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^^ This is the wife's big problem with it all too.
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Quote:
there's been a bunch of instances and they just all add up over time.
Well he *is* buddies with Lebron ... is any of this surprising? 
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Just clicking... The guys who are clamoring about them being bad teammates for selling just a Big 10 Championship ring... Seriously?  So what if someone sells a material reminder of a feat accomplished? They were there when they fought for and achieved that title, and all of whom were solid contributors. So they pawned the hardware because they were cash poor or it didn't match their outfits; hell if I know. I'm just puzzled as to how knee-jerk and misguided it seems to instantly equate that with being a bad teammate.
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Quote:
So a tattoo is worth more than the ring the school and conference gave them for a major team achievement?
Says alot about our sociaty and the state of sports these days. It's all about ME
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Nobody is "clamoring." The sense is, just a hint into overall character.
It seems it is OK for some to question the character of others on the Board for "throwing character stones." That is certainly as laughable as the original act(s) are in the first place.
I am not offended though, this is a free country, and you are entitled to your opinion. I completely understand most of the why's and how's of the situation. There are many factors at work here in having placed these kids in a spot where they have to make a choice.
I will leave the issue as "too bad it happened in the first place."
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Such a strange ruling. 5 games but go ahead and play the bowl game?
What if one of these guys was a senior / graduating / end of eligibility?
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1st String
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Quote:
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So a tattoo is worth more than the ring the school and conference gave them for a major team achievement?
Says alot about our sociaty and the state of sports these days. It's all about ME
Not that it makes it any better, but these were the 2008 Big Ten Champ rings and Golden Pants. All these guys were true freshman or redshirt freshman. They had a limited role if any beyond Pryor that season. Those awards, unfortunately, probably mean nothing to them since they have the same awards from 2009 where they had much bigger roles on the team.
The thing that I am not happy about is the NCAA. Yes they should be punished, but it should be for the bowl game. They are leaving this in the hands of Tressel to do the right thing. They should not be allowed to play in that game. Why the NCAA made it 5 games next year and left out the bowl game has only put Tress and OSU in a situation where they have to make the call on the players punishment for the next game. This behavior is not the standard at OSU and now the fans will likely call for Tress' head when he does the right thing and does not allow them to play in the Sugar Bowl
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now the fans will likely call for Tress' head when he does the right thing and does not allow them to play in the Sugar Bowl
Two thoughts here...... Tressel won't go beyond the NCAA and suspend them for the Sugar Bowl unless he has assurances from the NCAA that the suspensions will be reduced to 2 games. Because if the suspensions aren't reduced to 2 games then it's more than likely all those guys turn pro rather than miss half a season. Then Tress won't have them anyway.
No fan with half a brain or more will call for Tressel's dismissal for this. Now if he had John Cooper's record against Michigan that would be a different story.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Some teammates these guys turn out to be.
That's simply over the top. Team and teammates are made of actions of support on and off the field, not selling their own personal property.
I am as about Scarlett and Gray as it gets. It amazes me how the NCAA (via this rule violation) and the general public can be so judgmental (that's not aimed particularly at you peen although questioning their dedication to others is crap based on this situation).
Btw, although I'm a homer for the Bucks my opinion of this instance is not biased. I don't understand the NCAA's thinking on this one. Again, they are so hypocritical considering the money they gladly bank. The fact that the guys were not suspended for the Sugar Bowl speaks volumes to that fact.
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Quote:
Some teammates these guys turn out to be.
I'd worry about your team peen. They're becoming the cincinnati bengals of college football.
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Some teammates these guys turn out to be.
I'd worry about your team peen. They're becoming the cincinnati bengals of college football.
Maybe so, but looks like you need to worry about yours and not pick at mine.
You have to admit it is pretty weak selling off rings and such.
The leader of your team more or less saying "screw the team" isn't good.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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You have to admit it is pretty weak selling off rings and such.
The leader of your team more or less saying "screw the team" isn't good.
Can someone explain to me this (^) mindset? Selling off private property less than more says, "Screw the team!" It says it less than more because it has nothing to do with it. I just expect more judicious rationale from a former judge.
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Formerly 4yikes2yoshi0
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I don't understand it either, all these guys were true/redshirt freshman when this happened two full seasons ago in 2009. None of these guys, with the exception of Pryor, had that much impact that year.
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I don't understand it either, all these guys were true/redshirt freshman when this happened two full seasons ago in 2009. None of these guys, with the exception of Pryor, had that much impact that year. [/quote
]Maybe so....I guess I come from a different time.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I understand where you're coming from, but these were actions by freshmen. Not upperclassmen team leaders.
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I'm with Peen on this one.....especially selling the gold pants. No true Buckeye would do that.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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Would a true Buckeye leave before his 4 years of eligibility are complete? What are the requirements of being "true"?
I expect them to leave it all on the field and to not take plays off. I expect them to fight to the last second. If Tress expects more, which I believe he does, then that's is not only fine, but is fulfilling an role that many coaches understand .... to assist young athletes in understanding the important things .... being a good son, daughter, father, mom .... teammate .... citizen.
This may be a teaching point for Tress. For me, a fan, it's a speeding ticket ... a minor transgression only because they very likely knew they were breaking a rule. I am not going to presume I know their relationship with their teammates. Maybe I'm a "bad" fan. If so, I could care less.
GO BUCKS
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Quote:
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I don't understand it either, all these guys were true/redshirt freshman when this happened two full seasons ago in 2009. None of these guys, with the exception of Pryor, had that much impact that year.
Maybe so....I guess I come from a different time.
Nah I don't think so, I'd be willing to bet that some of the classes from the John Cooper years (not so long ago) who never beat Michigan would share the same disgust for Pryor or any others who sold their gold pants.
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1. i think terrelle pryor is a good kid, i just think he's extremely immature (duh, he's in college) and shouldn't have gone on twitter. i have no problem with what he thinks but using twitter was probably not a wise idea for him to get his thoughts out
2. it's not that the tatoo is worth more than the ring. it's the fact that getting a free tattoo in exchange for an autograph is said to be worse than selling a ring which is in your own possession.
3. of course they are gonna let those kids play in the bowl game. the ncaa would hear it from the bcs sponsors that the ratings would go down drastically in that game if terrelle pryor, devier posey, and boom herron can't play. sure buckeye fans will still watch, as well as razorback fans, but nationally, they would lose ratings. the bcs, the ncaa, and all the school presidents are in bed with each other. they wouldn't dare steal food off the table like that. they'll do it in a lesser game.
4. i expect the sentence to be bumped to 2 games. i think missing game 1 and missing miami is probably good enough of a punishment. this isn't a cam newton or reggie bush type infraction.
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Didn't AJ Green miss 4 games for teh same thing? If so I don't expect their suspension to be reduced... but here's hoping.
<><
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IIRC, and maybe Turk could shine some light on this, AJ Green sold his Bowl Game jersey from last year either to an Agent or someone who was associated with an agent.
He was originally suspended for 5 games and that was appealed and got reduced to 4.
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AJ Green was indeed suspended for selling his jersey to an agent.
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J/C...
I keep reading people say, and hearing, that these guys sold their private property... what I haven't read or heard is that these guys got that property by playing a sport on scholarship for a university.
It's not like OSU gave "Bill Jones", a freshman pharmacy major, a pair of gold pants or "Sally Random" a junior education major a Big Ten Championship ring. These kids got these awards because they're part of a team - a non-vital or vital - part of a team; not just because they happened to be students at OSU.
Therefore, I don't view it as "private property" while you're in school or on the team. When you're elegibility has been used up, hey, get what ya can. A few years down the road and you need some money? Go for it. NOT while you're in school playing for the team on scholarship.
And this excuse about trying to help out family... enough. These dudes, not just OSU but any school for any sport, are getting a completely free education and gobs of free stuff for 4-5 years. Their parents are saving 40-50,000 dollars minimum - I think that's all the help they need. Go pro and buy mom a house, or send your parents on a cruise, or pay your parents heating bill for life - or use that free education to your advantage and get prepared for life and maybe you can help your family out in the future... but don't sell things illegally while still in school as a scholarship athlete.
"If it weren't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college"
GO ROCKETS
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I agree Sperg. Quote:
i just think he's extremely immature (duh, he's in college)
I've often wondered how I would act and react if I was talented enough at something at their age. The constant ego stroke can have an affect that is or can be unbecoming.
A judgement of character .....
Coach Hayes urged his kids to Pay Forward. When you hear from Rex, Archie and so many others you hear that philosophy just as much and probably even more than their exploits on the field or the importance of beating Michigan. Is Coach Haye's spirit performing proverbial flips from the grave? I tend to think not, but I do believe that any of these guys would meekly cower away from a face to face with him. It could be fire and brimstone with teeth gnashing, black framed glasses breaking and Block O hat ripping. I can see blood coming from Coach's hand, veins popping and big, wide, "Oh crap" kinda eyes coming from these boys. Or it could be a calmer Coach speaking as the mentor, even the dad, that he was to many. I'm confident that Coach Tressel will manifest some form of this. If I live long enough, I expect to be hearing words of gratitude from his players for teaching such things.
I expect the teaching to be something as simple as explaining the value of awards, most particularly the gold pants, when these guys are older. When the tats and the money have faded those 3 and maybe 4 gold pants, the Big 10 Championships and the trials and tribulations with their teammates will be what is valuable. If any of these kids understand character and integrity, and I bet they do, it's what can be carried beyond death and on to generations after them.
I have enjoyed many years of following the Buckeyes with my son and nephews. I have had the privilege to be a role model for them, albeit not perfect. I take great pleasure that we all get together every Michigan game to spew our vile at the Maize and Blue and, most importantly, share common ground. Along the way I've had the opportunity to use Buckeye football as a way for them to understand right from wrong, integrity from maliciousness. Some years back I even created an certificate type award called, "The Woody". It's a bit of a cheesy Powerpoint creation, but it's rooted in family and commitment, obligation and honesty ..... just a small representation of Coach Haye's Pay Forward way of living.
This matter is between Coach Tressel and his players. The NCAA's role in this is ultimately irrelevant, at least in my opinion. I've never heard anything from the accused that would make me think that they won't "get" it and, like I said, I believe that Coach will make sure of it.
Note: In my post before I said I wasn't going to presume that I know what type of relationship theses guys have with their teammates. I must admit I'm presuming quite a bit in this post. My earlier statement is aimed at the notion that there is some element of disappointment or disapproval from the guys they play with. I suppose I can't speak one way or the other to that aside from not hearing or reading anything about this from the rest of the team (yet).
None the less, my presumptions stand. If these kids give me any reason to change my opinion then I will regrettably do so.
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They didn't get the awards because they were a part of a team. They got the awards because the team earned them.
Free OSU apparel, shoes, etc? Those are things they are given simply by virtue of being on the team. And, by extension, they shouldn't be able to sell such things. Like I said in another post, one can make a legit argument that such goods are property of the school being furnished for student use to the players. You can't make that argument about an award.
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Quote:
Would a true Buckeye leave before his 4 years of eligibility are complete? What are the requirements of being "true"?
I expect them to leave it all on the field and to not take plays off. I expect them to fight to the last second. If Tress expects more, which I believe he does, then that's is not only fine, but is fulfilling an role that many coaches understand .... to assist young athletes in understanding the important things .... being a good son, daughter, father, mom .... teammate .... citizen.
This may be a teaching point for Tress. For me, a fan, it's a speeding ticket ... a minor transgression only because they very likely knew they were breaking a rule. I am not going to presume I know their relationship with their teammates. Maybe I'm a "bad" fan. If so, I could care less.
GO BUCKS
I saw a tv show where some of the old buckeye vets showed off those gold pants and talked about how proud they were to have earned them. Those were true Buckeyes.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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I'm glad you mentioned archie. He is a better human being than he was a college football player.
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and that saying a lot candy. Have you read, "Woody's Boys"? One of my favorites. 
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I really like what you had to say there, but I think its important for people older than myself, and especially those of my parents generation and beyond, to realize that major college sports is no longer the bastion of integrity and sanctity that it once was held to be. The traditions are still quite strong for the fans, and the players and students alike still get up for the ages-old rivalries, but the days of grandfather, father and son playing college ball at dad's alma mater are all but gone. You have to take college sports for what it really is: an opportunity for kids with special talents, often from less than desirable backgrounds and situations, to be able to utilize their talents to earn a bit of financial security for their futures. To the cream of the crop of these athletes, it's little more than a stepping stone to the big leagues; a necessary one at that, considering the rules put in place that prevent them from entering the professional ranks right out of high school. The majority of these guys aren't picking the school they go to because of the traditions and the rivalries, they're going to the programs where they can get the most playing time, the most exposure and the greatest chance of getting to the pro level (especially in the case of the one-and-done players in NCAA basketball).
And most kids are immature. I don't think anyone should be surprised by that. But being immature does not necessarily mean that someone is of low character. Will they look back in 20 or 30 years and realize that having a trophy or an award to show the kids while they tell a story might be better than having a tattoo or whatever clothes or electronics they might've spent that $1000 on? Maybe, maybe not, and its really none of my concern. What I do know is that I'm not about to blame the players for utilizing the system that's been put in place for them to make it to the next level. Maybe that's why I don't really care about college sports the way I do about the pros. I know a lot of people feel the exact opposite, that the pros are corrupt and college sports are pure. I tend to feel that that couldn't be further from the truth, at least in terms of college sports. I'm just saying stop looking at them with a romanticized view of the way it used to be and see it for what it is, a stepping stone to the pros.
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I don't understand how you can gloss over the fact that they wouldn't have gotten anything if they weren't on the team - as I said these things weren't given to every student at OSU, they were given to players on the team who are playing there on scholarship under rules of the NCAA. Whether those rules are appropriate or not, they're the rules.
It's not private property IMO until you're no longer a student/ done with elegibility/ off the team.
"If it weren't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college"
GO ROCKETS
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I agree Adam. I don't know if it sounds like I'm talking out both sides? The ideal of character is still very relevant and on that note it's my opinion that the NCAA sends one hell of a mixed message in the way they conduct business to assure TV money and then impose and enforce this ruling. I'd frankly like to know what their motivations are when creating the rule(s). Like I said, I see this instance as more of a coach - team thing than something corrupting the student athlete ideal.
As an aside I firmly believe that some agents are pariahs and that is where I wish the NCAA could focus their attention. The legal truth is that they likely have very limited control with them and have to rely on governing the athletes against the temptations that present themselves. That's a tough one there and not very practical.
I absolutely agree that immaturity does not equate to low character. I could have been a total jerk if my dumb 18-20 something butt had received the accolades that these guys do.
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I didn't gloss over that in the least. I didn't say they would've gotten them if they weren't on the team; obviously every student at Ohio State wasn't given gold pants. What I said was they weren't given the awards simply by virtue of being on the team. The team still had to play the game and accomplish the achievements and earn the awards.
I'm also not arguing whether or not a rule is in place. I'm saying that whatever rule was apparently violated is a bad rule. It's also a slippery slope. A student on a full ride scholarship is going to have his textbooks paid for. Can he not sell these once he's completed the courses for which they're used? They're paid for by the university, and only because he plays on the team.
If a player is given an iPod by the school or the company sponsoring the bowl game or whatever NCAA-sanctioned body, and he doesn't want it, does that mean he cannot sell it until he's no longer a student at the school? After all, the only reason he was given the iPod is because he was on the team that made it to the bowl game.
Where do you draw the line? Why?
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Quote:
I don't know if it sounds like I'm talking out both sides?
I don't think it does. I think it speaks to a difference in perception of priorites, which is tied to generational differences.
As we all know, there was a time when professional athletes were selling insurance or used cars or groceries to earn a living wage during the off season. Professional athletes would put their careers in sports on hold to serve in the military. Today, the first pick of the fourth round of the NFL draft (Mardy Gilyard, WR, taken 99th overall) signed a contract with a half a million dollars signing bonus. Now, half a million doesn't buy what it used to, but that's still a hell of a good start towards a financially secure future.
I can understand why a person that's been a fan of the Ohio State Buckeyes for the past 40 years would be upset that a player sold his gold pants. I just don't think its reason to vilify someone if you step back and look at the reality of the situation. I mean, wasn't the deciding factor for Terrelle Pryor choosing Ohio State over Michigan the fact that Columbus is closer to PA, than Ann Arbor, so that he would be a little closer to his sick dad? These guys have a million different reasons for choosing the schools that they do, but its often not because "that's where Dad went".
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His ceiling will be Troy Smith.
Ouch...
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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Ohio State quarterback Terrelle Pryor was stopped for traffic violations three times in the past three years while driving cars owned by a car salesman or used-car lot, but an Ohio State investigation determined nothing improper occurred, according to the Columbus Dispatch. Pryor was pulled over twice in early 2010 driving a Dodge that was registered to Auto Direct, a used-car dealership in Columbus. In 2008, Pryor was pulled over driving a 2004 GMC Denali, registered to Aaron Kniffin, a car salesman at Auto Direct. Ohio State was unaware of the 2008 traffic stop, but told the Dispatch it would investigate. The use of the Dodge was excused because Pryor's car was in the shop and the dealer reportedly told Ohio State that customers receive temporary loaner cars for extended repairs like the engine replacement that the Buckeyes QB had to wait for. In the case of the 2004 GMC Denali that Pryor was driving in 2008, Pryor said the following: "I wanted advice from some of my family and friends I trusted to see if it would be a good vehicle for me to maybe buy." Ohio State received an anonymous letter regarding Auto Direct in July and investigated relationships between the dealership and its athletes. Associate athletic director for compliance Doug Archie said the conclusion was that no NCAA violations had occurred. According to the Dispatch, "about two dozen" autographed jerseys can be found at the dealership, including those of Pryor, running back Daniel Herron and receiver DeVier Posey. There are also autographs from players on a wall in the dealership. But Pryor did not remember when he signed the jersey, adding that "I sign a lot of stuff for Buckeye fans - I don't like to turn down fans. But I don't do it to get any favors or discounts." Pryor, Posey and Herron are among the five Ohio State players -- along with Mike Adams and Solmon Thomas, who were suspended for recently receiving illegal benefits. The players will be eligible to play in the Rose Bowl, but will miss the first five games of the 2011 season. http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-footbal...s#ixzz19tgo7eDE
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This young man is an embarrassment to his team. I can't wait to hear what is going to come out once he leaves Ohio State.
Where there's smoke, there is fire.
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That stuff was going on when my dad and uncle were at OSU in the 70s. It's nothing new.
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Quote:
The players will be eligible to play in the Rose Bowl
Sweet!
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,149
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,149 |
Quote:
That stuff was going on when my dad and uncle were at OSU in the 70s. It's nothing new.
Correct, and it's going on at every major program in the country.
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Ohio State in trouble for
inappropriate benefits?
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