DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum 2010 Cleveland Indians: And you thought your team sucked

I completely disagree. The Cliff Lee move, on the surface, was not that bad.

Look at what Texas got for Texeira and then look at what Atlanta got for him. Texas (with 1.5 years left on his contract) got a ton more than Atlanta (with only 1/2 a year left).

So, that, on the surface, looks to be a sound deal. You say that everyone in MLB knew we 'had' to trade Cliff Lee....well, this July, everyone in MLB would also KNOW we had to trade Cliff Lee, but he would only have 3 months of service with that team. His value would not have been higher than last July.

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ok, now the Victor Martinez move is what I would consider a pure business move and really cold-hearted. Victor was signed by us when he was 17. He came up through the system. He was our clubhouse leader. He was the heart and soul of our team and wanted to remain with us throughout his career.

I think Victor would have taken a hometown discount to stay here, but we've been planning for his departure for a few years, and we needed to save $$$, so we moved him.







oh, and if you believe that Forbes 'operating income' where the Yankees lost $25 mil while everyone else made $$$, then I have some beachfront property in Nebraska you might be interested in buying as well.

why wouldn't i? forbes is a pretty reliable source.

it's not like i got it off some kid's blog.

i don't know the numbers, i'm just showing you what i read, and i have heard national guys, in the past, talk about the yankees taking a loss that year.

I don't know the numbers either, or how they do their accounting, but is it possible that the Yankees could show an operating loss while their wholly owned subsidiary - The YES network - rakes in large profits?

from what i have read, the yes network basically funds their payroll. i think that's kinda the deal, you let us carry the games as long as you stack the team with the money you get.

and with revenue sharing introduced, i could see how they can lose money.

and don't forget, baseball does have a salary cap, a lot of people don't realize that, but it's like the nba, where you have to pay a luxury tax

for the yankees though, who cares?

From Wiki:

When YES launched, Goldman Sachs owned a minority share of the network. In late 2003, the Yankees and Nets decided to part ways, with the Nets being sold to a group led by real-estate developer Bruce Ratner. This sale did not include the Nets' ownership stake in YES, which remained with the pre-merger owners of the team. In 2004, YankeeNets was renamed Yankee Global Enterprises LLC, which owns the Yankees and YES as separate companies. Therefore, the Yankees technically do not own YES. The Yankees, however, receive a rights fee from YES that is somewhat higher than MSG previously paid. In 2007, the portion of the network owned by Goldman Sachs was put up for sale for estate taxes reasons [1]; the Yankees will reportedly keep their stake in the network.

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So I'm guessing that the Yankees could show an operating loss while the parent company that owns both the Yanks and YES would enjoy a fairly sizable net profit.

If they took a loss it might be because they added numbers for the building of that new stadium...

the problem is that any numbers I or you or even Forbes can show is what the teams provide.

if the Yankees decide to hide a bunch of their actual income somewhere else, they are under no legal operation to report it (they are not a publicly traded company).

they may say their "operating income" was at a loss while the funds from the YES network do not count. it also does not say if the merchandising income is included, et cetera.

that's the problem with trying to figure all of this out....unless you are someone trying to buy the team where they open their books for you, it is impossible to gather the information.

Yeah,...but if you or I "hide income" we go to jail, no ?

if a journalist asks you waht your income is and you lie or tell a truth that doesn't tell the whole story, you will not go to jail.

as long as they are being honest with the IRS (and again, not publicly traded company, so their books are not open even to the player's union), then what can you do?

I follow ya'

Doesn't make it right though.

i agree. i would love to see what is really going on with some of these teams and figure out how broken the system really is.

i personally think the bad owners would really get exposed if they adopted a policy like the nba where the team that the player currently plays for can offer more than other teams (like us and lbj)

then you'll really find out who cares about winning.

without the same type of contract restrictions and true revenue sharing, you would still end up in the state we are at today as some teams just wouldn't be able to afford the stars.

i agree we should have it though because it would lengthen the window in which to trade the player. players want the most $$$, so they would do sign-n-trades in baseball too.

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and I've said this before, but I just refuse to complain about this in MLB when in the NBA we have a chance at our first championship because we are the beneficiaries of similar economical advantages (LeBron making us a big market just by being LeBron).



also, Indians over Halos 5-4 in the 6th right now

Not to argue, and realize you're trying to behave but screw that comparison.

The Cavs aren't using any less "integrity" in what's "allowed" by the NBA than the Yankees are in what's allowed in MLB.

I agree. The teams merely need to play within the rules that they are given. How they are given the rules is another argument, but you get what championships you can and don't apologize for them.

Also, Indians up 7-4 now over Halos. Another solid hitting day for the Tribe bats.

only negative is that Westbrook was battered in his return, but that is as expected (should take him awhile to get re-aclimated)

1. i don't blame the yankees for doing what they do

2. the cavs don't have the yes network funding their payroll, that is all out of mr gilbert's very generous checkbook.

3. there is definitely some shadiness in the nba, but i think nba teams have a better chance to get better and compete than mlb teams do. that's why it is different to compare, plus 16 teams in the league make the playoffs. maybe that is what is wrong with baseball, allow more teams and the unfairness gets covered up by the fact that some of these smaller teams might have a fighting chance.

those are fair points.

on #3, how many times has a non top4 seed from either conference won the NBA championship? so, even though 16 make it, it's pretty well known who has a fighting chance.

the only team I could think of off the top of my head was the '94 Rockets who won with I believe a 6seed in the West.

Quote:

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plus 16 teams in the league make the playoffs. maybe that is what is wrong with baseball, allow more teams and the unfairness gets covered up by the fact that some of these smaller teams might have a fighting chance.

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id love to see more than four teams make the playoffs in mlb. Add two more wildcards and the top 2 seeds get a 1st round bye, just like the nfl. But this couldnt happen as the baseball season usually start with snow and ends with snow as it is. It could compliment another idea id love to see, shorten the regular season.

Id like to see 120-140 reg season games, I know that would destroy baseball statistics as we know them, but id be for it.

Whatever you say

i think now would be a great time to shorten the season.

seems like most were against it because of the numbers, the purists and media like that you can compare numbers, even though it hasn't always been a 162 game season...

problem is, you shorten the season and the games get bigger and more important, which means that prices go up and the average fan is gonna get priced out much like they do in other sports.

but back to my point that now would be a great time, the whole numbers being different because of the amount of games played changes, but what good are numbers anyways? 2 of the most famous records in baseball were broken by cheaters, one of them broken by several of them... it would almost be like a fresh clean slate.

if you could have the playoffs start in september, i think that would be awesome.

baseball has potential to be fun again, but in my eyes, it's the 4th best professional team league. the nhl is not anywhere near as popular as baseball, but the playoffs are a lot more fun to watch.

Thats and interesting thought LBJ, it would almost create a newer "modern era" in baseball. It would basically mean all the records that were broken by the steroid cheaters would be forgotten or at least become irrelevant.


KING

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The New Hope: These 10 prospects offer Cleveland Indians the best chance at a bright future
By Paul Hoynes, The Plain Dealer
March 13, 2010, 9:25PM

rondonhorizcc.jpgChuck Crow / The Plain DealerHector Rondon has enticed scouts and officials in the Indians organization with a variety of pitches that could make him "unhittable," according to Tribe director of player development Ross Atkins.GOODYEAR, Ariz. -- Indians fans are under the wrong impression. They thought spring training started Feb. 21 when pitchers and catchers reported to big-league camp. Where would they get an idea like that?

The spring training that really matters starts Monday, when full-squad workouts begin for the organization's minor leaguers. The top prospects have already been here for two weeks, but Monday the future will take the field in full force at the Indians' player development center.

The Indians are plotting their return to glory with these players. If that's not true, somebody has some serious explaining to do about the wholesale trading and salary dumping that's been going on for the last two years.

Filling the holes left by CC Sabathia, Cliff Lee, Victor Martinez, Casey Blake, Mark DeRosa and the rest of the dearly departed are reportedly the cream of baseball's minor-league crop. Throw in a few choice draft picks and these are the faces that the Indians will be selling to the public as their stairway back to the promised land of October baseball.

Here's a look at 10 players who could help turn the Indians around in the next few years.

santanabatcc.jpgChuck Crow / The Plain DealerConsidered already a big-league hitter who must still work on his catching skills, Carlos Santana will almost certainly appear at Progressive Field some time this season.C CARLOS SANTANA

Vitals: 5-11, 220 pounds, 23.

2010 starting point: Class AAA Columbus.

Acquired: Came from Dodgers for Casey Blake in July 23, 2008.

Comment: "He's well above average offensively from a discipline and power standpoint," said Ross Atkins, the Indians' director of player development. "Defensively, he has all the skills to be an above-average catcher. When he breaks into the big leagues is up to Carlos, Mark Shapiro, Chris Antonetti and Manny Acta."

RHP JASON KNAPP

Vitals: 6-5, 225 pounds, 19.

2010 starting point: Class A Lake County.

Acquired: Came from Philadelphia for Cliff Lee and Ben Francisco on July 29, 2009. Knapp needed right shoulder surgery after the trade.

Comment: "He just started throwing again," said Atkins. "Every report we've gotten from the doctors says he's ahead of the game. Because of how young he is, we're going to exhaust the process and make sure it's as thorough as possible.

"I see him as a starter. He has power to his pitches. He's a big strong physical kid who throws in the mid-90s and has a plus breaking ball."

LHP NICK HAGADONE

Vitals: 6-5, 230 pounds, 24.

2010 starting point: Class A Kinston.

Acquired: Came from Boston for Victor Martinez on July 31, 2009.

Comment: "He's 6-5, 230 pounds, with nine percent body fat and throws 99 mph," said Atkins. "And he has a pretty good breaking ball. ... It doesn't take long as an evaluator to like him ... it takes one pitch."

chisenhallcc.jpgChuck Crow / The Plain DealerA first-round pick in 2008 who is still just 21, Lonnie Chisenhall has shown a quick bat and a growing skill with the glove at third base.3B LONNIE CHISENHALL

Vitals: BL, 6-2, 190, 21.

2010 starting point: Class AA Akron.

Acquired: Indians first round pick in 2008.

Comment: "He has a short swing, discipline and a great understanding of what he needs to do to drive the ball," said Atkins. "He has a chance to be a special defender."

C LOU MARSON

Vitals: BR, 6-1, 200, 23.

2010 starting point: Cleveland/Class AAA Columbus.

Acquired: Came from Philadelphia for Lee and Francisco on July 29, 2009.

Comment: "He's a very complete player," said Atkins. "He does everything you look for in a catcher with some offensive ability and he's still only 23."

RHP JEANMAR GOMEZ

Vitals: 6-3, 170, 22.

2010 starting point: Class AAA Columbus (rotation).

Acquired: Signed as a free agent in Venezuela on April 4, 2005.

Comment: "Every year we know he's going to be better than the year before," said Atkins. "He's durable, takes the ball, throws strikes and has three weapons -- fastball, slider and change-up."

weglarzcc.jpgChuck Crow / The Plain DealerA blossoming left-handed hitter, Nick Weglarz is expected by the Indians to have a big year in Class AA for the Akron Aeros.OF NICK WEGLARZ

Vitals: BL, 6-3, 240, 22.

2010 starting point: Class AA Akron.

Acquired: Indians third round pick in 2005.

Comment: "Weglarz, Beau Mills, Travis Hafner and Matt LaPorta are probably the most powerful guys in our organization," said Atkins. "There are not a lot of guys with that type of strength where they can mis-hit a ball and it still goes out of the park.

"He's made great progress as a defender. ... We think he's a guy who should be the best hitter in his league. He could move quick."

RHP HECTOR RONDON

Vitals: 6-3, 180, 22.

2010 starting point: Class AAA Columbus (rotation).

Acquired: Signed as a non-drafted free agent in Venezuela on Aug. 3, 2004.

Comment: "He has above average ability with his fastball," said Atkins. "He has no fear. He'll attack any hitter. ... When his slider is there, he's unhittable."

LHP SCOTT BARNES

Vitals: 6-4, 191, 22.

2010 starting point: Class AA Akron (rotation).

Acquired: Came from San Francisco for Ryan Garko on July 27, 2009.

carrascocc.jpgChuck Crow / The Plain DealerA struggling performance at the end of the 2009 season hasn't soured the Indians on the potential of right-handed starter Carlos Carrasco.Comment: "In the last two years, he's been on the mound for his team's last game when they've won championships," said Atkins. "He needs to command his fastball better. If he does that, he has all the weapons to compete for a starting job in the big leagues at some point."

RHP CARLOS CARRASCO

Vitals: 6-3, 221, 23.

2010 starting point: Class AAA Columbus (rotation).

Acquired: Came from Philadelphia for Lee and Francisco on July 29, 2009.

Comment: "If he shows us he belongs in the big leagues, there's not a lot of guys with stuff like his," said Atkins. "He can hit 95 mph with a power breaking ball and a feel for a change. Typically, you don't find all three of those things in one pitcher. When you do, you start talking about someone in the middle or front of the rotation."

J/C

Good day today as the Indians ran their record to 4-0 vs the Reds (). Hafner hit a 440 ft tape measure bomb to CF, and our two young phenom pitchers - Hector Rondon and Jeanmar Gomez - each pitched 3 shutout innings. The Featherheads are playing really well for Acta.

j/c

I really feel like the Indians have done pretty well in these trades the past few years. While no one is immediately excited about the prospect of rebuilding, the fact that they have re-emerged with a deep top 5 farm system this year tells me that contention shouldn't be too many years away.

Also, maybe they could've gotten a little more for Lee, but I feel like the Victor trade could be big. 2 arms with great potential (Masterson and Hadagone) for what amounts to a year and half rental of Victor when we weren't going to contend anyways. Time will tell though.

About the Indians...

tcrowecc.jpgChuck Crow / The Plain DealerIf Russell Branyan's balky back puts him on the disabled list to start the season, the Indian most likely to benefit could well be fourth outfielder Trevor Crowe.1. No matter what they say, the Indians have to be concerned about Russell Branyan's back. He is not working out with the rest of the team. He's not played in a preseason game, and the Indians don't know when he'll be back. Given Branyan's age of 34 and his history of significant back problems that halted his season at the end of last August, it's hard to count on him staying healthy when he does return.

2. If Branyan opens on the disabled list, it appears Michael Brantley will be the starting left fielder with Matt LaPorta at first base. If Branyan were healthy, he'd play first. LaPorta would be in left and Brantley probably ticketed to Class AAA Columbus. If Brantley opens in left field, Trevor Crowe has a real chance to make the team as an extra outfielder. The outfield of Shin Soo Choo, Grady Sizemore and Brantley are all left-handed hitters. A switch hitter, Crowe batted .255 vs. lefties, .228 vs. righties in limited duty last spring. In the minors, Crowe is a career .299 hitter vs. lefties, .271 vs. righties. His ability to steal bases means he can serve as a pinch runner.

3. Now that Kerry Wood is headed for the disabled list, consider this: Every time the Indians have signed a player for at least $10 million annually, he got hurt. Jake Westbrook and Travis Hafner were the other two in that $10 million club.

4. The Indians are pleased with how Wes Hodges has made the switch from third to first base. He will open the season at Columbus, but if he hits, he can be a factor in Cleveland because he bats from the right side and the lineup tilts left.

5. Because of elbow problems, Mitch Talbot pitched only 69 innings last season in the minors for Tampa Bay. He is close to earning a spot in the Tribe rotation, and the Indians don't think innings will be a problem. In the previous two years when he was a 13-game winner in Class AAA, he threw at least 161 innings.

6. The Indians are careful on building up expectation about Fausto Carmona, because he looked strong last spring. But they have been extremely pleased with his control, sinker and slider. He is working with veteran catcher Mark Redmond, who probably will handle Carmona in most of his starts.

7. This scouting report from Goodyear was emailed by George Poe: "A) The hit-and-run is on. In three games, I think I've seen more of that then all of last year. B) Yesterday, we had two bunts. And they were successful. C) Pitchout. I saw one yesterday and they got the guy out at third. Manny Acta is brought some National League managing to the games, and this is really fun."

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Chris Perez eager to tackle closing role for Cleveland Indians as Kerry Wood is out 6-8 weeks with muscle strain
By Paul Hoynes, The Plain Dealer

GOODYEAR, Ariz. -- Kerry Wood's body has given Chris Perez the chance he's always wanted. He's going to be the full-time closer on a big-league club.

The Indians announced Saturday that Wood will miss six to eight weeks with a strained muscle below his right shoulder. Perez was going to be Wood's set-up man. Now he's going to be slamming the door.

Wood injured his right latissiums dorsi muscle earlier in spring training. An MRI revealed a tear in the muscle Thursday. Wood, who removed himself from a scheduled appearance against Texas on March 13, hasn't pitched in a game since March 10.

"I'm excited, but at the same time it stinks that it had to come with Kerry getting hurt," said Perez. "I think, hopefully, they're being cautious right now and that he comes back a lot quicker than the doctors said."

Perez, 24, has been a closer throughout his minor-league career. He recorded 60 saves working his way through St. Louis' farm system. He has eight in the big leagues, including seven with the Cardinals in 2008.

"It's a good audition," said Perez, acquired from the Cardinals last year along with Jess Todd for Mark DeRosa. "It's a good way for the new coaching staff to get a look at me. I hope I take the ball and run with it and get off to a good start and help this team get off to a good start. I think that's one of the easiest ways to ruin a season right off the bat is to have the bullpen blow games."

kerry-wood-action-crow-2009.jpgChuck Crow/The Plain DealerKerry Wood will open season on the disabled list.Perez was going to open the season as Wood's eighth inning set-up man. Manager Manny doesn't have a specific pitcher to take Perez's spot.

"It's unfortunate," said Acta, after the 12-4 victory over Oakland on Saturday. "No team is better without Kerry Wood. We have a lot of confidence in Chris Perez. This is what he's done all his life.

"The rest of the guys are going to have to move up. For us it's going to be more mixing and matching trying to get the ball to Perez. That's the challenge."

Wood, Perez, Rafael Perez, Tony Sipp and Joe Smith were all but guaranteed jobs in the pen since the start of spring training. That left two jobs to fill. Now there are three vacancies.

The candidates include Jamey Wright, Saul Rivera, Mike Gosling, Jensen Lewis, Todd, Frank Herrmann, Josh Judy, Jeremy Sowers, Mitch Talbot and Aaron Laffey. Wright, Rivera and Gosling are in camp on non-guaranteed minor-league deals. Lewis and Todd were in the Tribe pen last year. Herrmann and Judy are prospects in their first big-league camp. Sowers, Talbot and Laffey are starters.

Sowers is coming off a strained left shoulder and will probably open the season on the disabled list. Laffey, Talbot and David Huff are competing for the last two spots in the rotation. Laffey had success in the pen last year and has options remaining. Talbot is out of options, but has little, if any, experience in the pen.

"One door closes and another one opens," said Acta. "It's an opportunity for somebody else to make the club that probably wouldn't have made it."

It did not sound as if the Indians were in a rush to make a trade for a set-up man.

"There aren't that many guys out there that you can just go knock on their doors and they can come in and set up for you," said Acta. "We're going to have to deal with this."

Initially, Wood and the Indians didn't think the injury was serious. Trainer Lonnie Soloff said they grew concerned when the pain lingered. That's when Wood underwent the MRI.

Wood, the third-highest paid player on the team with a $10.5 million salary, has been on the disabled list 12 times in his career. This will make No.13. The two-year, $20.5 million deal between Wood and the Indians has a vesting $11 million option for 2011 should he finish 55 games this year. This injury could make that bonus hard to reach.

Wood converted 20 of 26 save situations last year for a bullpen that registered the fewest saves in the AL.

Perez said he's learned a lot from the three big-league closers he's been around -- Wood, Ryan Franklin and Jason Isringhausen.

"I picked up stuff from all of them," said Perez. "The biggest thing they say is that it's about your mentality. You've got the stuff, you've got the tools. It's just believing in yourself and doing it."

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I've got 2 Indians on my Salary Cap Fantasy Baseball roster: Sizemore and Hafner. Overpaid for Sizemore, got Hafner for the league minimum.

I have a big feeling Hafner's gonna be a big value pickup for me.

And if Hafner's at all the MVP-caliber player he once was, perhaps the Indians will be a 90-loss team instead of a 100-loss team.

So much for small market teams not having enough cash to keep their stars.

MINNEAPOLIS -- AL MVP Joe Mauer has agreed to an eight-year, $184 million contract extension to stay with the Minnesota Twins.

The deal announced Sunday covers the 2011-2018 seasons and includes a full no-trade clause. It's the culmination of a monthslong negotiation between the Twins and their hometown star.

Mauer has won three AL batting titles and an MVP award. He is considered one of the best defensive catchers in the game. Last year he hit .365 with 28 home runs and 96 RBIs to help the Twins win the AL Central division.

The St. Paul native was the No. 1 overall pick by the Twins in 2001.



http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=5016230

Trella, you beat me to it man. Here's another link for anybody who is interested:

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/story/13095...headlines;other


- This is a great example of ownership that cares. - 184 million to an all world catcher and we couldn't sign either one of two Cy Young award winners?

- Dolan needs to sell our team - NOW.

I share your same opinion. Here are some articles about the subject.

New York - Baseball owners continue to slam the ball out of the park. Team values increased an average of 15% for the second consecutive year, to $376 million, in our 2006 survey of Major League Baseball's 30 franchises. Overall operating income increased to $360 million ($12.1 million per team) from $132 million ($4.4 million per team) the previous year, as revenue increased faster than player salaries.

The biggest winner was the Washington Nationals, whose value rose 42%. In March, Major League Baseball finally agreed to terms with the District of Columbia's local politicians that will have taxpayers foot most of the bill for a new $700 million stadium, which should open by the start of the 2009 season and add $40 million to $50 million to the team's revenue.

But the biggest story is the effect revenue sharing is having on the league's economic landscape. Most of the money comes courtesy of the New York Yankees, which paid a record $77 million toward baseball's revenue sharing system. The Boston Red Sox, baseball's No. 2 revenue sharer, paid only $51 million. Such generosity by Yankees owner George Steinbrenner, required by the league's rule that teams pay 34% of their net local revenue to help make poorer teams more competitive, is the reason why the Oakland Athletics, Minnesota Twins and Kansas City Royals increased in value by more than 20%.

Revenue sharing also had a profound impact on operating income. The Yankees and the Red Sox lost $50 million and $18.5 million, respectively, before interest, income taxes and depreciation. By not using their subsidies to boost player payroll (which was the intent of revenue sharing), the Pittsburgh Pirates, the Royals and the Tampa Bay Devil Rays each earned more than $20 million.

But the league's reliance on Steinbrenner's Yankees goes far beyond revenue sharing. For example, a visit by the Yankees can increase a home team's ticket sales by as much as 25%. And the Yankees account for 27% of all league merchandise sales, the profits of which get shared equally throughout the league to the tune of more than $3 million per franchise. In effect, much of the league operates as subsidiaries of the Bronx Bombers.

But don't feel bad for the Yankees or the Red Sox. They sit atop our rankings, worth $1 billion and $671 million, respectively, thanks to the revenue generated by their ownership stakes in regional sports networks. Steinbrenner's $62 million in cable money from the YES channel was by far the most in the league. Moreover, the Yankees will have a new cash-rich ballpark by 2009--perhaps adding another 20% to the team's valuation.

The big question after this season will be about baseball's broadcasting deal with Fox, which is owned by News Corp. The current $2.5 billion, six-year deal expires after this season, and it is not certain yet whether Fox will renew its deal. The thinking here is that Fox will renew for a 5% annualized increase. The league's $2.37 billion deal with ESPN, which is owned by Walt Disney Co., runs through the 2013 season. That means next year should be another boom for baseball, especially those teams subsidized by the Yankees.


http://www.forbes.com/2006/04/17/06mlb_baseball-team-valuations-cx_mo_0420sports.html


Revenue sharing makes some franchises significant payers and others recipients. For example, in 2005, the Yankees reportedly paid out about $76 million. Meanwhile, the Tampa Bay Rays, Toronto Blue Jays, Florida Marlins and Kansas City Royals each received $30 million or more, according to the Wall Street Journal.

Under the first version of revenue-sharing (from 2002 through 2006), some low-revenue teams seemed to be gaming the system. While revenue-sharing money is supposed to be used to improve on-field performance, some teams appeared to be using the shared revenue to enhance profits while failing to invest in higher payrolls. Last year Forbes reported that from 2002 to 2006, the Royals’ revenue-sharing dollars doubled to $32 million, while their player costs increased only 6 percent. Likewise, in 2006 and 2007, the Florida Marlins reportedly received more than $60 million in revenue sharing, according to The Hardball Times, but the team had opening day payrolls totaling $45.5 million.

Indeed, for low-revenue teams, there was previously a disincentive to fielding a better team and raising revenue — under the 2002–2006 revenue-sharing plan, more money coming in from tickets meant less money coming in from the shared pool of MLB revenues. Lower-revenue teams paid a marginal rate of 48 percent of local revenues into the shared pool, while high-revenue teams paid 40 percent. The current deal seeks to fix that disincentive, with all teams contributing 31 percent. Lower-revenue teams will keep more of the money they’ll make if they field a stronger team.

Baseball also has a competitive balance tax (aka “luxury tax”) on the portion of team payrolls that go above a pre-set ceiling, which rises each year. However, the thresholds are set so high that this tax typically only affects the top-spending New York Yankees and Boston Red Sox. Going by their opening day payroll of $209 million, this year’s threshold of $155 million and a special 40 percent repeat offender rate, the Yankees will pay $21.6 million in 2008 — equivalent to the entire payroll of the Florida Marlins.

http://www.bnet.com/2403-13502_23-210897.html


Under Major League Baseball’s revenue sharing system, which has been in effect for the last ten years, a number of "big market" teams like the Yankees, Mets, and Red Sox give huge chunks of money every season to a group of "small market" teams that include the Kansas City Royals, the Tampa Bay Devil Rays and the Florida Marlins.

Revenue Sharing 101
It's not that the wealthier teams are generous. Quite far from it. In 1997, baseball created a new revenue sharing system that requires successful teams to pay millions of dollars every year to unsuccessful teams. Revenue sharing is supposed to create better competitive balance among all 30 Major League Baseball teams. The past decade has shown that teams who use revenue sharing dollars to attract and retain talented ballplayers become more competitive on the field and more profitable on the books.

The Colorado Rockies are a fine example. The Rockies used all of the $16 million they received in 2006 revenue sharing dollars to increase their payroll in 2007, and that certainly helped the team win this year's National League pennant. The Detroit Tigers are another success story. They used revenue sharing dollars to attract free agents Ivan Rodriguez and Magglio Ordonez, and those players helped the Tigers climb from a team that won just 43 games in 2002 to a club that won the American League pennant last year.

Many Revenue Sharing Recipient Teams Don't Improve
Being on the receiving end of baseball’s Robin Hood Policy doesn't guarantee success, however. One reason that some clubs fail to improve is that they don't use their revenue sharing dollars to attract free agents or to retain homegrown players.

Major League Baseball's revenue sharing agreement does not require recipients to spend the "shared" revenue on actual ballplayers. All that is required by teams is that they use the money "to improve the product on the field." That vague requirement, however, has not been enforced by the League. In reality, the money can go anywhere. It can even go into the owner’s pockets.




Florida and Tampa Bay Are the Worst Revenue-Sharing Offenders
The two biggest abusers of the system are the Florida Marlins and the Tampa Bay Rays (who changed their official team name from the Devil Rays just a few days ago, wow!)

The Marlins won the World Series title in 2003 with a team that had a unique combination of great young players and talented veterans that included Josh Beckett, Brad Penny, Mike Lowell and Ivan Rodriguez. That year, the team had a respectable $54 million payroll. Rather than retain those players, however, the Marlins traded away Penny and Beckett for much cheaper players, and lost Mike Lowell and Pudge Rodriguez to free agency.

By shedding these stars, Florida was able to cut its payroll down to $14.9 million in 2006, which is less than 20% of the Major League average of $78 million. It was also less than half of the $31 million in revenue sharing dollars the team received that year. So, rather than using the money to retain or attract on-field talent, the owners took it as part of the team's MLB best $43 million profit in 2006.

The Rays might be worse than the Marlins. From 2002 through 2006, Tampa Bay took in an average of $32 million per year in revenue sharing money. During that same period, the Rays had an average payroll of just $27 million, which was the lowest in baseball. They also had the worst five year record on the field, winning an average of just 70 games per season. Yet the team turned an average profit of more than $20 million during those years.

The Revenue Sharing Rules Need a Change
As stated above, baseball doesn't force revenue sharing recipients to use the money on payroll. All that is required is that the team use the money to "improve the product on the field." No one has even tried to define the meaning of "improve the product on the field." Moreover, there are not any subtantial reporting requirements or other measures of accountability in the system. Teams get the money and simply use it as they please. Some spend it on payroll and watch their teams improve. Others pocket the cash and watch their teams continue to suck.

So long as the rules remain lax and enforcement non-existent, teams will be able to take advantage of the system. Here are some changes that have been suggested.

Some advisors argue that baseball should require teams to spend a specified minimum percentage of shared revenue on player payroll. Others have suggested a model that would pay the most revenue sharing dollars to those small market teams who were best able to increase their attandance and/or television viewership each year. Some have even suggested a simple minimum dollar amount for player payroll.

Whether or not any of these ideas can work is of course subject to debate. Perhaps the best way to resolve that debate would be to implement one or more of them and see how they work. It's got to be better than what baseball has right now.

P.S. -- On December 4, 2007, the Marlins agreed to trade their two highest paid players, Miguel Cabrera and Dontrelle Willis, to the Detroit Tigers for young prospects, a move that will likely insure that the Marlins will have the lowest payroll and one of the worst franchises in baseball in 2008.




http://baseball.suite101.com/article.cfm/baseballs_revenue_sharing_problem

that article backs up a lot of what i was saying before, some of these smaller market teams that are crying bloody murder are also pocketing cash given to them by the big market clubs in the revenue sharing.

baseball is still an unfair product, but let's not be fools and think the dolans are just victims.

p.s. the joe mauer deal is the exact same per year $$ that the cc sabathia is. sad.

cleveland fans have never trusted the dolans, hence the bad attendance over the years, and they have good reason to.