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Joined: Sep 2006
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Quote:
Every year, like you, I'm optimistic. Every year, I always expect good things to come from this team.
So what you're saying is that every year you're opinion is wrong, which means we're going to win BIG this year 
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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I think anyone who expects this team to do anything well before they actually see it should probably consider rehab for their crack addiction.
Seriously, this is a team that has backed into the playoffs once in the last 10 years. Why in the world would anyone expect them to perform in a winning manner before they actually see it?
We all hope they win, but frankly, I stopped expecting it a long time ago.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,070
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: May 2007
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Quote:
I think anyone who expects this team to do anything well before they actually see it should probably consider rehab for their crack addiction
C'mon man, you HAVE to give your team the benefit of the doubt at this time of year. I happen to enjoy the optomism right now, there's plenty of time left before I let the doom and gloom set in.
.....and no, I'm not addicted to crack yet.
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,833 |
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Quote:
I look at each corps;
QB: we are essentially the same
RB/ FB: same
TE: no KW2, but better blocking = same
WR: BE stays and we trade Robo for Dainty = about the same
OL: looks like we are a little better here
DL: more depth, a little better
LB: about the same
DB: a little better b/c of depth at CB
not much improvement IMO,but who knows
This would be true if half the team hadn't been on the bench with an injury or on IR at one time or another. I don't know if we EVER had all the projected starters on the field once last year ?
so what you are saying is that I'm speaking a half-truth. 
I'll buy that.... It's true that there were alot of injuries and then there was the strength of schedule. We prolly underperformed last year and over performed the year before.
two year record: 14-18
What I like about the personnel moves made this spring is an attempt to improve depth along with fiscal responisibility AKA getting the most bang for the buck.
But injuries are part of the game. Getting quality depth will help prevent the kind of drop-off we had this past year when the starters got injured, improve the special teams and give much needed rest to the starters.
I'm still not sold on St. Clair as a starter or Sorensen as a back-up, but I'm not discounting the fact that Magini might know a little more than me 
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,531
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Quote:
I think anyone who expects this team to do anything well before they actually see it should probably consider rehab for their crack addiction.
Seriously, this is a team that has backed into the playoffs once in the last 10 years. Why in the world would anyone expect them to perform in a winning manner before they actually see it?
We all hope they win, but frankly, I stopped expecting it a long time ago.
I'll tell you why I'm optimistic...
Offense:
-Quinn is entering his third year and if he's worth anything he'll play well enough to win a fair share of games assuming the defense isn't a joke.
-Alex Mack means the power running game will improve. Don't sleep on James Davis either.
-Edwards is entering a contract year...if he's not motivated by Mangini then he'll be motivated by $$$$$.
-Did I mention the power running game? Robert Royal and Steve Heiden help that too...hopefully a healthy Tucker does as well.
-I like the fact that we spent two second rounders on receivers rather than one first rounder...it increases the chances of one of them being able to contribute this year and it also gives us three potentially legitimate targets when we spread the field.
Defense:
-Wright and McDonald are entering their third years. How much they improve remains to be seen, but they will improve.
-Abram Elam is an upgrade over Sean Jones...how much remains to be seen, but Jones blew chunks.
-We addressed the run D with Barton and Coleman...it should help.
-We addressed our pass rush with Veikune and Hall entering his second year...this could stand to be better.
-We addressed our CB depth with Poteat, Ivy and those two 6th rounders...it increases our chances of having a productive nickel and dime package this year.
The roster 1-22 might not be significantly better (tho it is marginally better)...but 23-53 is much...MUCH better. That gives me hope.
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
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I think what we saw last year from Wright / McD was pretty good. Only thing that improves our pass defense this year is a pass rush (I don't expect our safeties/ coverage lbs to help much in that dep't this year.)
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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You can be optimistic all you want. I'm not trying to stop that.
But if you EXPECT them to win the division or make the playoffs or even just have a winning record history tells me you'll be disappointed.
As soon as I see them play a home opener like they mean it maybe I'll be as Pollyanna-like as you guys are.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
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The roster 1-22 might not be significantly better (tho it is marginally better)...but 23-53 is much...MUCH better. That gives me hope.
that pretty much sums it up right there. well put.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 989
All Pro
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All Pro
Joined: Aug 2007
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Do you measure success by only wins? Which most here seem to be doing.
I agree with ammo. Mangini has already gotten rid of the troublemakers and brought in personnel who he knows and ones he knows that are dedicated with good work ethic. He's building a team and creating work ethic. Having good chemistry in the locker room will improve this team from last year IMMEDIATELY.
I doesnt matter if we go 1-15 or 16-0... right now I would have to say that the personnel in place will come out and compete every game. Anything is better then the miserable offense we had last year and the defense that only played every other quarter and monday nights.
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Joined: Apr 2008
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Dawg Talker
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AMEN!!!
i think we will have a scrappy team, with some brains....and might sqeak out a couple that we would have lost last year!
#brownsgoodkarma
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,531
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Quote:
Do you measure success by only wins? Which most here seem to be doing.
I agree with ammo. Mangini has already gotten rid of the troublemakers and brought in personnel who he knows and ones he knows that are dedicated with good work ethic. He's building a team and creating work ethic. Having good chemistry in the locker room will improve this team from last year IMMEDIATELY.
I doesnt matter if we go 1-15 or 16-0... right now I would have to say that the personnel in place will come out and compete every game. Anything is better then the miserable offense we had last year and the defense that only played every other quarter and monday nights.
Uhhh...We'd better go better than 1-15...
I'm saying we're gonna have the personnel to surprise some people this year...think '08 Dolphins. If we make the playoffs we won't make it out of the first, but it'd be nice to just be there this year and get the bite back in the bark.
My biggest concern is our passrush, but I think Rob Ryan's scheme alone is going to help us out.
Last edited by Ammo; 05/04/09 07:11 PM.
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Joined: Oct 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,850 |
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Do you measure success by only wins? Which most here seem to be doing.
Ask Romeo Crennel that question!!! Of course you measure success by only wins!!!
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Joined: Aug 2007
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All Pro
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All Pro
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If you go out and compete and work hard the wins will come. Having no depth, poor coaching, and poor leadership like we did last year is embarrassing. If we dont have enough talent, thats one thing. But I'd still rather see them go out and compete and lose, then what we went through last year. I'm sorry ... I'm not the roll over and die type of person.
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Legend
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Legend
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So if the Browns hustled hard and lost every game by 3 or less points, and went 0-16... You would be fine with that?
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Joined: Aug 2007
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All Pro
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All Pro
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Yes if they came out and competed and not rolled over every game. If we lacked enough quality personnel but the team gave its all every game. I can live with that. But the rolling over and dying and giving up in the 2nd quarter is unacceptable.
Dont get me wrong... I dont enjoy losing, but I would rather cheer for a team (good or bad) if they came to play. The circus that was here last year needs not to return.
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Joined: Apr 2007
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Legend
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Legend
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We are bringing in close to 30 new players.
Because of competition we should be better. Hopefully we have some personal growth from players like Alex Hall and others. Sometimes it takes a few years to see what a player can contribute.
We have brought in a bunch of LB's and DB's. Hopefully we will find some guys that will help. We brought in DL guys and OL guys. Each unit has additions that have played for Mangini or were brought here for a specific reasons (like Royal the Buffalo TE). All should help in the development of the others.
The X factor is Mangini. Romeo missed on many levels. The players liked him and wanted to play for him. The problems, which have been well documented, were game planning, game adjustments, game management, and player development.
Just being a head coach.
Mangini is going to create his brand. We will find out how that translates to wins. We have seen some changes and more will come.
Of course quarterback play means a lot. Quinn is starting his third year. It's now or never. I have always thought he has what it takes. But until verified and validated we just don't know. I am optimistic.
I think the team has been upgraded in the areas where improvement was needed.
How much? Who knows.There are so many factors that play out over the year that predicting is impossible. I never saw the 10-6 season coming. Last year if you had told me would lose 12 games I would have challenged you outright and bet my first born.
So you learn. The only constant for me is> I hate losing and I want to win really bad. I will back the team as I have always done. I would sure like my reward for having been doing it now since 1959 when I was 12. It's been a long time (1964) between drinks.
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Joined: Oct 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,850 |
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I can live with that. But the rolling over and dying and giving up in the 2nd quarter is unacceptable.
 You can?  ... Cuz I would be pissed off, and upset wondering why our team can execute and win atleast one game.... 
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Posts: 6,445
Hall of Famer
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The biggest point of emphasis for me is the new coaching staff. Don't get me wrong, I like the new players we brought in as well, but it's hard to evaluate players based on what they did in college and in shorts during workouts so I'm not even going to try. I trust Mr. Kokinis and Co.
Some of the stuff from Mangini's pressers and the rookie camp footage really jumped out at me. First is that Mangini runs some tough practices, teaches football, and expects discipline. He's also bringing in some smart players and one of the phrases that constantly comes up is 'the ability to process information'. In my eyes, this should translate to players being where they are supposed to be, when they are supposed to be there. If the QB throws the ball to the right spot and the WR is in the wrong spot (or vise versa), nothing good comes from that-- I think we saw enough of that last year. That's just one example.
I think all the Jets players we brought in will help speed up the learning process. Just off the top of my head I know we have Herron in the backfield, Patten with the wideouts, Ratliff with the QBs, Barton n Bowens at LB, Elam in the defensive backfield, Coleman with the D linemen, and if Mack is as smart as he thinks he is we might be able to include him with the O-line as a 'Mangini' guy. Regardless, hopefully these guys help within their respective position groups to help teach the system.
The coaching staff is also utilizing some new stuff with technology to help train and communicate with the new players that should help.
All in all, I'm expecting this team to get better, quickly. I think we'll be able to compete this year definitely.. contending might be a bit further off. As I've said before though I think we are super lucky to have this regime in place, but they ARE taking over that has had 4 wins in 2 of the last 3 years, just something to think about.
For now I'm going to stick with my 7-9 prediction.
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Not that they aren't necessarily Mangini guys, but Patten and Herron weren't J-E-T-S last season. Patten was with the Saints and Herron was with Tampa Bay (at least for part of the season, I think) and never touched a ball in '08. Just FYI... 
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Joined: Apr 2007
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Hall of Famer
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Ahh yeah, good catch. Mangini and Patten were both in NE from 02-04 though, and Herron had a future contract with the Jets in Jan-Feb last year, although that probably won't make much of a difference.
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1st String
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1st String
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The coaching staff really deserves attention and gives me hope for a winning season - and expectations that the team will compete. 1. This is the first time the Browns have hired a coach with actual head coaching experience in over 35 years. Think about that... Not only is the guy experienced, but he has coached in the playoffs! The playoffs. It's remarkable the Jets fired him after a winning season. Watching how he runs camp and the discipline he enforces, it's obvious that he understands how to manage a team... We're not talking about Rich Kotite here. 2. This team was talented enough to finish 8-8 last season, but injuries and poor coaching led to a collapse. Since then, the front office has infused more field-ready players than any other team in the league. The players might not be pro-bowlers, but they can contribute - we will not have to watch Terry Cousin!!! 3. Clear improvement in the trenches. Argue all you want about whether Mack was taken too early, but he is a first round talent, arguably the best interior lineman in the draft, and definitely better than Hank Fraley. Elsewhere, we see smart additions - and Shaun Rogers sounds happy to be playing for Mangini. Can we expect this team to go to the playoffs? No. Can we expect this team to perform as well as any other team with a new coach? Except for the Colts - YES. It's remarkable how fans and the media get excited about fresh coaches with positive stories and high expectations of success. Meanwhile, returning coaches rarely get attention (excluding those with big names or Super Bowls on their resumes). There are 11 new head coaches, and only Mangini and Mora (in Seattle) have experience. Ready or not: Breaking down new coaches' chances of winning in '09 - Don Banks, SI.comQuote:
Ready to win from day one...
3. Cleveland -- I talked to one league observer this week who believes Eric Mangini is temperamentally a much better fit in Cleveland than he was under the unforgiving bright lights of New York, and that will translate into a decent shot of having early success. I tend to agree the intense, ultra-focused Mangini will bring a sense of discipline and diligence to a Browns team that was a chaotic mess last season, just as he quickly injected the Jets with renewed purpose as a rookie head coach in 2006.
Mangini should also benefit from inheriting a defense whose players were picked to suit the 3-4 formation he runs. After all, Mangini has experience at taking over a Romeo Crennel defense and winning with it, just as he did in New England in 2005. We're also counting on Mangini's New York tenure to teach him something about what does and doesn't work in the NFL. Our gut tells us he'll be a better, more seasoned head coach this time, with a better radar for separating the important from the non-essential parts of the job. It doesn't hurt a bit that he and Browns owner Randy Lerner already have a well-formed friendship.
This is shaping up to be an exciting season to watch the Browns. Honestly, I don't recognize this team. I haven't seen a coach and front office who knew what they were doing since 1988 when Marty was in charge. We've had a bunch of bumbling knuckleheads for so many years, I think many don't know what to think. We can have rational expectations that this team will be competitive - not like one-third of the teams are gambling on coaches who have never proven themselves in the position...
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
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Quote:
This is shaping up to be an exciting season to watch the Browns. Honestly, I don't recognize this team. I haven't seen a coach and front office who knew what they were doing since 1988 when Marty was in charge. We've had a bunch of bumbling knuckleheads for so many years, I think many don't know what to think. We can have rational expectations that this team will be competitive - not like one-third of the teams are gambling on coaches who have never proven themselves in the position...
Hate to be a wet blanket... but that's what everyone said when CreVage got here.
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum So will we becapable of competing
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