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Football teams evolve.




Someone forgot to send that memo to a certain team in Cleveland.

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I'm not saying science has it right. In fact, I think they're probably in deep left field in regards to the truth.




Interesting. In what way? Just want to know your thoughts on it


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Quote:

Quote:

I'm not saying science has it right. In fact, I think they're probably in deep left field in regards to the truth.




Interesting. In what way? Just want to know your thoughts on it




I just mean it in the sense that what we thought we knew 100 years ago was way off base, and what we thought we knew 50 years later was way off base, and what we know now will be viewed as being way off base 50 years down the road. Maybe 'way off base' isn't the right term, but I think you get the gist.

And there's nothing wrong with that at all -- it's progress.

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I'm just waiting for the announcement that we are all just micro-organisms in a petri dish of some much larger universe.


We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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That's pretty neat. I find these things fascinating not so much because it proves or disproves a theory, but because of how we can figure out how old these things are.

Can you imagine how the people felt when they realized what they discovered? What a rush.


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Since you study this stuff... I am going to ask you a question about a talk I saw on Ted.com. It was given by Elaine Morgan. She believes we took to the water long ago and thus loss are hair and became bipedal. She explains why she feels so strongly about this and gives some compelling reasons why in this talk. Not sure if you've followed her or even seen this conference yet... But how do you feel about that theory?

Also do you feel epigenetics has any role in our evolution? Epigenetics is really exciting stuff to me... it's seems to be the missing link in our makeup. Behaviours, disease, etc... seem like they can be passed down from events that happened to generations before. I would think this has to play some role in our evolution?


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One thing I'd like to point out to all the science-deniers.




Not sure that this comment is relevant on this thread. At least not until Knight of Brown posts. i believe he is a strict creationist.

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How much evidence will it take to convince you that science makes no prediction about something it can't test, like religion, and therefore isn't a threat to it. Not only that, how much evidence do you need to prove something? Because evolution has the equivalent of mountains on its side.




Science doesn't make predictions and it doesn't interpret the info. That is where I have a problem. We hear from supposed experts that things are a certain way and you are an idiot for thinking different. I think scientists try to get the facts to fit their beliefs.

I want to note that I am not talking about creationism vs. evolution. Just an opinion about the way I think what we do know gets twisted and presented as fact.


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One thing I'd like to point out to all the science-deniers.

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Not sure that this comment is relevant on this thread. At least not until Knight of Brown posts. i believe he is a strict creationist.







Have you seen RememberMuni's posts regarding anything scientific? And who know's, maybe KoB has been reading and not posting.

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Science doesn't make predictions and it doesn't interpret the info. That is where I have a problem. We hear from supposed experts that things are a certain way and you are an idiot for thinking different. I think scientists try to get the facts to fit their beliefs.




So were back to the fallibility of man then? I'm not going to say that a select few don't push their agenda and fix their results and give the majority of scientists a bad name because of it. However, the vast majority do not. We have our observations, we base a hypothesis of why it could be happening on previous research, and then we test it. The data comes out and is put through statistical analyses that is only a positive test if the stats say there is a 95% confidence interval. Sometimes, certain things are open for interpretation due to taking place in a model organism, like a mouse. We interpret it to the best of our knowledge based on previous research. The scientific method is great because it limits the amount of human tinkering that can take place, basically, it removes human bias and error.

There are aspects of science though where the proof for it is overwhelming. Take the Theory of Evolution for example. You can do a primary journal article search on any major research search engine and come up with over twenty thousand hits easily. All of these help understand some aspect of evolution. The hypothesis that animals change over time and create new species has been shown to be true through many different avenues of research from genomics to paleontology. This isn't something new with very little relative testing, but the largest study comprising the most populace group of researchers in any scientific topic. At some point, one has to look at the mountain in front of them and acknowledge its existence.


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I just mean it in the sense that what we thought we knew 100 years ago was way off base, and what we thought we knew 50 years later was way off base, and what we know now will be viewed as being way off base 50 years down the road. Maybe 'way off base' isn't the right term, but I think you get the gist.




The theory of evolution hasn't changed much since the advent of the modern synthesis that combines Darwin's natural selection to Mendel's genetics that was proposed in the 30's. I will say though that 50 years ago the world was much different then than now. We were just discovering the structure of DNA, the molecule that all life is based off of. We didn't even know much about plate tectonics until the 60's and radiometric dating came after that! Since then, whole areas of biology like genomics and development have sprung up increasing our knowledge and fine tuning it. However, While I think you're right about the "way off base" thing not being the correct term, we've had roughly the same idea's since the 30's. The great part, and the most telling in my opinion, is that even through all of the new technology and discoveries we've had, the theory of evolution is pretty much the same as it was 70 odd years ago: genetic frequencies within a population combined with selective reproduction due to those gene frequencies leads to the advent of new species.


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It was given by Elaine Morgan. She believes we took to the water long ago and thus loss are hair and became bipedal. She explains why she feels so strongly about this and gives some compelling reasons why in this talk. Not sure if you've followed her or even seen this conference yet... But how do you feel about that theory?




I've heard of the hypothesis, and at the time it seemed like a plausible explanation, however, I think that this fossil evidence in this thread shows that her hypothesis may be officially shot down The ape walked in the trees, covered in hair, and could walk upright when it wanted to. No water involved and they're walking upright. Oh well, it was interesting at least.

Quote:

Also do you feel epigenetics has any role in our evolution? Epigenetics is really exciting stuff to me... it's seems to be the missing link in our makeup. Behaviours, disease, etc... seem like they can be passed down from events that happened to generations before. I would think this has to play some role in our evolution?




I think this is one of the next areas of biology to really hit the ground running and do some interesting stuff. While there's not a bunch of evidence for it yet, I think there's definitely promise in the field.


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Quote:

speaking of timelones. I've always wondered if the Grand Canyon really took millions of years to form.

Here's an article about a little canyon being formed in minutes. If it did this in minutes could the canyon have been formed in much less time? Perhaps, forty days and forty nights?

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/news/artic...-farm-land.html




Pretty interesting read and thanks for sharing.

BUT there is a huge difference between cutting through soil/dirt then cutting through rock, iron, and other various minerals that make up the Grand Canyon. The human body with a shovel can dig up Earth. It takes machines made of different medals to dig up rock from rock.

Also, if you include various theories and us them in conjunction...they do indeed back each other up. Geology is a real thing.

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I know that Einstein built off of Newton and I would surmise someone would do Issac one better. I have never taken any science as absolute. As new evidence is uncovered and people explore and debate new ideas, new theories and new science becomes the new accepted fact. That is, till someone trumps that.

Man, as a whole, thinks to highly of themselves, (that doesn't sound grammatically correct, but you get the point) especially when it comes to science, religion, or politics.

The thing I wanted to suggest to you and to others is that if you read the Bible in the language it was originally written in, (Hebrew for the Old Testament) you will find that the MEANINGS of words used to describe things might just change how you view things.

In the Bible it talks about God taking from the dust of the Earth and breathing the breath of life into it creating man. That is the missing link for me. Without getting all theological the words used in Hebrew for breath of life denotes spirit.

What separates man from chimp is having a spirit.


I don't need algorithms and scientific equations and a calculator to quantify faith. I like science just as much as the next geek, and I admit to being a bit of a Trekkie, but I think there is a missing equation in all of our pursuits and it is most definitely because we do things out of pride and not out of spirit.

Science and religion aren't competitors.

This is a very interesting thread.

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