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We've seen that you can win championships with an elite player and a very good #2. Could you imagine the #1 and #3 player in the league and a guy with high potential in beasley? Plus they still have the #18 pick so they could get a guy like Avery Bradley to play PG or Solomon Alabi to play center.
IMO, 2 supreme players is not enough. The Lakers last year had Kobe and Pau, but they also had an excellent supporting cast. This is also true for the Celts in 08, the Spurs all the years they won, and I'm willing to bet for most of the last 20 years. The Heat would have two superstars, a very good player in Beasley, but virtually no bench. The starting lineup would be great, but when they rested, that team would have trouble holding leads.
You are right about Chalmers, I forgot about him. But is he really any better than Mo? Or even in the top half of the league as a PG? The Heat do have draft picks, but how often do draft picks come in the first year and take over a starting role on a team that goes on to win the Finals?
Last edited by tjs7; 05/28/10 08:56 PM.
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You are right about Chalmers, I forgot about him. But is he really any better than Mo?
You don't want me answering this question 
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The Heat do have draft picks, but how often do draft picks come in the first year and take over a starting role on a team that goes on to win the Finals?
I don't think Miami would win a championship right away but after a year or 2 of the rookie developing they would start there dynasty run.
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yeah but if they plan on getting any coach of significance, they're going to need that sig on the dotted line.
Absolutely true. But I don't think the Cavs are in a bad spot here either. The best available coaching candidates are going to want to go to the best organizations with the best players, so I suspect they will wait until free agency shakes out. I don't see the coaching candidates being completely depleted before we know where everyone is going to land.
IMO, If he is communicating with the Cavs, there is no advantage to it being made public. If it is plastered all over the news, then people will start to assume that Lebron has too much pull in organizational decisions. No established coach will ever come here under those circumstances. Total guess on my part, but I think this is exactly what is going on.
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You are right about Chalmers, I forgot about him. But is he really any better than Mo?
You don't want me answering this question
I harbor no illusions about Mo. I think he is slightly better than mediocre as a starting PG. And he has played poorly in the playoffs. But I don't even think Chalmers qualifies as this. I saw a bit of him during the Boston series this year, and he turned the ball over a lot more than Mo and had few assists. But I guess he is much younger, with a lot of room for improvement. That makes him a question mark.
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Turkeyglue wants out of Toronto (man did they screw up or what) It appears that Hedo Turkoglu's days as a Raptor may soon be over, just one year after he arrived in Toronto on a five-year, $53 million contract via a sign-and-trade deal with the Orlando Magic. According to the Basketball Jones blog, Turkoglu was interviewed recently on Turkish television, where he revealed that he is actively seeking a release from the Raptors. Turkoglu was fined and then benched late in the season after allegedly being spotted at a nightclub just hours after missing a game with a stomach virus. In a translation of the interview on the Basketball Jones blog, Turkoglu described his situation: "When the circumstances turned against me, I lost my enthusiasm for this city. My lawyers have talked to the front office recently. Honestly, I do not want to go back to Toronto," Turkoglu told his Turkish interviewers. "My lawyers talked to Mr. Colangelo and I hope that they will come up with a solution soon. During this process I talked to [Raptors head coach] Jay Triano several times. I promised him that whether he starts me or not, I will do my best on the court. However, if I had a more temperamental personality, I would have left the team. Yet, I did exactly the opposite. I did my best. I told him that I have no problems with him. I am not a young player, so it's not a big deal for me to come off the bench," said Turkoglu. The 31-year old veteran played 74 games for the Raptors last season and averaged 11.3 points, 4.6 rebounds, and 4.1 assists. He logged nearly 31 minutes per game for the Raptors, who are his fourth NBA club. He has also played for Sacramento, San Antonio, and Orlando. http://tsn.ca/nba/story/?id=322972
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I read this on another website. I feel kind of bad for the T-Wolves 3 players in the top 5. It's kind of interesting: "A friend of mine that uses Marginal Win Score (for those of you who have read or heard of the book Wages of Wins and/or Stumbling on Wins) did a full calculation on each team, and decided to take a look at 2009-2010's most harmful players. If you don't get Marginal Win Score, it's basically a formula that calculates the production of a player and how much wins he produces in an NBA season. It has known to be extremely accurate and since the playoffs are winding down I thought it would be fun to see what you guys had to say about the list, because I know there are some players on here that many of the guys on here like.
So, without further ado, here is the list:
1. Jonny Flynn (Minnesota Timberwolves)
2. Corey Brewer (Minnesota Timberwolves)
3. Rasual Butler (LA Clippers)
4. Roy Hibbert (Indiana Pacers)
5. Ryan Hollins (Minnesota Timberwolves)
6. Thaddeus Young (Philadelphia 76ers)
7. Darius Songalia (New Orleans Hornets)
8. Andrea Bargnani (Toronto Raptors)
9. Monta Ellis (Golden State Warriors)
10. Chris Kaman (LA Clippers)
11. Jeff Green (OKC Thunder)
12. Juwan Howard (Portland Trailblazers)
13. Jason Thompson (Sacramento Kings)
14. Derek Fisher (LA Lakers)
15. Antoine Wright (Toronto Raptors)
16. Ben Gordon (Detroit Pistons)
17. Vlad Radmanovic (Golden State Warriors)
18. Mike Conley Jr. (Memphis Grizzlies)
19. Donte Greene (Sacramento Kings)
20. Maurice Williams (Cleveland Cavaliers)
Keep in mind that this is just what the numbers show, if you don't get Marginal Win Score (or don't think it's accurate) than just ask me and I'll give a little explanation of it. But this is just what he came up with. This is some food for thought, hope you guys find the list interesting, there are some obvious and somewhat surprising names on the list IMO. Keep in mind that this is the most harmful, NOT worst players in the league, according to the formula these players did the most to push their teams towards or under the .500% mark.
Facts about the list:
1. This is Andrea Bargnani's 3rd straight season the list.
2. This is Ben Gordon's 2nd season on the list.
3. This is Jeff Green's 2nd season on the list.
4. First time a rookie has made it atop the list.
5. Sebastian Telfair topped the list last year, curiously, the man that replaced him was Jonny Flynn, who ended up being more harmful than Telfair and came in at #1.
The formula for WIN SCORE is as following:
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Points + Rebounds + Steals + .5Assists + .5Blocks – Field Goal Attempts – Turnovers – .5Free Throw Attempts – .5Personal Fouls
It is known on average to be 95% accurate, and can range anywhere from 92% to 99% accurate. My buddy has never had a team be less than 88% percent accurate.
Win Score deducts for every field goal attempt taken by the player, something like PER only deducts for missed field goal attempts. Thus it and other metrics reward players for the simple act of shooting the basketball, an act that has no value in and of itself. Win Score requires players to turn field goal attempts into points, and penalizes them if they do not. Second, Win Score values rebounds and steals (possession creating acts) more heavily than assists and blocked shots, NBA Efficiency does not (PER does). Assists and blocked shots are helpful acts, certainly, but they are not as important as Rebounds and Steals when it comes to producing wins, and Win Score recognizes this. It also factors in defense, although there are some aspects of defense that are team based and individual based. It is impossible to calculate each players defense spot on. If there is a player who works his butt of on defense but the others around him play no defense, how is he going to stop his counterpart alone? I might elaborate on this further, but the best way to get MWS is to just get the acclaimed book Wages of Wins. It's a real eye-opener.
With Marginal Win Score each team and each player on that team produces wins based upon a comparison between his positional Win Score and the Win Score average that he and his team allow at his given position.
So, the formula for MARGINAL WIN SCORE is:
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(Player’s Win Score – his collective “same position” Opponent Win Score / 2) / his minutes played * 48
Hope that cleared some things up. It's just the formula Win Score uses but it compares his win score and the average he allows at his given position"
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J / C
Cavs might be looking at buying a draft pick. Likely in the late 1st to early 2nd round as that is where draft picks are usually for sale (going rate anywhere from $1 - $3mil).
I think if we do buy a pick it will be either someone who could become a top-flight PG or C (likely teams won't sell into the 20's, so the likelihood is lower, but I'll still go with our best bets there).
C - we need a strong, stout, defensive center who can take on guys like Dwight Howard and Garnett without needing additional help (Andy can take care of the Bosh's, Gasol's and the like just fine). Basically, who can be our Kendrick Perkins.
Possibly available in the draft at the end of the 1st or early 2nd:
Daniel Orton, C, Kentucky - a bench player for the wildcats, he fits this bill of need very well.
Larry Sanders, PF, VCU - ridiculously long arms and athletic, he may not be listed as a C, but he could definitely play it. he isn't the stoutest player, but he seemed to play strong when I saw him.
Solomon Alibi, C, FSU - horrible offensively. but, we aren't looking for offense here (at least initially). he can block shots, rebound, and he won't get moved very easily from the paint.
Jerome Jordan, C, Tulsa - one of my favorite under-the-radar prospects the past couple years. He's ridiculously gifted athletically, but hasn't really put it together yet. He is more offensive-minded than the others, but has shown he can be a defensive presence when needed. I think he has by far the most upside of any of these guys, but he also has the lowest floor.
PG needs - we need a true-PG. a distributer and someone who can knife through the defense to create opportunities. someone with enough size to guard guys like Rondo but enough quickness to guard guys like Rose and Nelson would be nice (obviously we aren't getting all of that with a late 1st rounder, but we can use it as a baseline)
who might be available? well, it's a weak crop of PGs after the 2 Kentucky guys (Wall and Bledsoe)...
Armon Johnson, PG, Nevada - he is 6'3" and very quick, but gets out of position on defense and isn't natural at setting up his teammates (or was never really asked to do it. he reminds me a lot of Rondo. he has the same type of demeanor and skillset. whether or not he can translate it as well will be the question, but he is by far the guy I would want us to pick if we do go the PG route.
Grevis Vasquez, PG, Maryland - he's 6'6". not a misprint. ridiculously big for a PG he would give opponents fits. he is also a very gifted passer. however, I don't see him being a PG in the NBA because he will get abused by the smaller, shiftier PGs and he is not a good defender. I think someone takes him with the thought that they play him off the ball and he can handle some of the ball-handling responsibilities on offense too.
just say no to the rest:
Sherron Collins, PG, Kansas - too small, not quick enough to make up for it.
Scottie Reynolds, PG, Nova - combo-guard who I don't think will make it.
Dee Bost, PG, MissSt - not really great at anything, higher floor, but very low ceiling.
Mikhail Torrance, PG, Bama - 6'5" and lanky. he's more interesting than the others here as he can pass and shoot, but he has a GLARING weakness. He can't dribble with his right hand. Good luck getting by in the NBA as a PG if you aren't an ambidextrous dribbler.
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Daniel Orton, C, Kentucky
Solomon Alibi, C, FSU
Grevis Vasquez, PG, Maryland
Those are the only 3 that I'd be interested in buying a pick and geting. Orton is a load with potential. Alibi reminds me of Perkins except you're right he has 0 offensive game. Vasquez would bring some swagger to our guards. How much does it cost to buy a pick anyways?
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How much does it cost to buy a pick anyways?
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Cavs might be looking at buying a draft pick. Likely in the late 1st to early 2nd round as that is where draft picks are usually for sale (going rate anywhere from $1 - $3mil).
^ As seen in the first papragraph of the post above yours.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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Orton does have loads of potential. However, his offensive game to this point is almost non-existent.
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lebron taped a piece with larry king today, the piece will air friday but cnn has released a small part of it cnn LeBron: Cleveland has "edge" when he's free agent Two-time MVP basketball superstar LeBron James is on the cusp of free agency. In an interview scheduled to air Friday with CNN's Larry King, James said his current team, the Cleveland Cavaliers, has the best chance of keeping him. King: Do you lean at all toward the place you know the best? I mean do they have an edge going in... JAMES: Oh, absolutely. KING: ...your home team? JAMES: Absolutely. Because, you know, this city, these fans, I mean, have given me a lot in these seven years. And, you know, for me, it's comfortable. So I've got a lot of memories here. And - and so it does have an edge. James has not talked to the media since the Cleveland Cavaliers were eliminated in the second round of the playoffs by the Boston Celtics.
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"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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part of me wants to believe that lebron is just playing this up, that he wouldn't keep us in the mix, only to crush us at the end. that would be a blow right up there with all the other ones. i don't think he'd do us like that. part of me wants to believe that if he wanted out he would have told everyone within a week or two after the team lost, that he didn't want to build our hopes up for 2 months only to break our hearts.
part of me wants to believe lebron doesn't want to become another notch on the belt for cleveland sports infamy.
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part of me wants to believe that lebron is just playing this up, that he wouldn't keep us in the mix, only to crush us at the end. that would be a blow right up there with all the other ones. i don't think he'd do us like that. part of me wants to believe that if he wanted out he would have told everyone within a week or two after the team lost, that he didn't want to build our hopes up for 2 months only to break our hearts.
part of me wants to believe lebron doesn't want to become another notch on the belt for cleveland sports infamy.
i don't know - I'm so thoroughly confused by Lebron's actions right now, I'm just trying not to think about it until everything is over...
~Lyuokdea
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part of me wants to believe that lebron is just playing this up, that he wouldn't keep us in the mix, only to crush us at the end. that would be a blow right up there with all the other ones. i don't think he'd do us like that.
I don't see how doing thas could be positive for him in ANY possible scenario. If he was hell bent on leaving, just coming out and saying it would be the best way for him to save some face.
Crowded elevators smell different to short people...
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http://www.newsnet5.com/dpp/sports/basketball/cavaliers/lebron-to-appear-on-larry-king-on-cnnfull transcript of the larry king interview. i'll save you guys the trouble. there is nothing groundbreaking in this transcript. it's everything you would have expected. vague answers, at best. said obama saying go to chicago "may" carry weight, new york is a great city, cleveland has the edge, and the clippers have talent. he also said the city has no bearing, it's about winning, which favors cleveland because all the other towns mentioned are all big cities. likes the celtics in the finals.
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he has public relations down to a science. I will give him that. he says all the right things, without dissing anyone in the process. Like you said, he doesn't give clear answers.
Him and the rest of the free agent class are playing a game, and loving it. they're the center of attention for the next 5 weeks, and they're soaking it up.
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what i still don't get is that none of these situations will get him a championship ring.
i still think the cavs need one more guy. with what they have now, if they can add another superstar, and for the cavs, that is very tough because of the city they play in, if they did land one, they could do it.
the bulls and knicks are not title contenders if they add james. the knicks might be able to pair lebron and bosh, but they won't win a title just those 2, that team is years away.
same situation with chicago, derek rose, great player, joakim noah, solid player, taj gibson has some upside, but that team isn't going anywhere either. and i have heard several bulls fans say they are either going to sign james and sign and trade for bosh or vice versa, and i just don't see either toronto or cleveland just giving away their star player for the likes of hinrich or deng, and their contracts. don't see it.
i'm pretty sure toronto is more accepting of a sign and trade because bosh seems like he wants out, but you can't tell me they won't get a better offer than a few very low draft picks and luol deng...
and with cleveland, no way do we sign and trade to chicago for deng or hinrich. and hand them a possible championship run, as well as let lbj have his cake and eat it too...
if it's true that lbj signs only a 3 year deal, and for those 3 years its about championships, the cavs are still your best bet.
but i think in order for the cavs to land that second superstar that we have not been able to get, i think you are going to need a long term commitment from lbj... and i don't know if he'll do it. if you can get james to commit to the cavs longterm you increase your chances. still no guarantee, but it can't hurt.
what i do like is the thought of paul. if you can get lbj to sign, maybe bring in byron scott who i think is a very solid coach, a guy who has played the game, played in big games, won a chip. and with his pre-existing relationship with paul (paul was angered by his firing) i think you can then set yourself up.
that's all so far away right now.
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FA Slot Machine What a joke this is, I did the thing about 20 times and got Cleveland once. Changing their name to FAILspn.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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FA Slot Machine
What a joke this is, I did the thing about 20 times and got Cleveland once. Changing their name to FAILspn.
haha i did it three times and all three times it had LeBron coming to Cleveland. On the last spin, however, it had Dirk, Wade, and Boozer landing in Chicago. Holy crap.
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I had LeBron in Cleveland 3 out of 6 spins. I had one spin with Wade and Stoudamier (sp) in NY.  lol And another with like 3 guys in NY. Kinda weird.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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And another with like 3 guys in NY.
Kinda weird.
This doesn't take into account cap i don't think. The Knicks won't be able to get two max contracts and extend David Lee. How could three max contracts go to the knicks?
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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I tried it, and the first time it had Bosh going to the Lakers.  Toronto must of been really desperate, unless they took Paul Gasol back in the trade. (even then ... wtf??) Second time was much more realistic (and actually quite funny) ... everyone stayed with their current team, except Amare joining Wade in Miami (likely) ... Bosh going to Chicago (likely) ... and David Lee going to New Jersey!  That would make my summer!! Watch NY renounce David Lee's rights to sign two FAs, and get nobody in the process. 
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I spun 3 times and the first 2 were but the last one had James, Wade and Stoudemire in Miami. Holy crap that would be scary!
"All I know is, as long as I led the Southeastern Conference in scoring, my grades would be fine." - Charles Barkley
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chad ford has been marching the Bosh for Bynum trade for 6 months now.
I don't know why Toronto would hurt themselves that much with a player locked into a large long contract with the kind of injury history that Bynum has, but then again, the Raptors did sign Turkoglu.
Maybe if the Lakers took Turk off their hands and gave them Bynum, Shannon Brown (can't believe Phil has forgotten about him), and Walton (passing PF would work well in Toronto's system). But, I can't believe that's the best Toronto could do.
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doesn't that definitely put us in the mix for bosh? i know he didn't put cleveland in his "list" but wouldn't playing with lbj and having an owner that wouldn't mind paying bosh and lbj max money, be worth it?
would you rather have hickson or bynum? great question. can go both ways on it. if bynum could shake his health concerns, he's no doubt the guy i'd rather have, but with the fact that bynum goes through this every year, hickson should get consideration.
that's what i'm hoping happens when these guys talk (i know there was a report that said they weren't gonna talk, but believe me, they're gonna talk) that lebron says, come and play with the cavs. consider it. the supporting cast is there to win a championship next year, unlike new york where that could take years to acquire a good supporting cast and bench. in cleveland you can win this thing next year. with the bosh sign and a good coach sign. which if you get bosh and lbj, you can have your pick of the litter.
i'm not saying this is going to happen or even there is a good chance it can happen. so save the "you're crazy!" comments. i'm just putting it out there for thought.
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I don't know that Hickson > Bynum (though their salaries along with Bynum's injury concerns sure makes a great case for JJ)
However, Hickson + AV is definitely > Bynum (especially when factoring the other portions into it).
I'd hate to give up AV, but if it meant getting Bosh and keeping LeBron, yeah I'd be okay with it.
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yeah, you'd have to be. any player on this team is tradable at this point.
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Quote:
I don't know that Hickson > Bynum (though their salaries along with Bynum's injury concerns sure makes a great case for JJ)
However, Hickson + AV is definitely > Bynum (especially when factoring the other portions into it).
I'd hate to give up AV, but if it meant getting Bosh and keeping LeBron, yeah I'd be okay with it.
Me too,...
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I found something interesting on CP3's contract if he's traded: http://www.storytellerscontracts.info/resources/09-10salaries.htm Cavs send: JJ Hickson 1.5 mil Delonte West 4.5 mil (expiring) S&T Wally Z 10 mil (Expiring) 2 future 1sts NO Sends: CP3 6.8 mil if used in trade Okafer 10 mil ish They get a budding young PF and a good combo guard with an expiring contract as well as another big expiring contract in Wally Z plus 2 future 1sts. I'm pretty sure Wally's 10 mil and Predrags 15 mil in expiring contracts could go a long way in helping them pull off a trade for some great talent considering that's 25 million in savings for a team. Here's what the Cavs roster would then look like: PG-CP3/Telfair SG-Parker/Mo SF-LeBron/Moon PF-Jamison/Powe C-Okafer/Varajao Okafer wouldn't be a bad C for us as he'd play defense and be a consistent 10/10 which isn't bad considering we'd have CP3 and LeBron making people pay.
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great point on Chris Paul being a BYC player. That trade has to happen before July 1st or it goes to the full contract value.
however, we definitely cannot use Z in a sign-n-trade that way (no bird rights because of the trade to the Wiz). i'm not sure on Wally since he sat out a year if he is capable of being signed for it or not. Keith Van Horn I believe sat out a year, so I think that might be possible.
#gmstrong
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however, we definitely cannot use Z in a sign-n-trade that way (no bird rights because of the trade to the Wiz). i'm not sure on Wally since he sat out a year if he is capable of being signed for it or not. Keith Van Horn I believe sat out a year, so I think that might be possible.
Plus if we're really desperate we can try the same move with Shaq
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i'm not huge on okafor, and i don't know if he can handle center duties, but i think if we had any chance of landing cp3, we'd probably have to take okafor and his deal.
i would probably be ok with it, but maybe explore during the season trying to acquire a 7 footer. we are at serious risk of not having one going into next year dependong on what happend with shaq (probably gone) and z (might be gone)
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i would probably be ok with it, but maybe explore during the season trying to acquire a 7 footer. we are at serious risk of not having one going into next year dependong on what happend with shaq (probably gone) and z (might be gone)
Okafor is strong for a center so he wouldn't get outmuscled by Dwight. Which as everyone knows is the only way Dwight scores. We could also try to buy a 1st rounder and draft Solomon Alabi.
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Quote:
however, we definitely cannot use Z in a sign-n-trade that way (no bird rights because of the trade to the Wiz). i'm not sure on Wally since he sat out a year if he is capable of being signed for it or not. Keith Van Horn I believe sat out a year, so I think that might be possible.
Plus if we're really desperate we can try the same move with Shaq
what would be nice is if shaq said "look, i want to go to this team, i will agree to a sign and trade, you guys can get something back"
very doubtful, but ya never know.
where does he want to go? who wants him? is there any contending team on the radar that might want him? atlanta? charlotte?
that guy has burned several bridges so you can cross off all the horrible teams, a lot of the good teams, and i don't think he's burned any bridge with the cavs but i think they are ok going their seperate ways, might actually be the first time in the guy's career he's left somewhere without some hard feelings. i think is only problem was mike brown and that guy is no longer part of the cavs organization.
i would like to keep shaq, but i would like it as a role/bench guy. not a starter.
he put mike brown in a bad place by probably having that pressure to force him out there. we don't know it, but you can probably guess it.
you can argue both sides too. before shaq got hurt when the cavs beat the lakers and magic in a span of one week they looked unbeatable (funny mo and delonte were both out too) shaq goes away for a while and the cavs look great, shaq comes back and they never looked the same.
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Cavs send:
JJ Hickson 1.5 mil
Delonte West 4.5 mil (expiring)
S&T Wally Z 10 mil (Expiring)
2 future 1sts
NO Sends:
CP3 6.8 mil if used in trade
Okafer 10 mil ish
We don't have Z's Bird rights ... for all intents and purposes, just consider Z off the roster now. We DO have Wally's Bird rights, but I can't honestly see any team spending 10 million a year for Wally to do nothing, just to get Okafor's contract off their hands. At least with Okafor, you're getting some burn. (And a guy you think should start for us) Wally would be a $10 million dollar mulligan. And add onto that, they're getting rid of the face of their franchise. It would be like us trading away Lebron a few years ago just to get rid of Larry Hughes contract.
Using Shaq for a sign and trade would be more reasonable, but NO would have to be absolutely desperate to shed cash, and not 100% confident in CP3 returning from his injury.
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We don't have Z's Bird rights ... for all intents and purposes, just consider Z off the roster now. We DO have Wally's Bird rights, but I can't honestly see any team spending 10 million a year for Wally to do nothing, just to get Okafor's contract off their hands. At least with Okafor, you're getting some burn. (And a guy you think should start for us) Wally would be a $10 million dollar mulligan. And add onto that, they're getting rid of the face of their franchise. It would be like us trading away Lebron a few years ago just to get rid of Larry Hughes contract.
I meant Wally Z as in wally szerbiak. Also Emekas contract lasts for 2+ years at least. Plus CP3 has said so himself he's not happy with what's happening in NO. There's no way in hell they'll compete in the west and you figure there management has to realise this. SO they might as well get something for him. He's just going to keep puting pressure on them forcing them to trade him. Darren Collison looks like he'll be a stud in there system. Any other of my ideas you feel like shooting down because that's all you've done
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i think new orleans could definitely sell collison to their fans. and if they decide not to deal cp3, there will be a point where they will probably have to part with one of the two. if collison continues to play well, he's gonna get offers from elsewhere, down the line.
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i'm not huge on okafor, and i don't know if he can handle center duties, but i think if we had any chance of landing cp3, we'd probably have to take okafor and his deal.
I agree with Candy on Okafor. He's strong and can be our Perkins. An expensive option for that, but if you get CP3 and our version of Perkins, then that is fantastic.
How has Okafor done on Dwight? Glad you/I asked. This might change my opinion; maybe we should get Aaron Gray from NO instead?
Feb 08 '10 - Okafor coming off injury only played 9 minutes and apparently none against Dwight (this is another Okafor issue).
http://www.nba.com/games/20100226/ORLNOH/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore
Feb 26 '10 - Dwight goes 11/18 for 26pts 12 rebounds in 42 minutes. Okafor only played 24 minutes and ended with 4 fouls
Interestingly, it seems Aaron Gray was the Dwight Howard stopper (off recap tab of that same link)
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"I think big Aaron, 300 pounds, just leaning on him," West said. "We wore him down a little bit and Aaron made some big plays for us on the offensive end, some rebounding, a little jump shot and a jump hook that kind of broke their back."
2008/2009 season:
noticed Tyson Chandler owned Dwight in '09 when I clicked before remembering the Charlotte trade on Okafor.
4/15 for Dwight in 36 minutes.
http://www.nba.com/games/20081225/NOHORL/boxscore.html
though maybe just NO scheme? Hilton Armstrong and Sean Marks held him to 2/4 with 8 boards later in the year when Chandler was hurt.
http://www.nba.com/games/20090218/ORLNOH/boxscore.html
Okafor was hit or really big miss the previous year in Charlotte.
http://www.nba.com/games/20081116/ORLCHA/boxscore.html
Dwight 0/3 (only 6 FT attempts) and fouls out in 25 minutes.
http://www.nba.com/games/20090217/CHAORL/boxscore.html
Dwight 16/23 with 45 points, 19 rebounds
http://www.nba.com/games/20090220/ORLCHA/boxscore.html
Dwight only 13pts on 5/8 shooting, but 16 boards (34 minutes)
http://www.nba.com/games/20090415/CHAORL/boxscore.html
Okafor only 6 minutes coming back from injury.
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really strange, I was hoping for a bit more of a consensus on whether Okafor was good at shutting down Dwight. But, completely hit or miss as Dwight seems to be with about everything he does. Okafor still seems from what I have seen of him like he could be our Perkins, but this shows that it definitely shouldn't be without some concern.
maybe we should just get the NO game tape against ORL from 2009 and figure out what they did.
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what if shaq was interested in going to atl?
they need size, as they constantly get beat up down low.
joe johnson obviously wants out, he actually credited the cavs while ripping his own team earlier in the year...
you could do maybe a sign and trade, shaq gets his money, maybe only for 1-2 years, leaving atl flexibility.
i know the first thing someone is going to say is atl will have better offers, but 1, willy they, and 2, outside of that, what do you think?
that might be the one guy who wants to come to cle. he's not as young as these other guys (close to 30) so it may not be so much about the lifestyle and city, but about winning the chip. and playing with lbj, and playing with an owner like dan gilbert who will spare zero expense. possibility?
fun to think about.
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