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Not wanting to high jack other threads...I will start a separate thread about the top subject being discussed today.
What do you think...should Obama fire Gen. McChrystal for his comments that appeared in a Rolling Stone article?
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The General is a complete moron for puting these comments out there for a Rolling Stone reporter no less . What did he think was going to happen ??? Sets the wrong tone IMO and it wouldn't upset me when he gets sit down .
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I was never in the military, but I do read a lot about it and know a number of guys who are/were in the military. And, it seems to me, you can question your superiors all you want in the privacy of your own home and with your peers, but you never do it publicly and you never do it when your subordinates could hear.
So goes the problem with civilian leadership. I know I'd feel completely intimidated sitting in a room with these guys as they're giving me advice, and I'm not an easily intimidated guy.
I certainly don't advocate a military-type government. I guess I'm just saying that this likely isn't a new thing. Hell, think about MacArthur and Truman. And, most likely, just about every other President who wasn't someone like Washington, Grant or Eisenhower (just to name a few of the big-time former military) likely was looked down on by the military.
In the end, I don't know what I'd do if I was President Obama. If McChrystal has lost the trust and support of the military, then I think you need to get rid of him. But, if I'm the President, and he's pissed me off, but he's still got great ideas, he's a good leader, and he still has support, then I tell him you have the job, but sin no more.
You'd hate to punish a guy just because he made a bonehead mistake if the punishment is going to hurt the cause overall.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Any ranking general, whose favorite beer is Bud Light Lime, should be fired.
yebat' Putin
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I'd rather keep McC and impeach the King.
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Quote:
Any ranking general, whose favorite beer is Bud Light Lime, should be fired.
Yes and he voted for O. What kind of military man would vote for a Dem comunity organizer and then get pissed when the guy shows no interest in the what the military is trying to do?
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Quote:
Not wanting to high jack other threads...I will start a separate thread about the top subject being discussed today.
What do you think...should Obama fire Gen. McChrystal for his comments that appeared in a Rolling Stone article?
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My opinion is yes, he should be.. it's just like when a football player voices his dislike for a coach or team management.. it's not that he should be muzzled, it's that he should keep that stuff in house and out of the press.
In this case, his and his staffs statements are, to me anyway, demonstrating that there is a divide between he and the president. while that may be the case (and it appears that it is) telling the world about it means that our enemy knows... and anytime you can keep info from the enemy,, that's gotta be a good thing..
I think he was wrong to do it in the press. if he felt that way, he should have flown to Washington and sat down with Obama face to face and handled it like a man....
Doing it in the press is, IMO, cowardly. That can't be a good trait for a General..
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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I want what is best for the Men & Women stuck in that ... whole .. Unfortunately , that would be to bring them home tomorrow.. Keep your dam lithium !
Anyone who has served knows all to well politics have non place in the Military at any rank .. It is a Tabu subject in public..
The other side of the coin is being stuck with a commander in Chief who is Clueless when it comes to Economics / History / Foreign Policy , and the list goes on ...
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Quote:
I want what is best for the Men & Women stuck in that ... whole .. Unfortunately , that would be to bring them home tomorrow.. Keep your dam lithium !
Anyone who has served knows all to well politics have non place in the Military at any rank .. It is a Tabu subject in public..
The other side of the coin is being stuck with a commander in Chief who is Clueless when it comes to Economics / History / Foreign Policy , and the list goes on ...
I don't think this has anyting to do with who the President is,, this has everything to do with using your head.. the General didn't. I wouldn't like it if a General would have knocked Bush or Clinton or Bush or Reagan.. to me it has absolutly nothing to do with who resides in the Oval Office, but respect for the position. The General needed to use his head and he did not.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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He should be fired.
A general is supposed to treat his superiors with respect.
Once you can no longer show them respect, he should be fired.
If a soldier was told to do something by his superior, and the soldier got snappy and said the things that McChrystal said, they would be dishonorably discharged from the army.
So, yes, he should be fired.
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Based purely on the Uniform Code of Military Justice...absolutely he should be fired.
Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.
Cut and dried. But, opinions swayed by personal politics swing the argument in both directions.
My initial reaction to this controversy is this; aren't these men, both military and civilian, responsible for the lives and safety of our troops? How in the world does BS like this competently and professionally conduct a war? Whether it's government or business, it seems as though incompetence is the current American way.
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Quote:
j/c
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100623/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama_mcchrystal
AP is reporting that McChrystal will be replaced by Petraeus.
tjs...with the most important element of this war being our soldiers on the ground, serving in harms way in Afghanistan...the selection of Gen. Petraeus is absolutely the best man for the job...
...and our troops deserve the best.
The troops will have no doubt that they have the most qualified individual leading them, rather than possibly questioning a if "second best" or next in line would have been selected to lead our men and women.
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Quote:
Quote:
j/c
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100623/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama_mcchrystal
AP is reporting that McChrystal will be replaced by Petraeus.
tjs...with the most important element of this war being our soldiers on the ground, serving in harms way in Afghanistan...the selection of Gen. Petraeus is absolutely the best man for the job...
...and our troops deserve the best.
The troops will have no doubt that they have the most qualified individual leading them, rather than possibly questioning a if "second best" or next in line would have been selected to lead our men and women.
So that means the ROE will change?
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Quote:
j/c
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100623/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama_mcchrystal
AP is reporting that McChrystal will be replaced by Petraeus.
He has to be replaced. He'll probably quietly slip into retirement so that his comments can just vanish into the ether ......
Just like my tax dollars .......
And the future of our country ......
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I'm sure Fox News has already offered him a job.
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I'm apparently out of the loop on this one... what were the comments that he made?
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http://www.aolnews.com/nation/article/ge...-story/19525656I'm not going to post the whole thing ..... but the subordinate felt the need to use the F Bomb in part of his comments ..... and obviously the general felt like the President didn;t have a clue what was going on. (Which is probably right)
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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.. " The other side of the coin is being stuck with a commander in Chief who is Clueless when it comes to Economics / History / Foreign Policy , and the list goes on " Excuse me ; But the above is an editorial comment which in deed comes into play .. I just might add it to every post I make !  Look the General stepped way over the line no doubt about it ! .. The Commander in Chief is well within his or her rights to can the General .. Period .. I can't help myself from making comments about the last Two Heads of State .. Having to defend their decisions in the field of operations has to be dam near imponderable. ..
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Quote:
I'm apparently out of the loop on this one... what were the comments that he made?
Ask and ye shall receive...
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/06/22/excerpts-from-rolling-stone-article-on-gen-mcchrystal/
Excerpts from a Rolling Stone magazine profile on Gen. Stanley McChrystal, the top U.S. commander in Afghanistan, set to appear Friday:
– "Even though he had voted for (President Barack) Obama, McChrystal and his new commander-in-chief failed from the outset to connect. The general first encountered Obama a week after he took office, when the president met with a dozen senior military officials in a room at the Pentagon known as the Tank. According to sources familiar with the meeting, McChrystal thought Obama looked "uncomfortable and intimidated" by the roomful of military brass. Their first one-on-one meeting took place in the Oval Office four months later, after McChrystal got the Afghanistan job, and it didn't go much better. 'It was a 10-minute photo-op,' says an adviser to McChrystal. 'Obama clearly didn't know anything about him, who he was. Here's the guy who's going to run his f-ing war, but he didn't seem very engaged. The Boss was pretty disappointed.'"
Read full Rolling Stone article: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/17390/119236
– "Last fall, during a question-and-answer session following a speech he gave in London, McChrystal dismissed the counterterrorism strategy being advocated by Vice President Joe Biden as 'shortsighted,' saying it would lead to a state of 'Chaos-istan,' The remarks earned him a smackdown from the president himself, who summoned the general to a terse private meeting aboard Air Force One. The message to McChrystal seemed clear: Shut the f- up, and keep a lower profile. Now, flipping through printout cards of his speech in Paris, McChrystal wonders aloud what Biden question he might get today, and how he should respond. 'I never know what's going to pop out until I'm up there, that's the problem,' he says.
Then, unable to help themselves, he and his staff imagine the general dismissing the vice president with a good one-liner. 'Are you asking about Vice President Biden?' McChrystal says with a laugh. 'Who's that?' 'Biden?' suggests a top adviser. 'Did you say "Bite Me?"'
– "In private, Team McChrystal likes to talk s- about many of Obama's top people on the diplomatic side. One aide calls Jim Jones, a retired four-star general and veteran of the Cold War, a 'clown' who remains 'stuck in 1985.' Politicians like (John) McCain and (John) Kerry, says another aide, 'turn up, have a meeting with (Afghan president Hamid) Karzai, criticize him at the airport press conference, then get back for the Sunday talk shows. Frankly, it's not very helpful.' Only (Secretary of State) Hillary Clinton receives good reviews from McChrystal's inner circle. 'Hillary had Stan's back during the strategic review,' says an adviser. 'She said, "If Stan wants it, give him what he needs.'"
– "McChrystal reserves special skepticism for (Richard) Holbrooke, the official in charge of reintegrating the Taliban. 'The Boss says he's like a wounded animal,' says a member of the general's team. 'Holbrooke keeps hearing rumors that he's going to get fired, so that makes him dangerous. He's a brilliant guy, but he just comes in, pulls on a lever, whatever he can grasp onto. But this is COIN (counterinsurgency), and you can't just have someone yanking on s-.'"
– "By far the most crucial - and strained - relationship is between McChrystal and (Karl) Eikenberry, the U.S. ambassador. According to those close to the two men, Eikenberry - a retired three-star general who served in Afghanistan in 2002 and 2005 - can't stand that his former subordinate is now calling the shots. He's also furious that McChrystal, backed by NATO's allies, refused to put Eikenberry in the pivotal role of viceroy in Afghanistan, which would have made him the diplomatic equivalent of the general.
"... The relationship was further strained in January, when a classified cable that Eikenberry wrote was leaked to The New York Times. The cable was as scathing as it was prescient. The ambassador offered a brutal critique of McChrystal's strategy, dismissed President Hamid Karzai as 'not an adequate strategic partner,' and cast doubt on whether the counterinsurgency plan would be 'sufficient' to deal with al Qaeda. ... McChrystal and his team were blindsided by the cable. 'I like Karl, I've known him for years, but they'd never said anything like that to us before,' says McChrystal, who adds that he felt 'betrayed' by the leak. 'Here's one that covers his flank for the history books. Now if we fail, they can say, 'I told you so.'"
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Just got done reading the article.
I have to laugh... that's the sort of talk you get when your aides are SpecOps types and not career political soldiers chasing stars for their shoulders.
I can't say that he *should* get fired, but I will say that it is almost a certainty that he will.
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Quote:
.. " The other side of the coin is being stuck with a commander in Chief who is Clueless when it comes to Economics / History / Foreign Policy , and the list goes on "
Excuse me ; But the above is an editorial comment which in deed comes into play .. I just might add it to every post I make !
Look the General stepped way over the line no doubt about it ! .. The Commander in Chief is well within his or her rights to can the General .. Period .. I can't help myself from making comments about the last Two Heads of State .. Having to defend their decisions in the field of operations has to be dam near imponderable. ..
I hear what you are saying,, but Politics should have nothing to do with this.. The General stepped over the line as you say... I don't care who is sitting in the oval office,,, The General damn well better respect the office at the very least..... General McChrystal and some of his aids did exactly the opposite...
What I'd hate to see happen however is for McChrystal, who apparently has a spotless record otherwise, get court marshaled and kicked out in disgrace....
I don't want that to happen..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I guess somebody couldn't handle the truth. 
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Quote:
Quote:
.. " The other side of the coin is being stuck with a commander in Chief who is Clueless when it comes to Economics / History / Foreign Policy , and the list goes on "
Excuse me ; But the above is an editorial comment which in deed comes into play .. I just might add it to every post I make !
Look the General stepped way over the line no doubt about it ! .. The Commander in Chief is well within his or her rights to can the General .. Period .. I can't help myself from making comments about the last Two Heads of State .. Having to defend their decisions in the field of operations has to be dam near imponderable. ..
I hear what you are saying,, but Politics should have nothing to do with this.. The General stepped over the line as you say... I don't care who is sitting in the oval office,,, The General damn well better respect the office at the very least..... General McChrystal and some of his aids did exactly the opposite...
What I'd hate to see happen however is for McChrystal, who apparently has a spotless record otherwise, get court marshaled and kicked out in disgrace....
I don't want that to happen..
Am I missing something? He "resigned"........yes, we all know he was offered that option from O - "resign or get fired",,,,,,,he resigned. How can he get court marshaled?
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j/c http://www.cnn.com/2010/OPINION/06/23/zakaria.mcchrystal.petraeus/index.html?hpt=T1This is a link to an interview with Fareed Zakaria. It is largely opinion, but on the surface, a lot of it makes sense. One point he makes is that the reason Iraq has been so successful as of late is b/c of the high level of coordination b/w the Iraqi govt. the US State Dept, the military, and the populace, and that Petraeus is always highly respectful of everyone and fosters this coordination. He posits that McChrystal is likely failing at this coordination b/c of the obvious contempt he seems to have for many on the US side. He may be a brilliant tactician, but if he is failing at the nation-building aspect, then it was time he was replaced. Just thought it was an interesting read.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
.. " The other side of the coin is being stuck with a commander in Chief who is Clueless when it comes to Economics / History / Foreign Policy , and the list goes on "
Excuse me ; But the above is an editorial comment which in deed comes into play .. I just might add it to every post I make !
Look the General stepped way over the line no doubt about it ! .. The Commander in Chief is well within his or her rights to can the General .. Period .. I can't help myself from making comments about the last Two Heads of State .. Having to defend their decisions in the field of operations has to be dam near imponderable. ..
I hear what you are saying,, but Politics should have nothing to do with this.. The General stepped over the line as you say... I don't care who is sitting in the oval office,,, The General damn well better respect the office at the very least..... General McChrystal and some of his aids did exactly the opposite...
What I'd hate to see happen however is for McChrystal, who apparently has a spotless record otherwise, get court marshaled and kicked out in disgrace....
I don't want that to happen..
Am I missing something? He "resigned"........yes, we all know he was offered that option from O - "resign or get fired",,,,,,,he resigned. How can he get court marshaled?
I was taking the word of ADHDawg in a post further up in this thread when he said the following:
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Based purely on the Uniform Code of Military Justice...absolutely he should be fired.
Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.
Cut and dried. But, opinions swayed by personal politics swing the argument in both directions.
My initial reaction to this controversy is this; aren't these men, both military and civilian, responsible for the lives and safety of our troops? How in the world does BS like this competently and professionally conduct a war? Whether it's government or business, it seems as though incompetence is the current American way.
I've not at all determined if ADH is correct, but it seemed about right about the uniform code of military justice..
I'm saying that i don't want to see him court marshaled.. I don't want to see his career end in that fashion...
As for if he resigned or offered to resign, I honestly don't know and I never said anything about it..
Do we know the outcome of the meeting with the President this morning?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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j/c
I think McC knew exactly what he was doing...and completely knew the consequences...and determined that the best thing for his country and the soldiers laying their lives on the line, was to let the world know about our Cic.
He is too smart, too tactical, and too experienced to have "let his tongue slip".
He knew what needed to be done...he "fell on his sword"...people aren't generally paying enough attention to understand the magnitude of a guy like this/him dissing the Cic in this manner.
We have a problem and at least one, now-retired, General with the stones to let it be known.
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Yes absolutely, he should be shipped off to gaurd the Arctic circle. You never, ever, ever, openly question the commander in chiefs abilities for a print article. Or at least not as bluntly as he did.
That had to be a calculated move on his part, he didnt get as far as he did by pissing off his superiors.
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss...
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#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Your right Willie He did...though most on here will drink the kool-aid however willie you hit the nail on the head! 
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Quote:
j/c
I think McC knew exactly what he was doing...and completely knew the consequences...and determined that the best thing for his country and the soldiers laying their lives on the line, was to let the world know about our Cic.
He is too smart, too tactical, and too experienced to have "let his tongue slip".
He knew what needed to be done...he "fell on his sword"...people aren't generally paying enough attention to understand the magnitude of a guy like this/him dissing the Cic in this manner.
We have a problem and at least one, now-retired, General with the stones to let it be known.
I agree.
He didn't like the direction, so he fell on the sword to make is final statement.
The guy knows how to calculate his comments.
He didn't want a commie telling him how to conduct his job.
Good for him.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Quote:
j/c
I think McC knew exactly what he was doing...and completely knew the consequences...and determined that the best thing for his country and the soldiers laying their lives on the line, was to let the world know about our Cic.
He is too smart, too tactical, and too experienced to have "let his tongue slip".
He knew what needed to be done...he "fell on his sword"...people aren't generally paying enough attention to understand the magnitude of a guy like this/him dissing the Cic in this manner.
We have a problem and at least one, now-retired, General with the stones to let it be known.
Great generals have done this same thing and suffered the same fate.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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Quote:
Quote:
j/c
I think McC knew exactly what he was doing...and completely knew the consequences...and determined that the best thing for his country and the soldiers laying their lives on the line, was to let the world know about our Cic.
He is too smart, too tactical, and too experienced to have "let his tongue slip".
He knew what needed to be done...he "fell on his sword"...people aren't generally paying enough attention to understand the magnitude of a guy like this/him dissing the Cic in this manner.
We have a problem and at least one, now-retired, General with the stones to let it be known.
I agree.
He didn't like the direction, so he fell on the sword to make is final statement.
The guy knows how to calculate his comments.
He didn't want a commie telling him how to conduct his job.
Good for him.
Dammit 'Peen, you beat me to it,....
All you gotta do is take a poll,....who would you follow tomorrow ?
McChrystal
or
Obama
Enough said.
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Quote:
j/c
I think McC knew exactly what he was doing...and completely knew the consequences...and determined that the best thing for his country and the soldiers laying their lives on the line, was to let the world know about our Cic.
He is too smart, too tactical, and too experienced to have "let his tongue slip".
He knew what needed to be done...he "fell on his sword"...people aren't generally paying enough attention to understand the magnitude of a guy like this/him dissing the Cic in this manner.
We have a problem and at least one, now-retired, General with the stones to let it be known.
Agreed. I think he knew exactly what he was doing. You don't get to be a General by being clueless politically.
SaintDawg™
Football, baseball, basketball, wine, women, walleye
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Quote:
He didn't like the direction, so he fell on the sword to make is final statement.
The guy knows how to calculate his comments.
He didn't want a commie telling him how to conduct his job.
Good for him.
The only problem with this line of thought, as I see it- is this:
President Obama OK'ed the strategic and tactical course of action outined by General McChrystal himself, whether the prez's staff agreed or not... including the 30,000 troop increase, and current counterinsurgency measures.
That puts the ball squarely in General Stanley's court, as far as I can see... and this is how he chose to return serve- 'airing dirty laundry' in an article by the Rolling Stone, no less.
___________________________
My very best friend in life is a full bird Colonel in the USAF... we go back 4+ decades together as 'brothers from different mothers,' and I was the one to pin on his wings at his most recent promotion ceremony. He began his service during the Clinton Administration (an administration with which he had many issues, truth be told...) , and in all the years we've been personally interacting together, he's never once said a negative thing about his Commander-In-Chief, nor anyone under who's command he falls. When those touchy subjects arise, his response has been unwaveringly consistent: "Now, Bobby- that's a subject for us to explore once I'm retired from service."
I respect his position, and don't push it- because I know that he'll tell me anything I want to know when the time is right, but won't break Military Protocol... even for his "Brother From a Diffferent Mother." I respect him for that, and don't push the issue beyond the bounds of fair give & take between beloved friends.
If Mark won't spill what he feels about a particular CiC during said President's tenure, what empowers Stanley McChrystal to break that code to a freelance reporter working for a 2nd tier media outlet?
NO MAN is above the oath he swore to... whatever the terms of that oath may be.
If my very best friend in Life won't 'break the code' with me, at 1:30 AM, when we've both had waaaay too much to drink, and tongues are loosened... what makes Stanley McChrystal feel compelled to spill his guts... or at the very least to not admonish his subordiantes to follow the military codes that dictate the behavior of all?
Either he's a loose cannon, who has earned (and lost) his position according to the 'Peter Principle,' or he's a calculating manipulator, who's story is just now unfolding. Either way, his actions tell us most of what we need to know- that he's a man who has placed his own need for a public platform above the dictates of his professional post.
Either way, he's bad for the current administration, bad for the current situation, and bad for the collective morale of our troops. Stepping out is the right choice for all involved.
Whether or not you agree with the nation's selection of Barack Obama as Commander-In-Chief of the US Military, you MUST agree to the tenets under which his military executives act. To espouse otherwise is tantamonut to saying that we can simply change the rules of the game whenever we don't like the principal players... and that will only seek to weaken us as a nation.
The Military has a code of ethics and behavior... and that code exists, whether the voting populace agrees with the philosophies of the governing administration or not.
General McChrystal broke his basic military code of conduct... and he did so, knowing what consequences could occur as a result. What his motivations were, one can only guess. One thing's for sure- doing so invited the very events brought upon him now.
He stepped down, as was the proper thing to do, given the circumstances. Petreaus is now in charge, whether he agrees with the Obama Administration or not.
I hope that our new "Afghan/Middle East Czar" of military operations chooses to behave differently than McC, who essentially pulled a K2- when he told the press about his 'staph (read: "staff") infection'...
Such utterings are simply bad for The Team.... whether you like the Head Coach or not... and things have progressed as they should- under ANY administration.
jmh.02,
Clemdawg
"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
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Can someone please refresh my memory as to why W was berated for "only" being in the air force reserves, or what ever it was, and consequently he "wasn't qualified" to be Commander in Chief, yet O, who never did anything, anywhere, gets a pass on that litmus test? (or, at least what USED to be a litmus test for presidents)
Anyone have any insight to that?
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Legend
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Quote:
Can someone please refresh my memory as to why W was berated for "only" being in the air force reserves, or what ever it was, and consequently he "wasn't qualified" to be Commander in Chief, yet O, who never did anything, anywhere, gets a pass on that litmus test? (or, at least what USED to be a litmus test for presidents)
Anyone have any insight to that?
Good luck with that one. Of course, Clinton got a pass too.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Same qualifications as Reagan if I recall.
It is a false test that is addressed by an election.
There will be no playoffs. Can’t play with who we have out there and compounding it with garbage playcalling and worse execution. We don’t have good skill players on offense period. Browns 20 - Bears 17.
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Legend
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It's not a false test. It's not a test at all. There have been many Presidents from both parties who have served, and haven't, and their qualifications to be CIC were, and were not, questioned.
The test is -- why does Obama get the pass and Bush didn't ? And the answer is, because the media is left.
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Should Gen. McChrystal be fired?
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