DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Joe Thomas says James Harrison flops

Joe Thomas says James Harrison flops

Posted by Mike Florio on December 19, 2009 9:10 PM ET
In the past, Steelers linebacker James Harrison has complained that not enough holding penalties are called against the blockers who try to keep him away from their quarterbacks.

Now, Harrison is being accused of doing too much to influence the throwing of flags.

Tony Grossi of the Cleveland Plain Dealer recently reported that Browns left tackle Joe Thomas believes Harrison "flopped" to draw a holding call in each of the two games that Cleveland played against Pittsburgh.

"It's something James Harrison has been doing," Thomas told Grossi. "It seems like he didn't do it last year. Now he's kind of perfected it. When you push him by the quarterback, if he doesn't think he can get to the quarterback anymore, he thinks the best thing for him to do is kind of flop as dramatically as possible and hope it baits the ref into throwing the flag.

"Basically as you push him by, he'll just throw his arms up in the air and his feet and try to make it look like you threw him down. It's kind of like taking a charge in the NBA."

But now that the word is out, it remains to be seen whether the move continues to work for Harrison.

"It was my mistake for not talking to the refs before the game because it shows up on tape over and over again," Thomas said. "I don't know if he has a reputation yet, but I know after this year he will."

Maybe next year Harrison's new move will be stopping short.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/19/joe-thomas-says-james-harrison-flops/

Joe's Post game interview

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Maybe next year Harrison's new move will be stopping short.

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LOL is that a seinfeld reference?

They mentioned this during the game when Joe had been called for holding and was being animated with the Ref. They said it was a move that Howie Long perfected in his playing days. When they showed the replay of the Thomas "hold" you could see what Harrison was doing.

Joe ain't afraid to block Harrison. He does a fine job of it. Now that Joe has publicly called him out on it the Refs and other teams will look for it and it's likely Harrison will not get away with it nearly as often as he has so far.

Good call Joe.

I wonder if this is something Pittsburgh teaches. One thing i always thought they did was run an intentional pass interferance call. Alot of times, Hines Ward will run strait into a DB and the pass will be thrown behind him. Ben and Ward will both be crying to the refs. I also wonder the the coaches warn the refs to watch for this. Ive seen so many times over the years that it seems Pittsburgh will run 'bailout plays'. If it doesnt work, draw the penalty. It works in basketball and i can see football players being no different. If you get beat, and there is nothing you can do, try to draw a penalty to keep a drive alive or in Harrisons case, erase a 1st down or move the ball back. Ive suspected Pittsburgh on doing things like this for a while now.

I think I still have the game dvrd so if someone still has it, let me know and Ill try to go back and look for the time and play and talking about. I think Ward did it a couple times last game in the 2nd half.

Hey.....That's MY move!!!!

As long as it wasn't "the swirl" ... I invented that.

NRTU

I re-watched the play where JT was flagged for holding. He is 1000% correct Harrison hooked his arm and made it look like JT was holding when in fact he was doing the holding.

I should say this too, I think it's actually a good move on Harrison's part. It was done with great timing too; we had the ball on the Steeler 6 yard line I think and the hold moved us back to the 16. It turned what should have been a TD into a FG.

JMHO

BTTB

Joe Thomas is a guy who doesn't talk much and is smart enough to not give anyone any motivation when they play us.

So he must feel pretty strongly about this. When he speaks, I bet people listen.

He is, after all, the best LT in the game. That carries some weight.

I kind of like that he spoke out about this.

I love it. It is stuff like this that fans the embers of the rivalry. Our best player calling out their best player. That is a good start.

For some reason after the game last thursday night I kept thinking I was a hearing a train coming but it sounded really far away. Lets hope it is the train of real cleveland browns leaving the station where it was idle the last 11 years and finally heading home.

I remember that play, they called it the old "Howie Long" play. I've seen Harrison do that a number of times, hopefully now that he's been called out on it the refs will watch closer...likely not though.

Steelers OLB Harrison will flop if its needed

By Mark Kaboly
MCKEESPORT DAILY NEWS
Saturday, January 2, 2010


The reigning NFL Defensive Player of the Year James Harrison was assured by officials during the preseason that if he was held during a game that a penalty flag would be thrown.

Call him naive, but Harrison believed what the officials were telling him ... until the holds kept coming and few flags followed.

So to combat that, Harrison decided to take matters into his own hands - or at least that's what Cleveland tackle Joe Thomas believes.

After the Steelers lost to the Browns a few weeks ago, Thomas said Harrison is getting a reputation for flopping when the outside linebacker thinks he is being held.

"It's something Harrison has been doing," Thomas told The Cleveland Plain Dealer. "It seems like he didn't do it last year. Now, he's kind of perfected it. I don't know if he has a reputation yet, but I know after this year he will."

The only two holding calls against Thomas this year were against Harrison.

"Basically, as you push him by, he'll just throw his arms up in the air and his feet and try to make it look like you threw him down," Thomas said.

Harrison did not deny Thomas' allegation but instead explained his mindset.

"Tell Joe he can say whatever he wants to say, if you hold me, I will do whatever I can to get that call," Harrison said Wednesday, making his first public comment on the issue.

Harrison said that the lack of holding calls are getting worse compared to a year ago.

"I bet I can go to the league office, and you can (find) at least three or four holds a game (on film) over the course of a season," Harrison said. "What's that — 50-something holds a year that they didn't call?

"What else you want me to do? I am having guys grabbing me around my neck and slamming me to the ground, and they are not called. They said they were going to enforce that rule."

Defensive end Brett Keisel, who plays on the same side of the Steelers defense as Harrison, doesn't agree with Thomas' assessment.

"(Harrison) doesn't flop," Keisel said. "He gets held every play. He may get one call a game. Joe is the worst holder in the league, so I don't know what he is talking about."

Whether it is him getting held or seeing more double-teams, Harrison's numbers have evaporated over the past month.

Through the first 10 games, Harrison had 10 sacks and 18 hurries. Since them, he has no sacks and only four hurries.

"He is getting triple-teamed and chipped and things like that," Keisel said. "He is a great player. That is why offenses do what they do."

Harrison, who set a franchise record with 16 sacks in 2008, isn't worried about his decreased stats.

"It is more than a compliment than anything," Harrison said. "They feel like they need two or three guys to block me. If you do that, then they are going to leave somebody else on the back end, and that's (fellow outside linebacker LaMarr) Woodley, and he has done a great job."

Woodley has 6.5 sacks over the past five games and has taken the team lead in the category away from Harrison. Woodley has 91/2 of his 111/2 sacks over the past seven games and has at least a half sack in each of those games.

"Other people have to step up, and that has been Woodley," Keisel said.

Woodley, meanwhile, came to Harrison's defense on the flopping allegation.

"Maybe when they hold him, it isn't a flop," he said. "Maybe they are holding on to him and pulling him down."

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"(Harrison) doesn't flop," Keisel said. "He gets held every play. He may get one call a game. Joe is the worst holder in the league, so I don't know what he is talking about."

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2 holds all season = worst holder in the league.

The Steelers are getting pathetic. First Woodley says the bengals will lay down so they don't have to face the Steelers in the playoffs (although they've swept them this season), then there's Clark disagreeing saying that he doesn't think anyone fears the Steelers, now we've got Keisel calling Joe, with only two holds all year, the worst holder in the league.

These guys are losing all sense of reality. I do believe the corner has been turned.

Since we all know that holding can be called on almost every play in an average NFL game, the fact that JT has only two calls tells me his is absolutely the best at holding in the league. Deceptively good.

I'm not too certain it is accurate, that there is holding on every play. More like an urban myth. But I will say that on any play an official can only see so much especially in a scrum or tightly packed mass of bodies. That is why there is a free blocking zone. Exceptions are chop blocks for obvious reasons and blatent holding. Keep the arms inside the frame of your body and don't grab a handful of jersey.

Example; on a conventional pass play the umpire and referee watch for holding. There are alot of bodies flailing and you can only really focus on a few players not the entire scrum. Sorta like spot-checking.If a plyer holds for a second and you are watching another dancing pair it will go un-noticed.

and what seems obvious on TV isn't that way on the field. You get screened out by bodies ,legs etc. I have gone an entire game without myself ( umpire) or the referee throwing a flag for holding. Not saying it didn't happen,just nothing obvious while we were watching.

And if there is holding away for the point of attack,I will keep my flag in my pocket.


Coaches get more upset when you throw a flag for an iffy penalty than the opposite. They would rather the officails let them play than have a flag fest.

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Tell Joe he can say whatever he wants to say, if you hold me, I will do whatever I can to get that call," Harrison said Wednesday, making his first public comment on the issue.

Keisel said. "He gets held every play. He may get one call a game

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"(Harrison) doesn't flop," Keisel said. "He gets held every play. He may get one call a game. Joe is the worst holder in the league, so I don't know what he is talking about."

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2 holds all season = worst holder in the league.

The Steelers are getting pathetic. First Woodley says the bengals will lay down so they don't have to face the Steelers in the playoffs (although they've swept them this season), then there's Clark disagreeing saying that he doesn't think anyone fears the Steelers, now we've got Keisel calling Joe, with only two holds all year, the worst holder in the league.

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ddub...I agree...these Steelers are sounding pathetic. I don't remember the Steelers crying like this in years past. I wonder what "the Chin" would have said to his players if they shed tears like this?