DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum I could see why Pete Carroll left Usc. Ncaa comes down hard on Trojans

The USC football program will receive two-year postseason ban, a reduction in scholarships and a forfeiture of wins from at least the 2004 season among the NCAA sanctions, a source told ESPN's Shelley Smith.

ESPN the Magazine's Bruce Feldman confirms the two-year postseason ban and a reduction in scholarships from a second USC source.

USC will respond Thursday to the NCAA's findings following its investigation into possible violations by the Trojans' football and men's basketball programs, a source with direct knowledge of the situation told ESPN's Joe Schad.


There is no press conference scheduled for Thursday. According to an SID at USC, the school would issue a statement in response to any NCAA announcement addressing penalties. A different source had said earlier in the day that the school would have a press conference following the NCAA announcement.


The NCAA infractions committee held a hearing in February in which USC presented its responses to allegations of NCAA violations. Results of the report have been expected for several weeks.


USC football players will be informed about the sanctions at a mandatory meeting Thursday morning, a source told Feldman.


Once released, USC would have a chance to appeal.


USC already admitted wrongdoing with the basketball program and sanctioned itself, including a ban on postseason participation, a reduction of scholarships and vacating all of its wins from 2007-08.


The school's football team is under investigation for its dealing with Heisman Trophy-winning running back Reggie Bush, who played at the school from 2003-2005. Bush also won the 2005 Heisman; if he is found retroactively ineligible, the Heisman Trust could strip him of his 2005 Heisman Trophy.


The NCAA and investigators from the Pac-10 Conference have tried to determine whether Bush and his parents took improper benefits, including an alleged rent-free residence provided by a sports marketer. Bush has not met with NCAA and Pac-10 investigators and has repeatedly denied any wrongdoing.


USC chose to contest the allegation against the football program, hoping to overcome the perception of a lack of institutional control, which could result in significant sanctions, including scholarship reductions, TV and postseason bans, recruiting restrictions and probation.


If USC is found guilty of major violations, the NCAA also could rule that the Trojans are "repeat violators." Per NCAA rules, "An institution shall be considered a 'repeat' violator if the Committee on Infractions finds that a major violation has occurred within five years of the starting date of a major penalty."


The athletic program was last sanctioned in August of 2001.


Information from The Associated Press was used in this report.

http://sports.espn.go.com/los-angeles/ncf/news/story?id=5267933

Carroll is a scumbag in the truest of forms. I use to admire the guy as a great coach, but he was nothing but a fraud at sc.

Ouch. That hurts...

so, ummm....what did they tell Henderson to get him to sign?

remember he was waiting to see how hard they were going to come down and they promised him it would be light, so he signed.

i'm guessing he isn't too happy with the team he is going to right now.

Yea, I bet he is regretting going there. as well as Lane Kiffin. That is 2 years of football down the toilet. No highly touted recruit will want to go there now. You add the scholarship reduction, this program will be set back quite a few years.

I hate decisions like this.....

The ones who are most affected now, are the kids who (1) have no power in the matter, and (2) weren't even around when the transgressions happened.

Meanwhile, the guys in charge like Carroll - have already walked away and don't have to deal with the punishment at all. And the university likely made around a hundred million dollars on the football teams success over the last 10 years - and they will never lose that back by losing some bowl games for the next two years. The TV contracts and season ticket holders are already locked in anyway.

I don't like the NCAA ban on athletes earning money (it creates these sort of economic scenarios - where families/athletes have almost no money, but are worth a lot to rich businessmen). But - if there is a rule, it should at least be enforced in a way that hurts those responsible.

IMO, here's what should be done:

1.) USC should forfeit all profits from it's football operations for the next two seasons. (They can be allowed to break even, so they aren't hurting the academic institution) - this would cost the boosters, and the university millions of dollars. If you want things like this to not happen - you have to make sure it's economically disadvantageous for the university to look the other way at these incidents.

2.) Those responsible (coaches and administrators) should be sued to return much of their salaries during the years they were violating the law. (I understand this can't be done now, because such language would have to be written into the contracts -- this is just what "should" happen).

3.) The team should have to forfeit it's old games - and players who were involved should give up any personal achievements (e.g. Bush should give up his heisman)

4.) Give any current athlete (not convicted of wrongdoing) the opportunity to immediately leave USC for any other program without losing a year of elgibility.

That's how you hurt the people who are actually responsible - instead of just the 18yo kids who had nothing to do with it.

This enforcement mechanism (like the rest of the NCAA) allows everybody who does wrong to go free - while only hurting those who are now locked into a program where they can't succeed.

Quote:

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USC should forfeit all profits from it's football operations for the next two seasons. (They can be allowed to break even, so they aren't hurting the academic institution

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Actually, this would hurt the institution, because football profits pay for almost all of the other sports programs at a typical university. (Maybe not Basketball at some ....)

This too is what bugs me...

If the NCAA wants teams and coaches to stop doing this then they need to hold the people responsible for the transgressions accountable. guys like John Cal, Tim Floyd, Pete Carroll, Kelvin Sampson, Dave Bliss (who did get banned for 10 years), and so many other coaches that have been caught or have had players doing illegal things (and i believe that theres no way a player can be doing something illegal and having a coach clueless...i think thats crap)...need to not only be put on probation but they need to face lenghty suspensions...otherwise these things wont stop.

If a coach can just bail out and get a new job before the NCAA sanctions land then they will continue to do illegal things and bail to newer better higher paying jobs. Its unreal that John Cal can have 2 final fours vacated (even though he was cleared) and somehow get a better job each time. that Tim Floyd can get caught and get a new job only a year later. Or that Kelvin Sampson can get caught making over 1000 illegal calls and then get a job at Indiana.

What they need to do when a team/coach gets caught doing something illegal in recruiting is a 3 step process...at the very minimum. MIND YOU, THESE NEED TO BE DONE QUICKLY (ie within a year...by the next school season)


1. and this is the most important one...lengthy suspensions and probations for said coaches. at least 1 year for secondary violations, and 5+ for major violations...and the penalties need to be levied like Roger Goodell would be doing it.

2. wins and ALL awards need to be STRIPPED...not vacated...that sounds harmless. every win, and every award from that season needs to be stripped from the coaches and teams.

3. school should be punished...reductions of scholarships and post-season bans...Those things are necessary. because there are people that much like Jim Calhoun...fail to create an environment of compliance.

4. Punishments of schools willing to hire said coaches. If you hire a coach who has past transgressions you are immediately put on probation. OR...and this is somewhat difficult to go about...lets make a hypothetical situation...a coach left behind a 2 year post-season ban, a reduction of 2 scholarships for his school and a 5 year probation...but left the job before any of those transgressions were uncovered...and is at a new job...those penalties will be enforced on his new school...

that meaning...lets say Pete Carroll now gets fired from the Seahawks and takes a job at say Florida State in 3 years...the second he sets foot on campus Florida State receives the same 2 year post-season ban and reduction of scholarships...



The only way that we can create an NCAA where coaches, players and others are NOT committing illegal recruiting violations...they have to take a proactive stance on recruiting.

until they make the punishment so heavy that it would cripple the school, coach, and future jobs for the offenders...they will continue to have these things happen.

i think itd be better...if a coach had to appeal and win, to bring back his ability to coach than not punish a coach cuz he wins...

I see we already started talking about Seantrell Henderson. - Is it too late for him to transfer? - Ohio State was his second option.

Yeah, but Calipari gets blasted for something that happened before a kid even got on campus.

Why should I let details get in the way of my senseless bashing if you don't?

I heard on espn, that if they enrolled early to get a head start on spring ball, they will have to get a release from usc, which is highly unlikely. If they didn't then they could go elsewhere and not sit out a year.

What I'm thinking is how much weight does a signing/intent letter have versus the actual act of official matriculation, as it would pertain to a "regular" freshman ? Just because you've been admitted doesn't mean you've picked up a schedule and started attending classes.

You mentioned spring and you're right,....that's a different ball game having enrolled early,....so is this kid at USC already ?