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The bottom line is that the bill passed Sunday evening and Obama signed it less than 2 days later.
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Obama specifically stated that in the above video that after a bill hit his desk there would be 5 days for the public to review it. He flat out didn't do that and I do not see any other way to spin it - just because the framework of it was there for 4 months doesn't mean congress didn't slip some crap into it at the last minute which was the entire reason he said he would allow for the 5 days of review prior to signing.
Not that it would make any difference as to whether he would sign it, but he did specifically state that. Bush would have been torn apart if he did the same; the double standards given to Obama are mind boggling as the man is not all that different than Bush at this point. Didn't everyone that voted for him want change and accountability?
#gmstrong
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There were 2 bills. The one that got passed and signed into law has been posted, since November. 4 months and 2 days versus 4 months and 5 days; is there really a difference?
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just because the framework of it was there for 4 months doesn't mean congress didn't slip some crap into it at the last minute which was the entire reason he said he would allow for the 5 days of review prior to signing.
This is where I was incorrect. The exact bill was posted in November and passed the Senate in December; thus the only thing the House can do is vote on that exact bill to send it to the president; no room for changes. So more correctly, Dec 24 - yesterday, the exact bill that is now law was posted (even though it was posted in November).
The reconciliation bill is not law yet; it remains unresolved.
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Not a reply to tou.
I have a question though ......
Does anyone know how the Congressmen and Senators treated their own health care plans in this bill?
Are they considered "Cadillac" plans ..... or did they exempt themselves?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Obama specifically stated that in the above video that after a bill hit his desk there would be 5 days for the public to review it. He flat out didn't do that and I do not see any other way to spin it - just because the framework of it was there for 4 months doesn't mean Congress didn't slip some crap into it at the last minute which was the entire reason he said he would allow for the 5 days of review prior to signing.
Not that it would make any difference as to whether he would sign it, but he did specifically state that. Bush would have been torn apart if he did the same; the double standards given to Obama are mind boggling as the man is not all that different than Bush at this point. Didn't everyone that voted for him want change and accountability?
In bold, this ^,.....the whole reason he said he would do this was to stop the lobbying for pork.
Fail,...whether there IS any pork in this bill ( uh, -- law --  ) or not. 
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I'm certainly no expert on this, but why can't the house make changes?
#gmstrong
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I'm certainly no expert on this, but why can't the house make changes?
Be careful what you wish for. What the media's not telling you is that the libtards threw into the bill a measure to take over all student loans. Yep, that belongs in a health care bill. Who knows what they'll throw in on the next change. 
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
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I was responding to tjs7 as to him stating that once the Senate passed the bill the House could not modify it. I'm not sure if that is true or not.
I saw the school loan stuff where South Dakota (I think) would be the only state that could give student loans outside of the Feds or something like that. Didn't read the article, saw the headline.
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but why can't the house make changes?
They could've made changes, but it would've then had to go back to the Senate. By accepting the already passed Senate bill, it went to the president.
The reconciliation bill is where the changes were made, but it must pass the Senate before the president can sign it.
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but why can't the house make changes?
They could've made changes, but it would've then had to go back to the Senate. By accepting the already passed Senate bill, it went to the president.
The reconciliation bill is where the changes were made, but it must pass the Senate before the president can sign it.
So...they passed a bill that they knew needed changes...send it to Obama where he signed it two days later...knowing the bill needed changes?
Now the Senate is contemplating those changes.
Really.
Why'd they do it that way?
I don't care if every single piece of the bill is the definition of utopia, this is NOT the right way to create law in the USA.
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Quote:
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I'm certainly no expert on this, but why can't the house make changes?
Be careful what you wish for. What the media's not telling you is that the libtards threw into the bill a measure to take over all student loans. Yep, that belongs in a health care bill. Who knows what they'll throw in on the next change.
Shhhhh...you might get someone to come on and say that such is a half-truth of the right. 
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I'm going to take this one point at a time.. Quote:
I understand that...you could have waited a while to have the removal and got insurance before the procedure....at least under the new system.
When they found I had kidney cancer, it had already grown almost to the size of my kidney.. The day after it was removed, the doctor came into the room to see me, he said, had we waited another couple of weeks, it could have begun to spread beyond the kidney and that I was very lucky.,,
So No, I couldn't have waited.. You seem to think that under the new system that it will be easy to get insurance.. I question that. I'll wait to see how it works before I agree to that.
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Actually, yours is a perfect example of how people could skirt the system. You can go from uninsured to insured in a matter of days.
Again, I seriosly doubt that is true. and I've seen or heard nothing that proves it is even a possibility to move that quickly.
When was the last time you shopped around for health insurance.. When I was young and healthy, it was a breeze to get insurance of any kind.. and even then, it took weeks for physicals and blood tests results to come back and be analyzed..
I guarantee you, while insurance companies may not be able to turn you down for pre-existing conditions, that doesn't mean they won't want to know they exist so that they can charge you accordingly. They won't deny you insurances if you have pre-existing conditions, they'll just price you out of it..
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Now, if you had told us about your unknown brain aneurysm that suddenly stuck leaving you at 70% of normal mental capacity, then I would say that is a good example of why you might not want to gamble.
I didn't have a Brain aneurysm.. I had an Abdominal Aeortic Aneurysm. IT was located in my aeortic vain about 1.4 inch below where the kidneys connect up. (Im no doctor, Hope I explained that right but not sure)
If you know anything about Aneurysms, then you know that if one blows out, you maybe have 30 to 40 seconds to say goodbye to your loved ones before you bleed out.
Anyone that would take a chance on that is an idiot... What's worse is that if you don't have heath insurance, I wonder what hospital would do the 100k surgery to repair..
You can't really go in through the ER where they are required to provide service without regard to payment. If you have an anueryism and it blows, chances are, by the time you get to the hospital, your a goner....
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You still going to therapy for that or are you as good as your going to get??
Ahh, I get it, you said this to make a joke of a brain aneurysm.. Funny.. NOT!
No, I wasn't required to get therapy for it.. Just get the staples out and annual check ups to make sure everything is ok... that's it.
But because of it (the aneurism), United Health Care turned me down flat.. Anthem Blue Cross of Ohio did accept me a year later but the costs were heavy per month.. Started out at 1100.00 per with High deductables, when I last had that insurance, it was a little over 1300.00 a month and even higher deductables for both me and my wife.
In the Grand Scheme of things, I'm a lucky guy. I was persistent, I was willing to do the legwork to find insurance, I found insurance and I made enough money to pay for it and the sizeable deductable.
Not everyone is that lucky..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I have known two people to die of aneurysms in the past two weeks. Both young. It was pretty much instant. Just wanted to say I'm glad they found yours in time, Daman.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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Interesting image, too big to embed.
http://i.imgur.com/590Ev.png
How is that interesting as to how it pertains to the this?
Unless he's trying to say that mandating health care is no different than those things, in which case he's seriously misinformed.
you had a good run Hank.
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I should post this in yellow. Yes the source link is right wing, but it doesn't change the man or the actual words we said on WJR radio. http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2010/03/rep_dingell_its_taken_a_long_t.htmlRep. Dingell: It's taken a long time to 'control the people' Peter Barry Chowka Rep. John Dingell (D-MI), the Dean of the House of Representatives for being the longest serving member of the body (he was first elected in 1955, succeeding his father, Rep. John Dingell, Sr.), made an amazing admission during a live telephone interview with Detroit WJR News/Talk 760 radio talk show host Paul W. Smith on Smith's show Monday morning, March 22, 2010. The night before, Dingell had been a featured speaker at the Democrat Congressional leadership victory press conference after Obamacare passed the House. In response to a question posed by Smith, Dingell said: Let me remind you this [Americans allegedly dying because of lack of universal health care] has been going on for years. We are bringing it to a halt. The harsh fact of the matter is when you're going to pass legislation that will cover 300 [million] American people in different ways it takes a long time to do the necessary administrative steps that have to be taken to put the legislation together to control the people.The comment by Dingell begins 6 minutes 23 seconds into the twelve minute-long podcast of his interview on Smith's radio show. The podcast is titled "Congressman John Dingell tells Paul W. Smith he is thrilled with the passage of the health care bill." It can be streamed or downloaded as an mp3 audio file from WJR's Web site.
"My signature line goes here."
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Can I get the transcript of 30 seconds before and after too? I'm not going to jump to conclusions based on one sentence that may be taken out of context.
There are no sacred cows.
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I have known two people to die of aneurysms in the past two weeks. Both young. It was pretty much instant. Just wanted to say I'm glad they found yours in time, Daman.
thanks,, I got really very very lucky Michelle.. it's funny how things work sometimes
Had my wife not forced me into getting a physical, they may not have found the cancer in my kidney in time... which in turn led to the kidney being removed which in turn lead to them doing a very specific kinda of X-ray each year when I get a physical which in turn led them to notice something not right with my aeortic vain...
And that led to the MRI which revealed the aneuryism... Very safe to say, my wife saved my life! And she will NEVER let me forget it...LOL
Crazy huh?
Sorry for the loss of your friends..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Can I get the transcript of 30 seconds before and after too? I'm not going to jump to conclusions based on one sentence that may be taken out of context.
I'll look this evening or tomorrow if there is one out there. The interview was on the WJR site.
"My signature line goes here."
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Full audio (MP3) can be direct downloaded from this link: A Dingell berry I've mirrored the file here as well (they provide it for free download): mirror
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Bottom line: There would be no need for regulation if businesses didn't get too greedy.
Whenever business gets too greedy, the government needs to slap them back to protect the people.
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Bottom line: There would be no need for regulation if businesses didn't get too greedy.
Whenever business gets too greedy, the government needs to slap them back to protect the people.
Yeah, that's the American way, right? 
How would you feel if the gov't. said you made too much money?
Free market - competitiveness.......what happened to that? Gov't. And the more gov't. gets involved, the worse it gets.
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Whenever business gets too greedy, the government needs to slap them back to protect the people.
Whoa there big fella,,, I'm all for corporate responsibity and all, but the government stepping in to slap anyone around doesn't excite me in the least..
Having said that, if a company comes to the Federal Goverment for a bail out, yeah, I can see them having a hand in it.. Any lender would put pressure on a company to change certain, less profitable endeavors risking the money borrowed,,, that's reasonable.
But for the governement to step in, when they've not put up any saving money.. Oooooo No..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Does anyone have an idea about how much health insurace will cost for the uninsured by 2016. I'm hearing by then the penalty for not having it will be 2.5% of you income. If that is the penalty for not having health insurance, how much will it cost to have health insurance, meaning the average person without health insurance ? Let's say single making 30k?
President - Fort Collins Browns Backers
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Quote:
Quote:
Whenever business gets too greedy, the government needs to slap them back to protect the people.
Whoa there big fella,,, I'm all for corporate responsibity and all, but the government stepping in to slap anyone around doesn't excite me in the least..
Having said that, if a company comes to the Federal Goverment for a bail out, yeah, I can see them having a hand in it.. Any lender would put pressure on a company to change certain, less profitable endeavors risking the money borrowed,,, that's reasonable.
But for the governement to step in, when they've not put up any saving money.. Oooooo No..
When it leads to corruption, absolutely.
If it weren't for SOME government regulation, working conditions in certain jobs would be beyond dangerous.
I didn't complete my thought clear enough. I'm talking within reason here. Zero government regulation would be just as disastrous as too much regulation.
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So who is going to slap the government around when they get too big and regulate everything under the sun?
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Quote:
Bottom line: There would be no need for regulation if businesses didn't get too greedy.
Whenever business gets too greedy, the government needs to slap them back to protect the people.
I know that you've clarified your statement in a secondary post, but on the quote above, I just have to say this: Gov't should NEVER be directly involved in the operations of ANY business.
Gov't should do anything at all other than create the framework for a free & fair market.... beyond that, it should NOT be involved at all, regardless of greed.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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So who is going to slap the government around when they get too big and regulate everything under the sun?
the nfl 
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Quote:
Quote:
Bottom line: There would be no need for regulation if businesses didn't get too greedy.
Whenever business gets too greedy, the government needs to slap them back to protect the people.
I know that you've clarified your statement in a secondary post, but on the quote above, I just have to say this: Gov't should NEVER be directly involved in the operations of ANY business.
Gov't should do anything at all other than create the framework for a free & fair market.... beyond that, it should NOT be involved at all, regardless of greed.
What about downright dangerous working conditions and unlivable wages?
When I made the above comment I made the dumb assumption that people would use common sense when I said it, rather than dissect it into "Ammo wants the government running everything!"
I don't see what's so bad about people with pre-existing conditions no longer being denied for healthcare, among others.
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I don't see what's so bad about people with pre-existing conditions no longer being denied for healthcare, among others.
Might want to read this: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100324/ap_on_bi_ge/us_health_overhaul_children_s_coverage
Gap in health care law's protection for children
WASHINGTON –" Hours after President Barack Obama signed historic health care legislation, a potential problem emerged. Administration officials are now scrambling to fix a gap in highly touted benefits for children.
Obama made better coverage for children a centerpiece of his health care remake, but it turns out the letter of the law provided a less-than-complete guarantee that kids with health problems would not be shut out of coverage.
Under the new law, insurance companies still would be able to refuse new coverage to children because of a pre-existing medical problem, said Karen Lightfoot, spokeswoman for the House Energy and Commerce Committee, one of the main congressional panels that wrote the bill Obama signed into law Tuesday."
So, they've been working on this for a year, yet now we find out that only hours after it passed there's already a problem?????????? I find that ironic - that this bill already doesn't do what it was sold as doing, don't you?
Now, granted, they will somehow "fix" this - I mean, ,passing a bill in the senate and then in the house and having it signed into law really means nothing because they can still change whatever they want to before it's enacted - or can they?
Doesn't this worry anyone other than me?
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Ahh, I get it, you said this to make a joke of a brain aneurysm.. Funny.. NOT!
Oh good gosh....get a grip.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Does anyone have an idea about how much health insurace will cost for the uninsured by 2016. I'm hearing by then the penalty for not having it will be 2.5% of you income. If that is the penalty for not having health insurance, how much will it cost to have health insurance, meaning the average person without health insurance ? Let's say single making 30k?
I have no idea but you know it is going to be hefty. The insurances companies are going to get their money from everyone else to cover all the loser polices they now have to take on.
Daman and Mac...when I say loser policy I am in no way referring to the person holding the policy. Simply the fact they now have to take on people knowing when they go in they are going to have to shell out big bucks.
Sort of like going to the casino, sitting down and the dealers telling you they are going to deal you loser hands but you have to bet the $20 minimum anyway.
Just wanted you to know that before you got all riled up.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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What about downright dangerous working conditions and unlivable wages?
When I made the above comment I made the dumb assumption that people would use common sense when I said it, rather than dissect it into "Ammo wants the government running everything!"
Well, let's see...
Free and fair economy. I'm assuming that means don't have people trying to kill themselves for their employer and people making unlivable wages.
Either way, the Government has no place in regulating any part of the economy. The difference is your point of view, I suppose. I view greed as a necessary and acceptable evil, you view it as the enemy of the people.
Let's put it this way, if it weren't for greedy people, there wouldn't be a jobs with livable wages. Someone has to succeed and someone has to fail, it's just the way of the free economy.
Anyway, I suppose that was a little OT but I believe it needed to be said.
you had a good run Hank.
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Having gone through the health problems I have had the last few years bro, I understand 100 percent. What I worry about is this new health plan. If it takes effect and I go through the same problems again there is a chance I would not be here if they do not pay for the tests I have had done, or delay them for a long period. 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Having gone through the health problems I have had the last few years bro, I understand 100 percent. What I worry about is this new health plan. If it takes effect and I go through the same problems again there is a chance I would not be here if they do not pay for the tests I have had done, or delay them for a long period.
Obama said in his speech to the Dems the other day there would be no death panels, so I figure instead they're going to call the life panels and of course, we'll be declined.
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Obama said in his speech to the Dems the other day there would be no death panels, so I figure instead they're going to call the life panels and of course, we'll be declined.
'politely declined'
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I don't see what's so bad about people with pre-existing conditions no longer being denied for healthcare, among others.
People losing their homes because of how the U.S. health care system works.... or going into deep debt while insurance companies and thier fat yacht-racing stockholders get obscenely rich.
I don't pretend to have wrapped my head around the massive logistics of HC upheaval down there but all I can say is that I'm glad I live under Canada's HC system. Yeah we're taxed more but I don't know how you guys tolerate it. I guess it's what I'm used to and what you're used to. Good luck.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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Quote:
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I don't see what's so bad about people with pre-existing conditions no longer being denied for healthcare, among others.
People losing their homes because of how the U.S. health care system works.... or going into deep debt while insurance companies and thier fat yacht-racing stockholders get obscenely rich.
I don't pretend to have wrapped my head around the massive logistics of HC upheaval down there but all I can say is that I'm glad I live under Canada's HC system. Yeah we're taxed more but I don't know how you guys tolerate it. I guess it's what I'm used to and what you're used to. Good luck.
It's a feasible idea for 30 million.
For 390 million? Eh...we'll see.
you had a good run Hank.
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Does anyone have an idea about how much health insurace will cost for the uninsured by 2016. I'm hearing by then the penalty for not having it will be 2.5% of you income. If that is the penalty for not having health insurance, how much will it cost to have health insurance, meaning the average person without health insurance ? Let's say single making 30k?
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I have no idea but you know it is going to be hefty. The insurances companies are going to get their money from everyone else to cover all the loser polices they now have to take on.
The info was posted in this thread... web page
BTW...did you know that the fine you spoke of, $650 (rounded), does not go into effect until 2016?
Under the plan approved by Congress, the fine for not carrying insurance would be...
...$95 a year or 1 percent of a person's income starting in 2014, whichever is greater
...$325 or 2 percent of income in 2015
...$695 or 2.5 percent of income in 2016
GM strong...
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,561
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,561 |
Quote:
Oh good gosh....get a grip.
Actually, I think you are the one that needs to get a grip..
it was YOUR words..NOT MINE....
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Health care "bill"
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