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Now, Eric Mangini has had a full year as head coach. He has his supporters and he has his detractors (me) and mainly I pose the question. Why? I am here to take as objective a look at Mangini as far as why I don't like him and yet, why I feel he's a good coach for our team. He's not changing my opinion yet, but I certainly don't feel he's as engaging to female sexual stereotypes as I did over a year ago. To say he's improved doesn't feel fair yet but the fact that H3 has kept him around (more likely for a semblance of stability than anything else) has caused me to take a second look.
To say he 'rubbed me the wrong way' would lean toward a unintentional double entendre. I was not impressed by what I first saw of him. I know very little about coaches and their history but Mangini busted onto the scene for the Jets and he came across like he was 'kind of a big deal', being an 'esteemed pupil' of Bill Belichick. What followed with the Jets was a complete breakdown after a first season that showed a lot of promise. What should've been was the kind of season that they had last season, with the Jets making a strong push for the Super Bowl. History would show us that is NOT what happened, even with the ageless Brett Favre at the helm.
THEN... Mangini gets hired to be our head coach and my first impression was WHAT THE There were plenty of great candidates available and we took the guy who was either a scapegoat or the catalyst of the degradation of the Jets locker room and unable to keep his team together after starting out lightning hot with Favre behind the gun.
What followed didn't help either. I don't know how many of you would agree with me but I felt last season that we hit rock bottom HARD. 1-11 was a very bitter pill to swallow and I thought the worst had already been seen for our "new" Browns at ... I don't know, ANY point the past decade where our team had failed to show any promise. I'm pretty sure pretty much everyone was calling to pull the plug. I can't speak for you guys but I was scratching my head wondering why we hired this guy.
It was around the point we would have been 1-6 or so. Sports Illustrated published an article that painted a VERY bad picture of Mangini. The image used to caption the article was a caricature of Manigni sitting on the Browns bench with the roster basically a heap of bodies behind him. He had chocolate all over his face and a pretty strong pout going on. The article literally compared Mangini's coaching tactics to Nazism and pointed the finger to the same alienating techniques that destroyed the Jets locker room.
Then something happened, something clicked. Maybe it was just the momentum of defeating our biggest rival for the first time in years or maybe it was the culmination of a man meticulously putting in place the kinds of players HE wanted. I can't say for certain. But we didn't just win that Pittsburgh game, we pretty much dominated the Super Bowl champs (and so did a lot of teams that season. WTF happened to the Pittsburgh, this isn't the place to contemplate that) We went on to finish the season very strong and managed to reverse all of the negativity that I had felt toward this team in the process(Mike Holmgren’s hire was a pretty sizable portion of that). It's amazing what a 4-game winning streak can do to fan morale.
So, enter Holmgren: The man brought in to be THE man for our franchise, and oversee a change for the Cleveland Browns. He spoke of change, spoke of bringing in 'his guys' like minded people who would help craft the Browns into a winner. New GM, new this and new that... but he kept Mangini around. Why? Was it because Mangini managed to befriend Holmgren and earn his respect? Was it because Holmgren didn't want to shake up the foundation too much and wash away the momentum that was built at the end of the season?
I don't know coaches and I can't pretend to know what works and what doesn't because I have never coached kids, let alone professional athletes earning millions of dollars. I can't assume the kind of pressure or tactics it takes to rally these kinds of people. As a fan, I can only watch the game of football and go by what I feel works and what doesn't. At times, Mangini's tactics DID NOT work, but by the end of the season, there was nothing to suggest that his plan wasn't manifesting some success and that he was earning the respect of his players.
So I ask of all of you, is Eric Mangini a Mangenius or a ? For me, 2010 will be his chance to ultimately prove himself. To H3, to the rest of the NFL, and to the fans. Will it be a triumph, or will it be ‘business as usual’ with our hopes being dashed yet again. I’m not trying to be negative, I’m trying to see Mangini in a positive light because for the life of me I cannot manage to break the nickname I've given him (and I'm sure others have as well) of
What are your guys’ opinion of Mangini as fellow Browns fans?
Last edited by Referee 3; 06/05/10 08:17 PM.
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Post deleted by Referee 3
Last edited by Referee 3; 06/05/10 08:28 PM.
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Haha, Thank you for the heads up. I knew language was monitored but I wasn't sure if play-on-words were going to fall into that. Do you think I should edit it out of my post?
Last edited by Referee 3; 06/05/10 08:29 PM.
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Is this a new rule?
If so, then good - I find it rather tacky.
As for Mangini, there was a point where we were 1-5 or 1-8 where I wondered if he was losing the team because of being a hardass (fan perception) combined with all the losing. I was on the fence back then.
However, I liked his attention to the little things, and holding guys more accountable than RAC seemed to.
I liked his response to the water bottle incident and what it represented, and the fact Mangini kicked guys like Braylon to the curb for being such an immature, selfish ass.
Sure, winning the last four sure eased a lot of fan concerns. It showed, IMO, that Mangini's Way might be working.
He did a good job building the Jets, and by Holmgren showing faith in him it sets the stage for some sorely-needed continuity.
I think he's a good coach and can "coach them up" as they say. His philosophy of having players with strong character is a tried-and-true method of building winners. Sure you need talent but you also need good people.
Last edited by Referee 3; 06/05/10 08:29 PM.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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Welcome,, I see you are a relative newbie.. Enjoy! Having said that  Quote:
He's not changing my opinion yet, but I certainly don't feel he's as engaging to female sexual stereotypes as I did over a year ago
Not sure what you are referring to exactly, but if I have it right, I fail to see how he's perceived by females as a factor when evaluating his coaching...
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I know very little about coaches and their history but Mangini busted onto the scene for the Jets and he came across like he was 'kind of a big deal', being an 'esteemed pupil' of Bill Belichick.
Again, the Media tagged him as such,, and I fail to see how the Medias labeling (new york media to boot) has anything to do with his coaching.. Mangini didn't ever say to anyone that I'm aware of, that he was anything more or less special... it's all media hype,, quick to build, quick to dismantle.
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What followed with the Jets was a complete breakdown after a first season that showed a lot of promise. What should've been was the kind of season that they had last season
Ahh come on.. he had pennington for all 16 games that first year, only 9 games the second and for the third year, they were rockin until Favres arm fell off.. if anything, the mistake he made was not removing Favre from the line up.. But how do you tell a future HOFer that he's out? Of course, you have to if that's whats requred.. but it can't be easy...
Also, to sit there and claim his last Jets season should have been like the last one is just ridiculous..
It could be said because of things he did during his three years as Jets HC, is why they were as successful as they were last year..
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What followed didn't help either. I don't know how many of you would agree with me but I felt last season that we hit rock bottom HARD.
He didn't exactly inherit a team that was on the brink of success. Starting out 1 and 11 isn't appealing to any Browns fan.. But to start out that way, and end up 5 and 11 isn't the worse season we've seen since 1999..
More importantly, it showed that something he was doing was working.. albiet against less than great teams (except pittsburgh and Jacksonville of course)
I should have stopped reading at the headline, but thought I was actually reading it wrong.. Pretty childish and without a doubt a bit offensive..
let me just say, I gave Mangini lots of rope in the last offseason.. so when things weren't going well, I wanted him gone.. I made no bones about it..
Still, I am not 100% convinced he's the one..But I'm actually more encouraged based on two things that took place..
1. the end of the season run.. Good opponents or bad, it was impressive and completely enjoyable to watch.
2. His attitude since the arrival of Holmgren.. he's way more open and way more media friendly thus fan friendly.. he's telling us things that he wouldn't have let out before. He's still guarded on somethings, but that's probably as it should be I suppose.
I sense that things are about to improve.
Where we end up this season may well be attributed to as much of what he did before Holmgren as what Holmgren and Heckert have done since there arrival... We'll see and I'm positive we'll have plenty of folks picking at it no matter the results..
Last edited by Damanshot; 05/31/10 11:45 AM.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
There were plenty of great candidates available
While hindsight is 20/20 .... I would like a list of these "great" candidates who were available. In damn near every case, the options were either ..... as is almost always the case ..... either a guy who failed at the end of his term (whether a 1 year term, or a 21 year term) and was booted from somewhere ..... or a young hotshot who had proven nothing as far as being a Head Coach goes.
I am long on record with my opinion that the reason most 1st time Head Coaches fail is not the x's and o's of football ...... but rather an inability to "manage the managers", and keep the assistants on track and teaching. Most 1st time Head Coaches fail because they do not know how to delegate, and try to have their hands on every aspect of the operation. It simply does not work .... especially with a 1st time Head Coach.
Anyway .... if we look at Mangini's NY teams, we see teams that were built to be physical and powerful teams. We see teams that were disciplined. Sure Favre's arm fell off and without a QB their season went to hell ...... but most teams will fall apart if their starting QB falls apart as well. Mangini had the basics right in NY. His teams did things the right way. The failings were physical, not a result of alack of discipline or preparation.
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don't know how many of you would agree with me but I felt last season that we hit rock bottom HARD. 1-11 was a very bitter pill to swallow and I thought the worst had already been seen for our "new" Browns at ... I don't know, ANY point the past decade where our team had failed to show any promise. I'm pretty sure pretty much everyone was calling to pull the plug. I can't speak for you guys but I was scratching my head wondering why we hired this guy.
1-11 was ugly. There is no question about it. However, the Browns dumped their best receiver when they traded Winslow. They were stuck with 2 bums at QB. There were holes everywhere, and not many pieces to plug in and have any reasonable expectation of those pieces working. We also had 4 draft picks thanks to Savage's wheelings and dealings of a year ago. (and I actually liked both of those deals ... so it shows what I sometimes know)  We had an exceptional TE, who was frequently injured, and who wanted a massive new deal. We had a #1 WR who could turn into a #0 at he drop of a football. we had an old RB, and a bunch of unproven youth. We did, however, have an excellent FB. You know that your team is in trouble when your best offensive weapon if your FB,
The Browns were set at LT, LG, and FB. Every other position was unsettled .... to be kind.
On defense, we had a unit that did nothing well. We couldn't stop the pass ..... rush the passer ... stop the run ......
There were pieces ..... but no cohesion.
Given this mess, plus 4 draft picks, it was hard to imagine a massive turnaround in 1 year. Mangini pulled off what seemed like hundreds of trades .... and acquired players and draft picks ..... The team got a lot younger ...... and player development became the order of the day. That didn't happen overnight.
Players had to learn ..... to understand that they are accountable ...... to understand and perform their duties in a disciplined and precise manner ..... and to work as a member of a team rather than 1 guy trying to stand out.
It took a culture change ..... and it didn't happen overnight ..... but it did happen.
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So, enter Holmgren: The man brought in to be THE man for our franchise, and oversee a change for the Cleveland Browns. He spoke of change, spoke of bringing in 'his guys' like minded people who would help craft the Browns into a winner
Holmgren never said, specifically, who would stay and who would go. he did say that he would review the operation and make decisions based upon his review. This was the right way to approach thing IMHO.
He did his review .... interviewed the Head Coach ... asked questions .... shared ideas ..... challenged him, no doubt, and in the end decided that this was a man he could work with, and win with
You talk of Holmgren saying that he would bring in "his guys". I don't recall that quote. It is normal for someone in Holmgren's position to bring in people he feels comfortable with ..... but that doesn't mean that he was just going to toss everyone out. he did what he said he would do, and wound up keeping Mangini as a result. It surprised many .... but was the right choice IMHO.
As far as my opinion .... I like Mangini. I like a power running team with a strong defense, and that's what Mangini wants to build. I like his philosophies regarding building a team first attitude. I appreciate that he wants players who are smart, and have good character .... and who will be disciplined on the field. Somehow I don't think we would have seen Dwayne Rudd running off the field with his helmet off on a Mangini team.
I also do not like derogatory names for our players and/or coaches. I have certainly had players who I came to the conlusion never be any good .... (Frye, Quinn, etc) but that doesn't mean slamming them by using sophmoric humor in bastardizing their names. I believe in commenting on the player's actions and play, rather than on his name. I'm sure that you wouldn't be all that happy if someone referred to you by changing the first word of your name from "Enigmatic" to "Enema". It's just a childish was to make an argument ... in that it relies upon childish humor rather than a reasoned and compelling argument.
Just my ever so humble $0.02 worth.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Not sure what you are referring to exactly, but if I have it right, I fail to see how he's perceived by females as a factor when evaluating his coaching...
Where we end up this season may well be attributed to as much of what he did before Holmgren as what Holmgren and Heckert have done since there arrival... We'll see and I'm positive we'll have plenty of folks picking at it no matter the results..
Well the sexuality comment was more a joke playing off the derogatory name I dubbed him with. Not any literal interpretations, or any assertions made by anyone of legitimate media background. It's easy to be a bully, I suppose in a sense that's what I was doing. I don't want to earn a reputation for that so I'm just going to steer away from that immediately.
I know it's not all on Mangini anymore and I'm thankful for that. I think now that he can focus solely on coaching the team and their attitudes on the field that will show to be positive or negative more directly this year than last year when Mangini's attention was most likely divided in many different directions.
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It could be said because of things he did during his three years as Jets HC, is why they were as successful as they were last year..
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What followed didn't help either. I don't know how many of you would agree with me but I felt last season that we hit rock bottom HARD.
He didn't exactly inherit a team that was on the brink of success. Starting out 1 and 11 isn't appealing to any Browns fan.. But to start out that way, and end up 5 and 11 isn't the worse season we've seen since 1999..
More importantly, it showed that something he was doing was working.. albiet against less than great teams (except pittsburgh and Jacksonville of course)
let me just say, I gave Mangini lots of rope in the last offseason.. so when things weren't going well, I wanted him gone.. I made no bones about it..
Still, I am not 100% convinced he's the one..But I'm actually more encouraged based on two things that took place..
1. the end of the season run.. Good opponents or bad, it was impressive and completely enjoyable to watch.
2. His attitude since the arrival of Holmgren.. he's way more open and way more media friendly thus fan friendly.. he's telling us things that he wouldn't have let out before. He's still guarded on somethings, but that's probably as it should be I suppose.
I sense that things are about to improve.
Where we end up this season may well be attributed to as much of what he did before Holmgren as what Holmgren and Heckert have done since there arrival... We'll see and I'm positive we'll have plenty of folks picking at it no matter the results..
That's a good point and I would also argue that the Jets weren't exactly in the kind of spot upon Mangini's arrival with them as the Browns were upon his arrival with our team, but that's pretty much an entirely different discussion. I think Holmgren's influence or his relationship with Mangini has resulted in Mangini taking a more focused approach to his responsibilities and it should help him look better as a coach in the end as well.
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There were plenty of great candidates available
While hindsight is 20/20 .... I would like a list of these "great" candidates who were available. In damn near every case, the options were either ..... as is almost always the case ..... either a guy who failed at the end of his term (whether a 1 year term, or a 21 year term) and was booted from somewhere ..... or a young hotshot who had proven nothing as far as being a Head Coach goes.
Players had to learn ..... to understand that they are accountable ...... to understand and perform their duties in a disciplined and precise manner ..... and to work as a member of a team rather than 1 guy trying to stand out.
It took a culture change ..... and it didn't happen overnight ..... but it did happen.
As far as my opinion .... I like Mangini. I like a power running team with a strong defense, and that's what Mangini wants to build. I like his philosophies regarding building a team first attitude. I appreciate that he wants players who are smart, and have good character .... and who will be disciplined on the field. Somehow I don't think we would have seen Dwayne Rudd running off the field with his helmet off on a Mangini team.
I also do not like derogatory names for our players and/or coaches. I have certainly had players who I came to the conlusion never be any good .... (Frye, Quinn, etc) but that doesn't mean slamming them by using sophmoric humor in bastardizing their names. I believe in commenting on the player's actions and play, rather than on his name. I'm sure that you wouldn't be all that happy if someone referred to you by changing the first word of your name from "Enigmatic" to "Enema". It's just a childish was to make an argument ... in that it relies upon childish humor rather than a reasoned and compelling argument.
Just my ever so humble $0.02 worth.
To be honest, maybe in a deranged way I would feel kind of honored if somebody took the time to go out of their way and defame me by mocking my display name 
My perception of Mangini was definately molded by what I've read about him in conjunction with how our team was performing on the field. When a team is playing poorly of course it's going to reflect badly on that teams coach and that's why I have such a negative outlook toward him to begin with.
I really want to turn my opinion around on him and I know he wasn't exactly inheriting a super bowl contender when he arrived in Cleveland.
The culture change is a necessary component to turning the Browns around and I think 2010 will be the telling tale on what Mangini is all about as a coach. I think Mangini and the Head Office's focus on changing the kind of team the Browns are in addition to the players on our team stepping up to perform could add up to the Browns being a surprisingly competitive team in 2010.
I think that's what we're all hoping for in the end.
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My thoughts on Mangini going into and from last season were as follows.
1) I did not like the hiring of Mangin before Kokinis. Bad move on the part of Lerner, which I believe he acknowleged implictly or explicitly with the hiring of Holmgren.
2) I did not like the draft, espicially doubling up on WR's.
3) I did not like the QB saga
4) I hated the signing of all the Jets retreads.
5) I did not mind the dumping of Winslow and later Edwards.
6) I liked the hiring of Ryan but not Dabol.
7) A new coach cannot demand voluntary team building activities when they are for the sole purpose of benefiting your image. Tossing rookies players on a bus, and then flying to the voluntary camp was an act without thought.
8) The loss of Don Carey was pure stupidity.
9) I thought for sure he was gone, but I was impressed with the final victories that were manufacturered without a passing game. Somehow they put it together to win some games. but until the Charger game, they were clearly outplayed.
I think any criticism of Mangini trying to be too much is valid. He was chef, cook and bottlewasher. Now can he coach, probably yes, but was he in over his head, absolutely.
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!
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Very good summery ! 
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Quote:
I did not like the hiring of Mangin before Kokinis. Bad move on the part of Lerner, which I believe he acknowleged implictly or explicitly with the hiring of Holmgren.
And yet .. here we are with the Head Coach now pre-dating both the President and GM .... lol
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I did not like the draft, espicially doubling up on WR's.
Yet both picks may start this year ... and maybe even be a solid twosome. Mack has been a spectacular pick. Bear in mind that we went into last year's draft with 4 picks ..... and last year's draft looks pretty damn good.
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I did not like the QB saga
And now there is no drama because we used last year to determine that neither guy is the answer .... so now we have moved on. There was really no way to get past that point without playing it out.
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I hated the signing of all the Jets retreads.
Happens every time a new coach shows up in a new town. They bring in guys who know their system to help teach the system to the rest of the players. You're never gonna get the top guys from a coach's former team .... so you hope they bring in a few guys who can help teach and develop the younger guys, while helping create the environment the Head Coach wants. That definitely happened here last year by the end of the year, so I don't mind the "retreads".
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I liked the hiring of Ryan but not Dabol.
Ryan inherited far more talent than Daboll did. It isn't even close. Daboll got 2 bum QBs, a bum TE, rookie WRs with a boom or bust in Edwards ...... a washed up RB in Lewis ... and a decent left side of the OL. Not much to do with a mess like that except try and figure out what they might be able to do and try to develop some identity. I think that they did that in developing a power running mentality by the end of the year.
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The loss of Don Carey was pure stupidity.
Mangini did what other coaches have long done with a legitimately injured, low draft pick, and put him on waivers to put him on IR. Jacksonville did what teams do not normally do to each other in that situation and claimed him. Hell, Carey hasn't done a thing for Jacksonville yet ... because he's on their IR now. He may never do anything for them. He might not have done anything for us. Our top 4 CB this year will probably wind up being Wright, Brown, Haden and McDonald. I believe that Adams could wind up in the mix on certain defenses as well. So what we wind up with is havign lost a guy who would probably have bene battling it out for somewhere between 4th and 6th on the CB depth chart, who was also returning from an injury serious enough to have cost him his rookie season. I'm not gonna sweat that one all that much.
If that's the "stupidest" thing he ever does .... we'll be in pretty good shape.
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I think any criticism of Mangini trying to be too much is valid.
I agree. I don't know whether it was Mangini taking power from Kokinis, or Kokinis being unable to stand up for himself that led to his downfall ...... but whatever the case, it is obvious that Mangini wound up with more on his plate than he should have had. I can safely state that this will not happen again as long as Holmgren and Heckert are in Berea.
I think that Mangini is an extremely talented coach ... and he did a great job of teaching the teachers last year and developing young players. That is a huge part of the Head Coach rsponsibility ... to work through others and allow them to do their jobs. I think that happened last year. We can argue about the offensive side of the ball .... but this happened there as well, as we developed a running identity. If we're going to slam the OC for the 1st part of the year we have to acknowledge that he did a good job of putting the team in position to win the final 4 games of the season.
Just my ever so humble $0.02 worth.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I can't tell if you are trying to refute my opinions or trying to change my mind about my observations.
Either way it can't be done young Jedi, I am too old for those silly mind tricks.
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!
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Mangini to me is just like every other coach that has walked the sidelines of the NFL.....Win your the greatest....lose your the stupiedest coach ever.
Coaches are hired to be fired....andf every fan knows the right moves and we know it all from who to draft to who to start to who should sell hot dogs at halftime.
Yes everybody has diffrent coaching styles some fit situations better than others, but as for Mangini we need disiplinary.
As for getting over a nickname, common isnt that a grade school thing.
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The only thing Gini can do for me is just coach..I don't need to hear much he has to say..I don't know how much he can improve so I'm not viewing this as he can learn new tricks..
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the jury is out as far as I am concerned on Mangini.
Positives: the four game turn around. Rob Ryan. Discipline, running attack.
negatives: stupid lop sided trades. getting Jet refuse. Poor draft and hiring a yes man GM(Kokinis) and then throw him under the bus. Sticking with the horrid DA.
Instrumental in the one sided dump of Brady Quinn.
New Positive: hiring Holmgren with positive personnel moves and a solid draft. Mangini can't make stupid trades. Holmgren and staff advising the "challenged OC".
A buffer with press and players. dumping Dawn Aponte.
Negatives: maybe knee jerk signing of Jake..this is a really important move and is pivotal to Mangini keeping his job. If Quinn excels in Denver and Jake flops another losing season gets Mangini out the door...so we will see. He has an incomplete so far. At least he cannot make any more stupid one sided trades.
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Quote:
the jury is out as far as I am concerned on Mangini.
Positives: the four game turn around. Rob Ryan. Discipline, running attack.
negatives: stupid lop sided trades. getting Jet refuse. Poor draft and hiring a yes man GM(Kokinis) and then throw him under the bus. Sticking with the horrid DA.
Instrumental in the one sided dump of Brady Quinn.
New Positive: hiring Holmgren with positive personnel moves and a solid draft. Mangini can't make stupid trades. Holmgren and staff advising the "challenged OC".
A buffer with press and players. dumping Dawn Aponte.
Negatives: maybe knee jerk signing of Jake..this is a really important move and is pivotal to Mangini keeping his job. If Quinn excels in Denver and Jake flops another losing season gets Mangini out the door...so we will see. He has an incomplete so far. At least he cannot make any more stupid one sided trades.
Holmgren signed Jake, not Mangini. How can they hold that against him.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Negatives: maybe knee jerk signing of Jake..this is a really important move and is pivotal to Mangini keeping his job. If Quinn excels in Denver and Jake flops another losing season gets Mangini out the door...so we will see.
Care to enlighten us as to what this has to do with Mangini when it was Heckert's move?
Your panties are very, very clearly in a bunch over us (finally!) dumping Quinn, but why do you hold it against Mangini for a move that was Heckert & Holmgren?
Or are you just reaching for rationalizations?
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Instrumental in the one sided dump of Brady Quinn.
I would think that you'd be happy that we're on the better side of a one-sided trade for once. 
I mean, I don't mean to hype it up - but we actually got something for Quinn from another NFL team. That's almost highway robbery.
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New Positive: hiring Holmgren with positive personnel moves and a solid draft.
Yup, this was a great move by Mangini
Rob Ryan is a great reason to like Mangini as well.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I do love how Holmgren and Heckert are in charge of all personnel decisions ...... Except one. For some unknown reason, they abdicated their responsibility on that one ..... and simply deferred ro Mangini.  I don't think that joe has got the structure figured out. The FO goes for consensus between the scouting/personnel departments and the coaching staff. They did so in this case too. They all thought that Quinn sucked, so they dumped him. They got a little bit back .... but nowhere near what we paid for that absolute joke of a QB wannabee bust.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Say anything you want, but we all know the reason you don't like Mangini is: Quote:
Instrumental in the one sided dump of Brady Quinn.
Holmgren was also instrumental,, same with Heckert,, wouldn't doubt that Daboll had something to do with it as well..
So let's throw them all out..
You are still stuck on the whole Brady Quinn thing..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Eh, YTown, Brady wasn't exactly breaking our Bank. Nowhere near what players like DA was tying down for our cap space. I think we got more than what we were due for Quinn IMO, and I'm really pulling for Hillis to show he was the steal of that trade.
As for Mangini. I want to root for him but I still don't like the guy. At least, he's managed to show a little more geniality in front of the media and that is a borderline miracle. He's got our team pointed in a direction, let's hope that direction equals a few extra wins in the W-column.
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I don't care if Mangini is friendly, cordial and open at his press conferences.
What I do care about is having a team that is disciplined.
That plays as a team.
That can run the ball.
That can physically impose itself on their opponent offensively and defensively.
That makes few mental mistakes.
If we get that, the rest will follow. I do believe that Mangini has brought these values to the team.
As far as Qunn is concerned ....... I do not believe that he has either the physical or mental makeup to be a successful NFL QB. He has huge biceps, and still has no arm. It's amazing. He's a scientific marvel in that regard.
He was a busted pick, if for no other reason than the fact that we gave up a 1st and 2nd to draft him ... and he never took the job. 3 years later, he was traded for a pair of low picks and a player. That's pure bust on the bustometer.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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As far as Qunn is concerned ....... I do not believe that he has either the physical or mental makeup to be a successful NFL QB. He has huge biceps, and still has no arm. It's amazing. He's a scientific marvel in that regard.
I just realized Hillis is known for freakishly large biceps. What a weird trade: trading biceps for biceps. Hillis is clearly better because he can also jump over defenders
I wonder who can throw further...
Last edited by Kingcob; 06/05/10 01:22 AM.
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Legend
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Legend
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He's got our team pointed in a direction, let's hope that direction equals a few extra wins in the W-column.
I for one wouldn't want to see those wins in the L column 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Good point, that, Damanshot. Those pesky little W's that run off and turn up elsewhere/ Heck, we have been up to our UnderArmours in wins anyhow. Hard to track 'em all, like lemmings. I am for a tag and release program so we can be scientific as we go forward. Problem started early last season. Seems Brayin' Edwards was assigned to catch all of 'em, and well, it went downhill, he left, and we got wins all over the place sitting around, breeding, looking to nest. Hope we find a few and put 'em in the W column where they belong. GreenPeace lists the Buck-toothed Ginning Win as an endangered species in Berea and the Greater Cleveland Metro Area.  
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
Quote:
As far as Qunn is concerned ....... I do not believe that he has either the physical or mental makeup to be a successful NFL QB. He has huge biceps, and still has no arm. It's amazing. He's a scientific marvel in that regard.
I just realized Hillis is known for freakishly large biceps. What a weird trade: trading biceps for biceps. Hillis is clearly better because he can also jump over defenders
I wonder who can throw further...
Arm strength for throwing comes more in the triceps, forearm and the Lats, obliques... not the bicep.
The bicep will only help you do a nice QB Pose as you raise the ball to your ear.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Legend
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That might be too many coaches... you know what they say: too many cooks spoil the broth.
gmstrong -----------------
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I like the setup we have with Mangini, Daboll's being mentored by Haskell and Ryan seems to really be enjoying himself with the Browns D. I think this year our team will be a lot more cohesive and hopefully a lot more productive. It'll be something to keep an eye on for sure, mainly our offense. I think out of anyone I would think if our Offense continues to fail to thrive, Daboll will probably get the boot but maybe that's just wishful thinking.
Damanshot, I must've had my head in the mud with the W-collumn comment haha.
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I never understand a damn point your trying to express.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Legend
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Legend
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I never understand a damn point your trying to express.
That's because there isn't one.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,887
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
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I never understand a damn point your trying to express.
A point Bard need not make
Love him, real or fake
Trust he means well
For it's his words that ring a Bell...
In other words, don't' try to figure it out,,just enjoy
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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2nd String
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2nd String
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Innuendo, irony and sarcasm are hard to figure out on a message board. Read it again. Fetch, Rover.  
Last edited by RoosteR; 06/05/10 08:49 PM.
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Legend
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Damanshot, I must've had my head in the mud with the W-collumn comment haha.
I know,, was just having some fun at your expense.. meant no harm to you at all..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Eric Mangini: Can you teach an old
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