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In actuallity, I considered Mangini's fate was sealed as soon as we went that route those last couple of games.
I mean we weren't winning anyway. Out of any type of playoff contention.
So why not let colt run loose and make the mistakes he will naturaly when asked to take the whole team on his shoulders that way. I'm sure MH saw that coming. now they have tape with which to work with. to show Colt what defenseive coverages he had trouble with, how to correct it and grow from it.
To me those last two games were investments for next season. To see how poorly we run anything closely resembling a WCO. To look for anyone who seemed to rise to the occasion and look for those who seemed lost by it as well.
These last two games, while not so fun to watch, may give us the true, big incite as to what the future will be. for the O I saw them trying to run those last two games, looked a lot more like something MH would have ran at Green Bay. Only he had the personnel to run the sysytem.
And one thing is for sure, he has film to see what he needs to run it here too........................now.
jmho
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Quote:
That wasn't my point. Money doesn't buy happiness.
It buys a wave runner.
Just sayin.
"All I know is, as long as I led the Southeastern Conference in scoring, my grades would be fine." - Charles Barkley
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You left out StClair.
Yates? C'mon a practice squad guy?
I don't know the reasons why he wasn't playing,but I would suspect being a rookie had alot to do with it.
4th round guards take some time,patience and practice.We'll see what we have in the near future.
I left out St.Clair since he does not play guard and his status has no effect on Lauvao's playing time.
Lauvao was behind Womack and Yates on the depth chart. Womack moved to tackle b/c Pashos got hurt.
Yates is a vet, not a PS player, and played quite well this season. Lauvao came in b/c Yates and Womack were hurt at the time.
Lauvao has been battling the high ankle sprain most of the season. This kept him from getting practice reps too. Don't give upon him after ONE BAD GAME.
Last edited by Line Judge; 01/04/11 07:03 AM.
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IIRC the Holmgren to Cleveland possibility became evident at the end of October, 2009.
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That is the 1000 pound elephant that nobody wants to talk about. Gini was dead this time last year when MH was hired.
I did..people keep wanting to ignore how turrible the BROWNS looked until Lerner came out and spoke..he was fuming,knowing fans were going to boycott that upcoming game..I never forgot even though they won those last 4 games..and I mentioned it again this year..but most thougght for sure the ship was righted..kept saying it wasn't.
Most of us were shocked that Mike kept him then and didn't hire his own guy, but I guess with the winning streak and the fact Gini did do some good things as far as cleaning up the "club med" culture we had around here....Mike gave him a year. Imo he shouldn't have because it was inevitable that his philosophy and Gini's just weren't compatible.
I think a couple of posters need to hear that several times..Mike hinted in a few ways that he was cringing at how the team and the offense were playing.
And I ll repeat something I heard..or read..Dabol seemed to be apprehensive about Haskill being in the building/meetings.
Oh and playing for FG's when the team needed TD's also made Mike crap a lot..
I'm not upset that Holmgren wants to bring in his people, but I am upset he wasted a year by not firing Gini last year and getting it going. In the end that was his 1st mistake........not realizing that him and Gini were just too different to coexist.
BAM!! BAM!!! BAM!!
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 01/04/11 10:38 AM.
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Who Attack? Who worth a damn would have came in here to coach this year? Who would have taken on that mess?
Blanket statements are easy to make but who did MH want that was available? Out of those, who would have come here then?
Easy to throw that out there without filling in the blanks but the fact of the matter is, you don't really know who MH talked to and what answers he got before making his decision to retain Gini last year do ya?
I didn't think so................................
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Once more U rush way ahead of comments..this subject was debated at length last year,do I really need to remind U if you were actually here?
Some of us(most who do not post here anymore) figued out why Walrus retained him..which some of what he actually spoke about..we also figured out that if he had wanted to can him there wasn't enough viable people(cough) ready to come in .
Just remember that MH has a list that he looks at that contains many names of FO people.
Why U guys get so worked up over certain things amazes me.
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 01/04/11 12:10 PM.
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Quote:
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That wasn't my point. Money doesn't buy happiness.
It buys a wave runner.
Just sayin.
At least I'd be happy while I was on my Wave Runner...
And in a response to the whole Gruden's Team vs. Dungy's Team thing...
People want to give credit to Gruden for "Building" the Raiders team that went to the Superbowl...
If by "Building" it they mean signing the best WR ever, and getting Rich Gannon to have some of the best years of his career... Ok then...
What happened to the Raiders team Gruden "Built" ? Oh yeah, they just had their first Non-Losing season in 8 years...
So all we need next year are:
2 HOF WRs
MVP QB
And to play TB in the SB (aka the last team he coached)
And Gruden will succeed... 
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Quote:
Quote:
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That wasn't my point. Money doesn't buy happiness.
It buys a wave runner.
Just sayin.
At least I'd be happy while I was on my Wave Runner...
And in a response to the whole Gruden's Team vs. Dungy's Team thing...
People want to give credit to Gruden for "Building" the Raiders team that went to the Superbowl...
If by "Building" it they mean signing the best WR ever, and getting Rich Gannon to have some of the best years of his career... Ok then...
What happened to the Raiders team Gruden "Built" ? Oh yeah, they just had their first Non-Losing season in 8 years...
So all we need next year are:
2 HOF WRs
MVP QB
And to play TB in the SB (aka the last team he coached)
And Gruden will succeed...
I think Chad Johnson and TO will be available. 
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
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That wasn't my point. Money doesn't buy happiness.
It buys a wave runner.
Just sayin.
At least I'd be happy while I was on my Wave Runner...
And in a response to the whole Gruden's Team vs. Dungy's Team thing...
People want to give credit to Gruden for "Building" the Raiders team that went to the Superbowl...
If by "Building" it they mean signing the best WR ever, and getting Rich Gannon to have some of the best years of his career... Ok then...
What happened to the Raiders team Gruden "Built" ? Oh yeah, they just had their first Non-Losing season in 8 years...
So all we need next year are:
2 HOF WRs
MVP QB
And to play TB in the SB (aka the last team he coached)
And Gruden will succeed...
I think Chad Johnson and TO will be available.
So will Brett Favre... 
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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And there you have it, super bowl here we come!
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Quote:
Once more U rush way ahead of comments..this subject was debated at length last year,do I really need to remind U if you were actually here?
Some of us(most who do not post here anymore) figued out why Walrus retained him..which some of what he actually spoke about..we also figured out that if he had wanted to can him there wasn't enough viable people(cough) ready to come in .
Just remember that MH has a list that he looks at that contains many names of FO people.
Why U guys get so worked up over certain things amazes me.
It's just funny as hell attack.
On one hand you claim he made a mistake by waiting a year then on the other hand you say there were no viable candidates last year.
Which one is it?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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He did make a mistake.Not backtracking.
Viable as in top choice that he might have wanted.
Doesn't mean that there wasn't someone else that he coulda brought in.But since I don't have any concrete names I can't say WHO.
The only name I heard was Chucky's.But he was locked into ESPN.
Stop trying to act like you're a judge on a throne somewhere. "Pit's court".... 
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But replacing the head coach for the sake of replacing him isn't a solid solution.
Maybe, just maybe, MH looked at what was available, made a few calls to friends, and in the end decided his best option was to stay with EM at the time, and he wasn't sold on any of the other options.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Quote:
But replacing the head coach for the sake of replacing him isn't a solid solution.
Maybe, just maybe, MH looked at what was available, made a few calls to friends, and in the end decided his best option was to stay with EM at the time, and he wasn't sold on any of the other options.
That was a guess I made last year.. then I thought,, naa.. I believe him when he said that he was sticking with Mangini cause he saw something.. now this move makes me wonder if I was right back then.....I don't suppose we'll ever know for sure..
But if we end up hiring someone that wasn't available last season,, like Fox or Gruden,, then that would lend truth to that theory...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I think its funny when people profess to know what Holmgren's motives were when all any of us have is speculation.
The only thing I think I know is that MH's only objective is to make the Browns better and, by default, make himself look good in the process. I don't think MH feels any allegiance to anybody that will not help him achieve that goal.
With that in mind, I can only think of one viable reason why he kept Mangini... and that is that it was a win/win for him. I honestly think he was hoping that Mangini would succeed.. I mean why wouldn't he? But the fallback position is that if he doesn't succeed, then MH has a year to start getting his roster set his way, a year to evaluate talent, then a second draft and FA period to load up the roster for his handpicked coach... Look, he probably realized we were going to struggle this year, if he hand picks his coach last year then that guy already has one bad year under his belt and with this fanbase, that's 1 of 2 or 3 that he is going to get... now we had a great draft, we have rid ourselves of some other potential problem players, we have the #6 pick this year....
That's just my opinion.
yebat' Putin
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One year ago when Mike took over the front office was in a mess. Between Phil's office and Erik's changes it was a disaster. Remember Kokonis and a lady working in the office. A complete redo of the building and moving of pictures of players.
Mike had an office staff to evaluate and rebuild.
Erik somehow was able to win the last 4 games and developed a small following on here screaming "1 more year"
MIke had to aquaint himself with the talent and coaching staff. He had no idea what we had as coaches or players.
The draft went fairly well.
Everyone on here was saying we have way to many running backs. We have no worry about the running back position. Well that sort of went down teh sewer. Some got cut or traded and I think attitude played into that too. Between holding out for a super big contract and not getting it.
The season started and we started losing. Every game was 30 minutes to long. We had no second adjustments to what our opponents were doing. Then add in poor clock management, poor play calling and really dumb decisions by Eric.
Some say Erik needs another year and more good players. That would be nice. Next year we have more close games and the guys play their hearts out. But we still have poor sideline decisions, no half time adjustments, poor time management and more dumb decisdions by Erik.
I have seem enough of Erik and his PROCESS!!!!!!!! His double speak at press conferences to explain his failed decisions during the game. Tryng to play mistake free football every week because you play to not lose is not my type of game planning.
Mike has the front office all set. Has anyone heard of any scandals this year?
Now he can concentrate on the coaching and the players that we need to move forward.
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Some say Erik needs another year and more good players. That would be nice. Next year we have more close games and the guys play their hearts out. But we still have poor sideline decisions, no half time adjustments, poor time management and more dumb decisdions by Erik.
When you're trying to squeeze blood from a rock I suppose you'd look foolish more often than not. EM is a young coach who is still learning, no coach that age steps out on the field and looks like Lombardi, it takes time especially when your trying to build and win at the same time.
EM proved he has what it takes to get a team headed in the right direction, that is more than you can say about alot of coaches, some never even achieve that.
Instead of taking another step foreward next year we took 2 steps back in hopes of taking 4 steps foreward. Unfortunately the odds are against us with this move.
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I would suspect that we will drop back to 2 or 3 wins if we switch over to a 4-3 defense. It would take time to put together talent that would allow us to make that change. This team has almost no one who can play in the front 7 of a 4-3.
Short term we probably would have been better off staying with Mangini from a wins standpoint if we switch defenses. Holmgren felt that we would be better off long term, and I hope he is right.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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EM is a young coach who is still learning, no coach that age steps out on the field and looks like Lombardi, it takes time especially when your trying to build and win at the same time.
The dude had been a head coach for 5 years and he still couldn't tell time or grow a pair inside the 5! How many more years should he get?
#GMSTRONG
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I would suspect that we will drop back to 2 or 3 wins if we switch over to a 4-3 defense. It would take time to put together talent that would allow us to make that change. This team has almost no one who can play in the front 7 of a 4-3.
Short term we probably would have been better off staying with Mangini from a wins standpoint if we switch defenses. Holmgren felt that we would be better off long term, and I hope he is right.
You raise a good point, and it's not necessarily only if we switch to a 4-3. Right out of the gate, the new guy is behind schedule. Instead of preparing for the off-season, he'll be setting up his office and putting a staff in place. Instead of evaluating new players, he'll be evaluating the current team. Instead of watching college tape, he'll be watching Browns game tape. And instead of tweaking the roster, he'll be purging it of "Mangini" vets and bringing in his own. And the players, instead of moving forward, will all be starting over with a new systems. 3-13 is not unreasonable, 5-11 will look good, and a winning record will be a miracle. Let's hope for a miracle. 
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Quote:
He did make a mistake.Not backtracking.
Viable as in top choice that he might have wanted.
Doesn't mean that there wasn't someone else that he coulda brought in.But since I don't have any concrete names I can't say WHO.
The only name I heard was Chucky's.But he was locked into ESPN.
Stop trying to act like you're a judge on a throne somewhere. "Pit's court"....
Don't need to be a judge to see double talk. So just bring someone, anyone in. not someone MH saw as a long term solution?
All-righty then!
In one breath you say there was a concensus that there weren't the "right candidates" available last year at the time.
Now you say he waited a year too long. Can't have it both ways. And yes, that is backtracking, pure and simple.
If the right candidate for MH wasn't available last year, you must be suggesting that the "right thing to do" was to hire anyone other than Gini just for the sake of hiring them. What useful purpose would that have served? To repeat the process in yet another two years?
It makes no sense. So you keep hurling BS instead of facing the fact you say that you and others had it figured out the right candidate "wasn't available" in one breath and complain he should have made a move anyway in the other breath.
It's okay, we understand.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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With that in mind, I can only think of one viable reason why he kept Mangini... and that is that it was a win/win for him. I honestly think he was hoping that Mangini would succeed.. I mean why wouldn't he? But the fallback position is that if he doesn't succeed, then MH has a year to start getting his roster set his way, a year to evaluate talent, then a second draft and FA period to load up the roster for his handpicked coach... Look, he probably realized we were going to struggle this year, if he hand picks his coach last year then that guy already has one bad year under his belt and with this fanbase, that's 1 of 2 or 3 that he is going to get... now we had a great draft, we have rid ourselves of some other potential problem players, we have the #6 pick this year....
I think that is pretty much correct. ddub mentioned it earlier, and I do believe that was MH's thinking. I understand it, but still think it was a mistake because we basically killed a year of what will be a complete rebuild.
At the end of the day it isn't the end of the world, and I'm not that upset about it as long as MH and Co. hire the right staff that can be here for a long time.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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I don't stutter.."IT WAS A WASTE TO RETAIN GINI"..I don't apologize for saying it ,thats what I think..a waste.
I said at the start I understood why he kept him but just being fair to him wasn't all it was..
MH has a list and I'm sure there are names that are better in line with what he wants than Gini .
And yes I did hear a tidbit that MH couldn't get who he wanted in that short period of time..but so what?.
U can poo poo it all ya want ,like I've told you many times don't care.I see nothing gained by retaining him another year,dude could hardly improve over what he did..and the team started spiraling downhill toward the end of the year..so keep trying to hammer your point..it's done dude is out and I'm glad.
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 01/05/11 11:06 AM.
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It's very basic with or without a stutter. you don't hire a HC just for the sake of hiring a HC. What you seem to be suggesting is that wheather or not MH saw a good HC candidate he thought would be the long term answer, he should have hired one anyway. That makes zero sense. ZERO! So you think yet another "non answer" hire would have somehow made things better? Yet another debacle at the HC position would have been a better idea? Yeah, that would have been REAL professional. You make a lot of sense a lot of the time, but this one makes none. The revolving door at HC must stop and MH adding one more body to the turnstyle would have accomplished nothing. Not for the team nor the organization. That's all we;ve seen since our return is short term band-aids at QB, HC and so on. at some point you have to wait it out to get who you want. someone on a VERY short list. If you can't, anothwer band-aid won't help accomplish anything but make you look just as innept as your predecessors. All that would accomplish is people questioning MH's ability to choose a HC. That's the problem with people. With some, no matter what you do, you're wrong. Of course I'm sure MH knew there would be people like that no matter where he went. jmho
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Why don't U just admit you were a Gini guy?
I saw how he ran the team in the ground how bad his decisions were.
U don't keep a HC for the sake of keeping one.If he's bad ,he's bad,nothing will change that.
Just as it was a bad decision to bring Delhomme in and pay him all that money..or are you gonna go out and tell me Jake was a such a genuis stroke?
Dude is washed up he has nothing left..he was another waste except to tutor Colt.
And BTW like I said..Holmy has plenty of names on his card ..I'm sure plenty that would not take much to supplant Gini last year..
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I think that is pretty much correct. ddub mentioned it earlier, and I do believe that was MH's thinking. I understand it, but still think it was a mistake because we basically killed a year of what will be a complete rebuild.
This is the part of the debate that puzzles me. Let's say MH didn't see a "long term answer at the HC position available last year". (Which I don't believe he did or I think he would have made a move then)
And who are you going to get? Look at last years roster. No QB, no secondary, no nothing. Who will that attract? What GOOD coaching prospect is going to walk into that mess?
After only one draft and off season, we have a better secondary, an actual RB and better LB core. People in the league can see this. We have a better roster now and we stand a much better chance of landing a much better candidate now.
Let's say MH had hired a HC during the off season last year. Someone he really didn't have on his short list because they weren't available. A guy he had questions about. A guy he wasn't truely sold on. Are you suggesting MH would only have given the new guy *one year*?
I doubt it. I'd say the new hire would have at least gotten two seasons. If you only give him one year, you look foolish for hiring him in the first place. So that would mean it would be next year before MH could have gotten "his guy" in here.
So it seems to me he actually SAVED us a year by waiting it out. I guess we'll have to see who he ends up hiring and what their availability was last year before we know for sure. But it sure seems to me that MH had his hands full when he got here without throwing a coaching change in the middle of it too.
And if he had moved too quickly, all it would have done was make him and the organization look foolish and set us even further behind in the long run.
jmho
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Quote:
Why don't U just admit you were a Gini guy?
I saw how he ran the team in the ground how bad his decisions were.
U don't keep a HC for the sake of keeping one.If he's bad ,he's bad,nothing will change that.
Just as it was a bad decision to bring Delhomme in and pay him all that money..or are you gonna go out and tell me Jake was a such a genuis stroke?
Dude is washed up he has nothing left..he was another waste except to tutor Colt.
And BTW like I said..Holmy has plenty of names on his card ..I'm sure plenty that would not take much to supplant Gini last year..
If I were a Gini guy I would be blasting MH for firing him. I'm not. The difference is, I'm not in favor of hiring someone just for the sake of hiring someone. If you don't have some degree of certainty that he's "the guy" to take you where you want to go, what difference does it make?
You know as well as anyone if MH had hired the wrong guy, we would be even further behind than we are now. You would be sitting here blasting him for that too and claiming you knew who he should have hired but he didn't.
No, I think Gini did all-right considering we went through our complete QB roster once and then started over again. lol But this season clearly did show he wasn't the guy to take us all thew way.
I'm a Browns guy.
This will be the first time MH will be hiring a HC here. If he didn't feel a candidate was right, or available last year, I don't have an issue with it. Was I hoping Mangini would come around and be the guy? Yes I was. Why? Because that would have been the fastest way for the Browns to succeeed. But he didn't.
So yes, if finding the right HC took an extra year, IF he turns out to be the right guy who takes us to a SB, it will have been worth it. Funny how you're asking questions while you dodged all of mine, but of course.
No I didn't like the JD signing when it happened and don't like it still.
The question is, how many people does he have on his card he really feels is a long term solution? If the Browns history since their return should have taught you anything, it should be that you don't just look at coaches resume's and "insert name here" as an answer. I don't think I need to list them all for you do I?
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Is no one trying to hire Mangini?
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Is no one trying to hire Mangini?
If Mangini is hired, he lets Randy and the Browns off the hook for what he is owed. But, last time he went out and got another HC job right away. perhaps this time, he wants to take a year off and reflect (while still collecting that paycheck).
finally, unless Mangini's agent made the leak, there is no way to know if he has been contacted. teams won't want to say they contacted him and he said no thanks.
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I would think if he was the awesome head coach some here say he is that someone would have grabbed him already.
It's supposed to be hard! If it wasn't hard, everyone would do it. The hard... is what makes it great!
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And BTW like I said..Holmy has plenty of names on his card ..I'm sure plenty that would not take much to supplant Gini last year..
I'm sure you are right, MH could pick up the phone at any moment and find somebody he likes that is willing to take a HC job in the NFL.... but then that new HC would have to work with MH and TH to go find an OC and a DC and all of the position coaches and all of the other staff that it takes to coach a football team... Then once those guys were all put in place, THEN they could actually start evaluating talent, developing the playbook, etc...
So the question before you is simple, was it wiser to let the Mangini staff have another year or should we have rushed our way through a half-assed attempt at filling all of those positions, not getting our "A" options at most of them but rather our "B" and "C" options because that was who was available at the last minute... and ultimately going into last season totally unprepared..... of course then we would be going into this off-season with the option of firing a bunch of people who had only been there a year because they weren't high on our hire list to begin with or sticking with yet another staff that isn't what you wanted?
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So the question before you is simple, was it wiser to let the Mangini staff have another year or should we have rushed our way through a half-assed attempt at filling all of those positions, not getting our "A" options at most of them but rather our "B" and "C" options because that was who was available at the last minute... and ultimately going into last season totally unprepared.....
I 'll respiond because you went a step further because that went through my mind but the answer is similar..MH has a list of HC's/coordinators ..sure it would have taken more time but guess what ?We went through a rush job before.I would have liked to see what coaching team could have been put together..and if they struggled so be it.
seeing Gini's performance told me one thing ,he could go further.
I look at the 1-11 start they had and the team looked like they quit,they didn't even look like a pro team..Gini looked like he wasn't making any attempts to do anything to right the ship UNTIL Lerner make his presence felt and was ready to explode..U remember how he said he was embarrased for the fans?
Funny how thats forgotten..funny how things changed after Lerner said he needed to fix things..even before he came out,I was done with Gini..uh I was done with him after the draft and the trades..
So I look at it this way get the people U want in place and roll with them don't settle for less as Mike is now saying..
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Is no one trying to hire Mangini?
Don't know actually. Now that he's not here, I really haven't kept up with it much. But as someone mentioned, he certainly doesn't need to be in a hurry.
I think he's shown enough chinks in the armour I don't see anyone rushing out to hire him. That's the problem. There aren't all that many "great coaches in waiting" where there is this "long list" to choose from as some may suggest.
The "I want that guy" list is very short. Which is exactly why you can't just jump out and name a new HC like it's just a name on a list. Our FO personnel and the draft we had last year is far more conducive to getting a more qualified candidate in here than we had last year.
jmho
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I 'll respiond because you went a step further because that went through my mind but the answer is similar..MH has a list of HC's/coordinators ..sure it would have taken more time but guess what ?We went through a rush job before.I would have liked to see what coaching team could have been put together..and if they struggled so be it.
Yes we have done it before. that's why we're where we are now. MH wants to get it right the first time and after all we've been through, I'm glad he does.......
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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So I look at it this way get the people U want in place and roll with them don't settle for less as Mike is now saying..
I agree. Are you convinced that last year after being hired that MH had time to evaluate the Browns, hire the right HC, the right coordinators, etc?
That is really my question because I still think that if we had fired EM last year, we would have had to settle for less than we can get this year.. then right now we might be looking at firing a one year staff, which would have looked really stupid.
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I agree. Are you convinced that last year after being hired that MH had time to evaluate the Browns, hire the right HC, the right coordinators, etc?
Tell ya what,I'll go on Holmgrems own words..he could have gone to his list and made some decisions in that regard.I think it could have been done unless the x-factor is the person(s) he wanted were not available..OTHERWISE it would have been better to do.
Then if those guys are in place for the next coming season nothing else or very little has to be done with the staff next season.
Now this way IT has to be done ,and now you're looking at a possible restart if the new guy switches schemes..and keep a eye on who's being interviewed ,most of these guys are 43 guys..who knows if Ryan stays or maybe is let go.
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IF MH was convinced that EM was not the long term solution and IF MH could have assembled a staff from the TOP of his list.. then yes, keeping EM was stupid. If either of those are false, then keeping EM was the right thing to do. I could have lived with sucking this year with a new staff if MH was convinced it was the staff that would lead us into the future. As I hope you can tell by now, my only point is that it would have been stupid to fire EM last year if there was any chance that we had to settle for less than exactly what MH and TH wanted... Quote:
most of these guys are 43 guys..who knows if Ryan stays or maybe is let go.
I want my new HC to work with MH to pick his DC, I don't want Ryan forced upon the new HC... I'm one of the few on here that seems to not be absolutely in love with Ryan.. I like the guy, I think he does ok.. I am NOT of the opinion that he can't be replaced.
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I don't think anyone doesn't think he can't be replaced. I certainly wouldn't mind if we hired Wade Phillips for DC (better fit than Houston since they run the 4-3 and he has done his best work in a 3-4).
But, I also thought he did an admirable job here. I wouldn't want to just replace Rob Ryan with some random 4-3 guy just for the sake of switching to the 4-3.
I'm also of the mind that former-HCs tend to make better OC/DC, so I wouldn't mind giving John Fox the DC role if we did need to make the switch to the 4-3.
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I get where you're coming ..it appears he was trying to be fair..but just knowing what philosophy Gini is as opposed to Mike it never looked good and I really wasn't hypnotized by those last 4 wins.
Thought they really didn't tell the whole story.
I was still miffed but that horrendus 1- 11 start.
As far as Ryan goes I'm in that minority,because I didn't like the blitz packages he used and exposed his DB's.regardless that Elam sucks ,you don't put a guy with no instincts in situations where he actually has to use his brain more than he can.
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum ESPN reports mangini has been
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