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NFL fines Fraser for hit on Roethlisberger
Saturday, November 25, 2006

Browns defensive lineman Simon Fraser's hit on quarterback Ben Roethlisberger in the 24-20 loss to the Steelers cost more than a possible score, it also cost Fraser $5,000.

Fraser was fined by the NFL for his second hit on Roethlisberger after cornerback Daven Holly intercepted a pass and was sprinting toward the end zone. Fraser hit Roethlisberger not once, but twice. The flag, 15 yards for a personal foul, was thrown after the second hit.

The penalty, offset by a Steelers face-mask penalty, cost the Browns 40 yards in field position, from the Steelers' 4 to the 44.

The Browns were almost assured of at least a field goal. Instead, they came up empty and went into halftime with a 10-0 lead.

The next day, Browns coach Romeo Crennel complained that the quarterbacks rules are unfair and he defended Fraser's actions.

Fraser said Sunday that officials were trying to protect Roethlisberger. Fraser was not available for comment Friday.


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Only posted the relevant part, article breaks and goes on to talk about this Sundays game.

The beef I have with this is the rules are not meant to protect the QB, they were meant to protect Rothlisburger. Twice, Frye ran out of bounds, then gets hit and no flag was thrown. Ben gets hit for trying to make a play, and it's a penalty and a fine. The NFL is very quickly losing any integrity it had left.

He was fined ?!?!

That is the most [censored] ridiculous thing ever. The league is a joke.

I don't care about Simon's fine frankly. That is the league being a league.

What makes me curious is how did the penalties off-set but the field position not stand? I just didn't get it.

BULL BULL

thats amazing you cant even tough the qb this year

Maybe the NFL can give Nick Eason a raise since he didn't completely knock down Ben <img src="/images/graemlins/rolleyes1.gif" alt="" />

That's a good one Nemy.

If that's what it takes for Frasier to learn not to be so stupid...

NFL Network explains the call and the rule

Frasiers hit on Ben

When you watch the first clip you can see that Frasier first hits Ben when Holley is already almost 6 yards past him...the first hit was a legal hit....Ben gets knocked to the ground...by the time Ben gets back up....Holley is at least 20 if not more yards away....there is no one behind Ben but Kendall Simmons...they are at the very back of the play...and when Frasier hits him again...His hand is on Bens back...Its not like he put his head right between Bens numbers..

While I do think the NFL coddles the QB (which is why Eason pulled up) According to the protect the QB rules there was no reason to hit Ben again...Frasier already took him out of the play..... IMO the call was correct...but I dont think he should have been fined.

HACK

your right he hit him to late

Good point. I was wondering the same thing.

The ruling is that you can't hit the QB after he gives up on the play, yet Ben was heading toward the play until he saw Fraser move toward him again, then he turned sideways to the defender and did a flop as he was hit. Some bad acting on Ben's part, but nothing illegal. RAC made the point that if he gives up on the play, he should stay down. There was no reason for him to get back up if he didn't intend to make a play. Had Holly's fumble been recovered by a Steeler, Ben would have become a blocker the other way. He DID NOT take himself out of the play. The call was bogus; he gave up QB status when he became a defender, he got knocked down, then got back up and suddenly he became a QB again who only "gave up" on the play when he turned sideways as he saw Fraser coming toward him. Total BS, as is the fine.

The play did stand; we got the pick. We don't get the yardage if there was a penalty during the run back. If the penalty would have happened after the whistle blew then we would have got the ball at the spot; but it didn't, it happened during the run back.

They made the right call on spotting the ball and I agree with Hack that the first hit was clean; but he didn't need to hit him again. Hell, I coach my pop warner kids to not hit anyone once the play is passed you. Should he be fined? NO

Well that's a bunch of [censored]....

That 2nd hit wasn't even a hit...it was just a shove....buncha BULLLLLLLL <img src="/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

Sure it wasn't needed...i agree with the penalty...but COME ON...A FINE? give me a break...

I can see why they made a late hit call. If the NFL wants to protect the qb, fine. They need to protect ALL the qb's not just Ben. As I pointed out, Frye was tackled twice after being running out of bounds, one hit being to his knee. Where was the late hit call on that? If refs are going to make calls like that, they need to call it for both sides.

it was definetly a penalty .... the rules are clear .. and fraser had absolutely no reason to go after Ben the 2nd time other than to try and punish/hurt him un-neccessarily .... it was an EASY call and the RIGHT call ..... the first hit and the 2nd hit actually were fine (he hits him twice the first time before he goes down) as Ben was still in the play ......... but when ben gets back up and the plays 20 yards past them and Bens just standing there Frazer clearly goes after him and knocks him square on his ass .... EASY CALL .. and the fine is definetly called for .. theres RULES FOR A REASON ....

and i watched the tape .. not your link ... dont know if u can see it on your link .... but at least two and possibly 3 flags fly in SIMALTEONASLY(it looked like a yellow snow storm .. *L*) ... so 2 or 3 Refs had the same thing .. its definetly a penalty if that happens ...

STUPID PLAY .... clearly a penalty and a no-brainer on the fine ...

Good. I hope he apologized to his teammates for his idiocy.

You are completely wrong, it was a horrendous call -worst of the year by far. Fraser's responsability is to block - Ben got up, he gets blocked - in case you missed it, Ben's the ONLY reason you went to the super bowl last year. Holly's return was all over the place, I'm sure he dodn't know where he was. That official should be fined and fired. Horrible call. They need to institute a new rule next year, QB's are NOT allowed to tackle - if they do - an automatic TD is awarded to the D. Horrible call. If Holly was that far away, the official should have been turned the other way - he certainly was the 2 times Frye got drilled out of bounds. Worst call of the year by far. Pittsburgh is 3-7 and Cleveland is 4-6. Worst officiated game in history.

More proof that it was the worst officiated game in history:



If Hines Ward was down on his fumble (which he wasn't) then Ben was sacked on his throw to Parker for the TD - he was going backwards when he threw - means forward progress was stopped. As for the quote above, the entire Steeler sideline enterd the field after the TD in celebration- no flag. This game was fixed to the fullest. These officials are taught to cheat against Cleveland. Tomorrow's game should be darn funny, I'm guessing Frye gets hit late 3 times with no flag - we'll sack Palmer and get a 15 yarder. GUARANTEED.

I still say Ben was (1) either knocked stupid/silly and didn't realize what he was doing OR (2) got up on purpose since he knew getting hit would stop the interception from becoming a score.

Not defending him or the league's pretty boy QB rules, but I don't think he was even attempting to make the tackle.

Why do you say it's a no-brainer on the fine? do you see ppl getting fined for getting flaged every sunday in NFL? NO! that HIT was NOT bad...it was a shove...it wasn't even like he laid him out or anything...that 2nd shove did NOT warrent a FINE from the league...that is complete [censored]....

PS- i agree with the flag...not the fine

Soup, where have you and Frasier been?
By now we should all know these rules.

By definition it was NOT a penalty - ask Crennel - first time I've read about him being ticked. They fixed the game, I want to know where the fines are where Charlie got leveled 5 yards out of bounds TWICE. Game was fixed. Every official but Mike Carey calls a rigged game.

Even though i agree with the refs decision on that play(suprise huh lol), any fine seems just plain stupid. <img src="/images/graemlins/plthumbsdown.gif" alt="" /> It wasn't a cheap shot,just against the rules. The league office is making a killing on these fines.I hope what Marshall Faulk said comes true in the offseason,of course blame the owners for the ticky- tack calls.The only one i agree with is when a defender puts his hands to the face,which is a penalty for any player,except a player with the ball.You see quite a few lineman against another lineman as well.

By definition, it was a clean hit, he never took himself out of the play. By definition, the 2 on Charlie Frye were LATE hits. No call, no fines either. By definition, Hines Ward fumbled (if you are going to say progress was stopped, guess what - Ben's TD doesn't count then, he was going backwards when he threw it - one of those calls was incorrect). If it's Brown and Orange the league doesn't care about it. They are trying to get us to lose our team again, then they'll put Modell in the HOF. The NFL is a JOKE. Cleveland will get screwed big again tomorrow. It's a guarantee.

Then Soup...why not do yourself a favor and stop watching the FIXED games every week...
I am not being sarcastic...or a smart*$$, just curious.... I would not watch something that I was positive was fixed every weekend.


Cleveland is the least penalized team in the league.....and is the 3rd lowest in penalty yards....would that not be higher if the whole league was against them?

HACK

Depends on how you look at it - Frye was hit in the head while sliding (clear as day) vs. Atlanta - no penalty, Frye was hit twice well out of bounds vs. Pittsburgh - no penalties. Vick got tackled - they called a personal foul, Ben gets LEGALLY blocked, they throw a flag. On one of your TD drives, your RT forced Roye outside- then slipped - Roye took off RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE OFFICIAL - and your RT reached out and grabbed Roye's ankle ARIGHT IN FRONT OF THE OFFICIAL - no call. A lot of no calls happen against us, and things like the obvious Ward fumble that they blew dead for no reason. That's why our penalties are low - by the way - in the last 2 games we have 4 personal foul penalties. It's getting down to crunch time, we'll start to get penalized a lot more down the stretch. Wait til tomorrow. The Steeler game was the straw that broke the camels back to answer your first question.

Ya know Soup, I only remember one of the hits out of bounds (off the top of my head)...and to me, the call could've gone either way. Palamalu (sp?) hit him, but it was a continuation of falling (diving?) at the sidelines while in play. I would've frowned if they called it a late hit if it was Sean Jones getting the pennalty.

The other was called "blocked into" problem was the play happened right below where I was sitting, the LB reached his arm out - full extention - and swept Frye's feet out from under him - well after the end of the OOB line. He wasn't going to run into him. Frye didn't have the ball, TP finished the hit - it was BS.

Yah i recall 2 out of bound hits on him....such bull......how the HELL are the going to fine for a hit like this? It wasn't even that bad...big baby BEN..blah..that really pisses me off....


As far as games being fixed....ehh i'm not going to go that far...but this game certainly had some calls in favor of pissburgh....i was REALLY mad when Eason missed that sack...that play still confuses me...

[color:"white"] Why do you say it's a no-brainer on the fine? [/color]

are u looking for an answer other tan "because it was a no braoiner"?? *L* .. it was an easy one to fine .. wanna know why?

1. the NFL has gone way out of its way to PROTECT THE QB'S ... how may rules have they put in to try and keep the QB on the field?? its to the point Now where QB's should wear RED SKIRTS .... i dont agree with all the rules but the rules are there FOR A PURPOSE .. and the purpose is to keep the QB's safe ..

Ben was knocked on his ass and it was a clean block ... the play was 20 YARDS AHEAD OF THEM ... Ben simply stood up ... thats all he did .. and Fraser went after him and KNOCKED HIM ON HIS ASS AGAIN ... there was a couple other guys FLYING BY FRASER he could ahve blocked that were TRUELY TRYING TO GET BACK IN THE PLAY ... but no .. he goes after the guy that JUST STOOD UP and is pretty much standing still

GEE ... I WONDER WHY????? *L* ..

this call and fine was as easy as it gets ... its simple .. u go after the QB on a play like that ... THERE GONNA FINE U ...

what is it about that U dont understand??? cause it truely baffles me ...

Vette - *LOL* ..... that was classic ...

Hack - *LOL* . that was good to ... maybe it likes the WWF also ... go talk to the wall .... your odds of an intelligent convo would increase tenfold .... <img src="/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

There was another one, vette. It occurred near the Browns bench, in the 2nd quarter IIRC.
CF was slowing to a stop AFTER running out of bounds and someone (an LB, I think) hit how behind the knees. The crowd briefly booed the replay on the big screens because of the non-call.

Hope he challenges the fine because that is complete bull. Before you know it sacking a qb is gonna result in a fine.

What i don't understand is how that HIT warrents a fine....as far as i know simply commiting a penalty doesn't get you a FINE...if you take a cheap shot and it's a really bad hit you get fined....the 2nd hit was NOT bad...it was a simple shove in the back...sure he could have gone after someone else....but he was blocking ben and he continued to do it...i agree with the flag....not with the fine....thats where i stand...

Straight from the rule book


The officials blew it, the ball should have been placed at the 3/4 yard line, where it was dead.

http://www.nfl.com/fans/rules/doublefoul

They chose to place it where the foul occured, those penalties should have offset and left the ball at the 3/4 yard line, as typical they interpreted iot the wrong way and screwed us out of points on purpose. They don't believe in home field advantage - this rule is left too wide open. It's put in there so they can screw over the team they want to lose.

HEre's a thought:

Let's say Fraser doesn't block Ben, the fumble is recovered by Pitt and returned the other way where Ben throws the key block for a TD. Then what?

Holly cut fully across the field, what if Ben was left alone and Holly cut all the way back and Ben took off and tackled him?

While the play goes on, everyone is still in it unless they are lying on the ground. Check out the rulebook on NFL.com, no where in the book is there any rule against blocking a QB cleanly after an int. There is no rule for it, the officials called a rule that does NOT exist



The offiicials should be fined, not Fraser.

http://www.nfl.com/fans/rules/protectionofpasser

[color:"white"] What i don't understand is how that HIT warrents a fine [/color]

its simple dude .. there trying to PROTECT THE QB .... thats the only reason that rule and a few others are there .... U break that particular rule and your going to get fined EVERY SINGLE TIME ... u cant do it ... the INTENT of the penalty alone merits a fine ...

The NFL has gone way out of its way to keep QB's on the field .. when u go after a QB like Fraser did ... your GOING TO GET FINED ... what part of that is so mysterious???

[color:"white"] as far as i know simply commiting a penalty doesn't get you a FINE [/color]

your absolutely right .... and lets not compare this to offsides or holding .. it was a PERSONAL FOUL .. now all personal fouls or even most personal fouls dont merit fines (but the NFL office will look at ALL PERSONAL FOULS to see if there should be fines)... so why is this so automatic on the fine front?? .. BECAUSE OF THE INTENT .... your blocking a PREOTECETED SPECIES with the SOLE INTENT of punishing and if your lucky he'll be injured ...

[color:"white"] the 2nd hit was NOT bad...it was a simple shove in the back [/color]

1. it doesn't matter how bad it is .. its gonna get a penaly EVERY TIME and fine prolly 90% of the time ...

2. it wasn't a simple shove in the back .... Fraser got a 2 or a 3 yard running start for his "shove" .... he looked like he was a lion attacking a deer ... it was far from just some innocent shove ...

U can stand anywhere u please as long as its not on my feet ... <img src="/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> ... and to me it was a NO BRAINER on both the flag and the fine ..... I bet u EVERY SINGLE time that penalties been called theres been a fine attached ... and thats becuase of the INTENT of the rule ...

this is a post for those that read the lies posted above .... IT IS A RULE ..... the rules listed above are for when the QB passes the ball and is still in the pocket and just released the ball .....there is a rule in another section that covers what the refs called Sunday .. i aint gonna go look it up .... but if the Refs made the rule up u can rest assured they would not only be fined but the crew would be suspended and the Referee would be fired ... and I'm pretty sure someone in the Browns org/media would have had a wee bit more to say if the officials made a rule up ...

only reason i posted this is so folks woldnt think whats posted above is actually factual .... i wouldlnt want anyone making an ass out of themselves and quoting that verbatim and spreading BS ...

And qb's need to be accountable for their actions. If Ben didn't want to get hit, he needed to stay down. Why would he have got back up if he was not going to get back in the play? On offense, when the qb runs and does not want to get tackled, he slides. If the qb does not want to get blocked on turnover, he needs to give himself up in the same manner, by going down.

If they want to protect the qb, the refs need to be unbiased in their calls. How many times has Frye been tackled without having the ball where nothing is called? This "protect the qb" rules are only being applied towards the hot shots(ben, palmer etc).

I looked through the rulbook and could not find it. Post the proof.

OK .. i give up .. u guys win ....

the Refs who got in ZERO TROUBLE and the NFL OFFICE are 100% wrong and u BITTER FANS that are absolutely objective and have NO CLUE what the rules are, are right .... what was i thinking ...

oh and someone might wanna tell RAC and Opie we got hosed cause appearantly THEY DONT KNOW THE RULES EITHER ..

U people amaze me sometimes ... uknow the rules better than the folks that make good $$$ to enforce them and the people that supervise them ...

as far as how many times Charles gets hit .. THATS AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT STORY ... there was a couple times i wondered why flags werent' thrown ... baffled me .. BUT THAT HAS NUTTIN TO DO WITH THIS ...