BY KATE BRUMBACK AND DIONNE WALKER - The Associated Press ATLANTA -- Visit any of the nation's more than 100 historically black colleges or universities and you'll see clusters of men and women engaged in the rhythmic clapping and foot-stomping routines known in black Greek circles as "stepping."
Now a white Arkansas team's win in an Atlanta step competition has started a fiery debate over the African-inspired tradition and whether the integration of a once ethnically exclusive activity constitutes a form of cultural theft.
"What has happened is black youth culture, what people would call hip-hop, sort of made black culture accessible and appealing to all kinds of people," said Walter Kimbrough, president of historically black Philander Smith College in Little Rock, Ark., and an expert on black Greek life. "It really now has become an American experience."
The uproar began when the all-white Zeta Tau Alpha team from the University of Arkansas beat out five other sorority teams to win last weekend's national final in the Sprite Step Off competition. A YouTube video of their performance, inspired by the movie "The Matrix," generated hundreds of comments.
Posters questioned everything from whether a white group should have been allowed to compete to whether judges wowed by the unlikely competitors inflated their scores to let them win. "Good Job but let the Black folks have their own thing for once!!!" wrote one commenter, who said the Zeta Tau Alpha team did well but should not have won.
On Thursday, sponsor Coca-Cola announced "scoring discrepancies" and said the runner-up - the Alpha Kappa Alpha team from Indiana University, whose members are black - would share first place and receive the same $100,000 in scholarship money that the Zeta Tau Alphas won.
It was unclear what the discrepancies were, and Coca-Cola would not elaborate. The tournament began in September with regional qualifying rounds across the country.
Pulling from things like military cadences and dance routines, stepping usually involves stomping out rhythms in heavy boots or loud shoes, with emphasis on precision and flair. Step crews often travel from coast to coast to earn cash, trophies and bragging rights for the most precise or clever routine.
In the early 1990s the fierce competition began to gain attention off historically black campuses, with large sponsors hosting events, Kimbrough said. Before then, competitions were mostly organized by fraternity and sorority chapters. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is crap
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
Quote: "Good Job but let the Black folks have their own thing for once!!!"
Then "black folks" need to stay out of hockey!
I know you said that as a joke but still if white people raised a big stink about a black guy in the NHL or if they raised a big stink about a black guy being the best golfer they would be condemned as racists.
So it is OK for blacks to claim things as " their own" but white people cant?
Here is a video of the step off winning ZETAS
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
Another crowd video of the winners announcement,you hear the girl talking and she says" it better not be the white girls" and the male voice states " they killed it,they did everything tight"
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
So it is OK for blacks to claim things as " their own" but white people cant?
This is the thing that bothers me the most about these types of "issues". People claim they want equality but when it comes down to it, they really don't.
So it is OK for blacks to claim things as " their own" but white people cant?
This is the thing that bothers me the most about these types of "issues". People claim they want equality but when it comes down to it, they really don't.
Exactly Michelle,when things are equalized people tend to get upset,they want it their way and in their favor only.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
Actually we don't have a specified white history month. It would be racist. Much like a WET (White entertainment television) or an all white step-dance competition, an NAACP (National Association for the Advancement of Caucasian People), United Caucasian College Fund, etc, etc.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
Quote: "Good Job but let the Black folks have their own thing for once!!!"
Then "black folks" need to stay out of hockey!
I know you said that as a joke but still if white people raised a big stink about a black guy in the NHL or if they raised a big stink about a black guy being the best golfer they would be condemned as racists.
So it is OK for blacks to claim things as " their own" but white people cant?
Here is a video of the step off winning ZETAS
KING
Look at the source when stuff like this happens. For example if you ask the question who looked the best at the Oscars last night, I bet if you asked (Black, White, Asian, Kindergartners, College students, Senior citizens, aliens (insert whatever here)) you will get completely different answers.
Stepping is a tradition not a sport, in my eyes its not comparable. For example if a black person did a "Wai khru ram muay" ceremony in Thailand would that be ok?
or
If (random race) did (random traditional ceremony) in (whatever country there were in) how would the people of that culture feel?
If you make it a competition, it's not be treated as cultural. Not like they went to a festival and just started doing this dance in the middle of the crowd mocking the people or their culture.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
Boos are perception of the person... so if whoever booed felt they weren't the best, then they weren't the best.. (very simple concept)
did we forget about this part?
Quote: On Thursday, sponsor Coca-Cola announced "scoring discrepancies" and said the runner-up - the Alpha Kappa Alpha team from Indiana University, whose members are black - would share first place and receive the same $100,000 in scholarship money that the Zeta Tau Alphas won.
This is telling me they weren't the best and it reminds me of a bad boxing score card...
Or Coke didn't want to tick off the African-American community and lose sales? Having a sponsor step in and announce a "scoring discrepancy" is ridiculous.
Quote: Boos are perception of the person... so if whoever booed felt they weren't the best, then they weren't the best.. (very simple concept)
did we forget about this part?
Quote: On Thursday, sponsor Coca-Cola announced "scoring discrepancies" and said the runner-up - the Alpha Kappa Alpha team from Indiana University, whose members are black - would share first place and receive the same $100,000 in scholarship money that the Zeta Tau Alphas won.
This is telling me they weren't the best and it reminds me of a bad boxing score card...
And this
Quote: It was unclear what the discrepancies were, and Coca-Cola would not elaborate. The tournament began in September with regional qualifying rounds across the country.
No answers to why there was a change rulings.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
And yet, at the same time, the person in the scoring video didn't seem to have a problem with it at all. He seemed to really like them and defended the decision to his friend. I watched it a few hours ago now and don't feel like re-watching it but he kept saying something along the lines of "their routine was tight". If there was really such a discrepancy, why would this member of the community defend and agree with the decision even when their friend clearly did not? BTW, he was saying this at the top of the video as well before the 3rd place winner was even announced and still said it after the 1st place was announced.
To me, it sure seems like the Coke thing was to help contain the situation in the community and save face.
As was said, once you create this as a competition, then all bets are off. The Native-American culture is huge here. A lot of people embrace the culture and love the traditional tribal dances. You don't see them going to their Pow-Wow though because that is reserved for the Native American community. The dances within that are purely out of a celebration of their culture and not for competition. If it became a large competition with major corporate sponsors and prizes of 25k/50k/100k for 3/2/1 places, then it becomes a whole new story. The other people who do it don't do it out of spite but rather because they love the tradition. The Native American community also embraces it.
I agree with you if it’s a competition then whomever is the best wins… It’s that easy and it’s that simple
However, there are 2 different sides and somewhere in the middle there is the truth. We are only seeing one side with no information on the other side(the other teams stepping). So I cannot jump on the bandwagon and call foul play because one guy out of 2-3 thousand is saying “that was tight”. Show me the other stepping teams and I can compare the two.
Sprite were the sponsors of the event who gave the money and it just does not seem logical for a huge company to donate $100,000 to save face for a market of 15-20k Greeks were there millions black people who could care less.
I found this on the internet from someone at the show
Quote:
The winning group tried but I still don't get how they won. They were without rhythm, were stiff in their performance even when they yelled it had no harmony. I do give them props for trying though, so the judges were whack in their voting choice. The second place winners had harder stunts, rhythm and clearly were way better. The winning group performed just as you would expect a group to perform who has no rhythm, they were also off time with one another and were obviously not as comfortable in their movements, it was as if I could hear them counting their steps because some people are naturals while others have to learn it and it shows. Sad sad Sad. At least the girls who placed second were vindicated in the end, but they should have won from the get go. I give the white girls props though for immersing themselves in step culture, hopefully they get more rhythm though because I thought they pretty much sucked. It was painful to watch. Don't step if u have no rhythm!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Well, Well, Well, The Racism Police are at it again!! Now we got people on this board that have NO IDEA what a step competition was or is!! But then again, most ppl on this board just talk with out any knowledge of what they type about.. Just"Racism".
Well lets look at the fact:
1) First if you ACTUALLY researched anything, you would know that the white sorority was taught to step by who????.. .The AKA sorority( black sorority) from the same college as Zau Tau Alpha .
2) Who was judging the event?? Well it was not a bunch of white ppl judging the event, so that means they were chosen the winner by a group of blacks!! And they should not have let the judging change one bit!!
3) If it would have been me, I would have told those who booed "To Freakin bad, they won fair and square, stop crying!!"
But then again we know that one this board, there is only 1 type of Racism!!..LMAO...
Hey Lurker, there use to be a competetion were one race was allowed to play in it...it was called baseball. Even tho some of fans thought black people made lously baseball players didn't mean it was true...
If you are seriously saying it's ok for a step competition to exclud a race then you are also saying what baseball did was entirely fine and if you want to take it a step further than that, you could say you are supporting seperate but equal paradigm.
Quote: Sprite were the sponsors of the event who gave the money and it just does not seem logical for a huge company to donate $100,000 to save face for a market of 15-20k Greeks were there millions black people who could care less.
Absoutely a major corporation would spend 100k to avoid a public relations problem..don't kid youself otherwise.
Quote: But then again we know that one this board, there is only 1 type of Racism!!..LMAO...
Nobody here is complaining about the competition or the judging ...
They are pointing out the racism of the people who are complaining that the "white girls won unfairly" and are saying that they shouldn't be allowed to compete in a 'african american' competition.
But I guess pointing out the racism in others is racist?
Quote: Well, Well, Well, The Racism Police are at it again!! Now we got people on this board that have NO IDEA what a step competition was or is!! But then again, most ppl on this board just talk with out any knowledge of what they type about.. Just"Racism".
Well lets look at the fact:
1) First if you ACTUALLY researched anything, you would know that the white sorority was taught to step by who????.. .The AKA sorority( black sorority) from the same college as Zau Tau Alpha .
And that matters how, exactly?
Quote:
2) Who was judging the event?? Well it was not a bunch of white ppl judging the event, so that means they were chosen the winner by a group of blacks!! And they should not have let the judging change one bit!!
Exactly. They were judged to be the winners. End of story, right? Should've been - but it wasn't. Apparently there was some sort of "scoring discrepancy" - but no one says what the discrepancy was. Kinda odd, don't you think?
Quote:
3) If it would have been me, I would have told those who booed "To Freakin bad, they won fair and square, stop crying!!"
If the judges felt they won, that should've been it, don't you think? But it wasn't. Odd.
Quote:
But then again we know that one this board, there is only 1 type of Racism!!..LMAO...
Not sure what this last comment means - I mean - you layed out as well as anyone that the competition was fair. It was judged. And a team won. But then the sponsors of the competition said, basically - "wait a minute - no, now 2 teams won".
Dude, you layed out exactly what people are/were saying - and believe it or not, it supports the racism charge. But you are right in one thing - racism, in the minds of many, can only be white against some other race - right?
if anyone has a video for the 2nd place dance team, then I can give it to my wife and have her judge the two. she's judged dance competitions in the past and can at the very least say if they were 'close' or if it was obvious one squad was better.
Excel, Excuse me but did I hear people cheering them in during their routines and after their routines?? Also, other than the people saying that they should not have competed ( that is B.S and Racism), we did not see the OTHER ROUTINES!!
Maybe some people booed because their routine was not as good as the other teams routines!!!.. As I watched it, I their first half of their routine was not that hard and Ok. ( but then again, I have seen step-shows for years, when I was in college) so most of their routine I have seen before. It was executed pretty good, but the tape only shows really 1/2 of the step team. But like I said, first half, pretty basic stuff. Maybe the other girls had tougher routines.
Again, I have a problem with those who said they should not have competed or allowed to compete( that is racist). Now the other booeing because they were not good and won might have a point.
Oh, pointing out racism in others is not racist, just show me where or who on this board does it?????
Arch, First - those girls did not learn how to step on their own, they were taught! And they were taught by some of the same ppl this board thinks is racist!
Second - there was no discrepency, who ever was judged the winner won! Now my thing is that we never saw the other routines. As I told Excel, I thought they did a good job but I have seen alot of step shows before. 1/2 of their routine was basic but executed pretty good. If there was another team with harder steps, I would have picked them. BUT I was not a judge so Oh Well, get judges who know something about stepping!
Third - pointing out racism ( by some) because I swore I heard people cheering for them is not bad. But please tell me where ppl on this board post ANYTHING about white racism?? Please, most ppl here search the internet for others being racist to justify their sick views!!
Quote: Maybe some people booed because their routine was not as good as the other teams routines!!!..
What the hell is with that anyway ? Didn't anyone ever teach these people common courtesy and good sportsmanship ? The whole event ( at least the portion that I saw ) was just a mess with people jumping around and screaming ...I've been to heavy metal concerts where the crowd was less boisterous.
Quote: Maybe some people booed because their routine was not as good as the other teams routines!!!..
What the hell is with that anyway ? Didn't anyone ever teach these people common courtesy and good sportsmanship ? The whole event ( at least the portion that I saw ) was just a mess with people jumping around and screaming ...I've been to heavy metal concerts where the crowd was less boisterous.
lol Do i need need to post the Philly fans hitting people with snow balls?
or
Cleveland Fans throwing beer bottles?
So you are telling me that people don;t get booed at heavy metal concerts? I am huge fan of the metal and I have seen acts get booed if they suck, hell i boycotted Bullet for my Valentine because they did 2 bad Metallica covers lol... if you suck you suck.. and people will boo...
Quote: Look at the source when stuff like this happens. For example if you ask the question who looked the best at the Oscars last night, I bet if you asked (Black, White, Asian, Kindergartners, College students, Senior citizens, aliens (insert whatever here)) you will get completely different answers.
Stepping is a tradition not a sport, in my eyes its not comparable. For example if a black person did a "Wai khru ram muay" ceremony in Thailand would that be ok?
or
If (random race) did (random traditional ceremony) in (whatever country there were in) how would the people of that culture feel?
At least that's the way I feel.
Lurker,
May I point out that "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery". We have bitched and moaned about cultures not being appreciated but yet when "some white girls" win a step competition, everyone is up in arms but yet does not see the compliment for what it is. They were interested enough in YOUR culture that they wanted to learn something from YOUR culture. The learned that something from YOUR culture to such a great extent that they were able to compete and win. If I'm not mistaken it's only the BEST of the best that goes to the Step Competition in Atlanta, right?
Quote: Hey Lurker, there use to be a competetion were one race was allowed to play in it...it was called baseball. Even tho some of fans thought black people made lously baseball players didn't mean it was true...
If you are seriously saying it's ok for a step competition to exclud a race then you are also saying what baseball did was entirely fine and if you want to take it a step further than that, you could say you are supporting seperate but equal paradigm.
Quote: Sprite were the sponsors of the event who gave the money and it just does not seem logical for a huge company to donate $100,000 to save face for a market of 15-20k Greeks were there millions black people who could care less.
Absoutely a major corporation would spend 100k to avoid a public relations problem..don't kid youself otherwise.
Read my posts, I never said once that it should be a black only event.. If they won, fair and square congrats, but the problem is we have only one side of the story and people are making judgments on that with ought knowing everything.
Baseball was a competition or a sport? because to me it looks like a sport
IRE, Have YOU been to a step show -> Probably not, because if you would have, you wouldn't have made that statement!! And when is cheering bad sportmanship??
Two - people jumping around and screaming -> yup, that is a smart observation!! No one was jumping around and screaming, cheering yes, but not as you describe.
Third - More boisterous than a Metal concert.. Please, was that before or after the drugs are passed around. Or maybe they were just like a Dead-concert.. without the drugs... Please,, I guess you really know your stuff!!..LMAO!!
And as far as booeing, even though I do not agree with it, I might have booed something in my life time, especially in college. I guess no other college kids boo also?? humm...
I know that, I was responding to the comment that some people feel it contaminates their culture....not those exact words.
Being American Indian and African, I love the idea that people are so interested in diversivying their cultural knowledge. Think about this, how many different peoples in this human race have gone extinct and we know absolutely nothing about their culture. The more we can learn about each other's culture the more we can keep those cultures alive even if only in memory not practice.
Sorry if I came across funky, it's the meds the doctors have me on. *cough* *hack* *passout*
Just had another thought about this. We will always have some form of racism as long as we allow the media to blind us with their bull crap articles. As long as we let others inflame our attitudes towards others, we will fight the racism issue. Once we stop allowing this crap to generate more hate out of ignorance, then we will see a world with one less major issue.
Second - there was no discrepency, who ever was judged the winner won! Now my thing is that we never saw the other routines. As I told Excel, I thought they did a good job but I have seen alot of step shows before. 1/2 of their routine was basic but executed pretty good. If there was another team with harder steps, I would have picked them. BUT I was not a judge so Oh Well, get judges who know something about stepping!
Your stating what everyone on here except I think Lurker is saying, that they won per the judges, so why is Coca Cola changing the outcome without revealing why?
The racism comments come into play because if you read the comments on the video sites there is quite a bit of prejudice comments on both the defending and the complaining sides.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
At least for me, it’s not about that they won the competition, if they were better than everyone else congrats… they worked hard for it, they earned it…
atomic_dog It’s a controversy because people who were there did not believe that the girls won, they believe the 2nd place winners won.
The board is quick to point the blame and claim the "black people want to play the race card ect…"
I say hold your opinion to you see both sides, but what fun what that be? right?
FF, Lurker and I are saying close to the same thing. We didn't see the other routines. If there are some ppl that did not like them competing, thats bad and racist. And like you said, there were probably comments for and against that team. Now if you want to start tallying up the racist comments on boards, lets start here!! ( And pointing out racism is not racist, just funny how ppl on this board can point it out but miss it right here!!)
Much like a WET (White entertainment television) or an all white step-dance competition, an NAACP (National Association for the Advancement of Caucasian People), United Caucasian College Fund, etc, etc.
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