DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) Browns 3rd Round Pick I: Colt McCoy (QB)

Totally agree with this Pitt. I'm totally on board with Colt in the 3rd. I would have been singing a different song had this been our 2nd rounder or if we did some stupid horse trading in the late 1st.

Holgrem also stated he "says lots of things." He probabally meant just the draft but I disagree, Holmgrem still has football in his blood. I guarantee if things go bad he will be trying to help. I gues we'll just see.

Besides my whole point was that he knows talent when he sees it.

Yeah, they do seem to be getting along great. Heckert joined Mangini and Holmgren for the end of draft presser.. I got through about 26 minutes of it before I had other things that had to be done..

These guys really get along.. But to me, the other big thing is, THEY TALK TO THE PRESS and by extention, to us.

I mean I understand it if a coach or GM wants to keep things close to the vest like Mangini did last season. I didn't knock him for it,, actually, I kinda defended it.. But looking back, I like this a WHOLE lot more

Lots of open communication.. Holmgren is great with the press.. and the press seems to love the guy.. Heck, they even seem to be warming up to Mangini and mangini is opening up showing a rather humorous side.

These guys are almost entertaining...

j/c .....

I've poked in this thread a bit and haven't read much of it, but my take on Colt is that it's possible that he may never end up as our full time starter. Mind you that is not meant as knock on him. It's just that I think that Mangini - Heckert - Holmgrem may very well go after another QB next year or in the next few years if the place and time is right. Obviously they would not have spent the pick if they didn't believe that he could succeed, but I do believe that the fact they we passed earlier while moving up to get others speaks for itself.

This is unlike the move that was made for Brady which defined him as the QB of the future. I think Colt has a very similar skill set as Brady and is likely more accurate coming in the door. Couple that with a much smaller contract and it's a personnel win for us.

Don't get me wrong, Colt has been a winner to this point and I hope he is for us. It's assumed for good reason that we will run the West Coast and, if the pundits got anything right, it is that his mobility and expected short / mid range accuracy give him a good opportunity to succeed.

Welcome Colt. Get your money, get into camp and take every advantage you can.

Good take, and one that I share as well.

I'm optimistic for him based solely on his history of success, his reputed accuracy (which to me is the #1 trait you have to look for) and his quick release.

If we can get him to make solid decisions, I think that we'll have something.... if not, we have a decent long-term backup.



Win/Win.

Toad:

I respect your opinion but I will comment about your assessment of McCoy.

First off winning means something. Winning in a big time conference against top competition. McCoy's accomplishments and career prove he can play (in college) as well as any other college quarterback. All of these prospects will have to prove if they can play at the professional level.

Development and throwing mechanics; I coached pitchers for ten years for East Cobb Baseball. East Cobb Baseball is the number one ranked youth baseball (15 to 18 year olds) organization in the country (by Baseball America magazine).

" What they have physically is what they'll have for their careers." "They've maxed out such things as speed and arm-strength."

To a degree I agree with that. Bob Feller was bringing it at seventeen. However, that does not mean a player can not improve in how he throws. He can learn and develop better mechanics which can result in tighter spirals. He may not throw harder or further but you can throw better.

What you can not teach or develop is leadership. You are or you are not.

Colt McCoy took over a team that won a title under a 6'5" 235lb guy who was a first round pick. He won more games.

I wonder where he would have gone in the draft or how he would have been perceived "if" he didn't get hurt in the championship game and Texas would have won?

Maybe nothing would have changed maybe not?

In the end all these prospects first rounders or undrafted players have to prove themselves. Marino was considered cocky and arrogant with issues. Montana was small with a so so arm.

It isn't just what you have or how you are graded by others it is what you do with what you have.

I'm just worried about who's gonna protect him when he finally does get playing. We'll have Mack and Thomas of course, but is Steiny gonna be there in a year or two? He's getting older, he's not a mauler like Mangini seems to like out of his interior O-line, and has a monstrous contract. Hopefully the new rookie pans out at RG.

Don't forget people develop physically at different rates. To continue with the pitching analogy, I pitched in high school and got by on movement, control and smarts. No one would mistake me for a power pitcher. In college I pitched and over those 4 years my fastball got substantially faster. After college I played some semi-pro ball and you know what? My fastball got even better to the point where if I needed to rev up I could throw it past most guys (just couldn't do that on every pitch). So I have a problem with people saying that Colt will never get more arm strength. He is a young guy and very well might. Then as bonefish states, if we can tweek his mechanics a little that could also help.

Quote:

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What about Brock Huard?

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Brock Huard = Jimmy Clausen

Drew Brees went through "core training" a few years back to help him. The knock on him was that he could not throw long.

Very seldom is that comment made these days. Is this perception or a result of training?

Maybe Colt can go work out with Drew Brees ..... pick his brain, etc.

J/C

after seeing Colt play nearly every week these past 4 years, I am happy to have him as a Brown. i think, at worst, he will be a fantastic backup QB, which is not a bad thing from a 3rd round QB.

also, much like Tebow, we will love cheering for the kid. he is pretty funny in his interviews but keeps it respectful at the same time (a hard thing to balance alot of the times).

i'm worried about his transition as he didn't have to make many reads, was out of the shotgun alot, and seemed to zone-in on Shipley for quarters at a time. but, he's by all accounts a very coachable kid and Holmgren has said he won't play this year. should be an interesting transition and hopefully Colt is the next in the line of successful Longhorn Browns (Metcalf, Dawson, Rogers).

one more thing, the tone of my above post would have been completely different had we selected him at the top of round2 as many projected us to do.

the fact that we were able to select him for a pretty good value in round3 adds to my good feeling about the pick.

i disagree..

A GOOD backup QB in round 3 is not a waste of a pick.. if your starter goes down.. a good backup can come in and win you a ball game.

plenty of teams draft QBs in the 3rd round or so to be a backup.

one example is GB drafting Brohm in the 2nd round with Rodgers already entrenched as the starter (and then Flynn in the 6th who beat him out for the backup job, but that is another point altogether).

the only reason we have to look and project McCoy is because we don't have a starter entrenched for the long term. if we pick a round1 QB next year and we re-up or flip McCoy for draft picks at the end of his term, I still see the value.

now, if he becomes the unquestioned starter, then that is great value.

Brees
Montana
S. Young
Kosar
Sipe
Pennington
Romo
Esiason
Stabler
Jaworski
Sims
Tarkenton


Some ols some new but just a few "right" off the top of my head that didn't have a elite arm.. yet got the job done.

Not saying that McCoy will but having a strong enough arm can really look good with drop dead accuracy. McCoy has that.

His size and lack of a elite arm made him drop to the third.
Thats our investment and we got a deal there IMO.

Lets not shoot him down yet when he has not yet had a chance to prove one way or the other.

That could be another list.

I was watching NFL Network the other day, and they had Top 10 Myths is Football.

One was your QB needs a rocket arm... MYTH!!

Most said guys with rocket arms end up having bad careers.. It was very hard for most to mention a successful QB who had a rocket arm.

Accuracy and leadership are the most needed.

We'll see how smart he is pretty quick...lol...He's gotta leave the girlfriend in Texas tho...lol...She's smokin'...

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=149&f=1547&t=5884779

I think [Delhomme] is going to be a great guy to play under, learn from, and to really learn the offense, learn the system, and I feel like I'm going to be a Cleveland Brown for a long time," McCoy said.

Now that he's been drafted, there's no time to waste. Brown's offensive coordinator Brian Daboll is FedExing a playbook to McCoy in time for next Thursday's rookie camp.

"The last thing coach Daboll told me was when I come into camp, he expects me to know what I'm doing," McCoy said. "He's overnighting me some of the playbook and we're going to Skype every day and talk ball and he expects me to come in there and be the leader and that's exactly what I'm going to do."

http://collegesportsblog.dallasnews.com/...erfect-sit.html

j/c

Thought this was interesting in hindsight:

QB Conundrum: Scouting Colt McCoy

McCoy By Aaron Ziraks
NoLogoNeeded.com Staff Writer
Twitter: @Z_NoLogoNeeded

The Browns are currently preparing to enter the "strategy phase" of their offseason. At No Logo Needed, we have to first figure out exactly what that means. My best guess is strategy (or stra-TEE-gery as we like to say) has a lot to do with the 12 picks the Browns have for the April draft and where those picks will be spent.

Until more definitive information is released on which players the Browns brass are bringing in to Berea for face-to-face interviews, NLN has decided to preview the following quarterbacks.

•Colt McCoy, Texas
•Tony Pike, Cincinnati
•Jarrett Brown, West Virginia
•Dan LeFevour, Central Michigan
•John Skelton, Fordham
•Mike Kafka, Northwestern
•Tim Hiller, Western Michigan

We are going to start with McCoy. He has been linked to Cleveland a couple of times in the past few weeks. Once the smoke clears, the Browns may have their quarterback of the future with McCoy. He should be available in the second round.

Below are five reason the Browns should draft McCoy followed by five reasons why they should have some reservations.

Reasons To Draft McCoy
1. Accuracy - In 1,645 attempts, McCoy completed 70.3 percent of his passes at Texas. He also was 1-for-1 in his career as a beach-side quarterback.

2. Leadership - At the NFL Combine McCoy answered a question about leadership. He had one of the best responses I heard that weekend.

"When I got in the huddle as a freshman I was calling plays to five guys that just started on National Championship team who just played with Vince Young," McCoy said. "I gained their respect through playing at a high level and there is no reason I couldn't do that again."

Not to mention, McCoy was a four-year starter at one of the best football programs in the country.

3. Chip on his Shoulder - After suffering an injury in the first series of the National Championship game, McCoy cited everything happens for a reason. That experience has made him more determined than ever to win a title at the next level.

4. High Praise - This week, long time NFL executive and NFL.com personnel guru Gil Brandt said:

"To me, Colt is Drew Brees on the field and Drew Brees off the field. But he's about two and a half inches taller and he's faster"


He also mentioned something specific regarding the Browns:

“The guy who retired from coaching and heads the Cleveland Browns now asked me who I’d take… I told him if you draft Colt McCoy and run the West Coast Offense, you’re going to forget about Joe Montana”.

Strong words from a respected NFL guru.

5. Not Top Ten Money - This is also a concern. Drafting No. 7 is not exactly a privileged anymore because of that financial burden. In addition, the Browns will have to move up to draft either Sam Bradford or Jimmy Clausen. However, McCoy will be there in the second round. The Browns will be able to position themselves to target McCoy thanks to their high number of picks.

Reasons For Reservations
1. Size - McCoy is not as tall as the average NFL quarterback. At the NFL Combine, McCoy measured in at 6-feet, 1 1/4-inches.

2. Gimmick Offense - McCoy didn't play much under center at Texas and that could be a concern for some clubs. It's especially a concern to a team that will employ a lot of play action, which requires quick decisions from under center.

3. Interceptions - He didn't throw a lot of interceptions, but he did throw enough to give pause. Two seasons with double-digit interception totals might be cause for a bit of concern.

4. Nerve Injury - McCoy has been cleared and the injury in the National Championship game was said to not cause any structural damage, but for a guy that has never had a major injury there might be concerns about how he handles it mentally.

5. Can He Be a Cold Weather Guy? - McCoy is a Texas guy with Texas blood. That blood is thin. The weather will affect him if he allows it. If he is the guy Cleveland picks, the brass have to be convinced he is capable of playing in Cleveland Browns Stadium in December.

Link

Why are you reaching so hard Toad?

What was Dorsey's completion percentage over his career? And McCoy won 7 more games. Dorsey won 38.

You know as well as I do that Dorsey was NEVER on the same plane with McCoy in terms of accuracy. So why try to compare two QB's who aren't comperable at all?

Dorsey threw for I know one year was something around 58% and another year around 55%. He was never in the same category from an accuracy standpoint as Colt. Never! You already know this so why are you even trying to pull this stunt?

This kid is far more accurate than Dorsey, far more mobile than Dorsey and won over half a seasons more victories than Dorsey. I really kind of expected you to at least "try" to make a fair comparison and you are reaching further than Denver did to draft Tebow!

Quote:

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Deep, I don't think he should have been the pick here, because of the system he played in the weapons around him and he never had people in his face when he threw and doesn't have the arm to throw though the small holes in the NFL. I'm not sure his arm is as good as Quins and evrybody ranked on him.

I think that MH should of stuck to his plan and taken his QB in the 5th round. we should have taken a player who could help us much sooner. The other big thing is, wether MH or Mangini like it or not, it is going to cause a QB controversy, AGAIN. When Jake starts to throw his picks the fans will screem for Colt.

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You seem like a big grump OldDawg. First off, this number system of yours is ridiculous. Just because it comes from NFL.com doesn't mean that it's credible. Managers get paid to do their own rankings, not to listen to some wanna be. It's what they get paid to do for a living, they get to meet the guy's up close, talk to them, watch all their game film, and be present at their workouts. Even if they are, they aren't hired by anyone. Therefore, those ratings are just opinions of random people, not experts or guidelines to strictly go by.

For example you complained about not picking up Vlad Duccaise (or whatever) in another thread. How do you know that Mangini didn't meet him, didn't like his attitude, didn't like what some people on BC said about him? A coach and player have to be a good fit to work well together. While good coaches try to coach different players differently, it's not always that easy when you install a philosophy. Plus may be our manager/coaches simply didn't feel like he fit our blocking scheme or what we were trying to do? One guy who might work well for the Jets, a team that takes a diff type of player, doesn't necessarily work well here.
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But one thing you are right about is that if Delhomme starts failing, fans will call for Colt McCoy. This is true about Browns fans. We go to the game, and the fans let their voice be heard.

I believe this is why Holmgren has worked hard to make it absolutely clear that Colt, in all likelihood, will not be playing this year.

But yeah. Unfortunately I finally agree with you there. Cleveland fans will let the team/coaches know that they want McCoy to play. When the truth is, McCoy is a 3rd rounder, and that's what our team and everyone else valued him as (or below). He needs time to develop if we hope for him to succeed

WELL said Pete.

I love these draft scenarios, in case you hadn't noticed. Here's another one: In Cleveland, midway through the third round, the Browns already had addressed cornerback, safety and running back; now they had two more priority positions to fill: defensive tackle and offensive tackle. They had picks 85 and 92. They had their two guys lined up from about the 70th pick on -- Kentucky defensive tackle Corey Peters and Arizona State tackle Shawn Lauvao. In the draft room, president Mike Holmgren, GM Tom Heckert and coach Eric Mangini, along with a few of the scouts, monitored the draft. Colt McCoy kept sliding.

"I had talked to Jon Gruden about Colt and he really liked him,'' Holmgren told me. "But Tom said we've got our plan, we like this defensive lineman and the offensive lineman, and we should go ahead and pick them. I kept saying, 'What about the quarterback?' ''

At number 83, two spots before the Browns were going to pick, Atlanta GM Dimitroff picked Peters, the defensive tackle the Browns had in their sights at 85.

"Then,'' Holmgren said, laughing, "the fates were telling me something. We had to pick him. I said to Tom, 'Let's pull the trigger.' I tried to run this draft the way Ron Wolf used to in Green Bay. Everyone contributed. But I kind of pulled rank a little bit. I said, 'Let's do this.'''

At the podium in Manhattan, Texas coach Mack Brown announced: "With the 85th pick in the 2010 NFL draft, the Cleveland Browns select Colt McCoy, quarterback, Texas.''


web page

At number 83, two spots before the Browns were going to pick, Atlanta GM Dimitroff picked Peters, the defensive tackle the Browns had in their sights at 85.


This was happening leading up to this pick..teams were picking up good players on the Browns board..it was ticking me off..

"Fate" huh??

Poor Heckert....at least 1 guy seems to know what he's doing in CLE

Good teams stick to their board...losers go with "gut feelings" and "fate"...don't like hearing that...scouts and Heckert work hard setting up a board and the Walrus pulls a "fate" pick...and is even proud talking about it....at least he's honest about it when he's saying he's learning on the job...maybe he needed this to feel he contributed something....whatever, but I don't like it 1 bit

Dude, you're really getting old...

I am not upset with the picking of McCoy especially where we got him. However I agree that him pulling rank on Heckert and drafting McCoy and not staying to the board concerns me. I wish we would just let Heckert run the draft and keep out of it.

If Holmgren isn't going to occasionally go over the top of everyone and say "This is what I wanna do, so we're doing it"...

Then why is he here?

Amazing...

Sell Luxury suites, and figure head of the organization. Let the person with the proven track record of succes do his job. I guess he should step in and call plays for Mangini too?

So we're giving him $50mil to be the poster boy?

Doubtful.

They had picks 85 and 92. They had their two guys lined up from about the 70th pick on -- Kentucky defensive tackle Corey Peters and Arizona State tackle Shawn Lauvao. In the draft room, president Mike Holmgren, GM Tom Heckert and coach Eric Mangini, along with a few of the scouts, monitored the draft. Colt McCoy kept sliding.


At number 83, two spots before the Browns were going to pick, Atlanta GM Dimitroff picked Peters, the defensive tackle the Browns had in their sights at 85.


How did they not stick to their board when the guy they wanted was gone and the next player on it, they got later???
They had McCoy on their board somewhere but wanted him to fall to them..