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I still read because we are both fairly seasoned, long term members, and I enjoy a good chuckle.
Peen...I know you did not make the statement
No, I did make that comment.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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I still read because we are both fairly seasoned, long term members, and I enjoy a good chuckle.
Peen...I know you did not make the statement
peen...damn...I even told you where the answer was...
Is it true that the Browns would only be the 2nd team in the NFL without an offensive coordinator, if Holmgren does not hire someone to fill the OC position?
IT'S NOT A TRICK QUESTION... 
No, I did make that comment.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
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I still read because we are both fairly seasoned, long term members, and I enjoy a good chuckle.
Peen...I know you did not make the statement but let me ask you if the following statement is true...
..."Now we are hearing that the Browns may go against general conventional wisdom and be only the 2nd team to go without an offensive coordinator."...
Peen...Would the Browns "be only the 2nd team to go without an offensive coordinator"?....if Holmgren did not hire an offensive coordinator this season...
Hint...the answer is posted in the list of HCs who call their own plays !!!
Who the hell cares what other teams have or have not done. Either way, it's not a "for sure" road map for us...
It tells us nothing, it assures us of nothing and in general, means nothing..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Why mac? Did I somehow miss a 2nd team last year that did not employ an offensive coordinator last year? Is that where you're going? That maybe there was a 2nd team that didn't employ an offensive coordinatopr .... and that maybe a 2nd team wold make it "not a rare occurance"? What ever, I don't care. If we do go this route, I won't like it. If you do .... great. Enjoy. Knock yourself out. Please. 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Not sure if serious. This has to be sarcasm.
Why is our picture linking and upload limit on this board so small? I've been waiting to break out my Worf Facepalm gif and this post was right down the plate.
That image is awesome. 
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YTBF is on solid ground.
And for the record, he is a solid member.
He has a opinion and I respect him sticking to his guns. It's easy to make a post or two then stop. It takes some effort to stick with it when it seems 95% of the board doesn't agree.
Good post. I admire you for having YTown's back, a guy who's been a good long-standing Dawgtalker.
I am on the fence. I could see reasons for firingh EM, I saw good reasons for keeping him.
In the end I just want to win, but guess what, Mike? Clock's ticking.
Holmgren has now made 3 HC decisions for the Browns:
1. He kept Mangini
2. He fired Mangini.
3. He hired Shurmur.
The Shurmur hire better work out. Soon.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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In all fairness, it is really easy to be in the "Shurmur is a bad hire" group. Every GM/HC the Browns have hired since 1999 has been a short lived dud. Being a MH hater is easy. Saying that the clock is ticking is easy... the Browns have had 1 playoff appearance since 1999.
Phil Savage and RC were fired a year after going 10-6.
The "MH has made 3 coaching decisions" comment is a bit ridiculous.
1. He kept Mangini
2. He fired Mangini
Was there never supposed to be step 3? Browns were going to be coachless? Also, seems like you are knocking MH for giving EM a year to prove himself. EM was a first year coach who went 5-11. MH extended him the opportunity to prove he should stay...
I don't understand the loyalty to EM. There were so many games that were just flat out unwatchable down the stretch.
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YTBF is on solid ground.
And for the record, he is a solid member.
He has a opinion and I respect him sticking to his guns. It's easy to make a post or two then stop. It takes some effort to stick with it when it seems 95% of the board doesn't agree.
Good post. I admire you for having YTown's back, a guy who's been a good long-standing Dawgtalker.
I am on the fence. I could see reasons for firingh EM, I saw good reasons for keeping him.
In the end I just want to win, but guess what, Mike? Clock's ticking.
Holmgren has now made 3 HC decisions for the Browns:
1. He kept Mangini
2. He fired Mangini.
3. He hired Shurmur.
The Shurmur hire better work out. Soon.
Count me in that group with Peen. IMO, YTBF has very very legit concerns. I'm still very much on the fence as regards Mangini. His firing is not a deal breaker for me, however.. the FO's subsequent moves after Mangini ARE a big concern for me. IMO, we've done a poor job since January 2nd.
Holmgren is going to have to earn my my approval as a fan. I'm NOT automatically giving him my official okie dokie until I see results HERE and not what he did somewhere else with another system, other players and other coaches.
So far what I see underwhelms me. The best I see so far is grabbing that guy from the Bears. Shurm strikes me as warm milk. Not cold beer, not a cold coke.. but warm milk. It remains to be seen if he's a puppet.
SaintDawg™
Football, baseball, basketball, wine, women, walleye
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I will be stunned...flat out STUNNED if we win more than 2 games next year. Combine lack of talent, unproven QB, total defensive rebuild, force playing rookies (due to lack of talent), a rookie HC...who just happens to double as our OC...in a division with Pitt and Balt making up 4 of our games? Yeah, good luck with that.
Shurmur might not last the year...and if that's the case Holmgren may not either (deservedly so).
I could TOTALLY disagree! 2 wins only, is a special kind of bad.
It almost takes work to get less than 3 wins, I think they can get more than 2 wins, just by making the right draft picks, and that isn't even until April,.
Heckert is not new
Holmgren is not new
McCoy is not new
Haden, and Ward are both coming back?
If you can bring back Vickers, Hillis, Robiskie, Momass, and Stuckey, the two tight ends, you can count on 4 wins from the players overcoming a new coach.
You don't have to necessarily bring in BAD players, or put up with BAD play from the players you do bring in.
You don't think Schurmur has something to Prove?
Do you think Mack and Thomas are going to allow for a team that gets routed every week? Or anyone else on that current offensive line?
Do you think Senaca Wallace can't make thing happen, or even Jake Delhomme?
Stunned if they win more than 2 games next year?
These are professionals, I wouldn't be stunned if they won the Super Bowl next year.
These are professional, I wouldn't be stunned if they make the playoffs next year.
If they can keep the team together.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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The "MH has made 3 coaching decisions" comment is a bit ridiculous.
Not at all. Count them, again, merth: kept Mangini, then fired him, hired another guy.
That's three (3).
gmstrong -----------------
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J/C
I don't have a problem with people having their opinions on whether the coaching moves are good or not.
But, it seems like the complaining is more of the same "culture of losing."
We're the Browns, so every decision we make will fail and we will never have a winnings team.
I guess I am taking the approach that I EXPECT our new coaches to come in and win. Yeah, there may be a transition, but I EXPECT results soon.
Look at the perennial winning teams. One of their guys goes down, they expect the backup to come in and succeed. When we run into any adversity, we think" oh God, we're doomed."
Once again, people can have their opinions. I'm just going to stay positive and keep my expectations high. Doesn't do me much good to be depressed about it.
After all, in the grand scheme of things, it's just a football team.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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The "MH has made 3 coaching decisions" comment is a bit ridiculous.
Not at all. Count them, again, merth: kept Mangini, then fired him, hired another guy.
That's three (3).
actually, it is ridiculous..... unless, there is some sort of Holmgren hater agenda.
he inherited Mangini, gave the guy a year because he didn't feel it fair to fire a guy after one year.... And then made a decision to go a different direction with a scheme Holmgren knows.
Back to the topic of the thread. I really don't like the idea of going without an offensive coordinator. The one thing giving me hope is that i would have expected a press conference to introduce the new staff. Maybe, with superbowl week, this has been put on hold. Or just maybe, the offensive coordinator to be will be coaching this sunday..... Guess this will all be sorted out in about a week.
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Why mac? Did I somehow miss a 2nd team last year that did not employ an offensive coordinator last year?
YT...now you are talking about two different seasons...last season 2010...and the coming season 2011..
I was responding to this claim by you...
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..."Now we are hearing that the Browns may go against general conventional wisdom and be only the 2nd team to go without an offensive coordinator."...
Referring to the upcoming season, 2011...the Browns would be the fourth team to go without an offensive coordinator.
Bill Belichick
Jason Garrett
Ken Whisenhunt
Pat Shurmur
Todd Haley listed as HC/OC
Everyone needs to understand this...the fact these 4 HCs have no OC and 1 HC who is listed as HC/OC...this does not mean that have someone else is not filling helping with the OC duties.
For example, Patriots HC Bill Belichick is calling the Patriots offensive plays even if the record shows the Patriots have no OC. He has people helping him with the OC duties, preparing the offensive game plan, breaking down film, run practice drills, etc.
If Shurmur does not have an OC this season, there will be someone helping Shurmur with the OC duties. It might be QB coach Whipple and/or RB coach Gary Brown helping out...and/or one or more of the many assistant coaches the Browns will hire.
Also, as I pointed out, there are another 8 HC who have someone listed as their teams OC, who will not be calling the plays but will be helping the HC with the duties of the OC.
This trend of HCs calling their team's plays is growing in the NFL and the Browns are now part of that trend. Belichick has done it for years and Holmgren did it when he was a HC so it's not like it has not been done before now.
The logic behind this growing trend of HCs calling their team's offensive plays, is rooted in simple common sense. Team's looking to improve themselves on the offensive side will target someone who is an Offensive Coordinator for another NFL team..just as the Browns did.
Most of those OCs hired to be HCs are going to bring their offensive scheme/playbook with them and install it as their team's new offense. No one is going to know more about a particular offense than the ex-OC, now HC of their team.
Who becomes the best qualified individual to install a new offense and call the plays?...the new HC...who used to be an OC.
In the Browns case, Shurmur is the best qualified individual to install his offense and teach it to the Browns offensive unit. Shurmur is also going to be the most qualified individual to call the plays, unless there is someone that Shurmur trusts to install, teach and run (call the plays) for his offense.
If you are the HC (ex-OC), ultimately responsible for the performance of your team and you know you are the most qualified to handle the OC duties, are you gonna turn that job over to someone less qualified?...NO, you are not.
This concept is no different than a HC who used to be a DC and installs his defense to be run by the team he is now HC of. In Mangini's case, there were times when he made the defensive calls rather than trust Ryan to do the play calling.
I'm guessing that HCs feel they are best qualified and if it's their job on the line, they want to call the plays themselves. This way, there is no second guessing by the HC and you can't blame the OC.
If the Browns do not fill the OC position, it is not a reason to "panic"...the sky is not falling..no need for the "negativism" some exhibit with each post they make.
In the future, the Shurmur might find someone he trusts to run his offense for him but it could take a while. He will either teach an understudy or hire someone from another team. Shurmur and Whipple might turnout to be a good team and eventually, maybe Whipple will take over as OC.
I'm not a "negative" person like so many on this message board. I always try to remain positive and even more so now that the Browns are being run by Holmgren, someone who actually knows football and has decades of experience.
Those of you worried about everything under the sun, posting nothing but negativism, need to do a "man check"...
“There is little difference in people, but that little difference makes a big difference. The little difference is attitude. The big difference is whether it is positive or negative.”
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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The "MH has made 3 coaching decisions" comment is a bit ridiculous.
Not at all. Count them, again, merth: kept Mangini, then fired him, hired another guy.
That's three (3).
I think you could better revise the MH coaching train... He kept Mangini for like 365 days, now MH has kept Shurmur for like 18 days... Clearly MH has made 383 coaching decisions...
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Arizona has two offensive coordinators.
Last year one team had no OC. This year no more than four teams will have offensive coordinators, assuming that the Chiefs do not hire one. That's 64 coaching staffs over two seasons, with 5 of those 64 staffs having no OC. 3.125% in 2010. 12.5% in 2011. 7.8% overall for the two.
Pretty rare, in my book.
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Wow. That's "mac logic" for certain.  Can you tell me what the results for those teams in 2011 will be? Please, enlighten me with your wisdom.. On 2nd thought ... don't. I responded, originally, to this question: Can anyone shed light on the success (or lack there of...) of other teams that run or have run their offenses like this? Is it a rarity? Happen often? I have no clue . . . That doesn't mean that no teams might do it going forward. Hell, for all we know teams might go without head coaches next year. That doesn't mean that it will work. Garret moved from OC to HC with the Cowboys. At least he has a feel for the offense he will be running, and an experienced pair of QBs. Did the Cowboys run this system last year? Only by necessait, because they fired their previous head coach. It remains to be seen how it will work in the long run. How does Ken Whisenhunt not have an offensive coordinator? They have a "Running Game Coordinator" and a "Passing Game Coordinator". He might call his plays, but he is not the offensive coordinator. How did Todd Haley do last year as OC? I'm curious. Can you post the results he had last year functioning as OC? mac, not even Mr Fantastic and Plastic Man could match your stretches.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Parity has placed an emphasis on coaching like never before. If you have a good gm and a good coach things turn around swiftly.
Atlanta went from JOKE to HOPE in one season and now two seasons later are arguably the best team in the NFC.
Just this past year the Chiefs, Bucs, Rams, Bears, Raiders all made huge leaps in how their teams performed.
We have some holes but we also aren't void of talent either. I wont start guessing record until the draft and free agency situations are completed but If we can keep our better talent, i see no reason why we can't improve upon our record of the last 3 years.
Benard, Roth and Wright are musts to retain.
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Benard, Roth and Wright are musts to retain.
Do you play Roth and Benard at DE in Jauron's defense? I'm not sure that Roth would want to make that change at this time in his career, and won't have to if he doesn't want to given that he's a free agent. Why wouldn't he sign with a team with a need at 3-4 OLB where he knows what he's doing instead of taking a risk of transitioning to a new position at this point in his career?
Benard actually played DE in college ..... but it was a loose defense. He's been banged up a bit playing LB so I kind of worry about him playing at DE. Too bad we didn't hang on to Wimbley at this point ...... because he might have filled a need at DE for us.
I am torn on Wright. The kid definitely has talent, but he's never been a great tackler. Jauron's defense requires that everyone be a solid to great tackler.That's one of those that I'm not sure on, and could see going either way.
I would expect to see a fairly large roster turnover this year, with a lot of younger players coming in. (especially on defense) If we dumped every LB except Fujita it really wouldn't surprise me. Now, I know that's not going to happen ... I'm just saying that none of our LB really fit a Jauron defense. DL is the same way. We definitely keep Rubin .... but I would not be surprised by us dumping any of the others.
I do think that we'll at least try to re-sign Elam. He might do well as a more traditional FS in a cover 2 defense. Again though, that's one of those that I can see going either way. I would put him as closer to fitting than many of our players. Obviously Haden, Ward, Brown, and Adams all fit.
It will be interesting to see how the roster changes over the next 6 months.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Roth really has never been a real linebacker. He played 3-4 DE or rush linebacker. No real difference for him.
Benard is our best pass rusher. At worst he is a 3rd down situational pass rusher.
Wimbley trade is what brought Colt to the Browns. Might have actually been a good trade for the Browns and the Raiders.
There will be a roster turnover but we have a number of players that should be able to adjust to the 4-3.
Titus brown, Costanza, Maiva, DQ, Fujita and Gocong (least likely to fit but has played in Jim Johnson 4-3) should make the roster. We also picked up Steven Octavien another small speedy backer.
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All this talk about switching and what player can and can't...What did these guys all play in college???
My bet is MOST were in a 4-3 so they KNOW...
Go Browns!!!
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Not to mention that I would rather have bernard or roth coming in as backups or rotating in (assuming we get quality starters) than an undrafted free agent. My guess is we wont be playing the 4-3 EVERY down, and if we try to make things cute and go to a nickel in some situations whether it's a 4-2-5 or a 3-3-5 we could still use guys like roth and bernard to either exclusively passrush or even play a drop-end role on zone blitzes ...
IF (big if) Jauron could use them creatively... I think Roth and Bernard would be AMAZING backups ... starters in this Defense? I'm not 100% sold yet
"Believe deep down in your heart that you're destined to do great things."
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Roth has played OLB for 6 years in the NFL. I doubt that he's looking to change positions.
Maybe he is, but I can't really recall a whole lot of established veteran players changing positions and making an impact. There have been a few ..... but it doesn't seem to me that there have been all that many. I would think that his safest path to success is to sign elsewhere as a LB rather than sign here as a DE.
That's just how I suspect that he will look at it.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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It will be more about getting rid of old and slow than anything else. We need speed and playmaking ability on both sides of the ball. There will be some stiff competition for spots as we try to get younger and faster.
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I will say it once more, he was never a linebacker other than in name. He was always at the line of scrimmage either playing the run or rushing the passer. It may have said OLB on the roster sheet but he was NOT a linebacker.
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All this talk about switching and what player can and can't...What did these guys all play in college???
My bet is MOST were in a 4-3 so they KNOW...
I agree....all of that is blown out of proportion.
I do agree with Mour in that we need a serious injection of speed.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I will say it once more, he was never a linebacker other than in name. He was always at the line of scrimmage either playing the run or rushing the passer. It may have said OLB on the roster sheet but he was NOT a linebacker.
He played OLB for us.
He set the edge better than ony other LB we have. He rushed the passer. He played the run, probably better than any other LB we have except for Fujita. He even covered a RB or TE on occasion. He had a couple of passes defensed. He played OLB in a 3-4. He may have played close to the line, but that's what an OLB in the 3-4 does. Look at how the Steelers and Packers play their LBs. Are their OLBs "really" DEs? Of course not. They are 3-4 OLB.
Plus, in 6 years, Roth has 20 sacks total. He had a nice run at the end of last year, but other than that hasn't been a pass rushing force. He's started 44 games in 6 years, all at OLB. He was used as a situational pass rusher mostly in the 2 years before he became a starter.
We'll see what happens when he has a chance to leave. Either he stays and plays DE, or moves on and plays OLB, as he has for his entire professional career. I suspect that he will prefer to leave to be a OLB. We'll see.
********* Well .... I will do a serious mea culpa here. It seems that Roth did play DE in 2007 for the Dolphins in a 4-3. In 2007, as a starting DE for the Dolphins, he had 44 tackles and 3 sacks.
Last edited by YTownBrownsFan; 02/02/11 12:58 PM.
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Four teams that would love to have Roth: pit, rats, NE & Jets. Yay. 
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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jc..
Head coach success/fail debate is about useless.
If we would have hired Belichick from the Jets instead of him going to NE, people would be up in arms that he sucked the first time, blah blah blah. But in hindsight he turned out OK in NE. And judging from his steady success there I have to say it has to be partly him not just talent on the team, cause over 10 years that same talent hasn't always been there.
Now Shurmur may or may not work out in the long run, but you could bring Lombardi or Brown from the grave, it doesn't guarantee success. And successful coaches aren't exactly walking the street after the season ends. There's 32 positions available, and any given year only 6-8 open up.
Everyone complains if you take a cast off from a bad team that released their HC, so what does that leave?
Good HC aren't out of a job, so you have to pluck away and hope you find the next one. Even then it takes a solid team, teachable players, good game plans, and a desire to win under any circumstance. In the end, even Belichick, Walsh, Parcells, Brown, Lombardi would suck if his players didn't execute.
Last edited by FloridaFan; 02/02/11 01:28 PM.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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The "MH has made 3 coaching decisions" comment is a bit ridiculous.
Not at all. Count them, again, merth: kept Mangini, then fired him, hired another guy.
That's three (3).
I think you could better revise the MH coaching train... He kept Mangini for like 365 days, now MH has kept Shurmur for like 18 days... Clearly MH has made 383 coaching decisions...
I got to admit, merth: I laughed at that. 
and to the other poster: I am not anti-Holmgren, at all.
Last edited by lampdogg; 02/02/11 06:04 PM.
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mac, not even Mr Fantastic and Plastic Man could match your stretches.
I'm laughing because every post I've read from you has been full of reaches, stretches, and your over bloated opinion. By overbloated, I mean that no matter what anybody says to prove anything, you have a negative response and come off as if nobodies opinion but yours has merit. Above, Mac presented a coherent and reasonable opinion on the situation, only to have you poo poo it, just the way you claim is being done to you. His points are valid, and sensible, unless you refuse to consider what he says outright, as you appear to be doing.
We get you stance, but rehashing the same arguements over and over is getting stale. You have over taken every thread with your gospel of disagreement with anything Holmgren does. You absolutely refuse to show any typr of reasonble objectiveness, and try hard to belittle anybody who disagrees. I have to wonder if you are just doing this to try to become some sort of "legend" , for lack of a better word, like Diam and Vers did for a while.
You call it debate, all I see is a shout down. You were always IMO one of the better posters, but you are quickly becoming a spectacle of sorts.
sorry...JMHO
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Legend
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You are perfectly entitled to your opinion.
I think it's wrong, of course, but you are entitled to think as you will.
I don't go from :
"It's rare, only 1 team did this thing last year" to "It's not rare, 4 of 32 teams might do this thing next year" .......
But .. carry on as you will.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Legend
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Legend
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2 more teams name their Offensive Coordinators .... http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2011/02/cleveland_browns_cornerback_jo.htmlThe Chiefs named offensive line coach Bill Muir as offensive coordinator to replace Charlie Weis. . . . The Bengals hired Arena Football League veteran Jay Gruden as their offensive coordinator. The 43-year-old Gruden is the younger brother of former NFL coach Jon Gruden. He was an assistant for seven years with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, including for his brother's 2002 season Super Bowl champions.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Legend
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Legend
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2 more teams name their Offensive Coordinators ....
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2011/02/cleveland_browns_cornerback_jo.html
The Chiefs named offensive line coach Bill Muir as offensive coordinator to replace Charlie Weis. . . .
The Bengals hired Arena Football League veteran Jay Gruden as their offensive coordinator. The 43-year-old Gruden is the younger brother of former NFL coach Jon Gruden. He was an assistant for seven years with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, including for his brother's 2002 season Super Bowl champions.
You gotta wonder why we didn't go after Jay Gruden.. I'm guessing he's a WCO kinda guy having worked for his brother for 7 years.... Oh well..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Dunno. I have this fear that we're going to manage to outsmart ourselves by trying to reinvent the wheel. I know that some will say that I'm a hater or some other crap .....
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Legend
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Legend
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Dunno.
I have this fear that we're going to manage to outsmart ourselves by trying to reinvent the wheel.
I know that some will say that I'm a hater or some other crap .....
Your a hater and some other crap.... now that we got that out of the way!
I understand the reluctance of some to embrace these changes.. I mean, hell, they aren't typical and certainly, some of this wasn't expected.
Shumur wasn't exactly on anyones top 5 list of potential coaches for the Browns was he. Jauron, it could be argued that he's a retread. Switching to a WCO and a 4-3 D (which has yet to be officially announced but I'd bet on it). Whipple as the QB Coach, Potentially no OC and the HC calling the Offensive plays..
Not conventional and certainly not typical. So I get it.
But here is the saving grace.. Holmgren has been a winner everywhere he's been. SF, GB and Seattle. Until he proves otherwise, I'm going to accept his plan. A plan, I might add, that actually hasn't had a chance to fully play out.
I don't want to hear that he wasn't successful as a GM/HC. Most aren't. It's actually a fluke when it happens. so big deal.
Speculation on the OC could change come monday or tuesday of next week. (if it does, my "grasp of the obvious" bet is that it's someone from GB)
Last edited by Damanshot; 02/04/11 01:18 PM.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Speculation on the OC could change come monday or tuesday of next week. (if it does, my "grasp of the obvious" bet is that it's someone from GB)
My thinking exactly. I'll be checking frequently at the beginning of next week to see if anything happens. I think it would be nice if Clements were brought in to be the OC with the understanding that he'd be given play calling duties by the beginning of next season.
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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Quote:
Speculation on the OC could change come monday or tuesday of next week. (if it does, my "grasp of the obvious" bet is that it's someone from GB)
My thinking exactly. I'll be checking frequently at the beginning of next week to see if anything happens. I think it would be nice if Clements were brought in to be the OC with the understanding that he'd be given play calling duties by the beginning of next season.
Play calling by the beginning of next season? I don't know,, I think if he were brought in and Shumur felt good about him at any point during the season,, that's when it would happen...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Good point, Daman. I would hope it could be earlier than next season w/ next season being the latest.
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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By next season, I actually mean before the 2012 season. I am in dire need of a weekend!
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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Legend
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Legend
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By next season, I actually mean before the 2012 season. I am in dire need of a weekend!
LOL I knew what you meant...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Whipple signed as QB coach- No OC
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