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Well hopefully they let waitresses and bartenders pack heat too....that should cut down on bad tippers.
I think its hilarious that taxpayer money is being spent on running a bill through government making sure that you're allowed to carry a gun into your local Boston Pizza.
My god, its about time.
Y;know, I think it might be illegal to have a gun in a hospital too....better get that amended as well. Or perhaps a theme park... if I can't pack heat on a rollercoaster, thats just wrong. CRIMINALS won;t stop packing their guns on Space Mountain...why should I????
I'm just kidding around of course. We borderline communist canucks of course don't have the same attachment to guns as our southern cousins so stuff like this I just find kinda funny. I've waded into a couple of discussions on it and its something I doubt if I'll ever really understand.
On a serious note, however, the worry with this and liquor establishments (ie nightclubs) is pretty moot. Individual establishments will initiate no gun policies and metal detectors and pat downs will just become more commonplace.
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If guns had been allowed at Columbine or at Virginia Tech quite a few children and young people would still be alive.
And you know this how? Please provide link to an article where persons claimed that had concealed carry been permitted, they would have had been carrying a gun, been in position to use the gun and would have used the gun. (I won't be holding my breath waiting for a link).
"My signature line goes here."
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If you really believe that, then I suggest you write to you congressmen and ask they support legislation to allow guns on college campus or anywhere else you see fit.
I absolutely believe it, but I doubt Dennis Kucinich would agree. Its ironic to me that we would need legislation to "allow" what the 2nd Amendment is supposed to guarantee.
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LOL You are cracking me up Canada.. that was good.. If ever there was proof that we need a "sarcasm graemlin, this is it...  Good job.. While I don't have a problem with guns or gun ownership, I do admit to not understanding the fascination with them... But to each his own.. No issues from me.. FYI,, I'm not a fan of fishing either,,, but if someone wants to walk around with worms in thier pocket, it's no skin off my nose..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I think there's a problem with people wanting to bring a gun into a restaurant...
...but I don't think there's anything wrong with having a gun in a restaurant provided you've shown due competence.
For safety sake,everybody carrying gun into a restaurant should be able to twirl it like Roy Rogers!
Matt Dillon was a punk He'd hang out in the Longbranch Bar and Grill and shoot troublemakers stone cold dead. Roy on the other hand would just shoot the gun out of their hand. Now there's due competence.
We need to be able to shoot like Roy. If annoyed by a guy talking loud on a cell phone just shoot the darn thing out of his hand. No need for anyone to get hurt.
I firmly believe this is what the founding fathers had in mind when they included insure domestic tranquility into our sacred constitution.
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Not a gun guy,,, don't mind others owning them if they choose to..
Got only one concern.. I've been in bars where fights broke out.. With guns, it might escalate beyond knuckles.
I'd hate to be sitting there, minding my own business and get nailed by a stray bullet.. I think that would suck 
Thats the thing, the people who would carry a gun while getting drunk in a bar and getting into fights are the kind of people who will do so whether its illegal or not. These laws are for the responsible people. Every responsible person with a concealed permit that I know, dont want to lose their rights to carry and will respect and obey the laws.
If we were are concerned about what everyone else was doing for our own saftey, then alot more people wouldnt have a drivers liscensce and tobacco would be illegal. But that would mean alot less govt. money. Make things legal and charge for a liscence then thats more money the govt. can invest in rare coins 
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Thats the thing, the people who would carry a gun while getting drunk in a bar and getting into fights are the kind of people who will do so whether its illegal or not.
I know that.. What I also know is that the RESPONSIBLE ones sitting in the bar carrying a gun will eventually draw down and a gun fight will ensue...
Innocent people will die either way..
That's an argument that I am not buying into..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
Thats the thing, the people who would carry a gun while getting drunk in a bar and getting into fights are the kind of people who will do so whether its illegal or not.
I know that.. What I also know is that the RESPONSIBLE ones sitting in the bar carrying a gun will eventually draw down and a gun fight will ensue...
Innocent people will die either way..
That's an argument that I am not buying into..
Mexican standoffs at the Olive Garden
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Mexican standoffs at the Olive Garden
Se
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I doubt if I'll ever really understand.
I'm pretty sure that is an accurate statement . I don't understand Hockey either which is why I don't opine on it.
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Put puck in net with stick. Its really not all that complex. After all, we Canadians play it.
Whats opine?
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o·pine (-pn)
v. o·pined, o·pin·ing, o·pines
v.tr.
To state as an opinion.
v.intr.
To express an opinion: opined on the defendant's testimony.
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[Middle English opinen, from Old French opiner,
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You know what Michelle,, That's great.. if you want people carrying a gun in a church,, Fine.. I don't..
Quote:
The pastor of a Maryville, Illinois, church was shot to death during a service Sunday in front of horrified church members who then tackled the gunman, state police said.
The Web site for the First Baptist Church of Maryville, Illinois, includes a photo of the Rev. Fred Winters.
Fred Winters, the pastor of the First Baptist Church, was shot and killed during the 8 a.m. service, and the attacker and two church members suffered knife wounds in the attack, authorities said.
The gunman entered during the service and walked up to the pulpit.
Winters and the gunman apparently exchanged words before the 27-year-old man fired four shots, hitting the pastor's Bible and then the pastor, said Illinois State Police Director Larry Trent.
"The only thing we know is that the suspect said something to the pastor, and the pastor said something back to him -- we don't know what that was," Trent told reporters Sunday afternoon. "It was almost as if the pastor may have recognized him, but we're not sure about that at all."
The gunman's .45-caliber pistol jammed after he shot Winters, Trent said. The man then pulled out a knife before being tackled by some of about 150 worshippers attending the service in southern Illinois, near St. Louis, Missouri. Video Watch the aftermath of the church shooting....
http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/03/08/church.shooting/<br />
<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">
Lucky the gun jammed or more people would have been shot, but if I'm there by the 2nd or third shot I've drawn and probably firing by 3rd no more than 4th shot, possibly saving the pastors and others lives in the process.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Lucky the gun jammed or more people would have been shot, but if I'm there by the 2nd or third shot I've drawn and probably firing by 3rd no more than 4th shot, possibly saving the pastors and others lives in the process.
My Hero,,
What is it you want me to say? do you expect to alter my thinking because of something you "think" you would or could do?
you actually think you are going to get people to listen to an argument like that to prove GUNS BELONG IN CHURCH?
WOW....
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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o·pine (-pn)
v. o·pined, o·pin·ing, o·pines
v.tr.
To state as an opinion.
v.intr.
To express an opinion: opined on the defendant's testimony.
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[Middle English opinen, from Old French opiner,
Huh.... well there you go. I honestly had never heard that word before.
However, I hope that you're not saying that since I have problems understanding the American attachment to firearms then I shouldn't be entitled to express an opinion on it.... That would just seem very unconstitutional.
I have my theories on why Americans think differently about guns than Canadians but I still have problems grasping the actual logic behind it. But whats life without a little mystery. Besides, it keeps you yanks interesting.... 
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However, I hope that you're not saying that since I have problems understanding the American attachment to firearms then I shouldn't be entitled to express an opinion on it.... That would just seem very unconstitutional.
"My signature line goes here."
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you actually think you are going to get people to listen to an argument like that to prove GUNS BELONG IN CHURCH?
Guns don't belong in church...but hell, guns shouldn't really belong anywhere!! Sadly, given the low lifes of our society, they do. And, no, to me this isn't about kids. I would want my kids protected more than I even want myself protected.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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guns shouldn't really belong anywhere!!
Oh, i don't think I'd ever go that far. Guns have thier place.. on the range, hunting... probably a thousand other places that I wouldn't have a problem with.. Like I said, I don't own one, but that doesn't mean I won't someday.. may want to,, dunno.. I like that i can..
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And, no, to me this isn't about kids
maybe we agree maybe we don't,, not sure,, But I think it is, to a degree, about kids.
I wanna throw something out to you,,, just for conversation..
You are in a bar,, you are are carrying.. a worthless fight breaks out.. someone calls the cops,,, but before they get thier, guns come out.. You, in an effort to defend yourself and anyone around you that you care for, pull yours..
Gunfire ensues and JUST THEN (this would be my luck) the cops come in and see you with a gun in your hand..
My guess is, you are a goner...
Did you having a gun help or hurt you? Did an innocent get killed or injured?
Cops are gun lovers for the most part,,, But I dare you to walk up to any cop and ask him,, would you like to see a law passed that would allow guns in bars?
Ask 50 cops, I bet you that you will get 50 no's..
One potential reason is the scene I described above... cops don't want to shoot anyone,, let alone someone trying to defend themselves.. but in the heat of the moment,, there is no guarantee they will know the difference in time.
Being a macho macho man(woman) isn't always the right answer despite what some will tell you..
Keep in mind, I'm NOT against gun ownership.. NOT EVEN CLOSE...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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guns shouldn't really belong anywhere!!
Oh, i don't think I'd ever go that far.
I meant for self defense. I wish we wouldn't need them for it.
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And, no, to me this isn't about kids
maybe we agree maybe we don't,, not sure,, But I think it is, to a degree, about kids.
I don't think we should ban guns from certain places for the sole reason of "saving the children". That excuse/reason is getting old.
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I wanna throw something out to you,,, just for conversation..
I suppose in your story a lot of things would simply just depend. What are the other patrons saying? Were you in the wrong? Etc, etc. Sure, things could go horribly wrong for you when you were just trying to protect your own life, but guess what, you aren't dead. Had you not had a weapon, you probably would have been.
I'm not sure I like the idea of guns in bars, but I would like to think that even if they are, those that are carrying know how to respect them and don't wave them around just to try to feel more macho.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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I'm not sure I like the idea of guns in bars, but I would like to think that even if they are, those that are carrying know how to respect them and don't wave them around just to try to feel more macho.
Just wait until they start getting used as pickup lines!
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That's an argument that I am not buying into..
I like to converse, not argue, but if thats how you look at it.
In Florida, which has a higer drop out rate and more people under the poverty line than Ohio, they have really leaniant gun laws. They do not have this problem at all that you are worried about. Even if there were laws allowing people to carry guns into bars, I would never have a fear of going to the bars I go to. Now, for you to have these fears, your either 1) trying to make a point, 2)or you worry to much 3) or you go to some really rough and tumble bars. I cant even remember the last time I have even heard about a gunfight between 2 people with no cops involved let alone at a bar. I would be extremely suprised if the stats shown that gun related crimes happening in a bar were over 5%.
The bars in Aurora must be like the Wild Wild West. Maybe thats why people quit going to Geauga Lake. 
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And as far as the title of this thread, if I had a CWP, I would rather be allowed to carry my concealed gun into the restaurant rather than leave it in the car. Leaving it in the car would leave a greater chance of the gun falling into the wrong hands and have a greater chance of my own gun being turned on me or the restaurant that Im parked at.
I own guns but never fealt the need to have one on me driving into Warren, Youngstown or Cleveland. Most of the shootings in my area are drug related and the people doing it dont have a liscence. Most of the robberies are from addicts being done because they know its a women, elderly or child inside with no guns. The people commiting these robberies are just using a knife or they are bigger in size or numbers. Those people cant even afford guns.
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NRTU but guns in bars would be asking for trouble.
Anyways more guns in a restaraunt increases the odds of "trigger happy" people in a restaraunts. Hell think of the amount of accidents that could occur from an idiot that doesn't know how to weild one or a kid geting a little too curious.
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Im not saying guns should be in bars but I dont fear the situation. I guess I dont put myself in those situations to see what people are so worried about.
Guns are allowed to be in cars and Ive seen more anger in road rage then anything in my life. I also dont hear about road rage turnng into shootouts. Like i said earlier, everyone I know with a CWP doesnt want to lose their rights to have a CWP and do so responsibly. The people that want to shoot people during road rage or at a bar are going to weather they are allowed to or not. The ones that arent allowed to are going to crap their pants when someone else pulls one back on them because which side do you think the laws going to take?
I remember all the people saying it would be a bad idea for Ohio to allow people to carry a concealed weopen and that they were worried if it passed. Now they are no longer worried because they dont think about it and nothing bad to them happened because of it.
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I like to converse, not argue, but if thats how you look at it.
Lawyers use the term "argue" all the time.. meaning, they argue a case...
Don't take it wrong..
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In Florida, which has a higer drop out rate and more people under the poverty line than Ohio, they have really leaniant gun laws.
Wow,, didn't know that. Now there is a good reason to push for gun control if I ever heard one...
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1) trying to make a point, 2)or you worry to much 3) or you go to some really rough and tumble bars. I cant even remember the last time I have even heard about a gunfight between 2 people with no cops involved let alone at a bar. I would be extremely suprised if the stats shown that gun related crimes happening in a bar were over 5%.
None of the above..
But you know what,, that's a great point.. the law today says you can't carry in a bar,,,, and you just sighted stats that prove it's working..
Have I thanked you lately...,
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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What is it you want me to say? do you expect to alter my thinking because of something you "think" you would or could do?
you actually think you are going to get people to listen to an argument like that to prove GUNS BELONG IN CHURCH?
WOW....
Point is, people intent on killing don't obey the law, and don't care if it's a church, school, park, mall or daycare.
We can ban law abiding citizens from carrying and just give a green flag to criminals. If you think the police will protect you, be sure to tell the guy pointing a gun at your family to please wait until the police get there. You have the right, given by the constitution to carry a firearm, and protect yourself and your family. It's your choice if you(in the general sense of others) choose not to, but don't step on my rights and tell me where I can and can't.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Sorry FF,,, I ain't buying what you are selling.. But carry on. I know some agree with you.. I just happen not to..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Anyways more guns in a restaraunt increases the odds of "trigger happy" people in a restaraunts.
More guns carried by CL holders does NOT mean more negligent use of firearms. The facts bear this out. The same twisted logic was used to try and thwart the Concealed Carry bill in 2004. Like I said earlier in this thread, "we're waiting....!!!.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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Guns don't belong in church...but hell, guns shouldn't really belong anywhere!! Sadly, given the low lifes of our society, they do. And, no, to me this isn't about kids. I would want my kids protected more than I even want myself protected.
This is so true. I carry most of the time, and I sometimes get asked "why are you carrying here?" The simple answer is that if we knew where we had to carry, we wouldn't go there. Most violent assaults against law abiding citizens occur during the course of routine daily activities.
Gun laws aid criminals and hinder the law abiding. It really is that simple.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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If you're carrying a gun almost all the time and you live in the Toledo area (and you're not driving a Brink's truck) I'd say you're more paranoid than informed. And this: Quote:
Gun laws aid criminals and hinder the law abiding. It really is that simple.
is a crock......but it is straight out of the NRA handbook.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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If you're carrying a gun almost all the time and you live in the Toledo area (and you're not driving a Brink's truck) I'd say you're more paranoid than informed. And this:
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Gun laws aid criminals and hinder the law abiding. It really is that simple.
is a crock......but it is straight out of the NRA handbook.
How do you figure?
I have been a NRA member for almost 40 years, and have never read that in the "handbook".
A honest question....if I had a gun inside my blazer, would it make you nervous???
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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I carry everywhere. I won't be a victim.
I present the case of the murder of the soldier in Akron. His killer was carrying an illegal shotgun.
It's not paranoia...It's the state of this country!
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If you're carrying a gun almost all the time and you live in the Toledo area (and you're not driving a Brink's truck) I'd say you're more paranoid than informed. And this:
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Gun laws aid criminals and hinder the law abiding. It really is that simple.
is a crock......but it is straight out of the NRA handbook.
A crock? How do gun control laws benefit law abiding citizens? How do they hinder criminals? If you think my statement is a crock, you must have a good answer for these questions.....let's hear them.
Are you saying there's no risk to being a victim of violent crime in Toledo? You're either high or blind. Toledo has a violent crime rate of 1141 per 100k people.....much greater than the rate for the state of Ohio. Not that I think the police are helpful in preventing violent crime, but if those layoffs occur I don't see the rate improving.
http://www.idcide.com/citydata/oh/toledo.htm
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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All Pro
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I'm so glad i live in Idaho. It's almost assumed here that the other guy at least has a rifle at home.
Arguments for gun control are based on a false assumtion that greater restriction = greater safety. Anyone who looks up the data will find that the ratio of violent crime committed with legally owned firearms is utterly dwarfed by crimes committed with illegal guns.
A man is not old until regrets take the place of dreams.
John Barrymore
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You guys do realize that I'm not for gun control don't you.. you do understand that I'm all for our right to own and yes, carry guns right?
The only question mark for me, is where should they not be carried..
I'll list them for you.. (and this excludes law enforcement personnel of course)
Schools
Church
Any place that serves Alcohol
Beyond that, I'm pretty much ok with responsible people carrying a gun....
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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You guys do realize that I'm not for gun control don't you.. you do understand that I'm all for our right to own and yes, carry guns right?
The only question mark for me, is where should they not be carried..
I'll list them for you.. (and this excludes law enforcement personnel of course)
Schools
Church
Any place that serves Alcohol
Beyond that, I'm pretty much ok with responsible people carrying a gun....
I can agree with the alcohol establishments part to an extent. Like if your drunk and carrying, but if I go into a bar to have some wings or pizza and 1 beer, does that make me a threat?
And with all the shootings at schools, I'm surprised people are against law abiding citizens to carry on school grounds.
How many people at Virginia tech could have been saved if some of the students had been allowed to carry their weapons there. How many at Columbine had a teacher been allowed to carry(I don't count the students since being under 18 they couldn't have a concealed permit)?
Our own military bases, how many could have stopped the shooting at Fort Hood if our own personnel that we train to handle firearms, could have stopped the events that took place.
I was mugged in the early 1994 walking to my car in a Kmart parking lot, and I'm not going to be defenseless if it happens again.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877 |
Quote:
A honest question....if I had a gun inside my blazer, would it make you nervous???
Well, I assume that if you have it in your blazer I wouldn't know you had it. So I would have to say that it would not make me nervous.
I also assume this is leading to some kind of snappy way to "put me in my place". If that's the case please save your typing fingers. You boys have your opinions about handguns and I have mine. Last time I checked that was OK.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 19,133
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 19,133 |
Quote:
You boys have your opinions about handguns and I have mine. Last time I checked that was OK.
The difference is that I didn't call you out by saying you were paranoid or that your opinion was a crock. Now after making those bold statements you're using this copout? That's funny.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877 |
Quote:
Are you saying there's no risk to being a victim of violent crime in Toledo?
Nope. But I'm in Toledo and it's suburbs all the time and have been for years. I've never carried a gun. I've never been afraid. I've never been attacked. I'm 55 so if someone is gonna get me they better hurry.
If carrying a gun all the time makes you feel better, more power to ya. It's my opinion that people that feel the need to do that (other than police officers, obviously) have a bit of a paranoid streak. Or they need to reevaluate who they're hanging out with.
Frankly, I'd like to hear how you think any of Ohio's gun laws hinder a law abiding citizen. Perhaps I'm unaware of some draconian new law that makes a person jump through totally unnecessary hoops. Barring that I doubt that any of the current laws are really putting you in a bind.
C'mon, handguns are for one thing and one thing only....to wound or kill another person. Obviously, some people need them in their daily lives because of their professions. Aside from that what exactly would they be good for?
I've had these arguments before. You're not gonna change my mind and I'm not gonna change yours. Let's leave it at that.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 19,133
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 19,133 |
Quote:
I've had these arguments before. You're not gonna change my mind and I'm not gonna change yours. Let's leave it at that.
So, you want to be able to call someone paranoid and tell them their opinion is a crock.....and leave it at that? Don't worry, I won't engage if you're not interested.
I can answer your question though:
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Frankly, I'd like to hear how you think any of Ohio's gun laws hinder a law abiding citizen.
The answer is simple. Gun laws hinder law abiding citizens by not permitting them the means to protect themselves, while giving violent criminals an arena where they know for certain that the law abiding victim pool will be unarmed.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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