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Wonder who we dropped to pick him up?
I would guess that it's one of the TE .. but not sure.
Butler makes sense. He's a tall CB with experience, and he did have a pick against us in the pre-season.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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J/C
CBS Sports is reporting that the Browns have signed Quincy Butler.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/1109424/quincy-butler
\
Which of our linebackers did we release in order to sign him?
And for those who think we are trading a linebacker, which one of our backers would you actually want to trade any value for if you were an opposing team's GM? I just don't see that happening. Even for an injury prone guy like DQ.
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Quote:
J/C
CBS Sports is reporting that the Browns have signed Quincy Butler.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/1109424/quincy-butler
Browns claim Butler off waivers:
The Browns have claimed former Rams CB Quincy Butler off waivers on Sunday. Butler had an interception against the Browns during preseason and was released by the Rams on Saturday. (Updated 09/05/2010)
6'1" 190 lbs......he has some size, but xou have to ask is he better than Coye Francies?
Why did the lowly Rams cut him?
Who is cut to make room?
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I'd guess either TE or LB. Royal or Veikune ...
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Quote:
J/C
CBS Sports is reporting that the Browns have signed Quincy Butler.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/1109424/quincy-butler
Just went through all cuts...we should take a look at:
DL J.Alford...can't believe he got cut...Giants simply have too many good DL and he'd be an instant upgrade for us over Robinson
SS M.White...possibly as bad as Elam...but can't be much worse, right?
CB J.Wall...6th round rookie I liked. Cowboys are deep at CB and he'd be worth keeping as #5 CB
OT Barbre...he started for GB....can't be much worse than StClair, right?
RT Tupou...HEckert should know him...still think he could be a nice RT
S Harris or Q:Demps....we need S, Heckert knows them...and it's difficult to be worse than Elam, Adams and Sorenson
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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I liked Francies, but it seemed pretty apparent that, for some reason, he was in Mangini's doghouse. Maybe he didn't impress enough on kick and punt coverage or something ... that seems to be a big deal to this Coach. I remember last year when Robiskie couldn't get on the field, and it was reported that Mangini was upset with Robiskie's special teams effort.
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I have a feeling we are going to trade D'Qwell, for possibly a draft pick and a corner.
I don't know if it's DQ that will get traded, But I get the feeling more cuts will be made as we pick from the list of players released. Someone is gettng traded.. just don't know who.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I'd guess either TE or LB. Royal or Veikune ...
My guess is that it will be a player whom is PS eligible like IIRC Titus Brown. This is why they only signed 6 to the PS.
Barton is listed as a starter and will most likely be at least until DQ is ready to go 
Coach Eric Mangini
[The prodigy man child of the Mad scientist AKA Bill Belichick] is about to unleash his
(V)ergeltungswaffe
"Reprisal weapon" on the League......
David(the beast man) (V)eikune 
Last edited by FL_Dawg; 09/06/10 10:27 AM.
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Sounds like bullscheisse to me ... 
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What do you find to be so impressive about Alford?
He's played 32 games, has 16 total tackles, and didn't play last year after tearing up his knee. He made 1 tackle in 4 pre-season games.
He has good size .... but I find little that screams "I can't believe they cut him".
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Sounds like bullscheisse to me ...
It's all true
I got my information straight from Bletchley Park 
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I wonder how many will get that reference.
Just the old farts, I guess.
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Quote:
I wonder how many will get that reference.
Just the old farts, I guess.
Well at least I'm not the only old fart around here, with an enigma devise
Who knows......I mean maybe a light will come on and this kid [Veikune]turns into a pass rush specialist and Mangini will have saved face in the PR department.
Is that not the reason why he was drafted so high, because he was supposed to terrorize QB's.
Maybe like Wimbley he is better suited to play in a 4-3 defense with his hand on the ground.
I think it's like trying to reinvent the wheel with some of these type of quote un-quote 3-4 prospects whom were DE's in College.
Some are able to adapt and others are not.
If anyone had the answer to the question weather or not they will be able to make the transition.
That person would be a genius sir or 
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j/c
My only thought on keeping so many linebackers is that they must not feel good or confident about the contracts that are up at the end of the year (DQ, Roth, etc). This is the only reason I can see why they'd keep questionable younger players like DV and Maiva.
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*In Baker we trust*
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I don't see Maiva as "questionable" at all.
The kid played really well when called upon last year, and is strong on special teams.
Veikune I question. I'm not yet 100% ready to give up on him ...... but I do worry ........
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
j/c
My only thought on keeping so many linebackers is that they must not feel good or confident about the contracts that are up at the end of the year (DQ, Roth, etc). This is the only reason I can see why they'd keep questionable younger players like DV and Maiva.
Or, they don't think that DV and Maiva are questionable younger players!
Maybe they like thier talents? Maybe they think they are coming along fine?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Just got to finish watching the fourth P-S game last night. It mostly (sadly) reaffirmed my thoughts on the cuts.
Why in the heck did we cut Engram? He would have been the best receiver on our team! Chansi Stuckey and Josh Cribbs are our "seasoned vets" at wideout. Really?
How did we cut McDonald AND Francies? We finally get some depth at corner and just drop it. THIS is how we end up with the Ralph Browns and Terry Cousins of the world on our team. So now we claim a player off waivers that the worst team in the NFL dropped? Brilliant, guys.
Costanzo was actually REALLY terrible in the fourth game. Hate to say it because I can think of 3 linebackers we kept I'd have rather cut in front of him but if we're keeping him for special teams, that punt coverage was TERRIBLE! He was right in the face of the punt returner and just froze. The bubble punt returner just ran right past him. Then, he had a free shot at the rookie QB on a blitz and slid right off of him.
With 12 LBs on the team, we can run a 1-8-2 defense and STILL have 4 LBs on the sidelines.
If we kept 12 LBs "because of DQ's injury" like Heckert said, why did we only keep 6 DL with Rogers just coming off PUP and R. Smith still possibly to receive a suspension? Geathers should still be on the team.
So should Asante. (PS doesn't count... he can be plucked away at any time.)
Barton, Veikune, Ventrone, Royal, T. Brown, maybe Maiava should all be gone. Still have Costanzo, Trusnik, and Sorensen as ST specialists if you must.
Engram, McDonald, Francies, Asante, and Geathers should all still be on the team.
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 The 1-8-2,...that made me laugh,...  I too have some questions, but more than anything, this past week just reaffirmed my faith in the fact that these personnel selections are just as political as the interaction in Congress is,..or the lack of it.
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jc...
I don't get all the sudden BMac love. Dude is mediocre on the field and a grade-A ass off of it.
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Quote:
jc...
I don't get all the sudden BMac love. Dude is mediocre on the field and a grade-A ass off of it.
No kidding,, I''m amazed at the number of people that are suddenly big Bmac fans.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Mediocre as a starter. Quality depth. We're lucky arizona claimed him and he didn't got o Baltimore.
I can't think he was that big of an "ass" like you say... Wright and Cribbs really liked him per a source I'm not allowed to post.
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We all understand he wasn't a world beater. It's not being "big Bmac" fans as much as it is questioning keeping 12 linebackers.
It's like politics. I don't have a problem with him being gone - I just want to hear what the REAL logic is, vice the media fed "oh, he just doesn't fit,..." ...,....whereas what appear to be some weaker players at other positions DO ?
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Quote:
Quote:
j/c
My only thought on keeping so many linebackers is that they must not feel good or confident about the contracts that are up at the end of the year (DQ, Roth, etc). This is the only reason I can see why they'd keep questionable younger players like DV and Maiva.
Or, they don't think that DV and Maiva are questionable younger players!
Maybe they like thier talents? Maybe they think they are coming along fine?
Then maybe they are seeing something off the field that we all are not.
I can easily say both of these guys are "questionable" because neither has proven anything on the field. Maiva making a few tackles here and there? Not exactly what I'd call a quality starter yet. The bottom line is we just don't know what these 2 can do and that's why it's technically questionable.
I'm just saying that the team is going to keep them around because they hope they'll be reasonable fill-ins when other the LBs are playing somewhere else next year. It makes sense. Give them another year to remove the "questionable" label.
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*In Baker we trust*
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Quote:
Just got to finish watching the fourth P-S game last night. It mostly (sadly) reaffirmed my thoughts on the cuts.
Why in the heck did we cut Engram? He would have been the best receiver on our team! Chansi Stuckey and Josh Cribbs are our "seasoned vets" at wideout. Really?
I hated to see him go too, but if you are only keeping 5.
I think we had to keep Mitchell, because like Geathers, he probably would have been claimed off waivers.
If it came down to keeping 4 TE's and 5 WR's over 6. I guess I'm okay with that because Moore can be split out @ WR too.
How did we cut McDonald AND Francies? We finally get some depth at corner and just drop it. THIS is how we end up with the Ralph Browns and Terry Cousins of the world on our team. So now we claim a player off waivers that the worst team in the NFL dropped? Brilliant, guys.
I think it could have been a number or other reasons, but I don't think Mangini ever forgave him for:
[dare I say the word  ] tweet episode, where McDonald is concerned. With Coye Francies, It might simply have been the case of not having enough time to catch the Coach's eyes.
Him being with Lawson the night he was arrested probably did not help him either.
Costanzo was actually REALLY terrible in the fourth game. Hate to say it because I can think of 3 linebackers we kept I'd have rather cut in front of him but if we're keeping him for special teams, that punt coverage was TERRIBLE! He was right in the face of the punt returner and just froze. The bubble punt returner just ran right past him. Then, he had a free shot at the rookie QB on a blitz and slid right off of him.
That was not very characteristic of Costanzo, but in his defense he beat the rest of the team to the punch and had no help on his flanks.
With 12 LBs on the team, we can run a 1-8-2 defense and STILL have 4 LBs on the sidelines.
If we kept 12 LBs "because of DQ's injury" like Heckert said, why did we only keep 6 DL with Rogers just coming off PUP and R. Smith still possibly to receive a suspension? Geathers should still be on the team.
I really thought we would keep 7 on the DL, because of Rogers and also figured Geathers would be snatched up in waivers.
We let another one get away there I agree.
One of the dozen LBers took his roster spot.
Even if you need to keep an extra LBer around because DQ is not ready to go. Still the math doesn't work. Say you need 10......okay the most then we should keep is 11.
So should Asante. (PS doesn't count... he can be plucked away at any time.)
Barton, Veikune, Ventrone, Royal, T. Brown, maybe Maiava should all be gone. Still have Costanzo, Trusnik, and Sorensen as ST specialists if you must.
Engram, McDonald, Francies, Asante, and Geathers should all still be on the team.
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I would have kept Bmac over Barton but there is a set of qualities for this team.
smart
Tough
physical
team first
Now lets be honest BMac doesnt get one check in any of those categories.
Adams is the 4th corner, he out performedt BMac last year. he played safety because we needed him to but he is a corner.
Now for those complaining we only kept 6 defensive linemen, We never play more than 3 at a time and we use a lot of 1 and 2 Defensive linemen sets.
For those complaining about keeping Robinson over Geathers. Look Robinson earned his spot. He clearly outplayed Geathers. BTW Geathers failed to do anything in 4 preseason games. I cant remember one single play the guy made. He is big but that is about it.
Barton got a free pass. hell Veikune outplayed him.
Elam got a free pass. He sucked but he was still our 2nd best safety.
Rogers got a free pass. Cause he is that good.
There is always a few spots to be questioned but I dont think it is that big of a deal this year. The guys we cut werent good enough. some that we kept arent good enough but we need 53.
I see about 43 that really earned it. After that it was reaching. most after that 43 were special teamers.
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To paraphrase (or, outright butcher) an old quote: "If you've got 12 linebackers, you haven't got any".
All kidding aside, it's all just much ado about nothing.... and a classic example of over-analyzing.
When you get as deep on the roster as some (most?) of those 12 LBers are, those are guys making the team due to special teams play, not simply because we think we need 12 or 11 or whatever at a position group.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Good counterpoint,....you gotta have ST'ers too.
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I coulda swore I saw a Practice Squad thread ... but I guess this will do .... http://www.ohiomm.com/blogs/browns/2010/09/browns-sign-six-players-to-practice-squad/The Browns signed running back Andre Anderson and wide receiver Jordan Norwood to their practice squad, a team spokesman said Monday. The Browns signed the following six players to their practice squad on Sunday: safeties Larry Asante and DeAngelo Smith, offensive linemen Paul Fanaika and Pat Murray, defensive linemen Travis Ivey and Brian Sanford. They were all waived by the Browns on Saturday.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Good counterpoint,....you gotta have ST'ers too.
You have 4 starting LBers.
So we should keep 8 ST/ backup guys???
Sorry,..... there is a reason why there is an average number teams keep at any given position and keeping over 10 even in a 3-4 is a lot.
I wound consider Costanzo and even Maiava STers, Trusnik is also a good backup LB.
I wouldn't think of any of the other players being good STers and a reason they should have kept them on the roster.
We have a perceived strength @ CB, but that could change in a hurry.
Okay we signed Q. Butler
That makes me feel a little better. A little!
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anything more than 8 lb's is ridiculous.. EVEN with a DQ injury.. especially if the coach's supposedly brings guys in that can play multiple positions.
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FYI,.....
The Browns added a wide receiver and running back to the practice squad Monday afternoon. The Cleveland Browns today signed wide receiver Jordan Norwood and running back Andre Anderson to the practice squad.
Norwood rejoins the Browns after signing as an undrafted free agent on May 1, 2009. He was waived on September 5, 2009 and spent 13 weeks on Philadelphia’s practice squad last year. He appeared in one game as a member of the active roster. In four years at Penn State University (2005-08), Norwood recorded 185 career receptions for 2,015 yards and 13 touchdowns. Anderson signed with Oakland as an undrafted free agent on April 24, 2010 and also spent time with Buffalo before being waived on September 4. He registered 1,966 career rushing yards and 17 touchdowns while at Tulane University (2006-09).
From the 2010 East West Shrine game:
Andre Anderson,
5-11 205, Tulane.
Plays a patient style, has been effective running behind FBs and pulling guards, does a little of everything, including blocking, catching out of the backfield, and lining up as a WR.
Last edited by FL_Dawg; 09/06/10 02:38 PM.
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I am as confused as everyone else about the composition of the roster. Quincy is not an upgrade over BMac. He has been in the league about as long ond only cracked the Rams lineup because of injury last year. Vasher is sitting out there if we needed another corner. And what is the deal with Smith and Royal sitting on the roster.. This is on too many TE's. The LB's have been beaten to death, so no need to put anything more on the pile of crap. Losing Gaethers is just stupid, when you draft a junior, you plan to put him on the roster for a year. Hopefully in a week this mess will be cleaned up. 
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!
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Then maybe they are seeing something off the field that we all are not.
Which is why blanket comments that a player is questionable or not don't mean much.. the only thing that matters is what they do with them..
If they keep them, then you can bet they see some value there.. Players are way to expensive to keep just for the sake of keeping them..
I'm pretty far from an expert, but honestly, they must see something in them that we don't, I say we because I don't see why they are keeping DV and Miava either, I'd have rather kept BMac or Gathers or kept Assante on the regular squad instead of the PS..
#GMSTRONG
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I am as confused as everyone else about the composition of the roster. Quincy is not an upgrade over BMac. He has been in the league about as long ond only cracked the Rams lineup because of injury last year. Vasher is sitting out there if we needed another corner.
And what is the deal with Smith and Royal sitting on the roster.. This is on too many TE's.
The LB's have been beaten to death, so no need to put anything more on the pile of crap.
Losing Gaethers is just stupid, when you draft a junior, you plan to put him on the roster for a year.
Hopefully in a week this mess will be cleaned up.
First off, it's been a while since I posted on here, so I'll start from the top:
1.) Brandon McDonald was most likely cut due to three reasons. Attitude being the first. McDonald wasn't a model player for the Browns. Willingness to commit to the Defensive Scheme being the second. He does his own thing on the field, and it either ends up in a great play, or him getting burned. And lastly, I don't believe he fits in with the future of this team in what Mangini has planned.
Now with that being said, is he a great corner? No, but he's a very good depth corner that has big play potential, and would have been an excellent 4th or even 5th Corner. The Cardinals got lucky here.
2.) Only keeping 3 Corners is a very risky move, but with the news of Butler being signed is great. My guess is Butler fits more of what we are looking for defensively, and can tackle, I'd guess.
3.) I'm glad we kept 4 TE's. How many times did we run 2 or even 3 TE Sets in Pre-Season? It is now part of our package and they seem to be effective out of it. We now have Watson/Moore/Royal or Smith as a possible TE Set.
4.) Keeping 12 LB'ers on Roster isn't going to stay that way, so everyone can relax. Also, a majority of those LB'ers are STer's.
5.) I was surprised, but not that surprised they cut Geathers. The guy has a MAJOR Attitude problem, and even had that in College. If he out grows it, then maybe he can develop into a player everyone thought he could be, but until then, who knows. Geathers has gotten into numerous fights already with the Browns.
6.) Cutting Asante is something I don't understand just yet. I thought he was supposedly having a decent camp, but apparently he must not be. That was evident by the fact no one even tried to take a filer on him by claiming a 5th Rounder.
All in all, I'm ok with the majority of the cuts.
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I think Ventrone making progress messed up Asante making the roster. Plus Ventrone is a "special teams ace"
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You probably nailed it gohooter.., Quote:
2.) Only keeping 3 Corners is a very risky move, but with the news of Butler being signed is great. My guess is Butler fits more of what we are looking for defensively, and can tackle, I'd guess.
Not that heckart needs defended here, but Adams played both safety and Corner., He seemed to do a decent job and he's experienced. Good team guy by all accounts.
So really they kept 4 and now added a 5th with Butler.
#GMSTRONG
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Right now I would say Titus Brown and Blake Costanzo are STs' only so that makes it 10 Lb's. With D'Quell out for who knows how long we now have 9 Lb's.
BMac is a touchdown waiting to happen. He gives up way to many big plays by being reckless when he should be smart. He can't tackle my grandmother and doesn't play special teams.
As for Quincy Butler, he might fit in better with our defensive scheme than the Rams'. You can't always just look at production. Some teams play primarily man coverage while others love their zones. Some Cb's are great at zone but can't cover man to man and vice versa. I don't know our preferences as compared to the Rams'.
What has Francies ever done to show he deserves a roster spot?
I keep hearing about all these other teams picking up players - either via waiver or signed after waivers cleared. Seems weird that these teams supposedly better than us need to do this yet we don't really feel the need.
I like the idea of picking up Stevie Brown S recently waived by Oakland. Heard some good things about him and that the reason he was cut is that "Big Al" wouldn't let the coaches waive his boy from Ohio University that they took in the 2nd round of the 2009 draft (Michael Mitchell).
Last edited by Jester; 09/06/10 06:05 PM.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,551
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Posts: 8,551 |
Browns land Steve Vallos on waivers
Posted by Mike Florio on September 6, 2010 8:15 PM ET
The waiver dance continues.
The Seahawks released center Steve Vallos on Sunday. Per a league source, the Browns and Panthers submitted waiver claims. The Browns secured his service.
Vallos, a seventh-round pick in 2007, appeared in 16 games in each of the past two seasons, starting eight of them.
In Cleveland, Vallos will be reunited with Mike Holmgren, coach of the Seahawks when Vallos was drafted.
Holmgren also may be interested in former Seahawks fullback Owen Schmitt, who also has been waived. Holmgren was the coach in Seattle when Schmitt was picked in 2008.
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,849
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,849 |
as I said before.. I like Vallos.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,189
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Quote:
Quote:
Looks like Clifton Geather was signed by the Dolphins. According to KFFL.
If they sign him he has to be on the active 53 man roster right?
No. If they sign a player off of a practice squad, then they have to put him on the 53 man roster. But claiming him off waivers allows them to sign him to their own practice squad.
On keeping 12 Linebackers: I doubt the final total will be 12, but a couple of those guys are special teams guys exclusively. That takes the total to 10. DQ is currently on the roster but injured so the total goes down to 9 and likely one will be cut when DQ is ready.
In addition, some of Ryan's 4-3 alignments has LB's lined up as Defensive Linemen taking the place of the typical DL-type guys. I'm guessing there's going to be a ton of rotation as there will be packages for certain groups.
With Linebackers being the heart of the 3-4 defense, and we don't have any above average ones, it makes sense to have extra LB'ers in certain packages that get the most out of them by using specific players in ways that utilize their best individual skills. Some likely won't play a lot of downs, but when they do it will be in situations in which they excel.
Bowens comes to mind, and Veikune as well. (btw... don't count Veikune out just yet. As it sometimes takes players into their 3rd year for the light to come on he has only 1 so far. Last year they tried doing too much with him, tried making him too versatile, and I think it confused him. Now that they've settled him in on less responsibility let's see how he achieves before calling him a bust.)
I agree with Mourg on BMac. He just lacked the overall qualities of a football player required by this regime. I always liked him and we all saw him make some really great plays. But he also had long lapses and was a risk taker which backfired on him too many times. He didn't play within the scheme and that's a deadly mistake with this coach. He also lacked the hard-hitting, physical play Mangini wants from his secondary.
With the addition of Brown and Haden to the CB position and Ward in the secondary as well, suddenly our secondary may become known for tough physical play. Something we haven't see here for a long time. Even Wright has been influenced by them and has stepped up his physical play. BMac was never going to be one of those type of players. Now this leaves Elam as the odd guy out. He sticks by necessity but won't be here next season.
Signing Butler answers the question as to why we left ourselves with only 3 CB's after the cuts. And as many of you have already said, they aren't done yet.
#gmstrong
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns Cuts (take 2)
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