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You gotta think about like the opponents do.. With as unselfish as LB and Shaq are (combined with the attention both demand), I really think that Mo is going to be the guy that is left floating around open..
One thing that MB is doing that I really like is having either AP/DWest/LB feed Shaq in the post rather than Mo.. This keeps Mo on the weak side and available for ball reversal 3's..
I think when you do that, it really opens up that slip screen play that Mo, LB and Shaq run late in the games for the Mo corner 3.. We really like to run that play out of timeouts..
I heart winning
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I agree, and I hope you're right. I trust in Mike Brown as a coach.
Mo didn't perform like we needed last season in the Orlando series, he missed open shots and Orlando basically told him no. I know Mo can be clutch, hes hit big shots in the regular season when we needed (without Shaq), there's no reason why he can't do it when we need him most, the playoffs.
At first, when we brought in Shaq, I rolled my eyes, and figured it was the wrong time in his career to do it but I proudly admit that Shaq has proven me wrong, and I pray that he can dominate the post in the playoffs like he has done thus far.
Has there ever been a player still as dominant as him even at age 38 not named Wilt Chamberlain? Unbelievable.
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actually, no. i stand by what i said.
honestly, nobody scares me in the east. the celtics are old, and can't stay out of the trainer's room, the magic screwed their whole team up, and the cavs are SIGNIFICANTLY better than they were last year despite the fact that we aren't on pace for 66 wins.
we have an inside presence that can handle big bodies, and also create his own, oh, and he happens to be one of the greatest passing big men ever.
we have bigger and more atheltic perimeter defenders.
and, we have signature wins over the magic and lakers on the road. we have once again dominated the western conference. and the cavs seem to be winning despite missing 2 point guards.
yeah, i'm gonna go ahead and stand by my statement.
nobody in the east scares me.
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Well, LBJ, I agree with you that nobody initially scares me in the East, but that's not what I implied.
What scares me is that, on paper + the experience of watching the team this season, can fall apart, or fail in the playoffs (like last season). I honestly did not predict, or thought we would be dominated by Orlando like we were. We had great chemistry, seemed unstoppable in the regular season, we beat down our first two series, then we ran into a brick wall in Orlando.
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Quote:
Well, LBJ, I agree with you that nobody initially scares me in the East, but that's not what I implied.
What scares me is that, on paper + the experience of watching the team this season, can fall apart, or fail in the playoffs (like last season). I honestly did not predict, or thought we would be dominated by Orlando like we were. We had great chemistry, seemed unstoppable in the regular season, we beat down our first two series, then we ran into a brick wall in Orlando.
the writing was on the wall. i knew orlando was a mismatch, but i thought that becuase of how playoff basketball was, that orlando wouldn't shoot that ridiculous 3 point %. they did. and they beat us. although who knows how that series would have gone if the cavs could have held onto game 1.
they didn't have a signature win over any of the other 3 big teams in the league (LA, ORL, BOS) on the road. 0-5.
things are different this year. if you watch this team every night, you can see it. shaq is the calming force we have been looking for.
the funny thing is, you get these basketball boneheads who ragged on mike brown's offense when we lost, because we couldn't outscore orlando, when it reality, it was their highest offensive output in the lebron-postseason-era.
i'm not saying we're a lock, but right now, the cavs are your favorites in the east. the only thing that remotely scares me is if boston gets its act together.
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True. No objections from me. Quote:
the only thing that remotely scares me is if boston gets its act together.
I was watching them last night against Orlando. Kevin Garnett just isn't the same, I know he's coming back from an injury, but he looks lost. LeBron playing some four is Kevin Garnett's worst nightmare at this stage in his career. I'm not concerned with Ray Allen, I actually hope they keep him and don't trade for a younger, athletic SG like Montae Ellis like word-of-mouth assumes.
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if the cavs make a move for a guy like jamison, or whomever, and only have to give up z for a month, then i'm calling the cavs a lock for the finals. until then, im just gonna say nobody scares me in the east.
atlanta is the only other team that really got better.
the one thing that does scare me is a charlotte/cleveland matchup.
i'm not saying charlotte beats us, but that certainly wouldn't go 4 or even 5. larry brown is doing a hell of a job with that group.
i've really enjoyed the nba this year, some of these bad teams are starting to get better, charlotte, okc, memphis, i think sacto is a sleeping giant, look out for them in the next 2 years...
and watching minnesota the other night. they are another team who could be really really good in the next few years...
kevin love and al jeffeson, that's a nice pair of big men, corey brewer has a little bit of game they are still hoping to get rubio soon. if you couple that with the fact that they're record is horrible and they're a lottery team, they could be onto something. kevin love has a really nice stroke.
gomes and flynn can play.
take a look at these averages.
brewer 13.3 ppg
flynn 14 ppg
gomes 10.6 ppg
jefferson 17.8 ppg
love 15 ppg
with rubio coming aboard in a year (probably 2), and a lottery pick, i think they are a good young coach away from being really fun to watch.
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Quote:
Partially agree. I thought the same thing last season, but really, you can't take anything for granted, and it renders the regular season almost irrelevant.
Maybe ... but the reason we lost to Orlando was almost the perfect storm of reasons.
First, they were our biggest matchup-problem of anyone in the league. They had a monster at center, and tall shooters at the 2-3-4 spots. For the most part, we couldn't cover the perimeter shooters. On top of that, we had almost two weeks of "down-time" because we blew through the first two series too quickly. Our guys got a little too complacent. Rather than running wind-sprints after practice, they did trick shots. You could tell in the first few games, we were really winded by the time the 4th quarter came around.
On top of THAT, our shooters went stone cold for some-reason, while Orlando was hitting shots that made you wonder if Van Gundy sold his soul to the devil. I forget the exact numbers, but it was something completely ridiculous like 70% field / 50% from 3pt range. Meanwhile, Mo Williams was putting on a Larry Hughes clinic, and nobody else seemed to be able to find their shot either.
With all that said ... we were STILL probably one Delonte rebound away from going to Game 7, and possibly winning.
This year we have Shaq to combat Dwight, and Moon and Parker to help guard outside shooters. Orlando on the other hand, lost one of the main pieces to their chemistry last year in Turg. Like LBJ says, they only team that really gives me any worries is Boston. But only if they get healthy. Problem is the majority of their team is in their mid 30's and ready to break-down at any point.
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also with Orlando.....
they got rid of Turkoglu who while seemingly unathletic always comes up with a play near the end of the game that makes you curse him
for.....
Vince Carter who comes up small in nearly every big game he has played. Sasha made his name his rookie year in the playoffs for shutting down VC. Last night, once again, VC tried to do everything he could to give Boston that game.
The best thing about VC is that every coach he has had talks himself into believing he can be a clutch player. Just look at last night, Rashard's winning bucket only came about because VC couldn't shake Eddie House on a play designed for him. yeah, Eddie House. and this was after a sequence of nearly turning the ball over on an entry pass (swatted out of bounds), and then turning the ball because he wasn't watching his defender.
#gmstrong
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Update on Iguodala, got this from RCF: Quote:
RicBucher: League source says take Cle out of Iguodala Sweepstakes. Dallas, Portland, Phoenix can all make infinitely better offers.
This is disappointing if this is true. And frankly, if it is, our options are becoming limited. I seriously hope our front-office has something up their sleeve.
Just for kicks, here's my personal proposal.
Here's + two first round draft picks (if necessary) my throw the entire kitchen sink at them, Ferry proposal.
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i really don't think the cavs make a move until the final hours, or even minutes of the deadline. they want a desperate team. they can do this because they don't necassarily need to make a move. but if they can get something for nothing? you better believe ferry is all over that.
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Ferry has done a really good job with turning this team into a legit contender from being a joke year in and year out. I think the guy has earned the benefit of the doubt, if he decides not to make a move then its probably safe to assume there just wasn't a good one to be made. Since Ferry has become our GM my opinion of him has gone way way up, he was the man/event responsible for the very first ever facepalm of my life. When I was younger my uncle took me and my cousin to a game and we had seats behind the basket and he had a breakaway dunk attempt... and he airballed the dunk out of bounds. Palm met face, and I hadn't liked him since until the past few years 
"All I know is, as long as I led the Southeastern Conference in scoring, my grades would be fine." - Charles Barkley
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WOW!!!
11 threes and 46-20 lead after first quarter!!!
Joe Thomas made Justin Timberlake change his name. He didn't want wusses to have the same initials...
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That was definitely fun to watch but I can see myself dozing off here shortly.
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I thought we would win by about 20 since the Nets and Twolves just beat the Clippers, but I didn't think it would be in the first quarter...
Joe Thomas made Justin Timberlake change his name. He didn't want wusses to have the same initials...
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That was very reminiscent of LeBron's 3-point run in Milwaukee last season. I've never seen anyone with 3-point range like him before, especially that one he took 2-4 feet beyond the arc close to half-court.
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I think you're overstating his 3 point ability.
He can shoot them from all over the place, but they're not always good. Sometimes I wish he would stop all the damn heat checks and run the offense. He aggravates me, but at the same time, he's amazing and a pleasure to watch.
Anyway, he's improved his 3's, but still has a LONG way to go.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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I don't think I'm overstating it all. His range is unbelievable, and his shooting is developing nicely. I do agree with the heat check but he takes what the defense gives him, and unfortunately for them, he can hit his three-pointers at 34%.
Not groundbreaking % but I have no problem with them, as long as he's saving the physical play, and post-play for the playoffs.
If he's taking those shots in the playoffs instead of attacking the paint, we have problems.
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i have no problem with the heat checks. it's some of the dribble dribble dribble shoot sequences that i hate. the heat checks seem to come right as they are coming down the floor after he has hit a few. that is fine. that can crack a team's psyche to pieces.
but he has really cut down on the stupidity. and it's showing up in the w/l column. which is all that matters.
cavs keep rolling.
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Cavs were amazing last night, when you shoot like that, almost unbeatable. It seems the iggy deal is gaining momentum but I doubt any deal gets done. I'm starting to think there wont be any deals for the Cavs this season.
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The closer we get to the deadline the more I hope we don't make a deal. Right now we're the best team in the NBA, and the weaknesses we had last season were already addressed this past offseason. We grabbed Shaq to match up with Howard and the Lakers big guys, Moon and Parker to defend taller 3 point shooters like Rashard Lewis and Turkoglu (which we won't have to worry about after all), and we have a wild card in Leon Powe sitting on our bench that we didn't have last season and people seem to have forgotten about since we haven't seen him yet this season.
Right now we're playing great basketball and we're doing it with the injuries we've had. The only deal I would really want to see is if Washington just gives us Jamison on a silver platter. Outside of that happening, I hope we stay put.
"All I know is, as long as I led the Southeastern Conference in scoring, my grades would be fine." - Charles Barkley
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i could not agree more.
now, you'll have cleveland sports fan panic guy, who will say "@!#$! OH MAN THE CAVS GOTTA MAKE A MOVE THEY DIDN'T LAST YEAR AND IT COST THEM A SHOT AT THE FINALS, LEBRON IS GONNA LEAAAAAAAAVE!!!!""
but honestly, like you said, we picked up shaq who looks better every single game. and getting powe on the floor is gonna be like we made a trade. leon powe is a really really solid rotation big. he is going to be a huge addition for us.
not only does not making a move seem like a logical thing, but i think it also shows the stability that the cavs have built, they aren't in panic mode. and that has got to be a seller to keep lebron in town. they have built this team. they didn't do an overnight quick change like boston did. they built this team. it's built to compete every year and last, unlike boston, who looks ancient.
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What about potentially losing West for the playoffs via a suspension after he goes to court?
I get the "no make a trade cause we're good enough" mentality.....but I look back to last year when we should have got Shaq, but didn't. And how many years did we talk about the Indians trading for Schilling/Randy Johnson or some other pitcher near the deadline and we didn't pull the trigger? We always said the same thing, why mortgage the future on a trade when we are built to win over many year AND we're the odds on favorite to win that year (and then we didn't win that year....or any year following).
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif) “...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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I'm also in the camp for not making a move. But if I did make a move it would be for Iggy, because he would fit right in with a young LeBron, Mo, Andy, Gibson, and West. I don't think we will have any exemptions to go over cap for next season, obtaining someone's Bird Rights would be the only reason to make a deal.
As for Powe has there been any updates on his progress? IMO he is our X-factor for a title.
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JJ being a starter in the playoffs is a concern..
Sure "right now" everything looks good, but I don't wanna have to watch 5 or 6 straight games in a playoff series where the other team attacks him on the pick and roll for the first 7 minutes of every game..
I heart winning
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Quote:
I get the "no make a trade cause we're good enough" mentality.....but I look back to last year when we should have got Shaq, but didn't. And how many years did we talk about the Indians trading for Schilling/Randy Johnson or some other pitcher near the deadline and we didn't pull the trigger?
Or you could look at the Magic who traded away a few pieces of their core to get Vince Carter, and are now much worse off because of it. A lot in basketball has to do with team chemistry. You don't just trade a few pieces for another guy just because he has better stats.
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If we can't get Iguodala, or Jamison (in that order), I agree that staying put is probably best. The rumors for Amare coming to Cleveland are swirling again but personally, I don't want Amare Stoudemire on this team. There are far too many risks with taking him than saying no.
If we can get Iguodala, pull the trigger. If we can't, and we can get Jamison, pull the trigger. If we can't get either of them, take your finger off the trigger, it's time to trust in our off-season transactions.
However, I'm not a fan of staying put just to stay put (based on this year's experience) if we have the opportunity to acquire Iguodala or Jamison. If we do stay put, and both were available, and we choke in the playoffs, LeBron really has no reason to stay. Shaq is a stop-gap, and he's 38, Anthony Parker is 34, and Zydrunas is 34-35 so the Boston argument that they're ancient applies here as well. We have a small window right now, and we must take advantage of it.
Making a move for Iguodala tells LeBron that we have potential past this season, so if we fail to win a championship, there's hope for 2010 and beyond. If we get Jamison, and we still fail to win a championship, then it also tells LeBron that we're willing to do what it takes to put the talent around him. If we fail to make a trade when both were reasonably available, I think that would be a fatal mistake. That's how Miami is handling their situation with Wade.
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Quote:
However, I'm not a fan of staying put just to stay put (based on this year's experience) if we have the opportunity to acquire Iguodala or Jamison. If we do stay put, and both were available, and we choke in the playoffs, LeBron really has no reason to stay. Shaq is a stop-gap, and he's 38, Anthony Parker is 34, and Zydrunas is 34-35 so the Boston argument that they're ancient applies here as well. We have a small window right now, and we must take advantage of it.
boston's core is ancient. the cavs core really isn't. lebron, mo, hickson, varejao are all young guys. shaq was a guy brought in for one purpose. i don't think anyone in the world thinks we are building around him. not to mention that he, along with z are both in the final year of their contracts. anthony parker also has just one year left after this season.
it's definitely not the same. we're experienced, but we definitely don't have that wear and tear that boston is showing right now. boston goes as far as kevin garnett's health takes them. they are a slightly above average team without him and have absolutely no chance at beating us unless he's on the floor.
i don't think our window is small at all. we are in very good financial shape, we really have no bad contracts at all beyond 1 or 2 years. our window only closes if lebron leaves and right now he has no reason to. he's playing on the best team in the league, with an owner who has given a very solid young gm carte blanche to do whatever is necassary to make the team better. dan gilbert is a top 3 owner in the league right now.
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Even with KG I think the Cavs could beat Boston in a 7 game series. They really haven't impressed me this year. They're horrible at offensive rebounding. I think they're ranked like 30th. Add in the fact I honestelly feel like the Cavs want it more then any team in the NBA right now.
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My only concern in looking past this season is in replacing Shaq.
He was brought in for one reason and one reason alone: Dwight Howard.
Well, after this year, I'm pretty sure that he's still gonna be in Orlando - and we won't have anything that can match up to him.
Granted, they aren't the same team as last year by any stretch, but he is still a problem that we have no other solution for.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I agree Purp, that should be our 2nd priority in the offseason. It's pretty much a given what our 1st priority is. I think we just need a guy like Kendrick Perkins. He won't be available but we just need a physical center to frustrate Dwight.
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Quote:
i don't think our window is small at all. we are in very good financial shape, we really have no bad contracts at all beyond 1 or 2 years. our window only closes if lebron leaves and right now he has no reason to. he's playing on the best team in the league, with an owner who has given a very solid young gm carte blanche to do whatever is necassary to make the team better. dan gilbert is a top 3 owner in the league right now.
I didn't mean to say that our window is small absolutely, but you said so yourself, Shaq was brought in for Dwight Howard. When Shaq leaves, breaks down, or retires, we're left with a huge hole. Especially if, God forbid, Dwight Howard improves and develops a mid-range game.
PrplPplEater said it better than I could:
Quote:
My only concern in looking past this season is in replacing Shaq.
He was brought in for one reason and one reason alone: Dwight Howard.
Well, after this year, I'm pretty sure that he's still gonna be in Orlando - and we won't have anything that can match up to him.
Granted, they aren't the same team as last year by any stretch, but he is still a problem that we have no other solution for.
Dwight Howard is the wall between LeBron and multiple championships. Our core is young, yes, but our core was young last season too.
Personally, I think Iguodala negates that wall by shifting emphasis from having to play Dwight Howard one-on-one i.e. Shaq, and instead, forcing Orlando to play US one-on-one with the back-court of Mo, Iguodala and LeBron. They can't, and Iguodala showed last season he can play against Orlando.
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The best thing about being in the east, is that if Lebron leaves, the talent we have here, we're still a playoff team.
If we got AI2 then we'd still be a contender with a lineup like:
PG: Mo
SG: West, Gibson
SF: JJ
PF: AI
C: Andy
Ill also say that with that, I don't think Lebron will leave, based on the chemistry he has here with guys like Andy and Month, why learn new teammates tendencies?
But knowing we won't be a horrible team IF he leaves, I don't really worry about it anymore.
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Yeah God forbid what Dwight would be like if he actually had offensive moves 
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Quote:
boston's core is ancient. the cavs core really isn't. lebron, mo, hickson, varejao are all young guys. shaq was a guy brought in for one purpose. i don't think anyone in the world thinks we are building around him. not to mention that he, along with z are both in the final year of their contracts. anthony parker also has just one year left after this season.
it's definitely not the same. we're experienced, but we definitely don't have that wear and tear that boston is showing right now. boston goes as far as kevin garnett's health takes them. they are a slightly above average team without him and have absolutely no chance at beating us unless he's on the floor.
i don't think our window is small at all. we are in very good financial shape, we really have no bad contracts at all beyond 1 or 2 years. our window only closes if lebron leaves and right now he has no reason to. he's playing on the best team in the league, with an owner who has given a very solid young gm carte blanche to do whatever is necassary to make the team better. dan gilbert is a top 3 owner in the league right now.
This 
I agree with all your points here, but I am also confident that the Cavs could beat Boston in a 7 games series even with KG. Even with him out there he/the team are showing their age. I also think Rasheed was subtraction but addition, he is not working wonders there in Boston.
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 17,284 |
Also guys we might have a bit of a problem with salary cap which may force us to make a trade. Losing Z and Shaq's contracts expiring after this season. However it still has us over the cap. http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9195
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,388
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,388 |
We own their bird rights though, we can resign them and go over the as long as the owner doesnt mind going into the luxury tax.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027
Legend
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OP
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
i didn't mean that boston beats us with kg on the floor, what i am saying is the stand zero chance of beating us in a 7 game series without us. he is that entire team. they barely beat a mediocre bulls team and struggled even though they still had favorable matchups against orlando, in the playoffs last year.
kg means that much. i don't like the guy (by the way, did you guys know he's INTENSE?) but he is a hall of famer and is one of the best defensive players in the history of the game, he's like dennis rodman with an offensive set.
with a healthy kg, boston cleveland is a 6-7 game series much like 2 seasons ago.
and yes, obviously if shaq leaves or even if he doesnt and breaks down at any point we have obvious problems with dwight howard, but let's remember, this orlando team isn't as good as last year, they don't make the clutch plays they used to make and they sent turkoglu away for vince freaking carter. definitely the bonehead move of the summer.
if shaq leaves, the cavs just need a big body, you don't need to shut dwight howard down, you just need to make him give the ball up, and not command a double team constantly. you can live with him getting his if you're at least singling him up most of the time.
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,317
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,317 |
Call me crazy, but I'm not that worried about Dwight Howard or the magic when we inevitably lose Shaq. Unless between now and then he develops a smooth jump shot, becomes a good free throw shooter, and adds a post move or two, I don't think he's a problem. If they still had the team they had last year I'd be in full on panic mode without Shaq, but they no longer have Turkoglu, Alston, or Lee and they can't possibly catch fire against us every year like they did last year. Plus they have Vince Carter hoisting up tons of bad shots and turning the ball over a lot... Howard hurts, but I think we have enough in Powe and Andy and hopefully another big after Shaq leaves (don't need an all-star, hopefully just someone who is an upgrade over D-Block) to just annoy him the whole series and try to frustrate him into fouling and turning the ball over. I think we have the Magic's number even if Howard gets 25+ a night. Turkoglu, Lewis and Alston are the reasons they took us out last year, not Howard, imo, and 2 of the 3 are gone... The Lakers on the other hand are a little bit scary without Shaq/Z in the next few years before Kobe hangs it up. Kobe is what, 32-33? He's still got some good years left in him. Gasol is a nightmare, that guy is a legit offensive threat. I think with Shaq and Z to match up with Gasol and Bynum we're fine and perfectly capable of beating them in the finals, however when Shaq and Z are gone...yikes. About Iggy, I would love to have him but I just don't think its very realistic that we can pull that trade off. I think the guy would be a tremendous defensive player in our system and would be perfect for shutting down the bigger perimeter players like Lewis. I think he would grow a lot and turn into a Pippen for LeBron, and that would be fantastic. I just don't see landing him as being a reasonable expectation unfortunately. Seems a lot more likely the Wizards will panic and give us Jamison for basically nothing (a bench player and Z's contract) at the deadline. Not expecting it though, would just be nice. There is one last possibility...We could infiltrate Oklahoma City's front office and we can have them trade us Kevin Durant for next to nothing...Hey, it worked for Boston and L.A. 
"All I know is, as long as I led the Southeastern Conference in scoring, my grades would be fine." - Charles Barkley
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum *** Cavs January Thread ***
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