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Ok so I think most of us will agree Wimbley is not the pass rusher savage thought he could be. What are the chances he could move inside for us? Bowens looked like an all pro after watching Barton most of the season. Is Bowens a more fluid of an athlete than Wimbley? It could kill 2 birds with one stone. Get some size and speed inside and free up a spot outside for someone that can hold the corner and use rush moves to GET TO the qb.
Thought? (even if you just want to call me an idiot, its ok)
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NO thanks.. I'm content w/ Wimbley outside.
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Quote:
NO thanks.. I'm content w/ Wimbley outside.
I'm not.
But I'm a bit indifferent to him staying or going. I just don't want him to be one of our two starting OLBs anymore.
Wouldn't mind keeping him around for depth.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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He'd be even worse at ILB.
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Any Thought as to putting him at DE? or is he too small for a 3-4 DE? I think the NYGiants are onto something with having way more athletic and physically fit DLinemen ... guys like OSI and TUCK aren't built like Corey williams ....
Dont get me wrong I know the entire defense is different ... but I still think we could get some natural pass rushing out of him just like back in the day at FSU where he made his name by putting his paw in the ground. Why take him out of his natural position, force him to back up 3 yards, force him to read the plays instead of just being a rusher or disruptor, and forcing him cover players? Let him be a bull again.
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You answered your own question. We play a 3-4 defense.
Anyway, he has his hand on the ground a lot of the time anyway in nickel and dime situations.
Wimbley is what he is. An average NFL player. He hasn't proven he is anything more than that, and I'd say we've had a fair amount of time to evaluate him.
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You answered your own question. We play a 3-4 defense.
Wimbley is what he is. An average NFL player. He hasn't proven he is anything more than that, and I'd say we've had a fair amount of time to evaluate him.
Trade him to Romeo.
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Trade him to the Browncos
As a side note.. I was really surprised to see Alex Hall disappear this season.
I was expecting big things from him after his preseason performance.
Last edited by Kingcob; 01/18/10 06:29 AM.
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Not anything like an ILB for this league. He could be a "rogue" set like we did with Rudd; but if we find a better guy, I want that guy. He just doeszn't impress me as regularly as an OLB should; inside, the bulk monsters eat him alive.
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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Just clicking
Ya know,, did some checking on Wimbley,, He had 6.5 Sacks this year,, an improvement over the last two years.. not big, but trending upwards.
69 tackles,,,, 48 Solo. Both of which are NFL Career highs for him.. improvement maybe?
He's durable,, having missed only one game in 4 years..
He's a worker.. no slouching around
He a high motor and high character guy...
All in all, it's hard not to like Wimbley from that standpoint...
The ugly is, he's not lived up to his 1st round selection status.. He's one dimensional.
But because we have so damn many holes to fill on this team (seems to be a recurring theme doesn't it) I'd say let him alone,, fix that position after you fill some bigger needs...
So, no, I'd leave him where he is.....
#GMSTRONG
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Damanshot
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There should be no thought moving Kam inside..I said after I knew he was being drooled over by Savage he was never a force against the run in college..and was no monster in rushing the passer..I haven'rt muxh improvement from him.yet I continue to see people want to elevate thios guy..one thing I have noted over the years is the inaccurate analysis on Browns LB's..overrating them..
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Wimbley has gotten better against the run this year. I've never seen wimbley contain the edge so the runner could not get to the outside until this year. He is still learning, but I think he is finally becoming an all around LB, and not just a pass rusher, which he was his rookie year.
He got a ton of sacks his first year in the league, and his coaches asked him to learn more about covering defenders, and he has done that.
Wimbley does not need to be touched, but if he were to be traded, it would be okay, b/c we have his clone in Alex Hall.
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None at all...all his negatives get highlited at the ILB position and he is best as a blitzer...we started moving him a lot on stunts at the end of the season...I liked our pass rush those last 4 games and Wimbley was a part of it - even if he didn't get the sack he moved the QB into sacks a lot...16 sacks the last 4 games???
Maybe upgrade on Wimbley but he progressed a lot last year and it will be hard to upgrade on him.
JMHO - ILB has to be strong at coverage.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
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The ugly is, he's not lived up to his 1st round selection status.
Don't be offended, D, but this is something I wish people would stop thinking about.
I'm not saying you are doing this, but in general, too many people think about a players draft status when forming an opinion. Once the player is actually drafted and signs his contract, where he was drafted becomes absolutely and utterly meaningless. We have to take that consideration out of the equation and just evaluate the player. Whether he's the first pick in the draft or a street free agent, it comes down to what he's done on the field compared to what is expected.
Side note: You can't say Wimbley is "trending upwards." His stats are marginally better than the year before, but it's the first year after two which were trending the other way. If he shows up next year and has 8 sacks and 80 tackles, then we can say he's trending upwards.
Like many players on this defense, Wimbley was the beneficiary of Ryan's defense which fools offensive sets and lets guys come free. We have players who racked up some sacks that really don't have any business being starters or in some cases even on the field. The Pittsburgh game comes to mind where so many unblocked guys were running free.
The real bottom line is that Wimbley simply doesn't make plays. Every once in a while an offensive linemen will screw up and let him run past him on his outside shoulder for a sack or a pressure. He'll take on a blocker, give up a few yards, then slide off him to make a tackle on a ball-carrier five or six yards downfield. That's all he does for this team. He simply isn't a disruptive force.
As for moving him to ILB, he isn't nearly physical or instinctive enough to make that transition, nevermind his lack of pass-coverage.
He belongs right where he is, however good or bad that may be.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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.I'm not saying you are doing this, but in general, too many people think about a players draft status when forming an opinion. Once the player is actually drafted and signs his contract, where he was drafted becomes absolutely and utterly meaningless.
Big fat BS-flag Sir...
so a Top 10 picks that turns out a "decent" starter but nothing exceptional would be ok despite making Top 5 position money and eating money only All Pros should get? You get the importance of value now?
Why do you think QBs, OTs and DL get overdrafted in the Top 5 and C, Gs and ILBs don't?...it's because even an average one at that position costs as much in FA and because a TRUE stud at thos positions are very rare
a C, G or ILB otoh should be All Pro material from the start and still would probably be paid more than 12 year vets All Pros at that position
It's rhetorical BS Toad to say it's not important WHERE you drafted a guy...especially for a rebuilding team that should look BPA all the way...if a guy drafted in round 1 or 2 is "ok" but not great for such a team and 5 of 10 players after those picks are good to grat players hen their draft was NOT "ok" although the players picked have been "ok"...it's really not that difficult....you're only as"good" or "bad" compared to other NFL teams and if you do worse than other teams despite being repeatedly in a better position (picking higher) than you're sucking
That's why last year's draft was bad despite having a some solid player's in it....
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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he's a great athlete. maybe a 3rd down specialist in the future.
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I think you're missing his point.
Obviously it's not OK to draft a bust with a top ten pick. That's on the draft people/GM, though.
Just because you drafted someone way high doesn't mean you HAVE to play them no matter how bad they are. Eventually you have to say you made a mistake on the player.
Example, Jamarcus Russell. I think that name is explanation enough.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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Some people are late bloomers though. Mangini may see something in KW that he likes.
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I'm all for wimbley playing ILB...
... on the steelers.
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Ok you all said what i thought was going to be said. Keep him where he is and keep building parts around him before we replace him with someone better. Just a couple more questions:
Do you think he would perform equal to Bowens on the inside?
Other than knowing the scheme better what does Bowens bring that Kam doesn't?
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Quote:
He'd be even worse at ILB.
^^^What Deep said^^^
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Bowens has played inside before.
#gmstrong
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How about moving Wimbley to any other team in the league's roster for any type of compensation. I mean if a new Mac Snackwrap is offered for Kam I would probably take it at this point.
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
Formerly 4yikes2yoshi0
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How about moving Wimbley to any other team in the league's roster for any type of compensation. I mean if a new Mac Snackwrap is offered for Kam I would probably take it at this point.
Gees,, yeah, let's create more problems.. perfect thinking... 
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Damanshot
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Okay, Daman. The Mac Snackwrap, although delicious, was simply an exaggeration. I just think Wimbley is good for nothing other than maybe depth/situational pass rushing (which in my opinion he's even barely marginally effective at that). His 6.5 sacks are the beneficiary of Ryan's blitz schemes. He's a hard worker and high character guy which I really do appreciate, but the guy isn't a playmaker and just doesn't disrupt the offensive backfield. If you ask me, the spot he's occupying needs to be upgraded. Roth is the only real starter we have at OLB to get to the QB and play stout against the run. Wimbley just doesn't do anything well enough for me to feel good about him being in our starting lineup.
I'd take a 4th for him and wash my hands of the situation. Maybe Jerry Hughes or Brandon Graham (who I had the opportunity to play against in HS and who was a complete freaking beast) would certainly have me feeling better about our front seven next season. Like the guy as a person, but as a player he and his one pass-rushing move are only holding this defense back. This will need to be upgraded.
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
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I think we have his replacement already (if he needs to be replaced).
Marcus Benard got to the QB a few times, and was able to disrupt the QB as well...
6'2, and 250 lbs.. he has good size.
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Quote:
I'd take a 4th for him and wash my hands of the situation. Maybe Jerry Hughes or Brandon Graham (who I had the opportunity to play against in HS and who was a complete freaking beast) would certainly have me feeling better about our front seven next season. Like the guy as a person, but as a player he and his one pass-rushing move are only holding this defense back. This will need to be upgraded.
Sure, I like Roth more than Wimbley too. But finding an OLB isn't that easy. I mean we've had Wimbley for how long, and just now we got ourselves an upgrade to him. No, I don't think Wimbley needs to be upgraded as much as some positions. I also believe that Wimbley has gotten better every year against the run and pass, especially the pass.
While I don't think anyone would give up a round 4 for Kam, i'm not sure I would take it. Be careful what you wish for.............
Then again, may be next year Veikune or Jason Trusnik could be starting on the outside next year and that 4th could find us a great new player......
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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I just think Wimbley is good for nothing other than maybe depth/situational pass rushing (which in my opinion he's even barely marginally effective at that).
Lots of folks share that opinion,, and perhaps you and they are correct.. dunno,,
My only comment was that with so many other holes to fill, keeping him where he is is probably the smartest thing AT THIS MOMENT..
Powers within the organization seemed to think he's improving.. in fact a few on this thread seem to think that also.
Not every LB we draft or bring in can be Ray Lewis.. in fact, few are.. Sometimes, decent, solid guys are good enough to win with... It's only my opinion, but I think Wimbley fits that description..
So until the next great thing comes along, I'd like to keep him right where he is...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Other than knowing the scheme better what does Bowens bring that Kam doesn't?
Watch Wimbley try to play in coverage. He performs in coverage as well as Jamal Lewis runs to the outside. Trust me, having him rush the passer (even if we have to switch him around and disguise things to get him sacks) is by far the better option.
We're... we're good?
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He did pretty decent this year, I wouldn't mess with him... Let Ryan do his magic! If he gets something out of him, don't expect much more. Telling him to learn a new position will hold him back another year+ 
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The main reason I even thought about moving Wimbley inside was I wouldn’t want to get rid of him but hope he will be upgraded upon. Roth is set, if we had someone like Brandon Graham opposite him that would be awesome.
You guys are right though, he is HORRIBLE in pass coverage, TE’s would eat him up.
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I was impressed with Bowens the last few games of the season. He was making plays, and was a big part of that defensive spurt we had against Pitt. This makes Wimbley expendable, and if we can retain Roth, we can buy some time to add depth.
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no thanks.. we keep wimbley. If you all actually take a look at our roster, we have good depth behind wimbley.
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How about moving Wimbley to any other team in the league's roster for any type of compensation. I mean if a new Mac Snackwrap is offered for Kam I would probably take it at this point.
I'm all for trading Wimbley as long as we have no one worse at his position.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
I just think Wimbley is good for nothing other than maybe depth/situational pass rushing (which in my opinion he's even barely marginally effective at that).
Lots of folks share that opinion,, and perhaps you and they are correct.. dunno,,
My only comment was that with so many other holes to fill, keeping him where he is is probably the smartest thing AT THIS MOMENT..
Powers within the organization seemed to think he's improving.. in fact a few on this thread seem to think that also.
Not every LB we draft or bring in can be Ray Lewis.. in fact, few are.. Sometimes, decent, solid guys are good enough to win with... It's only my opinion, but I think Wimbley fits that description..
So until the next great thing comes along, I'd like to keep him right where he is...
Good philosophy,...and, NO trade. That would just make him another wasted draft pick. He salvagable at this point. Give Ryan another year with him.
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Wimbley has gotten better against the run this year. I've never seen wimbley contain the edge so the runner could not get to the outside until this year. He is still learning, but I think he is finally becoming an all around LB, and not just a pass rusher, which he was his rookie year.
He didn't do anything outstanding..he was better this year but it's still not saying much..in fact it's interesting to me that when the starters went down it really didn't hurt the front seven too much more than it already was..which plainly says our LB core(and that includes Jackson) isn't good.
And for anyone wanting to come to DQ's defense,and post stats let me lay this out ... He doesn't force fumbles (zero in 191 tackles in 2008, one in 57 tackles in 2009), he rarely makes any plays behind the line of scrimmage (three of 191 tackles in 2008 were behind the line. Two of 57 were behind the line in 2009).
1 forced fumble in 248 tackles..5 tackles behind the line ...thats it..yet a lot of you are satisfied with his production..
If you want to post stats check where those tackles occur.
That is not a force..that does not spell out his is a dominate player..and I keep seeing comments about Miava..he is a backup and nothing more.
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 01/20/10 01:09 PM.
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He didn't do anything outstanding..he was better this year but it's still not saying much..in fact it's interesting to me that when the starters went down it really didn't hurt the front seven too much more than it already was..which plainly says our LB core(and that includes Jackson) isn't good.
And for anyone wanting to come to DQ's defense,and post stats let me lay this out ... He doesn't force fumbles (zero in 191 tackles in 2008, one in 57 tackles in 2009), and he doesn't make tackles behind the line of scrimmage (three out of 191 tackles in 2008 were behind the line. Two of 57 were behind the line in 2009).
1 forced fumble in 248 tackles..5 tackles behind the line ...thats it..yet a lot of you are satisfied with his production..
If you want to post stats check where those tackles occur.
That is not a force..that does not spell out his is a dominate player..and I keep seeing comments about Miava..he is a backup and nothing more.
What site did you get your numbers from?
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Actually you can go to multiple sites..
[edit] Career statistics
Year Team G Tackles Sacks TFL INT INT YDS FF FR PD TD
2006 Cleveland 13 93 0 3 0 0 0 0 0 0
2007 Cleveland 14 101 1 2 1 1 0 1 3 0
2008 Cleveland 16 154 2 - 3 29 0 0 6 0
Totals 43 348 3 5 4 30 0 1 9 0
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%27Qwell_Jackson
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.I'm not saying you are doing this, but in general, too many people think about a players draft status when forming an opinion. Once the player is actually drafted and signs his contract, where he was drafted becomes absolutely and utterly meaningless.
----------------------------------------------------
Big fat BS-flag Sir...
Oh boy............Sir now is it? I'm moving up in the world 
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so a Top 10 picks that turns out a "decent" starter but nothing exceptional would be ok despite making Top 5 position money and eating money only All Pros should get? You get the importance of value now?
I didn't say "value." You did. 
I could have...........should have...........been even more long-winded with my point, so here goes the clarification.......
In general, people tend to get too hung up on draft-status when forming an opinion about a player. In Wimbley's case, as it pertains to his play on the field, his draft status should no have influence in that regard. It doesn't matter if he was the 1st pick in the draft or some undrafted street free agent, because the only thing that does matter is whether or not he's playing well enough.
The money takes care of itself because value doesn't exist during those 60-minutes on Sundays.
So what I'm really saying is that there are some people who want to grade a players performance by including where that player was drafted or how he was acquired. That no longer plays a role with Wimbley when talking purely about his play on the field.
Back to money, that discussion takes care of itself. Once a rookie's contract is coming up, the player is either going to earn a raise because of good play or he's not because of bad play. At that point, draft status is utterly meaningless.
Take a long look at the Cribbs threads. People tend to use his draft-status (read, lack there-of) when talking about what he should be paid. Once he's on the team, that is ancient history and has zero bearing on the negotiations. He is either deserving to be the highest paid special-teamer in the league or he isn't.
So in terms of evaluating what Wimbley gives us on the field, his draft status doesn't matter. Keep in mind I noted this because Daman listed his draft position in reference as a negative. My comment veered into a different direction because I don't feel that matters. Wimbley is either producing well enough, or he isn't.
I say he isn't, and it has nothing to do with draft status.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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If you all actually take a look at our roster, we have good depth behind wimbley.
Really? Like who? We don't have much depth at outside OLB. We have much better depth at ILB. I don't mind Wimbley, and if we can't improve, it's only logical to keep him where he is.
Is he improving? Depends on what the comparison is. His first season? Pass-rusher? No, he regressed. Is he improving as a 3-4 OLB and its fundamentals (coverage, reading plays, being in position)? Yes.
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum thoughts on moving Wimbley to ILB
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