DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Cavaliers & FA Options...July 1st...

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2009/06/cleveland_cavaliers_free_agenc.html

It is expected some veterans will perhaps look for contracts that allow them to become free agents again next summer when there is more money available. Also, there is a belief that role players will see much smaller offers than in years past and will weigh other factors in making their decision, such as weather and how competitive the teams are.

Which is where the Cavaliers come in.

They do not have cap space but do have their salary-cap exceptions: the mid-level of around $5.6 million and the bi-annual of $2 million. What puts them at an advantage is they actually expect to use the exceptions while many teams don't because owner Dan Gilbert is willing to pay the luxury tax and create the best environment to re-sign James next summer.

In addition, the Cavs have never used their full mid-level or any of their bi-annual exceptions since Danny Ferry became the team's general manager in 2005. Nor in that time has Ferry been active in looking at other teams' free agents.

So expect the Cavs to be significant players in the first few weeks of free agency, even if it isn't for the top names on the market.

Which players will they be going after? Here is a comprehensive look:

The likely untouchables

With a big-spending owner and already a lot of star power, Cavs fans may get excited about these names on the market. But salary-cap rules and other realities will probably keep the Cavs away. Most of it is because of the difficulty to complete the sign-and-trade deals these players would require.

Hedo Turkoglu, F, Magic -- May be moving on from Orlando because of the Vince Carter trade but won't be coming to Cleveland. In any scenario, even the unrealistic ones fans are e-mailing in, the Magic would have to play ball, and there's no chance of that. He's leaving $7 million on the table to walk and will be getting a large raise somewhere.

Carlos Boozer, F, Jazz -- Before Shaq, it could have worked, but now the Cavs don't seem to have the assets to pull it off.

Ron Artest, F, Rockets -- Houston needs him back badly, and there already are enough personalities on the Cavs.

Shawn Marion, F, Raptors -- He will come at a better price but will have better options.

Ben Gordon, G, Bulls -- The Cavs already have a player much like him in Mo Williams.

Lamar Odom, F, Lakers -- Wants to stay in L.A., and champs want him back.


The wealthy veterans

These free agents are not only past their prime but past their massive contracts as well. This makes them a good fit as role players on a team prepared to challenge for a championship because they all have some gas left in the tank and plenty of experience.

Jason Kidd, PG, Mavs -- Fit perfectly with LeBron with Team USA and hinted in March he could see himself in Cleveland next season. But the Mavericks can pay him more money, and it looks like they are ready to do that. Plus, his role in Dallas would be bigger.

Rasheed Wallace, F/C, Pistons -- Quality defender who can play multiple positions and stretch the floor with his shooting ability and has a championship on his resume. Seems like a good fit for the Cavs, though his temperament is always a question, and he will have plenty of other suitors.

Antonio McDyess, F/C, Pistons -- Many of the same qualities as Wallace but would come at a cheaper price and with less on-court tension. The Cavs tried hard to sign him last season, but he went to Detroit, and he may stay there. The Cavs certainly will be giving him a call.

Joe Smith, F, Cavs -- The Cavs already have gotten their hands on him twice and will consider it again. He also figures to attract attention throughout the league.

Grant Hill, G/F, Suns -- Still a quality perimeter player and locker room asset. Said he doesn't want to leave Phoenix, but times there are changing, and he has a connection to Shaq and a Duke connection to Danny Ferry.

The wing options

These players fit a significant need for the Cavs -- long, perimeter-based players. The Cavs always prefer good defenders as they have often had to put Delonte West at size disadvantages, but they also could use players who can hit spot-up jumpers as LeBron and Shaq will get them open looks. Of all the calls the Cavs make Wednesday, they will be focusing heavily on these types of players.

Trevor Ariza, Lakers -- Tall, good defender, above-average shooter. A perfect fit except he's from L.A. and doesn't want to leave the Lakers. There's a chance they won't be able to afford him, but most likely he's going nowhere.

Flip Murray, Hawks -- An undervalued player who is an excellent scorer and has improved his outside shot. He was the seventh-leading scorer off the bench in the NBA last season and had the second-most steals of any reserve behind Ariza. The Hawks have hinted they would like to retain him.

Matt Barnes, Suns -- Another lanky wing who is a solid shooter and has the size the Cavs want. His defense is a question, but he has the tools. Excellent spot-up shooter and good in transition going to the rim.

Anthony Parker, Raptors -- The Raptors love him and may not let him walk, but they have cap space and other needs. It is well known the Cavs attempted to sign him when he came over from the Euroleague three years ago, and the tall, smooth shooter is very much still on their radar.

Dahntay Jones, Nuggets -- Unheralded player with stats that won't impress many, but has worked to establish himself as a strong outside defender with good size. Was an overlooked key in the Nuggets' success last season.

Desmond Mason, Thunder -- Limited offensively and coming off an injury but also one of the better wing defenders in the league and fits the Cavs' character requirements. Won't be the Cavs' first choice, but they certainly will have him on their list.


The restricted choices

These players are restricted free agents, which means their teams can in most cases match any offer they receive. In the past, restricted free agents almost never left unless there were rare sign-and-trades, but in the current market, some could be pried free because their teams are concerned about payroll.

Charlie Villanueva, F, Bucks -- A classic "stretch" big man who has excellent size (6-11) and can hit the outside shot and rebound. Questionable defensively but still young and learning. Bucks appear to be making moves to keep him.

Channing Frye, F, Blazers -- Another young, talented, stretch power forward who has good shooting range. He had his best season as a rookie and has since regressed after being sent to a crowded team in Portland. That could make him unneeded and undervalued, two things that make him a possible fit for the Cavs.

Josh Childress, F, Hawks -- A good, long and intelligent wing player. He left the Hawks to play in Greece last season, but many teams remain interested. He may stay overseas but has the option to get out of his Greek contract.

David Lee, F/C, Knicks -- Has developed into a stat-sheet stuffer in New York, especially as a rebounder. Knicks may not keep him as they look to protect 2010 cap space.

Hakim Warrick, F, Grizzlies -- Not as good a shooter or as tall as Villanueva or Frye but an excellent athlete who converts at a high percentage and is an excellent scorer. Fairly good rebounder.

Glen Davis, F, Celtics -- Big Baby has been a key contributor for the Celtics the past two seasons and likely will stay there.

Leon Powe, F, Celtics -- He's going to miss the start of next season due to another major knee injury. He could be taken with a big offer, but with the uncertainty over his current injury and past injuries, chances are he stays with the Celtics on a short deal.

I'd love Ariza and/or David Lee.

OK .... here's what I don't understand .....

The Cavaliers had Wallace and Wally. Thyey traded Wallace's expiring contract for Shaq ... but don't we get some sort of cap adjustment for Wally's expired contract? I thought that expired conrracts opened up some cap space?

it did, but the cavs were already over the salary cap. losing wally just brought them down near the cap. not under

I was under the impression that they would still be able to use that as some sort of exemption.

Does that then mean that Shaq's "$20 million" might not equate to an actual $20 million in 2010?

Would it be better for the Cavaliers for Lebran on sign his deal after they go out and add pieces next off-season? (Since I understand that they can re-sign one of their own no matter what)

not sure on the actual numbers, but the exemptions are the bi-anual exception, and the mid-level exception. Think together they are like 7mil the cavs can still spend.

5.5 for the mid, maybe 2mil for the bi-annual.


Shaq and Z's large contracts both come off the books next year. They will have money next season to do with what they want.

This year the cavs have both exceptions, and can still sign anderson verejao and joe smith back, although they are over the cap already.


Lebron signing at anytime would be a good thing, as it will show next years class that he is gonna be here and if they want to win a championship to sign on

yeah. z, shaq, and lebron are all off the books next year.

the cavs hope to turn that into a lebron 3 or 6 year deal, and turn z and shaq into chris bosh.

There's been a lot of talk on the Villanueva front. Apparently Milwaukee is highly unlike to give him a qualifying offer, which would make him a UFA. The question is whether any team is going to step up and offer him more than the MLE.

Luckily there are really only three teams, Detroit, Memphis and OKC, who have money to offer over the MLE, and who also need a PF. Detroit will likely be signing Boozer. David Lee is likely next in the pecking order. Does the third team offer Villanueva $7 million a year? Or does CV slip to the MLE level. He's young, so he'd certainly take the bigger contract, regardless of where he'd be playing.

If there, it looks very likely that he'd be a Cav. He's made several tweets about how much he likes what the cavs are doing, and they need a shooting PF. These tweets were subsequently taken down, because it's pre-FA period, and you can't say that.

He's a perfect offensive fit for the Cavs, he has legit 3PT range, and has a great jump shot. Defensively, he's always been known to be lazy, but he's athletic enough to play good D, and he was in milwaukee, where they don't play D anyway (same complaints we heard about Williams)

It will be a very interesting week.

I'd love to Sign CV at a 4 year max MLE, and then resign AV, because he'd be a great foil to shaq and CV off of the bench. Then I think we try to set up a trade like Hickson+Gibson+Wally S&T (for salary matching purposes) to Houston in exchange for a Ron Artest sign and trade. And then we get some combo guard at the Biannual exception.

Our team would look like:

Williams, West, BAE
Artest, West, BAE
LBJ, Artest
CV, AV, Jackson
Shaq, Z, AV


That team is sick. Another option is to S&T AV. I think a good destination would be Dallas as part of a deal for Josh Howard (AV+Gibson for Howard+JJ Barea?). Then we can resign Joe Smith again to play backup PF, and we'll be able to give Hickson/Jackson the rest of the minutes. We'd have a lineup like this:

Williams, Barea
Howard, West
LBJ, Howard
CV, Smith, Hickson, Jackson
Shaq, Z

~Lyuokdea

Charlie V has a good chance to land in Cleveland this year. He seems to want to come (hinted about it several times on twitter).


Would be a good addition to go along with the Big Snowplow.

here is a list of salaries for the cavs.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/cleveland.htm

You are right.. Charlie's tweets have been classic.. I don't have a twitter account, but I have been following his account online..

For those interested, here is a link to follow Charlie V.. Gotta like the fact that he is diggin the love from Cavs fans!

http://twitter.com/CV31

There's now way Vilanueve signs for the MLE. He averaged 16 & 8 last year, plus he's only 24. Varejo was offered 6 million a year by charlotte, and he's just a hustle player. If we do get him, it will have to be sign and trade. But from I understand he will be a base year compensation player, and those are difficult to trade.

he just may take a 1 year full mid level exception and then either be signed long term by cleveland, or go into the free agent bonanza of 2010.

Dude seems to really want to come to Cleveland and has to know what kinda money we have to offer.

Just a question here, If we sign CV or Artest to a one year MLE deal, at what 6 million. I know it's not much for these players, but can't Nike tell them, you go play with LeBron and Shaq and we will give you like a 10 million bonus to make up the difference?

Not sure if it is allowed, probably not but I'm sure Nike would do this if LeBron asked them. Now I'm not talking about this being advertised, I'm sure it would have to be behind closed doors.

You probably heard it from me, and I was wrong.

When you have a player on your roster and wish to exercise the Bird rights, his old contract still counts on your cap (plus something like an extra 10%). So if we have enough cap room AFTER you count Lebron's current contract on next year's cap number ... then we could sign Bosh. But we do have quite a bit coming off.

To answer YTown's question ... only Wally's contract came off our cap this year. Ben's contract expired next year, and we essentially swapped it for Shaq's contract. I don't know what "buying out" a contract does to a cap figure ... maybe you can erase it if you trade for a contract that you then "buy out"? ... but I know would of had Ben on the cap for this year. Next year though, we'll have pretty much $50 million in cap space, depending on the length of contracts we hand out this off season.

wow, yao out for possibly the whole '09-'10 season.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-yaorockets062909&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

sounds like a lot like someone we know.

Indiana is gonna let Marquis Daniels hit free agency. Is he worth a look or too injury prone?

they trade Richard Jefferson, draft a PG (Jennings) and now let their starting PF go for free.....wow.

I can't believe it, but it looks like all obstacles are now clear to us getting a young PF to pair with Shaq down-low and make our frontline extremely formidable.



http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4295423

MILWAUKEE -- The Milwaukee Bucks have made qualifying offers to restricted free agents Ramon Sessions and Ersan Ilyasova, but will not make an offer to Charlie Villanueva.

Bucks general manager John Hammond said Monday the offers to Sessions and Ilyasova give them the right to match contract offers from other teams. Villanueva will be free to sign with any team.

NBA teams have until Tuesday to make qualifying offers to their restricted free agents.

Hammond says he did not want to elaborate on the reasons for the decisions

jc.....

I'd like to see a debate about the pluses and minuses of moving LBJ to the 4 and bringing in a small forward.

I'm not an NBA expert but it seems to me at some point in his career this will happen and it seems to me that it'd be very beneficial to LeBron and the Cavs right now.

He has the low post game and the pick and roll game to make it work. If he's being guarded by the average PF away from the basket you couldn't get a bigger mismatch.

And he's plenty big enough to guard the low post.

Why hasn't this happened?

#1 PFs take a ton more physical abuse. We would be subjecting James to much more physical pounding over the 82 game season.

#2 PFs rack up more fouls. He would have to help a ton more and in many instances the proper play is to foul to prevent the layup. We don't want LeBron in foul trouble.

#3 He hasn't developed his post moves, which is because LeBron likes playing the perimeter. Sure, Orlando plays PF on the perimeter, but we don't have Dwight commanding doubles in the middle. To space the floor properly, you need guys inside and out and spread across the floor. With LeBron at the 4, we would have an overbalance to the outside.

#4 The best PF we could possibly get on the market is CharlieV. The best SF we could get is Marion (I don't think Artest is really on the market). CharlieV is younger and better than Marion at this point. So, go get CharlieV and use LeBron at PF in spurts when needed.

If we can't get CV maybe we could get Marquis Daniels. At 6'6 and a decent defender he could be the tall SG we need.


Pacers won't pick up Daniels' option

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4294765

INDIANAPOLIS -- The Indiana Pacers will not exercise their team option on guard Marquis Daniels.


Daniels' agent, Glenn Schwartzman, told The Associated Press in an e-mail on Monday that the Pacers have indicated that they will not pay the final year of the deal. Daniels would have made $7.3 million next season, but now he's an unrestricted free agent.

Daniels averaged a career-high 13.6 points per game last season, but Brandon Rush emerged late and is the favorite to start at shooting guard next season.

Daniels has been successful during his three years as a Pacer, but he missed 73 games the past three seasons with an assortment of injuries.

A Pacers spokesman says the team cannot comment on the situation until free agency officially begins Wednesday.

no logo nailed it down.

lebron is best as a 4 when used sparingly...

throw him out there to make the team smaller....

i wouldn't wanna see him play the 4 exclusively. we need his legs.

i can't believe milwaukee didn't make an offer to charlie v. maybe he told them not to behind closed doors?

i think our chances have been raised significantly...

the guy has potential... i think if brown can get in his head, to be more physical... 6'11, 232 the guy has some size...

Wow ... they didn't resign! Let us hope.

more doors are opening which leave us more options, that's for damn sure...

going to be very interesting when the market open here in a few days...

CV becomes a CAV.... I have a feeling.

Will we have to do anything to make it happen? Cap room?

I also have a feeling that Villanueva really wants to play here. I just hope the dollars can be worked out somehow. The stars have certainly seem to have aligned to allow it to happen if both sides so desire.

If he'll take the MLE, then we don't have to do anything with the cap room...

anyone follow shaq's twitter...funny stuff going on over there.. he'll fit right in here

http://twitter.com/THE_REAL_SHAQ

Follow Villanueva's Twitter...his name is CV31. Cavs fans are showing him the love apparently.

that they are....


A while back (maybe a week ago now?) someone asked Charlie V which is more likely Cleveland or Milwaukee. They said they know he can't answer out right so to use code for which movie he preferes, Hangover being Cleveland and Year One being Mil. He chose Hangover.


And to the poster who asked about Nike stepping in and offering more money to players to play with LeBron....

I would find that highly unlikely as Nike doesn't want to catch any wrath if word were to leak out. Could cost them bigtime.

Now the new Chinese investors would be more likely to be able to "offer" things that other teams can't via exposure in their market. Even that is probably unlikely though.

I don't think a bigger guard is needed as much as a good Power Forward is. We got nothing out of that position with Ben,Joe, and Andy late in the playoffs.

Shaq alone allows us to stop doubling Howard EVERY possesion next season.

I should really try and learn the ins and outs of the NBA salary cap .....

It seems as though using both exceptions we currently have, along with re-signing Varegao nd Lebron would take us out of 2010. I don't know how that works ..... but that's basically what this article says .....

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2009/06/cleveland_cavaliers_target_unr.html

The NBA is changing by the day and, it seems, it always affects the Cavaliers.

In a move that was considered shocking in corners Monday, the Milwaukee Bucks decided not to offer young free-agent power forward Charlie Villanueva a qualifying offer to make him a restricted free agent. He now will be unrestricted, which makes him significantly easier to sign because the Bucks will not have matching rights. According to sources, Villanueva now will be one of the Cavs' free-agent targets when teams are allowed to speak with them Wednesday.

The Cavs have their midlevel exception, expected to be around $5.6 million to $5.8 million, to offer in the first year of a contract. Villanueva's qualifying offer would have been $4.6 million. His salary last season was $3.4 million. Several teams with more salary cap space, such as the Detroit Pistons and Oklahoma City Thunder, might have interest in Villanueva, who averaged 16.2 points and 6.7 rebounds in 27 minutes per game for the Bucks.


Extending qualifying offers, which are not binding, usually are a formality for players in his class. The Bucks, who have financial problems that already prompted them to trade Mo Williams to the Cavs last summer and Richard Jefferson to the Spurs last week, decided to move on after trading for Amir Johnson from the Pistons as part of the Jefferson deal. With the current state of the economy, more and more teams are having to make such financial decisions.

Villanueva, a 6-11 24-year-old coming off a career-best season, has been flirting with the idea of coming to the Cavs in recent weeks on his Twitter account. Last Thursday, he hinted all the Cavs needed after trading for Shaquille O'Neal was a power forward. In a message Sunday, he thanked Cavs fans who have been contacting him via the social messaging network.

Monday afternoon, he thanked Bucks fans on his Twitter feed and wrote: "Now its on Gods hands (sic), where will I end up, only time will tell."

Villanueva has a good relationship with Williams, who became close to him the two seasons they played together in Milwaukee. Williams could serve as a recruiter much in the same way he helped bring another of his close friends to the Cavs, former Bucks teammate Joe Smith, when he was a free agent last March.

Villanueva also has a long-standing relationship with LeBron James. The two were in the same high school class and played with each other in various tournaments and summer camps as they were growing up. Following their senior year of high school, Villanueva and James became closer while taking part in two national All-Star Games, including the McDonald's All-American Game in Cleveland. They have kept in touch ever since.

The Cavs have been looking for a "stretch" power forward like Villanueva for some time. Because he is a good mid-range and decent long-range shooter (35 percent on 3-pointers last season), he is potentially a good fit alongside players such as James and Williams, who like to drive and kick out passes. Add in O'Neal, who succeed earlier in his career with stretch power forwards such as Robert Horry in Los Angeles and Antoine Walker in Miami, and that option creates an even better fit.

The team is expected to consider other players this week who can play that role, including Rasheed Wallace and Antonio McDyess.

The decision to seriously go after Villanueva is part of a larger decision the team must make. Do they go attempt to go after some older players and get them on one-year contracts to preserve the chance at the 2010 free-agent mega class? Or do they not follow the crowd of teams who are protecting cap space for 2010 and take advantage of being a buyer in a sellers' market and create a stronger core now?

Using the entire midlevel exception on a player like Villanueva, using the biannual exception of $2 million on a wing player and re-signing Anderson Varejao would pretty much take the Cavs out of the 2010 market for the top names besides re-signing James.

By trading for O'Neal, whose contract -- along with Zydrunas Ilgauskas' -- ends after the coming season, the Cavs are currently in position to re-sign James and add another player with a maximum level contract while also hanging on to Williams and Delonte West.