DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Defense catches up in 2nd week of OTAs

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2010/05/cleveland_browns_defense_catch.html

Cleveland Browns defense catches up in second week of OTAs
By Tony Grossi, The Plain Dealer
May 27, 2010, 1:47PM


BEREA -- Instant observations on Browns organized team activity practice today ...

• Most of the work was on third downs. Unlike the red zone drills from the previous week, the defense won the day. Quarterbacks and receivers struggled against Rob Ryan's frequent blitz calls. Rookie safety Larry Asante had a two-handed rejection of a Jake Delhomme pass on one play. There were a lot more balls hitting the ground than a week ago.

• Rookie safety T.J. Ward's coverage skills have been lowly-rated in the pre- and post-draft period. But he looked pretty good intercepting a Delhomme pass for tight end Benjamin Watson in the deep middle of the field.

• Still no sign of the five unsigned restricted free agents and kicker Phil Dawson skipping OTAs. Coach Eric Mangini reported, however, that running back Jerome Harrison joined his teammates in workouts earlier in the week, but was excused today for reasons unrelated to his contract status.

• At the start of his remarks to the media, Mangini singled-out receiver Brian Robiskie as having a good start to the OTA season. Afterwards, Robiskie expressed excitement about the coming season. Not necessarily because he expects a breakout year after suffering through a seven-catch rookie season, either. Robiskie, who is all about team, said he's excited for the 2010 season because of the team's four-game winning streak at the end of last year. He also admitted the addition of veteran QBs Delhomme and Seneca Wallace will benefit the young receiving corps.

• Wallace, by the way, continues to display a knack for creating throwing lanes by moving in the pocket. And his arm is a lot stronger than you'd expect from an under-six foot quarterback.

• Saw Colt McCoy wing a pass on one of those sideline out routes so prevalent in the NFL game. Might have been 10 yards from the line of scrimmage, but an additional 10 yards to the sideline. It's the kind of pass that may have kept him from being drafted in the first round. It was completed, but coverage would be a lot tighter in a regular game.

• It's dangerous to draw conclusions from lineups in OTAs in May. Coaches may be experimenting and there could be some randomness to lineup rotations at this time. That said, the offensive line with the No. 1 unit was Joe Thomas at left tackle, Scott Kooistra at left guard, Alex Mack at center, rookie Shawn Lauvao at right guard and Tony Pashos at right tackle. Eric Steinbach was with the second team at left guard.

• Kwaku Danso, the big defensive lineman from Ghana who played (rarely) at East Carolina and is trying out for the team, lined up at nose tackle with the second team defense. He's listed as 6-5 and 326 pounds.

• Josh Cribbs said there is still a "Flash" package of Wildcat formation plays expressly for him. But the playbook now also has a "Cyclone" package featuring him and Wallace together. Cyclones is the nickname of Iowa State, Wallace's alma mater.

• Fullback Peyton Hillis, the player acquired from Denver in the Brady Quinn trade, isn't necessarily physically imposing, except for his arms. They are huge. I don't know the circumference of his biceps, but they are so extraordinarily large that everyone in the media was talking about them.

Figured that this one could go right along with the other .....

http://www.ohio.com/news/break_news/95070889.html

Rookie could be putting heat on Harrison
By Nate Ulrich
Beacon Journal staff writer

POSTED: 08:06 p.m. EDT, May 27, 2010

BEREA: Browns rookie Montario Hardesty revealed a wide grin when asked if his presence pushed fellow running back Jerome Harrison to recently appear at organized team activities for the first time this offseason.

Harrison, a restricted free agent who rushed for 561 yards and five touchdowns in the final three games this past season, attended practices Monday and Tuesday this week despite still not having signed a one-year tender, Browns coach Eric Mangini said. Harrison didn't attend the training session Thursday, but Mangini said Harrison's most recent absence was not related to his contract situation.

''I think it's good for everybody to be here,'' Mangini said. ''This is the second round of [installing our offense], and it helps the players when we go to camp and it helps us when we go to camp because there are some new things. There are some different things. When you come in and you're not overwhelmed by information or you're not thinking all the time, you're playing, you're reacting.

''Jerome and I didn't talk about it very much. I was happy he was here, and I anticipate him being back next week.''

The Browns selected Hardesty in the second round [59th overall pick] of last month's draft. He rushed for 1,345 yards and 13 touchdowns during his final season at the University of Tennessee. Mangini has already praised him for his attentiveness and knowledge of the game.

Perhaps Hardesty's impressive start served as a wake-up call for Harrison, who skipped the Browns' offseason training sessions last week.

''I don't know about that one,'' Hardesty said with a laugh. ''But it was definitely good for him to come back. I've definitely learned some things from him.

''That's just another guy that I can pick his brain and ask him more things. I'm definitely just out here trying to learn.''

Mangini said the Browns' four other restricted free agents — linebackers D'Qwell Jackson and Matt Roth, safety Abe Elam and fullback Lawrence Vickers — have yet to surface at the team's headquarters in Berea.

Drops all around


Browns receivers impressed most observers in the first OTA open to the media last week, but Thursday didn't bode as well for the majority of those trying to catch passes.

Mohamed Massaquoi, Syndric Steptoe, Joshua Cribbs, Johnathan Haggerty, Evan Moore and Greg Estandia were among the intended targets who dropped at least one ball thrown their way.

Still, Massaquoi remains confident he'll improve this season.

''I tried to assess the things that I was doing — you know, the plays that I made last year to try to see how I could make more of them,'' he said. ''[I studied] the routes that I ran bad or why I had a drop in a certain incident and just learn from it. [I'm] just really trying to be more of a pro and be more serious about things and try to correct all the little things.''

Safeties shine


Rookie safeties Larry Asante and T.J. Ward produced a couple of highlights Thursday.

Asante batted down quarterback Jake Delhomme's throw near the line of scrimmage, prompting a teammate to yell, ''Get that [bleep] out of here.'' Ward later intercepted a pass from Delhomme.

Welcome, rookie


Although the Browns were supposed to be participating in noncontact drills, veteran linebacker Chris Gocong, who was acquired in a trade with the Philadelphia Eagles this offseason, knocked Hardesty to the ground with a pro-wrestling-style clothesline.

''It was fun, man,'' Hardesty said. ''It's football. You've got to love it. Get up. Shake it off. Go to the next play.''

Sympathy for coach


Mangini said he felt for Mike Brown after Brown was fired as Cavaliers coach.

''I like Mike Brown,'' Mangini said. ''I sent him a text the other day, and I can relate to the things he's going through. It's difficult. I really hope things work out for him.''

When asked if it's tougher to coach in Cleveland because of the city's 46-year period without a major pro sports title, Mangini repeated the question aloud and then took a dramatic pause that caused some reporters to chuckle.

''It's a passionate town,'' Mangini said. ''You get it, though. You understand, and you appreciate it. Believe me, you're consumed with trying to achieve what we all want to achieve. It would be amazing, fantastic and deserved.''

One more .....

http://www.cantonrep.com/newsnow/x1015938797/Not-so-great-expectations-for-Browns

Not-so-great expectations for Browns

By Steve Doerschuk
CantonRep.com staff report
Posted May 27, 2010 @ 08:10 PM
Last update May 27, 2010 @ 08:19 PM
BEREA — The NFL preseason annuals are starting to hit the stores.

The one by Sporting News hit the Browns right between the eyes.

The good news for the Browns: The magazine’s editors predict Mike Holmgren’s new team, Cleveland, will finish as well as Holmgren’s old team, Seattle.

The bad: The forecast for both is 2-14.

How is Holmgren taking this? He isn’t. At least, the team president was nowhere to be found during Thursday’s practice, perhaps to avoid being a focal point of media.

Owner Randy Lerner poked his head out the door long enough to kibitz with a few writers, then ducked back in before he could say anything that would make a ripple.

Would Lerner at least say whether he is optimistic?

“Go Browns,” he said, with a coy smile and an exit stage left.

The 2-14 prediction is a slap in the face of Head Coach Eric Mangini, although he would never say so.

It does seem odd that the Browns would be seen as worse than the 5-11 team they were in 2009. The doomsday forecasts — almost everyone who does power rankings paints the Browns as a weak sister — probably chafe Holmgren, who seems pretty sure he knows what he’s doing.

Another Cleveland sports oddity: Mangini, 1-11 at one point last year, was retained. Mike Brown, who guided the Cavs to the best regular-season record in the NBA, was fired.

“It’s a passionate town,” Mangini said. “You get it, though. You understand and you appreciate it.

“Believe me. You’re consumed with trying to achieve what we all want to achieve. (A championship in Cleveland) would be amazing, fantastic and deserved.”

Realistic? Not in 2010. The Browns have no LeBrons.

Holmgren thinks quarterback Jake Delhomme will be an improvement over the Brady Quinn-Derek Anderson tag team. Delhomme will have to prove his nightmarish 2009 in Carolina was a mirage.

In a practice seen by the media last week, Delhomme seemed sharp. On Thursday, he was off.

In one sequence, he overthrew tight end Evan Moore on back-to-back plays.

Still, Delhomme never lost his poise. At times, the difference in his maturity and that of last year’s young QBs seemed obvious. He seems to effortlessly manipulate his cadence, making defenders hesitate and jump early, running through complex terminology as effortlessly as if it were “Green Eggs and Ham.”

Yet, when it was time to find receivers during plays, he struggled at times Thursday.

On one play late in practice, he badly overthrew a wideout deep down the middle. On the next play, he went over the middle again, throwing a wobbly floater that was tipped by one rookie safety, Larry Asante, and intercepted by another, T.J. Ward.

Yet the practice was spirited. Delhomme hardly seemed discouraged.

Mangini is bent on having his coaches use positive mental attitude toward returning to NFL relevance.

No one captured this theme better than running backs coach Gary Brown responding to a nice moment from rookie Montario Hardesty

“Good, good, good, good, good!” Brown said.

Five goods. Can these guys really be so bad as 2-14?

Copyright 2010 CantonRep.com. Some rights reserved

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• It's dangerous to draw conclusions from lineups in OTAs in May. Coaches may be experimenting and there could be some randomness to lineup rotations at this time. That said, the offensive line with the No. 1 unit was Joe Thomas at left tackle, Scott Kooistra at left guard, Alex Mack at center, rookie Shawn Lauvao at right guard and Tony Pashos at right tackle. Eric Steinbach was with the second team at left guard.

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Who is Scott Kooistra? Is he really a threat to Steinbach's starting spot. ES is a starting LG. He's not the best, but he's shown that he can hold his own. Between him, JT, and Alex Mack, I really think our left side could be pretty strong.

May be this is because of our blocking scheme, which doesn't seem to fit ES that much, but I dunno. Kooistra? Never heard of him. I just don't see how Steinbach loses his spot when there's no contact yet.

This has to be like a running formation or something.......... Or may be they're just giving guys a chance. I would imagine that by subbing some guy in on specific plays it would tip the defense.

Same thing happened last year with Hadnot in Steinbach's spot until he got hurt.

I have to wonder whether they don't like Steinbach, or if they want to move him to the right side figuring that the spot between Mack and Thomas should still be fine with a lesser player?

Mangini wants a power running interior Oline. This was the impetus behind the ES rumors and the Fraley shenannigans last season. Sooner or later he will have two good power guards and it'll be on. Looking at what the Jets did is a pretty good indicator of what EM is working towards in Cleveland. He likes the term "stoutness".

Steiny is good and probably the best backup to JT on the team, but he isn't in the future.

Its really encouraging to see this on the main site:

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Second-year Browns receiver Brian Robiskie and linebacker David Veikune are getting rave reviews for their efforts during Organized Team Activities.

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Link

OMG.....a DV reference that looks slightly promising.

Robiskie and Veikune, they are 2nd round picks in their 2nd year of course the team is going to be praising them in the hopes they have better seasons than last year.

It doesn't mean anything if you don't see it in the 16 games.

Mangini Press Conference Transcript 5-27

Mangini press conf. transcript - 5/27
Posted 10 hours ago

a a The transcript of Eric Mangini's Thursday afternoon press conference.
Browns Head Coach Eric Mangini press conference 5-27-10


(Opening statement)- “Good morning everybody. Today, what we are doing is, we are in our second round of installs, so today is our third down day. What I like about this progression is you go through the first set, first and second down, third down, red zone and review. Then you have your second set and you get the majority of your install is in place after this round. What we are trying to do is give them all of the information. It’s not as much time as we would get necessarily during training camp, but it is a nice amount of time, a nice amount of reps and it’s an introduction for a lot of guys who haven’t been here with it. The rookies, the free agents, this is their first exposure and chance to understand it. Then you come back in mandatory mini-camp, you hit it at a faster pace, but it’s the same information so that’s their second round of hearing it. Ideally, some more sticks at that point and then you go into training camp and you start the process over again and hopefully what you are getting is a lot of review and you can start at a higher point. But, there is some consistency with how they are given the offense and defense and special teams and how it’s practiced. That routine ideally will lead to greater retention.


“I think there have been some guys having a really good camp. I thought so far Brian Robiskie has had an outstanding camp. He’s showed up quite a bit. I think the quarterbacks are doing a really nice job with what we are asking them to do. Ben Watson has been doing a really nice job with the things that we are asking him to do. Really there are a lot of guys that I have been happy with, especially when you consider that it is a new environment. It is a lot of new material, but it has been fun to watch the progression as we go. They guys that have been out, are still out. Robaire (Smith) is not here, he had some things that he had to take care of and I talked to him. Jerome (Harrison) is not here, he had some things that he had to take care of. I talked to him, it’s nothing that’s related to his contract or anything like that. I expect him to be back next week. In terms of the restricted guys, there’s really no update along those lines.”


(On if Harrison has been at the facility)- “Yes, he was here. At the start of this week, he came in. He was here on the field. He hasn’t signed his tender, but there’s another way they can do it. I think it’s a waiver. You would have to talk to Matt (Thomas) and Tom (Heckert) about the exact document, but he is allowed to practice and participate and he had been the previous two days.”


(On the improvement of Robiskie)- “I think it’s a lot like quite a few of the younger guys. It’s not, ‘Where am I? What am I doing?’ It’s, ‘I remember this. I remember the technique that I have to do.’ You can start to develop it more and you can start to play faster because you’re not thinking and processing, so that helps. He’s running good routes and made some big plays pretty much every day. David Veikune has gotten a lot of reps working inside. I think he has looked better as well. All of those guys have shown some really positive things early on. We have a long way to go, but it is encouraging to see.”


(On what he learned about Robiskie last year)- “Tony (Grossi) a lot of it is and I know you hear me say this all of the time, but there is no one formula for these guys. You try a lot of different things to get them to contribute as quickly as possible. We spend a lot of time with the rookies to help do that, but it just sometimes hits at different spots. I know we were talking about the receiver from Jacksonville when we played them who had the first two years, with I think, 16 catches. Then came back and had last season 70-plus catches. So a couple years there, but it started to hit. You don’t know and I’ve seen it with a lot of players and pretty much every team I’ve been with. You always try and get that magical combination of installs, meetings, the way to handle it and you work at it, but each person is a little different.”


(On having to add a wide receiver)- “In terms of having to go out and get somebody, I think we are open to that. What is nice is that these guys are getting a lot of reps, they are getting a lot of chances to work the system, not just in the classroom, but on the field and I think that helps. We are open to all different positions if it came up and made sense, but it really would have to.”


(On if there are any restricted free agents practicing besides Harrison)- “No, he’s the only one.”


(On if any of the injured players from last week will be practicing today)- “They’re all on the same program. Nobody’s been added on right now. I don’t think we will see them through OTAs. Don’t anticipate it, but they are on their rehab program and it is set up with different milestones and things. I don’t anticipate them participating right now in that aspect. They are doing all of the other things.”


(On sticking with Veikune at inside linebacker)- “Yes, that’s what we will do, have him focus in that area. You forget how, and I have to keep reminding myself and the coaches, it’s hard for those guys. The young guys are going through what all of those guys went through last week. I know when Shawn (Lauvao) was running his laps, I think you guys were there for that. Alex Mack was like, ‘Hey, I’ve been there.’ Hopefully, and what I look for from the group of second-year guys now is to help the new guys through the process. To give them some things that they may have used to improve and they become teachers in their own right.”


(On Veikune)- “With end conversions, you don’t know necessarily where the best spot is going to be. Sometimes those guys are better outside and that’s where they naturally fit. A guy like Marcus Bernard, it made sense. Sometimes guys have the flexibility to do a couple different spots. You’re going through a trial and error to figure out, where is the best spot for him? Where is the best spot for us? You don’t know right away because they have never done it. There is a lot that you have to see and they have to experience to figure out where the best spot is.”


(On the right side of the offensive line)- “George (Warhop) spends a lot of the time on the rotations, so we mix those guys. Tony (Pashos) has played both spots, so has Floyd (Womack), so has John (St. Clair). Shawn (Lauvao) has worked at guard primarily, so there have been a lot of different combinations over there. That’s what you’d want to do because whoever isn’t the fifth is probably going to be the sixth. You’d like to have the position flexibility with that group to where if one is a better guard than tackle, you plug him in at guard and the other guy moves to tackle, depending on how the injuries go or how you need them.”


(On which spot Pashos is better at)- “They’re all pretty confident guys, so they feel like they are pretty good at both. He’s played both, he has worked at both. He probably has worked more at tackle than he has at guard historically, but that doesn’t necessarily mean you can’t work at both.”


(On if Lauvao has played any left guard yet)- “He hasn’t to this point. That’s something that we will probably do in the next round. Really let him get his feet wet, let him hear the terms, let him work at a consistent spot. Then we will work him in some other spots and see how the retention goes, see how it transfers. We wanted to give him a base first.”


(On Sheldon Brown)- “Sheldon, he’s a pro and that’s probably the highest compliment I can pay a guy. He’s very mature in his approach, working diligently to get the information down. He has been in one system for a long time, so he can associate things, but there is a lot of stuff that he needs to get down and it is really important for him to get it right. I think as he continues to grow in the system and understand the system, he will work with the younger guys to help them get it right and I think he will provide some leadership in that room.”


(On if he was surprised that Brown was available through trade)- “I don’t know surprised. Tom (Heckert) and his connections, he had a pretty good beat on what some possibilities were. When we had the opportunity, we went with it.”


(On how the rookie class is coming along)- “They’re coming along like all of the rookie classes that I’ve been a part of. Do you remember Steve Crosby back in the day? He said, ‘Like a ball in tall grass: lost.’ There’s a little bit of Lost going on. We haven’t seen that season finale here.”


(On the importance of Brown’s physical style of play)- “The criteria for evaluating any defensive back is, can they play man to man, can they play in the deep part of the field and can they tackle? You want to have all three of those elements in order to bring somebody in. Sometimes you hear cover corner and usually that’s a nice thing in a lot of ways, but it also means run at him. You want the complete corner that can do all of those things and Sheldon is a good tackler and a good run support player.”


(On the idea of playing a Super Bowl in cold weather)- “I really like it. I like it more if we are playing in it. We are all going to be able to see how it goes in New York, but I think it’s exciting. You have the elements and elements play such a huge part in the regular season. They play a huge part in the postseason, depending on where the game is located. To mix that in, I think it’s great.”


(On if he thinks cold weather locations should be in the regular rotation of sites)- “It’s a little above my pay grade, but I think it would be fun. You add the component that you deal with all of the time into it and it can dramatically affect games.”


(On expecting early results from rookies)- “I don’t think you ever really can tell if a draft class works out for two to three years down the road or whether a player works out necessarily because it’s not defined by one year, it’s defined by a body work. Believe me, I’ve coached a lot of guys that had to play right away that really shouldn’t have played. Sometimes that can be detrimental too because their confidence gets shot. I don’t think you can say it worked out or did not work out until you see the body of work over time and then you make your assessment.”


(On how he tried to develop Robiskie last year)- “I wouldn’t classify it as pushing or backing off, it’s just helping. How can you help the development? That’s really what you’re trying to do as a coach and a coaching staff is, how can I help this player get better? You can’t approach each player the same way because they’re radically different. They respond to things differently, they retain information differently. Ideally, you have a lot of different way to help them improve and you expose them to all those different ways. They learn what helps them the most as well and tend to focus their energy in those areas. But, it takes some time and some experience to get to that point.”


(On Seneca Wallace)- “I think Seneca has had a really nice camp. Obviously, he’s learning a lot of new things. It’s a different style than Jake is, which is good because it puts some different pressures on the defense. I don’t think you could rule out the possibility of having them both play. Seneca gives you some flexibility to do some things, just like Jake has certain things that they do. If you can incorporate them both in a plan that makes sense, that works, then that could be a good thing. Then you have a guy like Josh Cribbs, he presents different problems. Now you put Josh Cribbs and Seneca in the game together, they can present different problems. Ideally, it’s easy for you, but hard for them. That chews up a lot of preparation time for your opponent that they need to deal with it, you have to deal with it because it could come up and you better have good answers and you better have practiced it. Ideally, it’s part of your routine so that it doesn’t chew up a lot of time from your perspective.”


(On the additions in the defensive backfield)- “I think one thing that’s really good is that you add competition and competition makes everybody better. I think that’s a good thing. It gives you some flexibility with the type of packages that you can run. How it will unfold though, I couldn’t say definitively because I don’t understand exactly what (Joe) Haden’s strengths are going to be, what the weaknesses potentially could be. Same thing with Sheldon, learning about him as a player. T.J. Ward, Larry (Asante), seeing how their development works, strengths and weaknesses. You have more information obviously than you had before because they are working with you now, but there are a lot of things that we have to see before I can give you any kind of definitive comment.”


(On Harrison working out at the facility this week)- “I think it’s good for everybody to be here. Really, Mary Kay (Cabot), this is the second round of install and it helps the players when we go to camp. It helps us when we go to camp because there are some new things, there are some different things. When you come in and you’re not overwhelmed by information or you’re not thinking all the time, you’re playing and you’re acting. It gives them the best chance to put a true picture of what they can do forward. I think it’s valuable for everybody to be here. Jerome and I didn’t talk about it very much. I was happy he was here and I anticipate him being back next week.”


(On Alex Mack’s progress)- “I think that the experience that he got last year is fantastic. To be able to start 16 games as a rookie is really hard to do, especially at that spot. Center is often underrated in terms of how much information they have to process and how important they are to setting the whole protection, the front, the running game. It’s critical. He did a good job with it and I think he got better as the year went on. Now, what you’re looking for is to avoid a sophomore slump, to build on the lessons of last season. He’s a lot more comfortable, it’s just different. They’re all more comfortable now.”


(On if Mack has ran any lap)- “I don’t want to black cat him here, but he has not as of yet.”


(On Mack’s previous snapping issues)- “We’d snap it early or snap it late or we’d snap it right or we’d snap it left. He was snapping it all over the place.”


(On snapping being difficult)- “I think it’s a lot harder than it looks. You’re a young kid and, ‘Here you go.’ It’s tough. Nick (Mangold) was the same way. Nick also couldn’t come until a lot later because of the graduation format, so that made it even harder on Nick as he missed a ton of time. It’s a good thing, he was finishing college, but it was tough for him.”


(On if he has empathy for Mike Brown losing his job)- “I like Mike Brown and I sent him a text the other day. I can relate to the things he is going through and it’s difficult. I really hope things work out for him and I really hope things work out for the Cavs as well. I like Danny Ferry a lot and this sometimes happens. You just want to see ideally everyone move forward in a positive way.”


(On if there is more pressure to win a championship in Cleveland because of the title drought)- “Tougher to coach in this town? It’s a passionate town, it’s a passionate town. You get it though. You understand and you appreciate it. Believe me, you’re consumed with trying to achieve what we all want to achieve. It would be amazing, fantastic and deserved.”

Some really nice articles, and I particularly enjoyed seeing the one from Grossi that was simply just reporting, no spinning.

It's really nice to hear the positives about Robo & Veikune, but as was stated, let's see it when the hitting starts.

I know...

Aliens took Mangini in late January last year and left this changeling pod for the media. Can't be the same dude, can it? Invasion of the Berea Body Snatchers. I believe Mangini is having more fun this year as well and knows despite pressures that he has help.

That actualy sounds possible

Sometimes in life we all at one point want it all. I'm sure Mangini wanted it all. But just like most things, until you get it, you really don't know what to expect.

Many have, and I was one, criticized Mangini for his style and percieved shortcomings. But at this point, I really have to wonder how much pressure the guy was under. Even if many don't think so, the guy is a quality coach. If he wasn't he would have never worked for the likes of Belichek, Parcells, or Marchibroda. Those are some pretty "quality guys" IMO.

It could be a blessing that he has been relieved of the many duties that filled his schedule last year. I hope, that what we are seeing is a good coach being allowed to coach with no interference. This year should be the true evaluation of Mangini as a head coach. No distractions to take away from his "process".

I want to say I believe that it will produce good results, but I will temper my expectations. But I will say this, if he is what Holmgren seems to believe he is, things could be good for a long while.

IMO the best part of this whole situation is that, if he isn't, the power structure in place will not have to change with the coaching staff. That is a luxury that we have not had since the return. In the worse case situation, Holmgren would be forced to the sidelines............................wow would that suck

I'm willing to wait and see if he comes on this year before I send him to the firing squad.

If he becomes a good player, I really don't give a damn if it's at ILB or OLB.

Barton was a 30yo vet stopgap when he signed, D'Qwell was probably going to walk after the next season, and they didn't have Trusnik (got him in the Edwards trade in October).

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Mangini drafted him for 34 OLB than saw him FAIL and he now tries to cover up his arse salvaging the moronic pick at ILB (where he will fail too)....how I know that? why would you draft another ILB high in round 4 of the same draft (Maiava) when you just traded for a ILB (Trusnik), drafted one in the 2nd (supposedly Veikune), signed a vet you love in Barton as FA AND inherited Dqwell?

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First: Trusnik was acquired in the middle of the season. He's not a topic when talking about trading for Veikune.

And from what I remember, Mangini from the start said he was going to transition him to ILB and it would be a more difficult switch to make than DE to OLB. So yeah, while I'm not looking up proof, I am willing to bet most anything that there are things that say that Veikune would potentially play ILB for our team.

I can't explain why they drafted Maiava except that he was a later round pick (wasn't he 5th, or was he 4th?). Plus he was considered by Mangini the underappreciated and undervalued LB that wasn't getting drafted because of he was undersized.

Don't cloud the issue with facts.

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Career Transactions
Originally drafted by Cleveland in the fourth round (104th overall) of the 2009 NFL Draft.

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http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/team/roster/Kaluka-Maiava/3c56a704-5586-4627-8691-9f8474839bb0

From the main Browns Site. He was a 4th rounder..

I agree. At first, we had a brat mentality that seemed too lax for too many to play well. Not all, mind you. But we were not dealing in consequences. You could make the same crappy showing week after week, often with the same muddled excuse for a game plan and it came out the same, short end of the stick. I applaud his discipline demands, and he had to make it clear. Perform and achieve. Improve. Some of that has happened and I am hopefully confident will continue. Had to close the resort, return the adults to the playground, and win. Think we made some vital strides. A little poison goes a long way in your waterhole.

You speak in riddles.

In riddles Bard doth speak,,,

Walrus and Eagle inhabit the lake. A genius shares the throne.
3 birds are added to the flock. A Rebel not alone.
Irish scribe now mile high. Ham Sandwiches for all.
A pitcher joins, but not the tribe. Wild elf the call.
A ghost, long waiting for his life, is threatened by a volunteer.
A wily cat of many years is given reins to steer.

I wish to wash my Irish wristwatch?

A tug of war surrounding a pit of alligators.

On one side were 4 valiant young warriors. stout of heart, yet average in stature.

On the other side were 4 fiercesome warriors, each a match for any man, or even a man and a half.

The 4 young warriors pulled in unison, as one, struggling together.

The other 4 warriors knew the best way, and each pulled in his own direction.

For a while, it appeared that the 4 young warriors cause was lost, and that they were destined for the most gruesome of fates.

The raw talent and power of the 4 fiercesome warriors might prove too much.

However, as the battle progressed, the teamwork, unison, and singlemindedness of purpose began to overcome even the mightiest efforts of the 4 fiercesome and powerful warriors.

As the rope pulled ever closer to their doom .... the 4 fiercesome warriors pulled even more desperately, mightily straining and struggling ... each in his own direction, and each according to his own will.

1 by 1 the fiercesome warriors fell over the edge, into the pit, and to their doom. Teamwork and purpose had overcome divided, yet superior strength and ability.

The 4 young warriors would never forget the lesson of that day, that a united effort can oversome superior strength ... and that each team member who disregards the team in favor of his own will and desire adds a team member to his own opponents.




I think I read that on a fortune cookie or something.

fiercesome warriors...

Hmm.. ::blink blink::

I think it might have been a story I heard as a kid ...... or a fable ..... a parable .... or something.

That's one hell of a fortune cookie...

It was an extended family size cookie ......

Quote:

---

A tug of war surrounding a pit of alligators.

On one side were 4 valiant young warriors. stout of heart, yet average in stature.

On the other side were 4 fiercesome warriors, each a match for any man, or even a man and a half.

The 4 young warriors pulled in unison, as one, struggling together.

The other 4 warriors knew the best way, and each pulled in his own direction.

For a while, it appeared that the 4 young warriors cause was lost, and that they were destined for the most gruesome of fates.

The raw talent and power of the 4 fiercesome warriors might prove too much.

However, as the battle progressed, the teamwork, unison, and singlemindedness of purpose began to overcome even the mightiest efforts of the 4 fiercesome and powerful warriors.

As the rope pulled ever closer to their doom .... the 4 fiercesome warriors pulled even more desperately, mightily straining and struggling ... each in his own direction, and each according to his own will.

1 by 1 the fiercesome warriors fell over the edge, into the pit, and to their doom. Teamwork and purpose had overcome divided, yet superior strength and ability.

The 4 young warriors would never forget the lesson of that day, that a united effort can oversome superior strength ... and that each team member who disregards the team in favor of his own will and desire adds a team member to his own opponents.

---

in bed.


That's not funny.

Mangini in this presser sounds pretty candid. Almost Parcells like in a couple of areas. His words don't really sound "cryptic" in anyway. It's actually pretty cool to read.