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Quote:
1. Joe Thomas
2. Rogers.
3. EWright
4. BQ
5. DQ
6. Cribbs
7. Vickers
8. McD
9. ES
10. Wimbley
Youngsters not proven yet that I would consider...Mack, MoMas, Hall, Davis all for the future.
JMHO
That"s funny..cause #4 on your list is pretty unproven yet.. lol . He should have been on the bottom list going by your protocol. You can always add the Pro Bowl QB on our roster in his spot till the kid proves himself or disproves.  You know I'm jabbing you. Other than that, the list is solid. I think you could put Pontbriand on there, we take for granted what this guy does as consistent as anyone ever. Was it last year Pittsburgh went through three?
Last edited by LOYALDAWG; 09/09/09 10:20 PM.
"Going from 4-12 to 6-10 isn't good enough. I believe we are going to be better than that. We're going to be a lot better than that." - Mike Holmgren (3/15/12)
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There is a total of 5 guys on that list that I'd rank higher than DQ.
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Legend
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I believe I did say why Jackson is a top 5 ILB... Quote:
I think people are severely underrating D'Qwell Jackson. According to Football Outsiders D'Qwell Jackson is the 2nd best linebacker at making "stops."
What is a stop? The total number of plays by a defensive player that prevent a successful play by the offense, defined as 45 percent of needed yards on first down, 60 percent of needed yards on second down and 100 percent of needed yards on third or fourth down.
Jackson had the 2nd most stops in the league behind only James Farrior. Also, he led the league in tackles against the run with 106. Add that to his very good pass defense (he had 3 picks last year) and Jackson is a top 5 middle linebacker.
If our defense wasn't so horrible, Jackson would be making the Pro Bowl every year.
Mayo - Could be as good as Jackson this year, but is not currently as good
Urlacher - Urlacher was pretty horrible last year. Ask any Bears fan and they will tell you. On downside of his career. Maybe better than Jackson. Only 79 solo tackles last year. 6 years older than Jackson
Ray Lewis - On the downside of his career. A little better or equal to Jackson. Gets most of his tackles after jumping on a pile after a play has alraedy been finished. 9 years older than Jackson
Scott - Overrated, was helped out by the other good players on the Ravens D (Ngata, Suggs, Pryce, Lewis) . 4 Years older than Jackson
Ryans - Better than Jackson
Pierce - Plays behind the best D-Line in the league, wasn't that good when on the Redskins. Also 5 years older than Jackson
Farrior - An equal to Jackson. But also 9 years older.
Beason - Equal or better.
Foote - Was released this off-season and signed by Lions. Wouldn't start over Barton or Jackson.
Nick Barnett - Was hurt most of last year. When healthy an equal to Jackson.
Timmons - Has started two games in his career.
Patrick Willis - Best LB in league.
Takeo Spikes - Has been released by two teams. 7 years older than Jackson
Tatupu - Had only 69 tackles last year.
London Fletcher-Baker - 96 tackles last year, no INT's. 9 years older than Jackson.
So of the 10 guys you have listed I would only take 3 over Jackson (Beason, Ryans, and Willis.) And 4 guys are as good as Jackson but also much older or less experienced (Urlacher, Lewis, Mayo, and Barnett.)
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Legend
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"You can always add the Pro Bowl QB on our roster in his spot till the kid proves himself or disproves."
Thought I was staying with the THEME of the thread...who I would take with me to build a team around.
I basically stayed YOUNG...I think ES is maybe my oldest probably by mid-season would exchange Mack for him?
But the rare positions in building a team.
QB, LT, Corners, Pass Rusher. Why I included these...Wimbley being the only maybe but I still see his Potential from his rookie 11 sack season. Possibly Hall could take his place with more play.
As for BQ - he has 3 years experience and is ready...the others I noted are rookies (except Hall who is a 2nd year guy from a Division III program.)
Pro-Bowl QB??? If I saw one I would add him
You go and build your new team around DA - Good Luck 
Me I'll build mine around BQ...if a dud I will have to draft one in the future.
But with JoeT there - I'm pretty sure he will develop just fine 
I know you were just jabbing...I don't mind. But now you made me explain why I picked who I picked...
Them are the Yutes I take with me and build around. and why. Punter? Kicker? WR? RB? TE? Not really guys I build a team around - and know I can fill with ease if the commitment or Need is there.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Legend
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honestly don't know where I would rank DQ right now....
but any discussion of top LBs needs to include:
EJ Henderson
Barrett Ruud
Kirk Morrison
David Harris
Ernie Sims
Keith Rivers
Then there are the rush LBs who probably don't fit into the discussion, but need to be included somewhere:
Merriman
Ware
Harrison
possibly Aaron Kampmann with his conversion to OLB this year....
also a few rookies may be added:
Orakpo
Curry
Lauranitis (already starting MLB for Rams)
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Ok at least now I can see that you have reasons for calling him a top-5 ILB. I don't agree with you on his relative ability, and even a Ray Lewis on the decline is better than DQ IMO. Personally I believe if someone is better now, they are better even if they're older. Yes, you're right about Urlacher... He did have a pretty awful year last year. There are a few guys you think DQ are better than that I disagree with but we'll just have to agree to disagree.
I still think it'd be a lot tougher to replace wright, mcd, Edwards, steinbach, and maybe even Rubin than Jackson.
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Legend
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top 10 players I wouldn't want to cut or trade uless it was a really good deal (no specific order) are...
Thomas
Stiney
Cribbs
Dawson
Pointbraind
Wright
McDonald
Vickers
DQ
oopsy...
Rogers
Last edited by superbowldogg; 09/10/09 01:27 PM.
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Legend
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Legend
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Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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OP
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Uggghhhhh.....
I did have Cribbs at 6 and then had DQ and I'm so back and forth on that guy that I somehow absorbed Cribbs on my list for DQ.
Cribbs is a structural member of the Browns if people get what I say by saying that. I mean that with the utmost respect. I love players like Cribbs. We need more, far more of those players.
And for those thinking,,,,
I'd do a real good eval of Pool. And if not A++ then Hall all the way.
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I think we were all sticking to ILBs. Ruud I see as similar to Jackson, where his raw numbers make him look better than he is. Kirk morrisson is almost someone I'd consider a playmaker, but figured I'd get shot down by the others on that so I left him off. Orakpo is playing end at washington, and we don't have anything on those rookies to say they're better or worse than Jackson.
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no worries....and yeah, that's why I listed the OLB's separately.
and i'd at least have Harris and EJ ahead of DQ at this point in addition to the others listed.
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Legend
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Just for future reference. Orakpo is playing OLB for the Redskins in the 4-3. I watched one of their preseason games and was surprised to see him standing up. Washington Redskins.com - Depth Chart
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Legend
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Quote:
Just for future reference.
Orakpo is playing OLB for the Redskins in the 4-3. I watched one of their preseason games and was surprised to see him standing up.
Washington Redskins.com - Depth Chart
He was actually on the AM station here in Austin yesterday for an interview....he said that while he will be primarily an OLB this year, he will play some DE as well.
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Wow, thanks. I'm surprised. Good info 
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Legend
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If Sanchez was gone prior to our pick (surprised Seattle didn't take him) it would have been Curry vs Orakpo for our pick and I believe Orakpo was the choice on top of our Charts. Had a real small birdie on the outside looking in and Orakpo seemed to be the pick.
JFoodForThought...
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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1st String
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1st String
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Offense: Thomas Stienbach Mack Edwards ST: Cribbs Defense: Rodgers Wimbley DQ Wright Elam Of course this is after watching the Minn. game 
Ruining QB's since 1999.
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
I believe I did say why Jackson is a top 5 ILB...
Quote:
I think people are severely underrating D'Qwell Jackson. According to Football Outsiders D'Qwell Jackson is the 2nd best linebacker at making "stops."
What is a stop? The total number of plays by a defensive player that prevent a successful play by the offense, defined as 45 percent of needed yards on first down, 60 percent of needed yards on second down and 100 percent of needed yards on third or fourth down.
Jackson had the 2nd most stops in the league behind only James Farrior. Also, he led the league in tackles against the run with 106. Add that to his very good pass defense (he had 3 picks last year) and Jackson is a top 5 middle linebacker.
If our defense wasn't so horrible, Jackson would be making the Pro Bowl every year.
Mayo - Could be as good as Jackson this year, but is not currently as good
Urlacher - Urlacher was pretty horrible last year. Ask any Bears fan and they will tell you. On downside of his career. Maybe better than Jackson. Only 79 solo tackles last year. 6 years older than Jackson
Ray Lewis - On the downside of his career. A little better or equal to Jackson. Gets most of his tackles after jumping on a pile after a play has alraedy been finished. 9 years older than Jackson
Scott - Overrated, was helped out by the other good players on the Ravens D (Ngata, Suggs, Pryce, Lewis) . 4 Years older than Jackson
Ryans - Better than Jackson
Pierce - Plays behind the best D-Line in the league, wasn't that good when on the Redskins. Also 5 years older than Jackson
Farrior - An equal to Jackson. But also 9 years older.
Beason - Equal or better.
Foote - Was released this off-season and signed by Lions. Wouldn't start over Barton or Jackson.
Nick Barnett - Was hurt most of last year. When healthy an equal to Jackson.
Timmons - Has started two games in his career.
Patrick Willis - Best LB in league.
Takeo Spikes - Has been released by two teams. 7 years older than Jackson
Tatupu - Had only 69 tackles last year.
London Fletcher-Baker - 96 tackles last year, no INT's. 9 years older than Jackson.
So of the 10 guys you have listed I would only take 3 over Jackson (Beason, Ryans, and Willis.) And 4 guys are as good as Jackson but also much older or less experienced (Urlacher, Lewis, Mayo, and Barnett.)
From Deepthreat:
Quote:
There is a total of 5 guys on that list that I'd rank higher than DQ
epic bump #2.
I was looking for AD4MVP's input but couldn't find it... just me and Turk...
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Dawg Talker
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This is funny. The DQ oiver cribbs comment made me laugh.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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1. Joe Thomas
2. Josh Cribbs
Repeat 5 times . . .
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I really wish there was something I could say to defend that comment. I have no idea what I was on there.
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Dawg Talker
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Yeah I think you would be able to name 5 better ILBers off the top of your head.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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Off the top of my head right now, I have all of these guys ahead of D'Qwell:
Patrick Willis
Jon Beason
Ray Lewis
Jarod Mayo
Lawrence Timmons
Bart Scott
David Harris
DeMeco Ryans
London Fletcher-Baker
Curtis Lofton
Jonathan Vilma
Lofo Tatupu
Barrett Ruud
Stewart Bradley
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Legend
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I think DQ is one of the most overated players on our team and that's saying something 
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
I think DQ is one of the most Underrated players on our team and that's saying something
There, fixed it.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
Quote:
I think DQ is one of the most overated players on our team and that's saying something
There, fixed it.
that was nice of you. I figure I'd fix your typo for you.
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Legend
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overrated... underrated... I think you're both right depending on who you talk to. I don't think he's the next coming of Mike Singletary.. I also don't think he should be 3rd round trade bait either..  Only opinion that matters is the Browns staff and we will see how they feel in the fall.
yebat' Putin
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