Cleveland Browns: They're not convinced that Brady Quinn or Derek Anderson is the answer.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I'll say this..and I'm not leaning toward anything...I'm posting info..
I see that one more reporter has picked up on the idea that Mangini doesn't wanna keep Quinn around. Yet he told Lerner he can win with Quinn. And exactly which part of Quinn's game and personality might Mangini not want?
His work ethic which matches Mangini's own?
His professionalism and leadership abilities, especially compared to DA's and Cutler's?
His experience in the new offense?
His intelligence that the scheme requires?
His discipline and accuracy in the short passing game that sets up the long game--
A glowing recommendation from his college coach that supposedly is working in favor of him going to DEN?
There are things that don't add up for those jumping to the conclusions that Mangini wants the trade to go through..
Truth is we haven't seen enough of the kid to know what he can do on a week in and out basis..we do know some things he can do and he is accurate in the short game..they didn't turn him loose to really go downfield in the two games he played..
So if the Browns are going to run a scheme that BQ benefits from how is he a better fit for Denver?
Now I do not know whats exactly going on..and maybe it's all to confuse everyone and keep teams that want a QB hot on the Browns trail because ONE OF THEM NEEDS to go..for me I stand by what I've said all along ..I feel DA is the one being bused out..
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All Pro
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Personally I would hate to see us trade Quinn....However , IF Mangini wants to put that scenario into motion and assume FULL accountability for the eventuall outcome IMHO he better get it done ASAP....Distraction and Confusion is Not what we need heading into the season....IF Quinn is moved , Anderson should be as well....At that point we would be in a position to start Cutler and sign a experienced veteran QB( ?...  whoever that might be to back him up)....Either way any debate at QB must be resolved ASAP....
The Mammal
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Good take,...
But whatever it is needs to WORK.
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It is killing me to agree with Grossi.
Ok, I gotta clarify myself....
I had read this much: Trading for Jay Cutler would be a sucker move for the Browns.
They need to define their quarterback situation, not muck it up more with a whining, insecure flamethrower. Whatever additional RPM's on his fastball Cutler would bring, the overall total package is not going to significantly upgrade the team.
and thought that was the complete jist of what Grossi was talking about. That much I am in agreement with him on - getting involved in a deal for Cutler would be a sucker move for us.
The rest of it is garbage unless we REALLY come out ahead in the deal... and I HATE the idea of unloading Quinn. And given what we as a team set ourselves back to acquire Quinn, we had better REALLY score a coup to unload him.... otherwise it will cement itself as one of the worst deals of our re-existence. And don't give me any of that "well, Savage gave that up, not Gin & Koke"... that's BS - The BROWNS gave up the picks to get him and the BROWNS need to have that deal not be one more mega-loss of a first day move.
So, if we're just a facilitator in moving Cutler and we end up not getting a sweetheart of a deal - hell no, I want no freaking part of any of this garbage.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Well truth is EM could make that deal...but I am leaning that DA is going to be moved..
Now what I do know is that Cutler's agent is really working the Broncos to get him out of there..he's known for doing it ..and he's up to the task..by going to the media he knew it would get ugly fast..and the only way to squelch it is for the Broncs to trade him out..
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Agreed,...hopefully just not to Cleveland (that geekazoid Clayton came up with this crap,....)
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I also have a feeling if either of our QBs will be moved, it's DA.
While the fans' feelings shouldn't enter into things too much, Mangini has to know that Quinn is a fan favorite, for whatever reason. The fans are going to be more lenient with Quinn than with DA. I'm not saying they'd let him struggle through an entire season, but they'd be a lot less harsh early on.
From what I understand, Lerner likes Quinn a lot. I have to think that Quinn came up in his discussions with Mangini and, hence, Mangini believes in Quinn like Lerner does (to a certain extent).
I continue to hold out hope that our coaching staff realizes that DA is not the answer. That being said, if DA is our starter, I'd support him 100%. And, I'm not saying Quinn IS the answer. I'm saying that I don't believe that DA is.
Right now, I think we can get a lot more for DA than for Quinn. With DA, you know what you're getting as there's substantial tape on him. You can't deny the guy has a great arm, good size, etc. With Quinn, there are still question marks, for no other reason than he just hasn't played much.
On the flip side, though, a team might feel they can groom BQ better than DA.
In the end, I just think that DA is the one that's going to be shipped out, and that's if either of them are shipped out.
JMHO
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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It is killing me to agree with Grossi.
Ok, I gotta clarify myself....
I had read this much: Trading for Jay Cutler would be a sucker move for the Browns.
They need to define their quarterback situation, not muck it up more with a whining, insecure flamethrower. Whatever additional RPM's on his fastball Cutler would bring, the overall total package is not going to significantly upgrade the team.
and thought that was the complete jist of what Grossi was talking about. That much I am in agreement with him on - getting involved in a deal for Cutler would be a sucker move for us.
The rest of it is garbage unless we REALLY come out ahead in the deal... and I HATE the idea of unloading Quinn. And given what we as a team set ourselves back to acquire Quinn, we had better REALLY score a coup to unload him.... otherwise it will cement itself as one of the worst deals of our re-existence. And don't give me any of that "well, Savage gave that up, not Gin & Koke"... that's BS - The BROWNS gave up the picks to get him and the BROWNS need to have that deal not be one more mega-loss of a first day move.
So, if we're just a facilitator in moving Cutler and we end up not getting a sweetheart of a deal - hell no, I want no freaking part of any of this garbage.
I do like the whining, insecure flamethrower bit.  .hey if Quinn was to be traded..the Browns would need to get a high pick back..not just give up a second and Denver not fork over anything....a swap of the first rounders..and something else..
But once more Gross-me-out is playing GM..
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I'm not saying they'd let him struggle through an entire season, but they'd be a lot less harsh early on.
And that time is still coming,...and this is why I thought all along he should have been baptized right away. Now we have to "estimate" how and/or what Mangini is "feeling."
I know they have a plan,...we just have to wait it out. It's all we can do.
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The thing that kills me is how people talk about Brady Quinn being accurate...I thought his inconsistency, lack of a good deep ball were his downfalls. He had less than a 60% completion percentage in College and less than a 50% completion percentage in his brief stint in the NFL...mostly of which were no more than 10 yard passes. His YPC was smaller than Fryes, who if I remember correctly people hated the dink and dunk. At this point he has a 1/1 TD/int. Take the blinders off folks. Use him however you have to to get us some players or picks, that is where his true value is in my opinion. Despite what many of you think...not many people think much of him outside of this city. I've been to other boards where they would rather have DA. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity to get some overinflated value for him because of the situation with Cutler, and McDaniels being a Weiss Disciple...that is all. I don't hate Quinn, I just love my Browns!
"Going from 4-12 to 6-10 isn't good enough. I believe we are going to be better than that. We're going to be a lot better than that." - Mike Holmgren (3/15/12)
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Either way any debate at QB must be resolved ASAP....
mammal...why would the "fans" QB debate have to be resolved ASAP, even if Mangini stands firm with Anderson and Quinn competing for the starting job?
The fans and media may believe they can control the QB situation by writing about it and giving their differing opinions, but I doubt that Mangini is gonna have rabbit ears and act based on the opinions anyone other than his coaching staff.
Our opinions don't matter and some in the media have already put an X on Mangini's back regardless of what he does with the Browns QB situation.
I'm sure that Mangini is aware of the notorious "best fans in football" and our local media. The best thing Mangini could do is ignore everyone, which I believe he's doing, and use his own judgement (and his staff) on how to build the Browns into a winner.
I have no idea what Mangini will do but I believe he wants to build the defense via the draft, therefore, he's not likely to make any deals that grossly alter his draft plans. The Browns can not afford to go hog wild and give up too much just to land Cutler. But it may be doable...but thats jmho...
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"mammal...why would the "fans" QB debate have to be resolved ASAP, even if Mangini stands firm with Anderson and Quinn competing for the starting job?".... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- IMO not resolving our QB debate will only lead to confusion and uncertainty among the players , which will only slow down our progress as we move forward....Competition is great , but not at QB....I believe that waiting to name our Starter only allows for any disention and locker room biased to ferment further.... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Our opinions don't matter and some in the media have already put an X on Mangini's back regardless of what he does with the Browns QB situation...." ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is also true ....However , as Browns Fans we have to vent....It's what we do.....
The Mammal
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It's what we do as a cause of past ineptitude. If that has run its course, fine.
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While the fans' feelings shouldn't enter into things too much, Mangini has to know that Quinn is a fan favorite, for whatever reason.
I agree that it shouldn't matter, but was Mangini here when Belichick released Kosar? If so, he'll know what a p.r. disaster it was to let go the hometown hero. Not saying that Quinn ranks anywhere near Kosar in the fans' esteem, but your point about the fan favorite thing just had me wonder. Random thought, for what it's worth.
Ultimately, a QB controversy is initially more of an issue to fans and media. I really don't know how much it affects the players as long as the starter is playing well. I think when the starter struggles, that's when the other players might start wondering about the other guy. It's really not out of the realm of possibility that both QBs are on the roster this year. We either have a somewhat experienced starter being back-up by a talented young guy or we have a talented young-guy being backed up by a guy with some experience. Seems too simple, I know, but it just might happen.
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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i actually think i feel the complete opposite of you, lol. here's why Quote:
While the fans' feelings shouldn't enter into things too much, Mangini has to know that Quinn is a fan favorite, for whatever reason. The fans are going to be more lenient with Quinn than with DA. I'm not saying they'd let him struggle through an entire season, but they'd be a lot less harsh early on.
as i said all along, once mangini was hired, he can get away with a jaw-dropping move like getting rid of quinn. although he had just drafted clemens, i'm sure his group with the jets looked at whether or not quinn was a worthwhile prospect. the jets even traded up to no 14 to take a cb when quinn was still on the table. i don't see why, if quinn was a can't miss prospect, mangini didn't take quinn then, especially if quinn supposedly possesses all the skills that many here speculate mangini as wanting. and in case people don't remember, mangini never said what he wanted to run here. daboll made a quick statement in relation to the pats offense but mangini always said he'll adjust the gameplan based on his personell
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From what I understand, Lerner likes Quinn a lot. I have to think that Quinn came up in his discussions with Mangini and, hence, Mangini believes in Quinn like Lerner does (to a certain extent).
this goes against lerner's MO. if there's one thing lerner has made clear over and over again, both by words and by example through aston villa, he hires the smart people and let them do their thing. it would be hypocritical and counterproductive for an unknowledgeable football owner, something he always calls himself, to make any type of personel decision. it was RUMORED that mangini said he could win with the team but we don't know what was actually said. for all we know, mangini may have made clear to lerner that he'd only sign if he weren't commited to any of the qbs on the roster. we just don't know. i think lerner's putting pressure on playing quinn last year was a culmination of frustration and wondering why a player they traded up for wasn't on the field. i don't think those feelings are valid now, with a new regime. i would be willing to bet that, in lerner's desparation to land mangini asap, he let mangini do whatever he wants to the roster including the qbs. i wouldn't be that surprised if we moved both, i really wouldn't.
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I continue to hold out hope that our coaching staff realizes that DA is not the answer. That being said, if DA is our starter, I'd support him 100%. And, I'm not saying Quinn IS the answer. I'm saying that I don't believe that DA is.
i think we can agree that DA is a hot/cold player. the question is whether the coaching staff believes they can put him in a situation to get hot and stay hot. i think they can look at the giants game and understand what was done in that game that was different from the other games. you can argue luck, i'd argue an offense playing as a team that helped DA.
i still maintain that DA "got it" at the beginning of the preseason but then everything that could go wrong did. we talk about important injuries and junk like that but think about this one: if the qb is supposed to be smart and make decisions, which injury is worse? an injury to the knee or an injury to the brain? which one would be more detrimental to his development and progression in a season? sure ain't the knee...
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Right now, I think we can get a lot more for DA than for Quinn. With DA, you know what you're getting as there's substantial tape on him. You can't deny the guy has a great arm, good size, etc. With Quinn, there are still question marks, for no other reason than he just hasn't played much.
you can't claim to have enough tape to see that DA isn't the answer yet say that there is substantial tape on DA for other teams to think he is. if anything, quinn is the one who has the most value because 1) he has the "pedigree," 2) he's a first round talent that sat in the pros for two seasons learning his craft, and 3) there is limited tape on quinn. at this point, quinn is still a question mark on paper so teams looking for a qb will look to see that this guy was supposed to be the most pro-prepared player coming out and he already adjusted to game speed. further, one could only naturally believe that quinn got better because he had two full seasons to develop. i'd argue that quinn has more draft value and if he can get us a couple picks in the first day, i'm all for it. if DA is traded, so be it. no matter what, i just want ONE qb for the next 10 years.
i still feel that charlie could get the job done. i bet, if he had just last year's line, not even the 2007 line, we wouldn't be looking for qbs. we'd be looking for his supporting cast. if you REALLY think about it, all the things people are expecting from quinn, charlie did in his first full season starting. 63% completion, while showed great toughness and leadership. he just got skittish after all the poundings he took. people argued he had no arm strength, yet his proponents argued he could "make all the throws" (sound familiar?). finally, he completed the deep balls, something we still haven't seen from quinn. even when he went out of his way to do, like in the 3rd preseason game starting against detroit.
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My take from THIS fans Point of Veiw:
We sacraficed to get Quinn and it made sense because he's a local grown QB with potential.
We were very patient with RAC and Phil, watching the DA experiment while MOST of us thought the better QB was on the bench. This was justified by the "Bring him along the right way" BS which Flacco proved was BS.
He FINALLY gets a couple of starts, gets injured and then gets yanked by a coach fighting to save his own butt... much to the dismay and discontent of the fans...
NOW when it is finally time to hand him the reigns and see if we have a real stud QB or not, the new regime considers trading him for what in all serious discussion could only be considered a loss...
After 40 years as a browns fan (THE ONLY TEAM I've ever followed) and not watching football AT ALL when the browns did not exist... If this trade happens... If BQ does not get his shot... THEN I for one am through with the Browns. Not just the COACH, not just the GM, not just the OWNER but the whole damn ORGANIZATION.
I don't say this because I'm a BQ fan (which I am), I don't say this because I hate DA (which I don't), I say this because I have waited... I have been patient... I have been told it would happen... I have bought tickets... I have bought merchandise... I have loved the Browns with my heart and soul... BUT in trading BQ at this point, this organization would be plainly telling me that I as a fan and loyal follower DO NOT MATTER... That money is their only motivation... AND that they will lie, cheat and steal to get that money regardless of the situation.
I will NOT contribute one more red cent to an organization like that. I've talked to alot of my friends and family who feel the same way. So, for these reasons, if this regime ships Quinn off without letting him have his shot here, I will be DONE with the Browns.
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Quote:
I just wish Mangini would come out and say....
Quinn will be our starter... I hate this nonsense...
Charlie Frye had more of an opportunity than Quinn was given. I'm a little confused on why some of you on this board have already deemed Quinn to be a failure.
I'm a little confused as to why many on this board just KNOW Quinn will be a success.
Savage was a sucker when it came to Frye. I didn't like him coming out, and Savage blew it by taking him at all. He was a bum. He's a bum now. Savage had no choice but to go with Frye as Dilfer was a whiner who was physically breaking down, and Savage had hitched his cart to Frye. Quinn sits along-side of Anderson, who's no bum and isn't physically breaking down.
Whether people here like to want to believe it or not, we're in a rebuilding mode. Whether people here like to want to believe it or not, Quinn was a selection by a man who's no longer calling the shots or with the organization, meaning Mangini or Kok have no perticular bond with him. Since the above are true, whichever guy nets us a really high pick makes sense when it comes to trading him.
I don't think Quinn is a bum, but I think he's overhyped. I think he's got a higher ceiling than Anderson, but I don't know that he's a piece to build around, not when we have so many other holes than need to be filled.
If Quinn is our starter or if he's traded, I won't be unhappy with either situation. I think he has more trade value than Anderson, so to me, he's the more likely candidate to be moved.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Fair analysis,...no one knows, or is even stating they KNOW Quinn will be a success. But it is a fact that we won't know if he gets traded,....and it is a fact that if he gets traded for Cutler, then Anderson is on the bench.
Trade Anderson for whatever you can.
Couch and Frye got their shots; Quinn deserves his. If he fails, the Browns are no further behind than they are now.
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Dilfer was a whiner
You do know when it turns out you're right people really can't call you a whiner.
Turns out Dilfer was right. The Browns were (and may still be) a highly dysfunctional group in the FO and coaching staff. So crapping on Dilfer as being a whiner really doesn't cut it anymore.
And other than Diam I don't know that anyone on here consistently says Quinn will be a success. However, at this point in time Quinn appears to be the most likely candidate to lead us to what little success we're likely to see this year. Like it or not if they trade away Quinn and don't get someone better at QB in return the staff/FO is basically saying they'll gladly take our money but don't you dare expect a winner.
As I said in another thread on here someplace, we may be in another rebuild but so far it looks more like a cheap remodel to me.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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If we could ship Brady for Cutler I would do it in a second. DA could play back-up to Cutler---cuz that is something we know DA is capable of doing.
I have never been a fan of Quinn---didn't like the pick, and I think he is overhyped.
With the scarcity of news coming out of Berea its tough to make any predictions as to who is going and who is staying. But if the situation arose where we could ship a QB for Cutler, I would ship Quinn.
I wish to wash my Irish wristwatch......
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well if quinn is traded for cutler, you can bet anderson will be traded too. that would be the benefit. quinn for cutler, trade anderson for a 3rd, and you have an established qb and another first day pick.
quinn doesn't "deserve" anything other than a chance to fight for a starting spot. just because the prior regime game DA some starts doesn't mean it's "quinn's turn" now. if they're both here come TC, then they deserve to battle it out for the starting position. if it comes to that, and quinn can't win it, he didn't earn the field time.
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I dont look at it as the organization is just trying to cheat and steal money from us fans at all. IMO Their job each and every day is to do what is best for the team. In today's age in sports players change teams a lot. I think our Indian's dynasty in the 90s and how they all left showed us all that painful fact.
I understand wanting to see him have his chance, but if Mangini feels he can improve the team by dealing him or perhaps gets blown away by an offer, I think he makes that move. Especially when you consider he has no ties to anyone on this roster (he proved that with Winslow). And like someone else said, he traded up and passed on Quinn with the Jets. After Winslow got traded, it should have sent a message to the whole team that anyone was fair game.
In times like these, Hal Lebovitz would remind us we didn't have a team for four years.
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i think he was referring to when dilfer was playing for us, not commenting on espn. it was very clear that dilfer and carthon did not see eye to eye.
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Setting much of it aside, Dilfer was whining because while he was brought here under the premise that he was to mentor Frye and keep the seat warm for him, when it was time to sit, he didn't like it and made his feelings known.
That's called whining 
Yeah, Crennel was an idiot for not letting a veteran QB call audibles, but that won't change how Dilfer handled himself when he was touted as being a "professional."
Now, whether we're rebuilding or doing a discount remodel, we need more parts. Bringing back Tucker is a good move, but knowing he's a cough away from landing on the inactive list, we made more good moves by bringing in Porky and St. Claire. I don't see that Shaffer was much better than St. Claire was. What we did was essentially buy insurance while helping our cap. Even if that doesn't equate to an upgrade of talent, it's an upgrade for the team.
However, back to the QB's. Ok, you don't see it as a rebuild, but a cheap retooling. I could make an arguement that Anderson has more experience and is better suited to win now. (Hell, I can make an arguement that the sky is green if given enough time *L*). Does that mean I want Anderson over Quinn? No, but I can make a legit arguement for him. I bet if Mangini came out and endorsed Anderson that many on the board would be swayed because they view it as a legit source, and that could happen. So why do I say it? Because it's important to understand that it's very possible to make that arguement, and that since it's possible the organization could take that stance, that it's also legitimate, realistic, and feasible. So, if Quinn can get us a 1st round pick, that's something I'd seriously have to think about.
This walks too close to a Quinn versus Anderson debate, and I'm not interested in that. My opinion is that they are two very different QB's who are very-damned close in terms of what they are going to do to help this team win. I think Anderson is underrated because of how badly the team stunk around him last year, and that Quinn is overvalued because of rampant Homerism combined with the mantra that the backup QB is always the most popular guy on the field. One's a ball-control, mobile guy, the other a pocket stretch-the-field guy. I think in terms of production, they would be eerily similiar. Given that opinion, if I can get a 1st for Quinn, I do it and don't look back. Same for Anderson. I simply believe Quinn would be more likely to fetch that pick. My ACTUAL preference is to keep them both and let the best man win.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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My .02
I just wanna win......plain simple and yes i know it's not that easy,
I'm so tired of hearing he's a savior, he's the real deal..he's this or he's that, My loyalty does not lye with a player , it lies with the Browns, which Lerner might own but even I'm getting to the point I'm starting to feel he might not have a clue about football talent and might think about selling the team if he cant get it right this time. I do believe Randy is committed to winning and trying to win, I just dont think he knows how to do it.
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I just want to say that I am officially on the Jay Cutler bandwagon. Cutler can throw the ball hard and accurately. He can run. He can carry a team on his back. Cutler is a proven Pro Bowl quarterback, something we haven't had with the Browns in a long time.
I like the thought of winning with a kid who grew up a Browns fan or a 6th round pick, but both of those QB's are not a sure thing.
If we traded for Cutler we would have a starting QB who has already had success in the NFL. He has carried teams on his back all by himself. And not only that, but he would have a major chip on his shoulder.
I do like Brady Quinn, I think if we held on to him he would have a chance at being a pretty good QB, it is not a foregone conclusion he will be a good starting QB. We just don't know. We have already seen Anderson's best season, and if he could repeat that then he is worth keeping for sure, but there is a chance he can't repeat that season.
With Cutler you don't leave anything to chance. You know you are getting a Pro Bowl caliber QB who is potentially great. And I would much rather have that then a possible starting QB.
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Quote:
well if quinn is traded for cutler, you can bet anderson will be traded too. that would be the benefit. quinn for cutler, trade anderson for a 3rd, and you have an established qb and another first day pick.
Quinn doesn't "deserve" anything other than a chance to fight for a starting spot. just because the prior regime game DA some starts doesn't mean it's "quinn's turn" now. if they're both here come TC, then they deserve to battle it out for the starting position. if it comes to that, and quinn can't win it, he didn't earn the field time.
That's what deserve meant,...if he gets traded, then the said deserved chance is gone. In case there is a doubt, I am done with Anderson. And if they do trade Quinn, then so be it.
So how many Super Bowls did this Cutler guy win ?
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So how many Super Bowls did this Cutler guy win ?
That's a fair question.
But for a team to win a Super Bowl they have to have at least some defense. Cutler has only started for two full seasons. In those two seasons the Broncos where ranked 28th and 30th in points allowed and he still won 7 games in 2007 and 8 in 2008.
Anytime you have the chance to get a 26 year old franchise QB you have do it. Especially if you don't already have one on the roster.
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Cutler is a proven Pro Bowl quarterback, something we haven't had with the Browns in a long time.
Cutler has as many pro bowl selections as Anderson. Just had to toss it out there. Personally I think Cutler is better than both of our QBs. At least with his ability. His leadership I have begun to have some serious questions with.
In times like these, Hal Lebovitz would remind us we didn't have a team for four years.
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Whining leadership should be questioned,....while I don't believe we know all of the facts in this Denver mess, I've heard enough to just say "stay away."
I am more into seeing how Mangini does as a real coach.
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