DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Eric Mangini will help pick new GM

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/11/07/king-lerner-wants-a-football-czar-in-cleveland


King: Lerner wants a "football czar" in Cleveland
Posted by Michael David Smith on November 7, 2009 4:20 PM ET
It's not clear how much longer Eric Mangini will remain the head coach in Cleveland, but if he's able to hold onto his job, it looks like he'll be getting a new, hands-on boss.

Peter King, who joined Jimmy Roberts and PFT's own Mike Florio on today's NBC Notre Dame halftime show, reported that Browns owner Randy Lerner is planning to hire a "football czar" to take a very active role in shaping the team's football operations.

King said Lerner wants a proven winner who can come in and run the franchise in a manner similar to what Bill Parcells has done for the Miami Dolphins. Parcells, of course, hired his own head coach, so that news can't sound good to Mangini.

So who might be the executive who takes over the Browns' football operations? King offered three names that Lerner would love to bring on board: Former Giants General Manager Ernie Accorsi, former Packers and Seahawks coach Mike Holmgren and former Packers General Manager Ron Wolf.

King said the Browns' new boss would have one job: "Advise Eric Mangini to, basically, stop screwing up this organization."

That sounds like a big job. But Lerner desperately wants to clean up the mess his franchise has become.

Cool,, Accorsi says he's out, Wolf may have a bad taste in his mouth from the snubb he received from the Organiaztion during the Davis era..

that leaves holmgren.. I can't understand why Floyd Reece is never mentioned

I thought he said he didn't want the GM job. A Czar position, one where he's the top dog may appeal to him. Has he ever had VP or Presidential status with a club?

Hmm..Holmgren as VP? Wonder what the odds of Gruden becoming the H.C. if Holmgren gets hired are??

Very slim. If we get a big name at President, it won't be a big name at GM, or Head Coach. They have too big of egos for that to work, and like to bring in their own guys.

If Lerner can get someone to come in as a Football Czar (A Respected or Proven Winner) that is, I'd give Lerner a chance to let this one play out for 3-5 Years.

The Browns sadly need stability, and the only thing that has been Stable is our Record and Fan Disappointment.

Who ever the next Head Coach/GM is, we need to stay with them for a minimum of 3-5 Years just to see, and then decide if an additional year or two is needed.

He was. Not anymore.

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I thought he said he didn't want the GM job. A Czar position, one where he's the top dog may appeal to him. Has he ever had VP or Presidential status with a club?

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It could be that I misunderstood what he said,, I thought Accorsi said he didn't want another job in the league but he would be available for consulting.. Czar sounds like a full time job to me.. at least that's the way I took it.

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I have mentioned Reese....another guy i like in that role is Dick Vermiel. I think he would do a super job as a director of football operations/GM/Czar

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I forgot all about Vermiel,, You are right Peen, he'd be solid.. wonder what his thinking is these days about going to work again..

It has nothing to do with that. It's about him having an ego and not succumbing to a boss like that. Gruden won't work under anyone.

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Very slim. If we get a big name at President, it won't be a big name at GM, or Head Coach. They have too big of egos for that to work, and like to bring in their own guys.

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Before he went to Miami, I'd have said the same thing about Parcells.. and let's be honest here, there is hardly a greater ego in the NFL than Parcells

As for the title president, I doubt anyone takes that title from Keenan.. Keenan has, by all accounts, held up his end of the bargain and done a good job so why replace him in that roll... Besides, as the browns structured, the President doesn't have any control over football operations anyway. He's an adminstrative guy.


Unless they make it President of Football Operations.. I suppose that would be one way....dunno

That's my point with Parcells. He brought in a no name Head Coach and a no name GM to work under him.

IMO Keenan is a miserable President. The business side of the Browns is as much of a joke as the football side is.

Compare the business sides of the Indians and Cavs to the Browns. It's like the Browns are black and white and the Indians and Cavs are color. Having dealt with all three teams I can tell you that first-hand. Indians and Cavs do everything to assist the media and fans while the Browns seemingly couldn't care less.

And you know this how? Did someone you "work with" tell you?

Truth is you dont know this for a fact or not, maybe the two like each other, maybe they hate each other...but there isnt one poster here who knows for sure!


I would love to have them both here in Cleveland as I wanted us to get Gruden when we picked Mangini, then tried to convince myself that Mangini would be a good coach, but after the first pre-season game I started getting that sickening feeling that things were going to go down hill fast!

Are you kidding me? It is common knowledge that Gruden has a huge ego, even larger than most head coach's. Has nothing to do with inside info, but has everything to do with paying attention to the league.

Oh no,, Deep, I understood what you meant about Parcells bringing in No or low ego guys as HC and GM.. got it.

I was talking more about the President title and How it doesn't appear available because of Keenan... How do you justify getting rid of Keenan, who by all accounts, has done a decent job..

Big question, would a Holmgren, Vermiel (good catch Peen) or even Reece want to be in charge of the Accounting Department, or information Technology or purchasing or the Sales and Marketing functions... more importantly, what qualifies them to be in charge of those things?

About 3 years ago when Collins was cut loose, I was made to understand that there are two sides to running a football club.. 1. Adminstrative and 2. Football.

I said back then, Lerner should be president and basically have two guys that report directly to him,, VP Football Operations and VP Business Operations.

I mean, it's kinda like that now anyhow.. except his Business Ops guy is titled President and Lerner is CEO.

Probably maneuver around with the titles involved.

Even still to say those two are no longer friends or not is a load of BS!


This is off topic but I dont think it needs it own thread has anyone heard who we worked out the other day? In Mangini's presser he said there would be a few guys they was going to work out

I never said they weren't friends. I said that Gruden has too big of an ego to work under someone.

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IMO Keenan is a miserable President. The business side of the Browns is as much of a joke as the football side is.

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You seem to be baseing you opinion of Keenan on his Media relations... yet, you completely disregard his handleing of all the other departments that make up the admin side of things...

I'm not sure he has anything to do with the Media anyway..

How can anyone here say for certain the Keenan is doing a Decent Job, or Horrible Job without actually working for the Browns?

Does anyone here read the financial reports about the Browns? Does anyone compare them to other NFL Franchises?

The whole "Title" thing sounds ridiculous. If we bring in a New President, it was be President of Football Operations.

Then, we'll have Administrative and Football Operations with Lerner being the CEO, and both Sides report to him.

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Good point, I'm sure Mangini has a lot of input in that regard.

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When was the last time anyone spoke publicly for the Browns OTHER than Mangini.. Not only do I think he had input, I think he controlled all Media relations..

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But even then, under other regimes they've been miserable.

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Ok,, but what's that got to do with Keenan...

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someone (won't name names) told me "That's the Browns for ya, they're inept in every way."

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Was that unnamed someone an employee of the Browns or someone that may have viewed it as you did...

Point being, the browns were a friendly team from the standpoint of the fans until John Collins took over. That's when I personally saw how us dawgtalkers were treated worse. the timing falls right in line with Collins arrival.

I can remember the first year I went to a DTD at camp.. we were treated like kings.. we had a tent, free food and soda... I felt important.. it went down hill from there.

All of this is true and happened.. but it has nothing I can see to do with Keenan..

First, I think Green is retired.. second, I don't believe he'd keep mangini,..

And I don't think anyone ever said he was soft... ever

I might be wrong, but didn't Gruden work under both Rich McKay and Bruce Allen? I don't remember him having any problems with either of those guys.

If Holmgren comes, Gruden, Mariucci, and Mornhinweg will all be mentioned as head coaching candidates. And all would be acceptable options.

Worked under him the same way Mangini worked under Kok.

They lasted a little longer.

Before everyone gets their panties in a bunch..not you deep...Holmgren had his GM duties recinded while in Seattle. That was part of why he started considering retirement.

I'd rather have Holmgren here as coach after he was selected by a Ron Wolf type.

You're right that he had his GM duties taken away in Seattle. However, Holmgren himself admitted that being a GM/Coach was just too much to handle.

Give him JUST a GM role, and I think he'll be good. Give him JUST a coaching job, and he'll be good. Give him both, and not so much, IMO.

j/c

I really, REALLY want Ron Wolf. I think he is the perfect person to run this organization.

Accorsi I'm sold on but...I really don't like Holmgren. Unless he was coming JUST to coach, I don't want him here.

By the way......

As an aside.....

Wouldn't it be mildly intruging if we brought Lucifer himself in to be GM/Coach? I'm trying to think of a current coach in the NFL or College that is as roundly despised as Mangineous. As a GM Kokinis was like an absentee father (for whatever reason).

When the Savage/Crennel team was fired (thankfully) I thought to myself...well there's nowhere but up from here! Where's the champagne? [showtunes]Better Days Are Here Again![/showtunes]

Then it got obviously worse.

If Mangini was fired is that the floor? Could anyone do worse? Not sure. I think Satan could figure out a way. And at this point I might be curious unless Jesus is willing to try his hand with this franchise.

This is the MAJOR and biggest problem with the Browns organization. Lerner has made the SAME mistake three times in a row now. We will remain the laughing stock of the NFL until Randy gets it. You must hire, an experienced, proven, winning GM and let him make ALL decisions, including hiring HIS own HC. The HC should have absolutely NO say, what so ever, in the selection of a GM, only the owner.

Sad to say, but until this organization follows that proceedure, we will continue down the path of self destruction, what a sad state of affairs for what was once one of the best teams ever, in the NFL.

I went to my first game in 1952 and teamed up with a few friends to be season ticket holders from 1961 until Art flew the coupe. I refused to buy PSL's for the new stadium, I feel for the people who wasted their hard earned cash, on this fiasco they call an organization. it's the most POORLY organized thing I've ever seen in 67 years +.

Until the fans stop paying and the stadium is empty, will their be any change or will the owner pay attention to the real problem.

I hope and pray Ron Wolf accepts the President position.

This situation is so bad it's beyond fathomable/ It's reached the point where I said I'd quit. But I can't.

All these threads and the HATE for Mangini asolutely kill me.

Mangini has been in the league for 10+ years and people with ZERO experience in the NFL critique him.

Mangnin has worked hard to move through the NFL ranks, from the lowly ball-boy, up to his gig as HC, and people seem to hate him.

He has worked with the best in the business and obviously knows how great organizations run. He had some success with his first gig as HC, and here we are----8 games into a rebuild and everyone wants to fire him!!!!!

I don't get it.

He got rid of all the guys that we needed to get rid of, he is committed to building through the draft, and he is looking for football players to build a core to this team.

And we want him gone?!?!?!?

Already?!?!?!?

I Don't get it!!!!!!

Mangini has a plan for this team, he got rid of guys in an effort to stock-pile draft picks in order to further build the team going into next year.

Why can't we let him go that route?

I would much rather stick with the coach then go starting over again.

For the love of god let the guy do his thing here.

Last time I checked NYJ aren't too upset with where he left them.

He knows what he is doing.

He certainly knows plenty more than 100% of the board.

So why all the hate?

I somewhat agree with your TD, however this is the same argument we have heard from our HC apologists over the years. To me, he has utterly FAILED in almost every aspect this year, something the likes I have never seen. Granted I dont mind getting rid of the players, or building through the draft, the issue is that even in the deals he has failed to execute correctly. He should have traded BE before the draft when his stock was the highest, shouldn't have pulled Quinn so early, esp for the likes of freaking DA... trading for he Jets' scrubs, sorry thats what they are, cast offs. No one in any of the Jets land is saying damn I wish Mosely was here, Elam, Stucky, or Ratliff. He completely screwed the draft with the drafting of the two LBers. I dont care how early it is, Maivia and Veikune are complete busts. Terrible picks, esp when MUCH better players were available, ala Lesean McCoy, Phil Loadholt, all of whom we needed someone at their position. He downgraded us at many positions including ILBer (AndraDavis > Barton + leader in the locker room), Shaffer > St. Clair (We actually replaced Shaffer with two players because St. Clair is so terrible we have to pair him with a TE every time.) Hired a complete numskull at OC, he is right up there with Mo Carthon, just AWFUL. Zero imagination or adjustments made.

I can't think of many positive things to say about Mangini, other than he is consitently terrible week in and out. Consistently shows no improvement.

I also think your statement about non of us being in the NFL is flawed. That doesn't means we cant discuss and express our opinions. Thats what this board is about. I have been an Avid Football fan for more than 20 years, I dont have to be a professional race car driver to know how a car works. When something is terrible, especially when able to compare to the other good organizations in our division, it's not rocket science to determine what stinks.