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As I said U tell the team who the starter is..this is NO ADVANTAGE not telling the team as soon as you're decided...name another position that a coach wouldn't name the starter immediately to the team even if the public doesn't know????
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Just some last minute notes on this riveting subject 
1. The Secret...I wanted the starter to be named by game 3 (traditionally when it is done - and was by all the other teams with QB competitions).
Not that it has been held close to the vest this far...I could care less if its done one more week. Might as well use the Advantage of stealth and what ever it can give us to an Infrequent opponent, since we kept the decision back this far.
I'm sure Mangini is confident that there hasn't been a rift of sides being taken so that the team will struggle to rally behind the named starter. I also believe he is confident that the Entire team really knows who the winner is.
2. Why BQ will be the STARTER! Little doubt in my mind...there is that 1% messing with me saying its...DA, its DA - Noooooo 
In the 3rd game against a pretty good Defense playing hard.
BQ saw something on a route that they had ran with BE...he took it to Daboll (nice that he's on the sidelines  ) and stated the next time we call that route with BE if we make this adjustment on this D...its money! Daboll trusted him and they put the adjusted route in.
There we were driving and in the RedZone...called the adjusted route...TD!
I know part of Mangini's Mantra for a winning team is COMMUNICATION - TRUST - FINISH! Don't know the 4th part but these 3 I have picked up to be in my coaching mantra  but more important there was BQ exhibiting Mangini's Mantra to its fullest. It is for this reason and I"m sure there are more similar things...like last year in training camp - in Goal line situations BQ was practicing throwing the ball at many different arm angles...and soon after there was DA joining him in the routine. But these details to situational football is what will get BQ the starting QB position...not poplularity, not cause Randy demands it, not cause the girls love him. Cause he's the better QB pure n simple.
3. Also another tell tale sign is more than once Mangini has stated that one QB has got better progressively and that is who will win the competition. DA? same old DA looked like a champ against the Lions. Couldn't move the chains to get the same amount of reps that BQ got. Still threw INTs on a bad read or another simple High Pct pass. I did not think DA played bad...he just didn't Improve on his play.
Where BQ looked better with each game. So that one QB did show that they can GROW into this offense and make it better. Also the movement of Chains is so, so big for the Defense!! And the game of field position against the tough teams!
So I'm 99% sure its BQ...I thought DA played OK and showed once again he does belong in the NFL. But I thought BQ played better and has shown more apt to grow and actually get better as the Offense gels.
Just can't get that 1% out of my head.
 JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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I just wonder .... if the choice is Quinn .... and he struggles .... how long before those who called his name with such reverance in the pre-season begin calling for his head?
I give it until halftime for those calling Anderson's name with such reverance. 
Anderson has had far more experience behind center and he can't beat Quinn out, and I think it's silly to act like they have had equal time to show who is better. That's what Anderson fans seem to want people to believe, that doesn't fly.
Anderson had his time, and quite frankly, I wasn't impressed.
You have to give Quinn the reins and let him go.. If you continue to go back and forth then he is done and we are drafting another QB. If he is your guy, then he is you guy.. He will struggle at times and at other times he will look really good. Playing Pitt and and Baltimore twice a year will be where he most likely struggles, but it will be good for him..
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Frankly, the fact that some maroons might boo the starter when he's introduced on Sunday would be one (albeit a small one) of the reasons I'd name the guy as early as possible this week. Give the vocal majority a chance to cool off before gametime.
I also cannot believe that so many intelligent posters are buying into the "don't reveal the starter's name, it's an advantage over the Vikes" BS that the Browns are spreading.
C'mon, both these guys are pocket passers. Neither of whom would put the fear of God into a Pop Warner team at this point in the season. Seriously? An advantage? We'd have more of an advantage if we turn off the hot water to their lockerroom, for God's sake.
And one last rant......Please, all the DA people, quit mentioning that Pro Bowl berth your boy got. He backed in because another QB wanted a break after the season. Then when he did get in he looked so bad the coaches were thinking of calling up Ryan Leaf. Sheesh......ya gotta give that Pro Bowl reference a decent burial.......
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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J/C
So Mangini thinks we will have an advantage by forcing the Vikings to prepare for a QB that is accurate on shorter passes and another that can throw the deep ball? In other words, our two QBs combined have the abilities of most of the QB's in the league not named Chad Pennington? If thats actually the case with Quinn and Anderson, if they are really that much of polar opposites in their respective skill sets, then we have a problem no matter who starts. I happen to think DA can throw the short pass and that BQ can throw the deep ball, in which case Mangini's little ploy is just bush league.
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What has he done to deserve it? He hasn't been able to separate himself from BQ since his pro-bowl year...
Not for nothin, but BQ hasn't really been able to seperate himself from DA either.
I'm gonna say this now,, and I hope to hell I'm wrong.., But I'm not really sure we have the right QB on this team at all.. WE don't have a Big Ben or Tom Brady or Even a Matt Ryan... At least it's not completely apparent that we do..
I fear that we may be looking for another guy soon... that's discouraging... But it may be accurate.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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j/c
I'm going to take the chance to end this deadbeat with one final, epic post, the likes of which have never been seen before. (Refs: Feel free to lock the thread after this post )
First, the Mangini issue. There is no reason whatsoever for the Browns to name a starter. I'm willing to put money on the fact that the coaches know who the guy is, the quarterbacks know who the guy is, and the team knows who the guy is. No one else needs to know. I doubt anyone on here would say that Quinn and DA are similar quarterbacks. So, the fact of the matter is that the Vikings will spend time preparing for both of them. If Quinn is the starter, they will do more underneath coverage and, I think, blitz less. If DA's the starter they will do more deep coverage, and blitz a little more, but not much.
As for who should be the starter, I like Quinn. I think he will be as well. I can respect someone respecting DA, and he has obvious strengths, but I am in favor of Quinn. He showed me a lot more in the preseason (not his QB rating is 30 points higher than DA's), I think he is a better leader, and I like his style of play better. He takes less risks than DA, is more accurate, and is a high completion guy (note his completion % this preseason is 10 points higher than DA's). He doesn't get quite the yards per attempt of DA, but he keeps the ball moving, and you get a sense that he is in control of the offense. He is ideal for the ball control offense that Mangini favors.
With that said, I'm not knocking DA (okay, I am a little). I think he is a decent to good quarterback, and a great backup. He is loaded with talent, and has an arm most can only dream of. I just can't stand his terrible decisions and awful throws anymore. He's made too many of them for me. I compare him to JaMarcus Russell. Immensely talented, but no intangibles.
As for those who say "Quinn's had a chance to earn the starting job, but he hasn't, so he must suck". Not an exact quote, but you get the point. When has he had a chance to win the starting job? Until now, never. His rookie year, he missed time holding out and was never in the competition. Last year, DA was the starter going into camp and there wasn't a competition. Midseason, he got the start before breaking a finger. I don't see how he's ever had a chance in the past.
Then it was brought up that Quinn was rated as a 3rd rounder by the Sporting News. First, I'd like to point out that the Sporting News is the joke of the NFL Draft community. Scott Wright meanwhile, is the most respected NFL Draft expert out there. He had Quinn as his 2nd overall prospect behind Calvin Johnson (ahead of Joe Thomas), and in his top 5 QB's ever. link
Despite my preference of Quinn, I will support DA if he is named the guy. I think we can win with him, and that's all I care about. But somehow, I have a feeling that if it is DA, our fans will boo him when he comes out onto the field. That would/will be truly embarrassing.
I personally like an idea posted earlier (I think it was YTown, but I could be wrong). Leak who the starter is, then start the other guy.
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"Not for nothin, but BQ hasn't really been able to seperate himself from DA either."
But he has...both statistically and also with the intangibles. And the sample base is pretty small and yet slowly the statistics leaned towards BQ as close to a full game came from the 3. While DA once again proved to be DA that we have seen for his cumulative 27 starts. Not horrific but not good enough to beat the good teams consistently - which is needed in a Championship run.
Again as for the preparation...there is distinctive preparation regarding both QBs - more 8 in the box with BQ and tight coverage....force him over top to beat you. Reward for blitzes might not be as often due to BQ's mobility and hot read abilities.
With DA more Zone deeper coverage...look at the QB and jump routes - force him to throw Underneath to beat you. Make him move laterally out of the pocket.
Definitely two distinct preparation. How much will it be an advantage? Well I think they might work in their Packer D for BQ and their Cutler D for DA???
But as for our point...if the team knows and they do. And we kept it unofficial this long (something I didn't like but it was done) - does it really matter that we keep the MEDIA/FANS from knowing for this first game...One - keeping it from the Vikings...there is a "SLIGHT" advantage. Two - keeping it from the MEDIA that btw has shown SOOOooo much love to Mangini lol  means absolutely SQUAT.
So it doesn't bother me as much as not naming the QB before the Titans game.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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That wasn't epic ...that was a replay of 1000+threads/posts/ QB debates over the last 9 years.. 
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I guess I failed then. 
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" First, I'd like to point out that the Sporting News is the joke of the NFL Draft community."
What a RAG they have become...once one of the best - now, I have canceled my subscription
In agreement with what you stated - how can anyone use TSN as proof of anything.
JMHAgreement
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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I guess I failed then.
And then some......
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That's a good post. I don't get why people are saying the Vikings won't have to prepare differently for the two QB's. One thing I disagree with, Deep is if it's BQ, the Vikings will blitz more. A LOT more. DA is at his best when facing a blitz and man to man coverage. If he has to sit in the pocket and try to pick apart a zone... Forget about it. If it's DA, the Vikings will sit back in a Cover 2 all day, and let DA beat himself. If it's BQ, they will try to bring pressure on a kid making only his 3rd NFL start. But, either way, it's going to be BQ, and anyone who thinks otherwise is just foolish. Let's just hope he can get the job done. I think he can 
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I guess I failed then.
Epic Failure.
Nice try, though.
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I'm hoping everyone realizes that opening statement was a joke.
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which is why when Quinn is in teams are able to put 8 guys in the box without much worry about getting beat deep.
At least with DA defenses have to worry about the deep ball which opens up our running game. Lets face it, the Browns are going to have to pass to set up the run because our offensive line is quite solid in pass pro but mediocre when it comes to getting a push on running plays. Anderson gives the Browns the best chance to win right now. This is going to be his 3rd NFL season as a starting quarterback, the 3rd year is often the year where it all comes together for many NFL players. Hopefully it all comes together for Anderson. I think that it will.
So you claim that BQ can't throw a deep ball, because of what? his vast 97 attempts as a body of work? Or not taking into account the retardedly conservitive play calling from the coaches last year? That is a claim that has zero validity, just because somone doesn't have an arm like marino doesn't mean they are weak, it just means they aren't superhuman. One the other side, because somone has a cannon for an arm does not mean they have what it takes to win a game in the 4th quarter (which DA has choked over and over) or the ability to make smart decisions under pressure.
Again there are alot of OPINIONS in what you just typed out but no facts. Last year DA only completed 50% of his passes, that was a reduction. Not progress. Why? because defenses kept 2 defenders deep to stop that dreaded deep ball. Accuracy is by far a better skill than being able to throw the ball 80 yards in the air, it means the diference between a swing pass to a RB losing a yard or gaining 5. the difference between gaining a first down or two to run out the clock or leaving our defense to hold on of a win, seriously how often have we seen that happen!!!!
again you end with HOPEFULLY Anderson will come together. well as of thei preseason IT HASN"T check: http://www.nfl.com/teams/clevelandbrowns/statistics?team=CLE
same Anderson, you get what you get.
Does BQ give us the better chance to win, no one can answer that because his body of work is nothing as of this point, we hope what DA has. and we need to see what BQ has, but i guess you would rather hope to beat blood out of a rock than possibly be proven wrong.
Ruining QB's since 1999.
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It was to me...I'm teasing U...
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I think that's a little harsh. Hack does post some good information once in a while and at least he isn't arrogant like some steeler fans.
I second that. Hack is no smack shack troll.
Hack is one of those subtle smack trolls, he's been called out for it more than a few times. Some people have a hard time picking up on that kind of thing.
I have been UNJUSTLY called out for it more than a few times.
99% of the time...I am just here giving my opinion....When it agrees with "yours" Hack is a good guy....when it does not....its "SMACK TROLL"
When I found the Giants Super Bowl ring and posted it....the post came and went without anyone saying a word. When I post the Steelers Super Bowl ring...SMACK TROLL.
The post that set off this mini nuke....I posted my thoughts on Mangini....which mirror the thoughts of many on this same board....and what was the debate that Mangini is a good coach..or the right coach for the Browns....I believe I was told that I was scared of Mangini...my sig pic was mentioned...and then I was given the 8 championship nuggy.
Ill be the first to admit...there is that 1% of the time where I do say something just to get a rise out of people...we are still rivals after all....but there is no DISGUISE to it when its done.....Its pretty obvious. But I also think its good natured ribbing. I do not get bent out of shape everytime I read SQUEALERS...and I read it a lot.....but I do not take it as SMACK...its rivalry....pretty much the same as the PEE MAN.....its funny and light hearted....but there is no DISGUISE to it....its pretty much "IM PEEING ON YOU"
And as for the "HE WILL BE GONE....if you look at the MEMBER SINCE area...I was here long before most of you....and thats not even taking into account the original board that this one is based on....I was on that one for years...long before Super Bowl XL...so its not like I just showed up when the rings were getting passed out.
Ill go back to ignoring most of these...as I have pretty much broken my own rule in getting into this bathroom stall sword fight to begin with....Just wanted to share my side of the story.
HACK
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"the Vikings will blitz more. A LOT more."
Mostly cause they will have 8 in the box...so the opportunity is there.
But definitely not because they are not worried of getting beat. Og is acting as if BQ cannot throw a pass or one accurately 30-40 yards.
Of course they are worried...every team playing is worried about that. But teams will try to statistically beat a Move the Chains Offense by taking the run away first and force into 3rd n longs. But we will take our shots - hopefully at the right times. Its just a calculated risk on a game plan...its not as if they will let us throw long - it just means they will cover into a Cover 3 rather than a Cover 2.
Again another reason I think BQ will be the starter...he provides more risk to the D in their forcing of BQ to beat them...rather than the history in the Game plan of facing DA - force him to throw underneath and not only do you get an UNBELIEVABLE unheard of 50% accuracy from DA but a good chance at a pick 6 if he is rattled in a check down.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Eo- I didn't mean to come off like I thought the Vikings aren't worried about BQ throwing deep. I'm a big BQ supporter. I just meant that they'll blitz a lot more than they would against Anderson for the simple fact that Anderson is at his worse when he has to sit in the pocket and try to read a zone.
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Actually I was supporting your theory and trying to knock down Og's bit about sucking on the long passes...lol why its so much better talking about our Browns face to face and a Beer in our hands...communication a lot better.
I do however agree somewhat but not all regarding DA...Zone, yes, much better against DA cause he still locks onto WRs - but to covet giving him no pressure and let him sit in the pocket all day...nah, thats why DA rips apart the lousy teams, cause they can't do both...Zone and pressure. The good teams are able to put the pressure on and run the zone. Put DA in a pocket that is "free as a bird" he'll rip the teams apart. Make him have to check down out of desperation or quick decision downfield because of pressure...thats when they get rewarded.
JMHO - its all about comfort with DA...you leave him be and he gets in that comfort zone...DA at his best.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Arguing QB's in Cleveland is like arguing politics. It's always going to be this way, and it's partly because we're a Mickey Mouse franchise who handles things poorly from day 1 (Quinn, Couch, Frye, etc. etc.). We just make poor poor decisions and it starts at the top.
People might be sick of arguing QB's or the QB threads but we have the same dolt franchise we root for to thank for all this. They continually don't get it right even down to the miniscule decisions, such as having a QB competition that was dragged out and played out this summer. Ridiculous. It's not our fault that the team we root for carries itself like they're trying to drive us away!
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Welcome to the board Captain Negative. Way to bring everyone down. Even if some of things you said are true.
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but we have the same dolt franchise we root for to thank for all this.
Ghosting will get you more time in banned camp 
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Somebody isn't a very good ghost buster.
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J/C
QB A: 5402 Yards, 53.4 Comp %, 38 TD, 27 INT, 1.40 TD-INT, 74.5 QB Rating
QB B: 5092 Yards, 57.2 Comp %, 26 TD, 25 INT, 1.04 TD-INT, 73.8 QB Rating
Two players in their first two years starting, can you guess who they are?
you had a good run Hank.
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Something's not right.. that Ghostbuster spelled his sentences correctly..
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Quote:
J/C
QB A: 5402 Yards, 53.4 Comp %, 38 TD, 27 INT, 1.40 TD-INT, 74.5 QB Rating
QB B: 5092 Yards, 57.2 Comp %, 26 TD, 25 INT, 1.04 TD-INT, 73.8 QB Rating
Two players in their first two years starting, can you guess who they are?
ooooooohh I love these games where we do this and then draw the conclusion that DA or BQ must therefore be a cross between Peyton Manning and Joe Montana... WOOOOOOHOOOOOOO... 
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
J/C
QB A: 5402 Yards, 53.4 Comp %, 38 TD, 27 INT, 1.40 TD-INT, 74.5 QB Rating
QB B: 5092 Yards, 57.2 Comp %, 26 TD, 25 INT, 1.04 TD-INT, 73.8 QB Rating
Two players in their first two years starting, can you guess who they are?
who?
![[Linked Image from i161.photobucket.com]](http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t215/nick_ogrin/ogdawg.jpg) Thanks NaTaS "In the unlikely story that is America, there has never been anything false about hope."
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i think quinn starts, as far as who should be, i have no idea. neither guy really proved much to me.
i just honestly think we have bigger problems, i know that qb is always your biggest topic, but we are horrible at the run, we are horrible running the ball, and we have a superstar wide receiver who has mental issues with the game of football.
i know qb is the most important position, but it's not the only position.
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Something's not right.. that Ghostbuster spelled his sentences correctly..
And that certain someone isn't even banned. 
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Back to the topic...Quinn.
Why?
I think he's the smarter QB and better leader. A guy with his mental abilities, work ethic and physical gifts should be successful with time and experience.
See: Philip Rivers after sitting for 2 years, but Quinn doesn't have LT and the Chargers' D of 2006 to rely on.
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My sentiments exactly... except I am not going to sugarcoat my sarcasm with intriguing little green, dancing bananas....  and will go the angry route
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
Formerly 4yikes2yoshi0
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A is eli and B is DA.
arguments over who *should* start is moot now. i believe in mangini's decision.
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 647 |
I think Hack's posts are fair and reasonable. Like on the other boards, there are good rival fans that are ok. christyk is good, as is OnB (Bengal fan). I just love our division as a whole--where all 4 teams any given day can kick the snot out of anyone else, including those NFC idiots. 
Go Browns!
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 4,563
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 4,563 |
Quote:
Quote:
J/C
QB A: 5402 Yards, 53.4 Comp %, 38 TD, 27 INT, 1.40 TD-INT, 74.5 QB Rating
QB B: 5092 Yards, 57.2 Comp %, 26 TD, 25 INT, 1.04 TD-INT, 73.8 QB Rating
Two players in their first two years starting, can you guess who they are?
who?
Player A is Derek Anderson
Player B is Jeff George.
And before you say sample size, 810 Att-819 Att, and that doesn't even include Anderson's first few starts in 06, which if I did, would have made the comparison a little more skewed *and would have brought Anderson well back to George.*
My point is that despite a few unbelievable games in 2007, Derek Anderson has been Jeff George.
you had a good run Hank.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475 |
*L* ... no way Diam would be able to spell the word miniscule nor try to look it up..
NFL - 1. This is a new regime and they didn't pick the QBs on the team except for the 3rd stringer. I fail to see a track record of failure with them....To state cause it is the Cleveland Browns and that just spells "Mickey Mouse" or Clowns or whatever...is not something a Brown fan communicates to his fellow fans on the eve of a new Season.
2. As for arguing about the QB...its done everywhere around the NFL unless the team has an obvious Franchise QB.
3. Why would having a QB competition on on the time frame of the Media or most fans...signify being "Rediculous" and "Trying to drive the fans away"
4. In the end the only question our fans think about is WINS and Playoff Runs.
Bengals??? Heck even Browns fans feel sorry for Bengal Fans 
Steelers??? hehehe...I remember when they were the perennial doormats of the NFL...What goes around comes around...the cycle is ready to break.
Ravens...Flacco is the only positive infusion into the team in a very long time...the D is on its last legs and Flacco or not, I don't think he will be able to carry the team.
We're ready...To take over our Division. RAC n Savage at least gave us a foundation for the new guys to work with....First year has seen significant upgrades and unlike past 5 year plans and so forth...this won should start to be seen this season and in full swing the next two seasons....To start a Dynasty
Poor decisions regarding QB??? Nah...helps to have a team. Poor Decisions...getting JoeT was the best one to groom our future QB/s and provide an environment to grow into.
Couch? Holcomb? Garcia? Dilfer? Frye? didn't matter - we were pretenders then...now we are actually ready to be Contenders
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Quinn or Anderson - who will be
the starter, who should be the
starter?
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