Nope, and I won't even pay you a penny to "find out" who it was.
We had slavery in those days too. Surely you aren't suggesting that we return to the politics of that era?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: As someone that admittedly chooses to "live a meager lifestyle" working a few days a month, you agree with everything that comes down the pike that requires the government to fund it.....and you are completely ignorant of the fact that the government can't afford it. No sweat off your non-taxpaying back. Doesn't it bother you in the least that the money must come from those of us that have to work for a living? There's going to be a time in the near future when the freebie well will dry up. Good gosh, what will you do?
You sure are warm and cozy with the elite of the country. Hello Mr. Rockefeller. In your ideal America all Americans work for minimum wage, any worker that has an issue at their job can only speak with their boss person to person where they are fired and replaced by another worker that will make even less. Unions exist to protect the worker and fight for worker's rights.
Wisconsin is blatantly trying to break the union. They want teachers to make even less than they do now, which isn't much. All the while, making them pay for healthcare that in the end denies them the life-saving operations they need. In the Wisconsin that the current governor wants - there are no worker's rights. You work for your company 7 days a week 12+ hours every day. Unions gave America the 8 hour workday and 5 day workweek. Before unions, workers gave their soul to their jobs - literally. They were worked to death for nothing. All the while, robber barons lived like kings.
That is the ideal America for the right wing. Workers having absolutely no righs while the CEO's lived like Roman Emperors. Nobody remembers the past. You and your ilk are determined to destroy the working class and turn them into a slave class. The Democratic representatives in Wisconsin are forcing the Republicans out of the vote. As soon as a single Democratic representative shows up the Republicans will destroy the union and elimate all worker's rights.
Considering the number of right wing republicans that actually are lower middle and middle class.. your diatribe makes absolutely no sense. Why would we all want to destroy our own standard of living like that?
Quote: As soon as a single Democratic representative shows up the Republicans will destroy the union and elimate all worker's rights.
I'm not in a union, I have rights at my work place. I make a good salary, I get bonuses and vacations and I work a 5 hour day, usually I work more than 40 hours but I get paid a 40 hour salary... sometimes I work weekends when I have to. My bosses know that to attract the best people you have to make the job attractive through decent compensation, benefits package, perks, etc... other bosses know this too. If the jobs in Wisconsin suck that bad then people will leave and nobody will fill the jobs and then they will have to adjust, offer more money, offer better benefits, etc...
Quote: I'm not in a union, I have rights at my work place. I make a good salary, I get bonuses and vacations and I work a 5 hour day, usually I work more than 40 hours but I get paid a 40 hour salary... sometimes I work weekends when I have to. My bosses know that to attract the best people you have to make the job attractive through decent compensation, benefits package, perks, etc... other bosses know this too. If the jobs in Wisconsin suck that bad then people will leave and nobody will fill the jobs and then they will have to adjust, offer more money, offer better benefits, etc...
That is what they want you to think. This is about destroying unions and also destroying any political opposition. Right-wingers know that unions tend to be left-leaning. So, how to make it so that only Republicans can have groups to raise money? Eliminating unions. That's how! As soon as right-wingers make it so that only they can have third party groups backing them. The democratic process is over and this becomes a fascist state.
Right-wingers are determined to destroy any poltical opposition and workers rights and Wisconsin is the largest battleground. If they do it in Wisconsin, what is to stop them from doing it in other states? Every single union in Wisconsin should shut the workforce down. Destroy Wisconsin's economy if they have to. The same with the Democratic members that are in hiding. The only way they should return to work is if their demands are met. Have the entire state on strike. Wisconsin's governor only wants scab workers.
You say it is great not having a union to back up your worker's rights? What prevents your boss from firing you the second you have a labor dispute?
The answer: NOTHING
Collective bargaining exists to make a compromise. The workers have a grievance and they voice it with their union. The union representatives acts as a mediator between the worker and the company. The worker(s) with the complaint are anonymous and the company has no idea what workers are having issue. But, eliminate the Collective Bargaining. It's a face to face between the worker(s) and the company. Nothing - absolutely nothing - prevents the company from then firing the workers.
The only thing that prevents my boss from firing me is ..... my own competence and ability to deliver results.
It is also what allowed me to increase my salary by over 50% in just under 4 years.
I do a great job for my employer, and deliver results. If I felt that my employer asn't fairly compensating me, I would walk away and go elsewhere. (as I did from my former employer over bonuses)
I have no need for someone else to do my negotiating for me. I have no desire to have someone else set my earning limits either. That is a matter between myself and my employer. If I do the job I say I will, I expect to be fairly compensated for doing so. If I am not, then I am free to take my track record and ability to create success elsewhere.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: The only thing that prevents my boss from firing me is ..... my own competence and ability to deliver results.
It is also what allowed me to increase my salary by over 50% in just under 4 years.
I do a great job for my employer, and deliver results. If I felt that my employer asn't fairly compensating me, I would walk away and go elsewhere. (as I did from my former employer over bonuses)
I have no need for someone else to do my negotiating for me. I have no desire to have someone else set my earning limits either. That is a matter between myself and my employer. If I do the job I say I will, I expect to be fairly compensated for doing so. If I am not, then I am free to take my track record and ability to create success elsewhere.
Great little mindset you have there. Wait untill the companies decide to cut your wages though. Good luck finding another job with that entitlement attitude. You may have a "cushy" job now. But when the company decides to slash your wages and you voice your disapproval and expect to be able to find another well-paying job at another company - and they in turn pay you less than you expect. The other companies even less with longer hours. You won't have a job and then you'll settle for pennies because you are so desperate to find a job.
Poor people would be severely impacted, along with poorer children. Those with money would probably either stay home and home school their kids, send them to private schools, or move. It's not going to devastate them.
What about the poor in the state .... those who rely upon government services, and government money coming in each and every month? What happens to them? Do you abandon them in pursuit of your high minded ideals?
Destroy the economy? Unlikely. That would destroy the very jobs, wages, and benefits they desire.
This isn't a fight over "equal" treatment, it is a desire to maintain the unequal benefits that the state unions have gained over the years. The unions have benefit packages unmatched by the vast majority of people in the workforce. That vast majority with inferior benefits ..... those are the people who pay for the superior benefits of state employees. Taxpayers. Why should taxpayers have to reach even deeper into their own packets to support an elitist lifestyle and benefits package for so called public servants?
As far as the Democrats .... they should be given a week to return, and then the Governor should declare their seats abandoned and vacated, and hold new special elections to fill those vacated seats. Let the Democrats return to the state to fight that ...... or stay away and lose in abstensia. The choice is .... entirely theirs.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Poor people would be severely impacted, along with poorer children. Those with money would probably either stay home and home school their kids, send them to private schools, or move. It's not going to devastate them.
What about the poor in the state .... those who rely upon government services, and government money coming in each and every month? What happens to them? Do you abandon them in pursuit of your high minded ideals?
Destroy the economy? Unlikely. That would destroy the very jobs, wages, and benefits they desire.
This isn't a fight over "equal" treatment, it is a desire to maintain the unequal benefits that the state unions have gained over the years. The unions have benefit packages unmatched by the vast majority of people in the workforce. That vast majority with inferior benefits ..... those are the people who pay for the superior benefits of state employees. Taxpayers. Why should taxpayers have to reach even deeper into their own packets to support an elitist lifestyle and benefits package for so called public servants?
As far as the Democrats .... they should be given a week to return, and then the Governor should declare their seats abandoned and vacated, and hold new special elections to fill those vacated seats. Let the Democrats return to the state to fight that ...... or stay away and lose in abstensia. The choice is .... entirely theirs.
You know full well that the governor is sitting there living a posh lifestyle while he dictates that everyday workers take pay cuts. He is sitting there living like a king. You know full well that politicians are millionaires - they have to be in order to run. Chaos hurts everybody - sure. The poor know what it is like to have very little. They can sustain themselves on very little. The wealthy? The second they can't have their caviar they feel the pinch. The second they can't find somebody to come and clean their house - they feel the pinch.
This is a fight over worker's rights. The governor of Wisconsin wants to eliminate the worker's right to bargain. Collective Bargaining is the principle purpose of a union. If the governor decides to eliminate the democratic representatives by holding a special election - who will vote? Who will cross the picket lines to vote?
The only person acting high and mighty right now is the governor and his cronies. Having policemen go to the homes of the Democratic representatives to force them to go to the quorum that way he and his right-wingers can force a vote to eliminate worker's rights? That's not a democracy. Forcing people - under threat - to vote? Heavy-handed tactics like that are what you expect of the Gestapo and the Brown-coats.
It is the workers who toil. It is the workers who lay the foundations to every building that goes up. It is the workers that lay the stone. It is the workers who slave and toil to build the economy. It is not the greedy parasitic CEO's. They sit around with their hoarded cash. They do, not the workers. The union is what makes workers strong. When workers get together collectiveley that eliminates the injustice done to workers.
The gov. in Wisconsin is, plain and simply, asking the elected representatives to do their job. You know, the job they wanted? The job they get paid to do? The job that they aren't doing, but are still getting paid for?
Amazingly, you are FOR people getting paid for not doing their job? Imagine that.
Quote: The gov. in Wisconsin is, plain and simply, asking the elected representatives to do their job. You know, the job they wanted? The job they get paid to do? The job that they aren't doing, but are still getting paid for?
Amazingly, you are FOR people getting paid for not doing their job? Imagine that.
I'm for the workers that are striking. This is no different than a strike. The governor of Wisconsin wants to do away with the unions. Eliminate collective bargaining and eliminate worker's rights.
This is a fight between elitist benefits for state union workers and the ordinary taxpayers who have to pay for them.
I believe that this was one of the issues in the latest round of elections in Wisconsin that, like so many other states, saw a Republican tsunami.
I doubt that ordinary people are sitting at home thinking "God bless those illegal strikers for not teaching my kids. I don't care if they have to raise my taxes, or if I lose my job ........... I hope they get an even better and more expensive package as a result!"
It's an illegal strike, and it is illegal for the Democrats to have abandoned the state they are supposed to serve. It is specifically illegal under Wisconsin law. I guess that doesn't matter to folks like you though.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: You sure are warm and cozy with the elite of the country. Hello Mr. Rockefeller.
Lol! I'm warm and cozy with a bunch of middle class folks that work for a living. You won't find me in the society pages.
Quote: In your ideal America all Americans work for minimum wage, any worker that has an issue at their job can only speak with their boss person to person where they are fired and replaced by another worker that will make even less.
You are full of crap. In my ideal, people that work are paid a fair wage, excellence is rewarded, laziness and incompetence are not protected, and raises and promotions are based on merit.
Quote: Wisconsin is blatantly trying to break the union. They want teachers to make even less than they do now, which isn't much. All the while, making them pay for healthcare that in the end denies them the life-saving operations they need.
You're so full of crap I'll bet you leave brown footprints. The average salary not including benefits for a teacher in Wisconsin public schools is well over 50k. Not too shabby for a 9 month per year job. I also read where their benefit package is worth over 40k per year.
You're so full of BS, I'm not going to respond to the rest of your post. Anyway, it's pointless to have a labor discussion with someone that chooses not to work and mooch off those that do.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul. - John Muir
Quote: This is a fight between elitist benefits for state union workers and the ordinary taxpayers who have to pay for them.
I believe that this was one of the issues in the latest round of elections in Wisconsin that, like so many other states, saw a Republican tsunami.
I doubt that ordinary people are sitting at home thinking "God bless those illegal strikers for not teaching my kids. I don't care if they have to raise my taxes, or if I lose my job ........... I hope they get an even better and more expensive package as a result!"
It's an illegal strike, and it is illegal for the Democrats to have abandoned the state they are supposed to serve. It is specifically illegal under Wisconsin law. I guess that doesn't matter to folks like you though.
This is a fight between right-wing corporate interests and the rights of workers. The right-wing wants to eliminate workers rights and create a fascist state. They want to run the nation like company. Politically and economically. The working class is being held hostage by the corporatist interests of the governor. The sole goal of Walker is to eliminate the union and the worker's right to collectively bargain.
All of you right-wingers are of the idea that all workers are lazy. Typical elitist view. You go ahead and stay cozy with your CEO's that make 500x what you make. Maybe they'll give you some scraps from their table.
No, the working class is being held hostage by the unions that fail to see there is no more money........the unions that fail to see the state is bankrupt.....the unions that fail to see there is no more money, the free ride is over. The unions that fail to see that it just can't work financially.
No. The public employee unions are the ones holding the working class hostage.
Is there any kind of "screw the middle class, Tea Party Koolaide" you guys won't suck up? Seriously? The good, maybe great benefits a teacher gets to go along with the lousy pay to be the people responsible for turning your kids into to something resembling an educated person...
Teachers, Cops, Firefighters, Social Workers... These are not rich people hoarding tax payers dollars. Get a clue people. The only thing going on here is misdirection of anger.
Quote: Is there any kind of "screw the middle class, Tea Party Koolaide" you guys won't suck up? Seriously? The good, maybe great benefits a teacher gets to go along with the lousy pay to be the people responsible for turning your kids into to something resembling an educated person...
Teachers, Cops, Firefighters, Social Workers... These are not rich people hoarding tax payers dollars. Get a clue people. The only thing going on here is misdirection of anger.
Lousy pay? They're paid an annual salary for 9 months of work and get the same holiday schedule as the kids. They are rather adequately compensated.... and of course, it varies by school district. You'll be able to find examples of gross underpayment and I'll be able to find examples of over payments. The simple fact is that EVERYBODY wants to get paid more, but the question is are they paid a fair value for what they do and the answer is, almost unequivocally, yes... if they weren't, then people wouldn't be doing the jobs.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
Quote: Is there any kind of "screw the middle class, Tea Party Koolaide" you guys won't suck up? Seriously? The good, maybe great benefits a teacher gets to go along with the lousy pay to be the people responsible for turning your kids into to something resembling an educated person...
Teachers, Cops, Firefighters, Social Workers... These are not rich people hoarding tax payers dollars. Get a clue people. The only thing going on here is misdirection of anger.
Lousy pay? Maybe starting off. Lousy pay as a whole? Not at all.
My first job out of college had lousy pay. Big deal.
I'm drinking no kool aid whatsoever. What you need to do is understand the money flat out IS NOT THERE! If that's kool aid..........well?
And also - teachers, cops, firemen - it's not lousy pay. Plus, the pay scales are known prior to anyone going into education, or becoming a cop, or a fireman.
When the money was there - great. It is not there anymore. So, something has to be done.
Again, states aren't the fed. gov't. They can't run with a deficit. They can't print money to cover a deficit. States have to have a balanced budget.
At what point in time SHOULD states start to make cuts?
Quote: Is there any kind of "screw the middle class, Tea Party Koolaide" you guys won't suck up? Seriously? The good, maybe great benefits a teacher gets to go along with the lousy pay to be the people responsible for turning your kids into to something resembling an educated person...
Teachers, Cops, Firefighters, Social Workers... These are not rich people hoarding tax payers dollars. Get a clue people. The only thing going on here is misdirection of anger.
Lousy pay? Maybe starting off. Lousy pay as a whole? Not at all.
My first job out of college had lousy pay. Big deal.
I'm drinking no kool aid whatsoever. What you need to do is understand the money flat out IS NOT THERE! If that's kool aid..........well?
And also - teachers, cops, firemen - it's not lousy pay. Plus, the pay scales are known prior to anyone going into education, or becoming a cop, or a fireman.
When the money was there - great. It is not there anymore. So, something has to be done.
Again, states aren't the fed. gov't. They can't run with a deficit. They can't print money to cover a deficit. States have to have a balanced budget.
At what point in time SHOULD states start to make cuts?
"Teabagger Ideas on Cutting the Budget"
Cut teacher pay. Cut fireman pay. Cut police pay. Eliminate worker's rights. Give CEO's pay raise to "encourage" growth. Give Right-Wing politicians a pay raise.
Great idea on how to cut the budget. Make the worker that has little money take a pay cut. Then, reward the big businessman with a pay raise.
This shows your ignorance of the topic being discussed.
Quote:
Eliminate worker's rights.
This shows your ignorance of the topic as well.
Quote:
Give CEO's pay raise to "encourage" growth.
This shows your ignorance of the topic also.
Quote:
Give Right-Wing politicians a pay raise.
As if we needed another example of your ignorance - well, you came through. How does this bill effect politicians of any sort? How does it only effect "right wing" politicians????? Stupid.
Quote:
Great idea on how to cut the budget. Make the worker that has little money take a pay cut. Then, reward the big businessman with a pay raise.[/quote} Yet another example of ignorance. I honestly expected at least a semi educated opinion from you............that was obviously too much to ask for.
You have no clue what you are even talking about and it makes you look stupid.
Class war in Wisconsin Lee Sustar reports from Madison on the growing union struggle against Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker and his attempt to crush public-sector unions.
WISCONSIN LABOR was gearing up for its fourth consecutive daily rally--and biggest yet--February 18 after sit-ins by workers and students and stalling tactics by state senate Democrats stopped a vote on devastating anti-union legislation pushed by Republican Gov. Scott Walker.
It was difficult to estimate the size of the protest on Thursday, February 17, but it was clearly larger than previous protests, which began with a 20,000-person demonstration on Tuesday, and a 30,000-strong protest the following day.
The numbers on Thursday were swelled by thousands of teachers--members of the Wisconsin Education Association Council who followed their union leaders' call to skip work and join the protest. Numerous school districts around the state decided to shut down altogether on February 17 and 18 as a result.
The Wisconsin's teachers' sick-ins are one of the largest union job actions in years--and a long overdue show of labor's muscle. But the unprecedented mobilization is understood everywhere as an appropriate response to Walker's plan to slash state workers' pay and benefits--and bust public-sector unions.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
MUCH OF the media coverage of events on Thursday focused on the boycott of the senate session by Democrats, which denied Walker and the Republicans the quorum they needed to conduct business. According to news reports, the Democrats traveled out of state so that Wisconsin state troopers couldn't be sent after them to bring them back to the senate chambers and force a vote.
But Democratic state Sen. Chris Larson's exit from the Capitol was assisted by dozens of protesters who blocked his office with a sit-in midday February 17. Earlier, that same group--teachers, students, some building trades workers--scuffled repeatedly with Republican state senators and their staffers for two hours as they tried to reach the senate chambers through a nearby back staircase.
"It was the most militant action I've been involved in for a long time," said Shaun Harkin, a Chicago-based socialist and activist. "The woman leading began chanting, 'This is class war.' The guy next to me said, 'She's a kindergarten teacher.' We locked arms and sang, 'Solidarity Forever.'"
The sit-in outside Larson's office was a preview of a much bigger action a couple hours later outside the senate chambers. Although word had circulated that the Senate Democrats were safely out of state, protesters weren't taking any chances.
Anticipating the possibility that state troopers could seize control of an elevator located near a side entrance to the chamber, hundreds of students from the University of Wisconsin and area high schools and middle schools jammed the area. A large man in a United Steelworkers jacket made a point of putting himself between the elevator and the door--and got a large cheer of appreciation from those nearby.
At the same time, those blocking the main senate chamber entrance led the thousands of people in the Capitol in chants--"This is what democracy looks like!" "People power" and "Union power." With protesters covering the Capitol floor and all three circular balconies, the chants at times made normal conversation impossible.
Unlike the outdoor noon rally organized by union officials, the multi-level indoor occupation and protest had no organized speakers. Nevertheless, the crowd communicated through signs, banners and cheers.
The loudest roar came, like the previous day, when members of the Wisconsin Professional Fire Fighters Association marched through the rotunda. Another big hit was a sign carried by a bearded man in his 20s that read: "I Went to Iraq but I Came Home to Egypt." There were many other signs with the same theme, such as "Walker, Pharaoh of the Midwest," and depictions of Walker alongside ousted dictator Hosni Mubarak.
To sustain the sit-in outside the Senate chambers, building trades workers brought in water, hot dogs, fruit and Oreo cookies, which were a big hit with a group of 14-year-old middle school students who joined the sit-in near an entry hall. "My mom is a teacher, so she really encourages this," said Julian Halsy-Milhaupt, an 8th grader at O'Keeffe Elementary School in Madison.
Those participating in the sit-in were prepared to physically prevent the senate from conducting business. Instead, Democrats members, by denying the senate a quorum and crossing state lines to avoid being forcibly brought to the legislative chambers, prevented Walker from muscling through a "budget repair bill" that would strip public-sector workers of the right to bargain collectively over anything other than wages.
Walker's bill would also end the automatic payment of union dues and compel unions to hold votes each year to recertify their status as bargaining units. The legislation would also force public employees to pay 12.6 percent of their health insurance costs, and contribute 5.8 percent of their paychecks toward their pensions.
That would slash take-home pay, say workers. "It sounds like it will be a minimum of 20 percent of our wages," said Dick Dahnert, a member of American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees Local 655 and a worker in the Jefferson County Highway Department.
Dahnert scoffed at Walker's claim--which has become the justification for attacking public-sector workers not only in Wisconsin, but around the country--that they have an easy, and early, retirement at taxpayers' expense. "The reality is that none of us can afford to retire early," Danhert said. "We'd be paying 100 percent of our insurance. Retiring early is not an option."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
THE STAKES in Walker's war on labor are clear to both sides. If he wins, he'll set an example for Republican governors and legislatures out to break public-sector unions in Ohio and Iowa. He'll also make it easier for Democratic governors, like Jerry Brown of California and Andrew Cuomo of New York, to appear more reasonable as they press their own demands that public-sector workers suffer cuts in wages, pensions and jobs.
The difference is that Democrats will leave public-sector unions mostly intact--not because they're pro-worker, but because they want labor's fundraising and get-out-the-vote operations at election time.
Because Walker's plan poses a grave threat to the very existence of public-sector unions, top labor officials are being drawn into the fight.
American Federation of Teachers President Randi Weingarten met with University of Wisconsin graduate employees who are members of her union the night of February 18. (Ironically, Weingarten came to Wisconsin fresh from a government-sponsored labor-management collaboration conference in Denver, at which she praised recent concessionary contracts as the way forward.) AFL-CIO President Richard Trumka was reportedly set to speak at the February 18 rally at the Capitol.
But Trumka and Weingarten aren't coming to Madison to lead the movement so much as to catch up to it. Given the danger to labor posed by Walker's program, international union leaders should have joined their Wisconsin affiliates from the beginning in calling on union members far and wide to converge on the state in a show of solidarity. However, labor's long decline has left union officials with a defeatist mindset, and they were slow to act.
But the dramatic mobilization of rank-and-file union members, students and nonunion working people across Wisconsin has transformed the situation in a matter of days.
Anyone who participates in the rallies is struck by how the unions see themselves as fighting on behalf of the entire working class. And there is a palpable sense from nonunion workers and students that the organized working class has the power to hold the line against employers and politicians who are determined to carry out a permanent and deep cut in the standard of living of working people.
In other words, the one-sided class war is over. Unions in Wisconsin are fighting back--and they're doing so across union lines that have traditionally divided and weakened them. Around the Capitol, it's common to hear conversations from veteran unionists that they'd never seen anything like this from the labor movement--and they couldn't be happier.
But the struggle is far from over--and despite the powerful mobilizations, victory is by no means assured in Wisconsin. Walker has a Republican majority in both houses of the legislature to rely on if he can get a vote. "If this passes, it's going to be nationwide" said Dahnert, the highway worker. "You're going to see the quality of life go way down."
Asked if that means workers have to be prepared to escalate their action, he said: "I believe that's the only choice we have."
I could have told you that Charlie was a Socialist from the moment he spoke (or typed) about creating chaos. That is the typical first step for a socialist takeover.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: What is your take on what Strickland passed in regards to cutting teachers benefits that will go into effect in 2014?
I have mixed feelings about the evidence based education (EBE) method. On one hand, the argument is that the method leads to "tried and proven" methods of education, but on the other hand it limits innovation. Kids are in school 30-40 hours per week and I'm not sure that the tried and proven method is the best; especially with technological improvements happening nearly every day it seems.
There is correlation between the EBE and success but it hasn't been proven as a cause and effect relationship yet. Strickland's wife is one of the foremost educational psychologists in the country so I tend to lean towards believing her that the method would work if implemented correctly, but to be perfectly honest, I'm not 100% sure.
They've started to use the method in Kentucky with some measure of success, but this is one of those things that will have to be given real-world application before a definitive answer can be given either way. JMO
I have a good friend from Norway which is a very socialist country. He still loves Norway and misses it a lot but he got sick and tired of going to work and busting his butt and getting paid the same as people who did nothing. He moved to the US because of this and is doing very well here. The stories I hear from him about working make me very happy I am in the US. Now there are other things they have that are very nice (retirement benefits, free health care) but they are taxed so heavily it isn't worth working hard; plus they have a very small population and lots of oil that feeds the government cash.
What are those bags called that are attached to that thing's hat?
What do those bags contain?
Marijuana? Nope. Anchovies? No. Potpourri? No.
Tea? Yes.
Those are teabags attached to the ladies hat. Hence, Teabagger. Teabagger is a very common term for the ultra-right wing fascistic party. You want to distance yourself from the Tea-Bag party?
Great post. The thing is I am wonder what your take on Strickland cutting benefits for teachers who retire after 2014. They are going to get a much smaller percentage then teachers now. They will also have to pay for some of their health insurance.
Quote: The gov. in Wisconsin is, plain and simply, asking the elected representatives to do their job. You know, the job they wanted? The job they get paid to do? The job that they aren't doing, but are still getting paid for?
Amazingly, you are FOR people getting paid for not doing their job? Imagine that.
I'm for the workers that are striking. This is no different than a strike. The governor of Wisconsin wants to do away with the unions. Eliminate collective bargaining and eliminate worker's rights.
Did I miss something? What workers are on strike? Last I heard the teachers that were there are still under contract and took off closing down schools. To me that is grounds for firing.
Quote: Great post. The thing is I am wonder what your take on Strickland cutting benefits for teachers who retire after 2014. They are going to get a much smaller percentage then teachers now. They will also have to pay for some of their health insurance.
My take on the situation: it's not pretty but necessary. The State Teachers Retirement System (STRS) board voted in favor of it and to raise the retirement age. The cutting of benefits saves the state about $11 billion and is necessary for the financial stability of Ohio. The health benefits have remained untouched (teachers pay up to 50% of their premiums) but will most likely be the central point of conflict over the next couple of years in negotiations. Health-care costs keep increasing, so even though the benefits remain untouched, the "real dollar value" of it is going up, so something's going to have to give sooner or later.
Oh, by the way I was in a large union. I did work of others because they chose not to do it. I broke union rules by working overtime without getting paid. I had clients and customers that were expecting service and instead of telling them I'll get to it tomorrow, I did it that night. It's called customer service.
I also was forced not to work because I was unfit to drive,( a very small part of my job) yet the companies disability department denied my claim. I sat home for 8 months without pay while I had to fight it, without the union helping. Funny thing is someone else was caught drinking while driving a company vehicle. His job was as a field tech so driving was a huge part of his job. Not only was he able to keep his promotion (he hadn't started his new position yet) he was driven around for the 6 months he didn't have a license.
Finally, the company had layoffs. people who were found to be surplus were allowed to bump others in the same job title from other departments. If you were not surplus you could be bumped by others even if you had more seniority than those initially listed as surplus. Once you were bumped, you were gone. You were not allowed to bump anyone even if they were junior.
What happened is there was people with less than 2 years in their field ( and company) bumping others out, yet people with 10 years got bumped out but not allowed to bump others. This might seem hard to understand, since the union bosses couldn't figure it out.
This might help.. You had three departments with the same job title. Two departments did the same job. Both of those departments were hit with layoffs. The people that were surplus in my department bumped out people from the department that wasn't hit. The other department that did the same job as me closed. They had the option to bump into my department as well as the department that wasn't hit. So what ended up happening is the department that was closed (all very senior employees) were able to bump non surplus employees in my department, yet those who were bumped couldn't bump anyone else, even though they were much junior. All of this negotiated by the union. When the district vice president came down and was asked how the union could do this he decided to shout down the workers. Talk about screwing the worker..
Quote: The gov. in Wisconsin is, plain and simply, asking the elected representatives to do their job. You know, the job they wanted? The job they get paid to do? The job that they aren't doing, but are still getting paid for?
Amazingly, you are FOR people getting paid for not doing their job? Imagine that.
I'm for the workers that are striking. This is no different than a strike. The governor of Wisconsin wants to do away with the unions. Eliminate collective bargaining and eliminate worker's rights.
just like many followers of the Democrats who want to get rid of the corporations and their voice in politics. there is no difference. they both are trying to influence politics in their own favor.
"Don't be burdened by regrets or make your failures an obsession or become embittered or possessed by ruined hopes"
just remember if you are union or non-union, all of our current work rules (8 hour day, 40 hour week, child labor laws, unemployment comp) are all laws that have been enacted in the last 50-80 years to protect the worker and most were enacted with the help of unions. Understand, whether union or non-union, whatever happens to these union workers is coming at the rest of us like a runaway train. THIS does affect all of you! At least for Wisconsin, about 49% of these public workers have a college degree and on average make about 25% less what the same worker would make at a comparable job in the private industry. Also, they said last night that they would give up some more concessions and pay more for health care and more for their pension and the governor still said he wants a vote on the bill; because he wants to break the union. Also, the 30 states that are in the red are about 83 billion in the red if you add them all together. The amount of money that was spent in Iraq alone is about 900 billion. There are many other things that we ... our money away on that could fill the deficit, and by the way the Wisc gov. started off his term by giving away 114 million in tax breaks for businesses. If your going to cut, then cut everywhere, not just on the damn backs of the working class.
That's fine .... and George washington held slaves too.
A positive contribution in one area does not mean that all areas they have participated in have been positive.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: The gov. in Wisconsin is, plain and simply, asking the elected representatives to do their job. You know, the job they wanted? The job they get paid to do? The job that they aren't doing, but are still getting paid for?
Amazingly, you are FOR people getting paid for not doing their job? Imagine that.
Almost sounds like someone in a union, doesn't it?
Quote: At least for Wisconsin, about 49% of these public workers have a college degree and on average make about 25% less what the same worker would make at a comparable job in the private industry.
Do you have a link to verify this, and maybe how the benefit packages compare? I posted a link showing the Wisconsin public school teachers are very well compensated. In my area, I know many city and county employees....and none of them are hurting. In fact, some are retiring on huge pensions and coming back to work for the city....double dipping. The city tried to fight this thievery, but the union fought for them to continue to receive a large pension WHILE WORKING! Yep, we need unions to keep fighting for these "rights".
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul. - John Muir
Quote: IMO, this bill has nothing to do with cost savings.
LOL...you need to get a clue.
For those like the poster you quoted, I have one simple question ......
What do you think are the largest parts of any State Budget?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
socialistworker.org
![[Linked Image from i190.photobucket.com]](http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z33/booger52/phpGGRdhwAM.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](http://i.imgur.com/FUKyw.png)
