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I say stay at # 6 IF we can get either Peterson or Green....IF it appears that both will be gone by # 6 IMHO we should move up to ensure that we get 1 of them....This of course shouldn't cost us our 1st Rd. pick in 2012....  ....
The Mammal
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If we move up I will kick my dog, punch my baby, and shoot my TV.
Thomas - The Tank Engine
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Legend
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If we could move up to #2 and take Dareus, and it cost us this year's #1 and #3, I would make that trade in a heartbeat.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Legend
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Quote:
If we move up I will kick my dog, punch my baby, and shoot my TV.
What would your reaction be if Mark Ingram ( RB Alabama) is the pick at #6?
C'mon Mike, and Heck, just think of the roster AFTER the Ingram pick!
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Quote:
Quote:
If we move up I will kick my dog, punch my baby, and shoot my TV.
What would your reaction be if Mark Ingram ( RB Alabama) is the pick at #6?
C'mon Mike, and Heck, just think of the roster AFTER the Ingram pick!
This is why people rag on u all the time...
Ingram is a LATE 1st rounder and u wanna waste a 6 pick... 
Go Browns!!!
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I was just gonna say, we have an early 2nd round pick that has a chance at landing Ingram and you want him with #6? Well you are the guy who defended Derek Anderson tooth and nail every week
"All I know is, as long as I led the Southeastern Conference in scoring, my grades would be fine." - Charles Barkley
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We need a Top 10 QB much more than ANOTHER top 10 CB....we are making the same mistake we did with Frye and Quinn (McCoy's better but still no franchise QB) if we pass on Gabbert...we "waste" another year or 2 "to find out" if a mid round QB pans out...we've been hanging our hopes on middling QB talent for the last 5 years bypassing guys like Roethlisberger and Rodgers
U place too much on YOUR opinion son on QB's..I've said since last year none of the QB's in this draft are top 5-10.
Gabbart wasn't even a consideration for being in the top ten till a few months ago..Had Luck came out,Gabbart would be a second round prospect and Newtion's name wouldn't even be mentioned in the first round.
Want to debate that?
U can't.
PP is arguably the best player in the draft..why in heck would U pass on that to take a suspect QB???
Anyway people..here's a tidbit.the Browns probably have the following players rated so closely, that though one player may be off the board, the option of taking the next at the position doesn’t appear to be of concern to the Browns;
The players in question are DL Marcell Dareus and Nick Fairley, CB Patrick Peterson,Prince Amukamara,Green and Jones.
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Is Gabbert a better prospect than McCoy? Yes he is, 1 is considered franchise QB material, the other clearly wasn't by the entire NFL 3 times
Is Peterson a better prospect than Haden? Close, both are franchise CBs
We have a franchise CB but no franchise QB...
Listen, I like Peterson and I'm alll for BPA...but I'd only take Peterson IF Gabbert, Dareus, Green, Jones are gone...but before I'd do that I'd prefer a trade and then go Jones, Fairley or Jordan...and if there's no offer I'd still think hard about 1 of the other 3 over Peterson, probably taking both Jones and Jordan over Peterson simpy because I dont like the risk involved with Fairley
Now...IF we take Peterson to play FS, I'd do that over probably Jordan and Jones, maybe even Green but not over Dareus (but he's gone anyway)
I'd be ok with Peterson if we move him to FS day 1
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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Man...U definitely think outside the box...Makes for decent convo anyways...
How can u possibly let the #1 or #2 player in this draft get by you for what you're talking about???
We would be the laughing stock of the NFL if we took Jordan/Fairley or even Jones ahead of Peterson...
U just can't do that...Not solid drafting at 6...
Go Browns!!!
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Quote:
Is Gabbert a better prospect than McCoy? Yes he is, 1 is considered franchise QB material, the other clearly wasn't by the entire NFL 3 times
The only thing that separates Gabbert and McCoy is that one is taller and has a stronger arm.
I am...meh on Gabbert, certainly not high enough to toss McCoy to the garbage pile when we are moving to an offense that McCoy should thrive in.
you had a good run Hank.
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J/C PFT is stating that New England is taking to Cleveland about the 6th pick. #17 and #28 equals just about #6. I'd very seriously think about this if it is true - the opportunity to pick up 3 players in the first 37 picks is incredibly enticing. Refs, I don't recall if we're allowed to link to PFT, so sorry if I am screwing up by posting the link: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/04/28/patriots-have-spoken-with-browns-about-sixth-pick/
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I think if Peterson is there he's the pick. If you want to be a really good team in the NFL, you need to have at least one unit on your team that is exceptional. Picking Peterson could give the Browns the best secondary in the league for the foreseeable future. Haden, Ward, Peterson, Wright, and Brown would be a phenomenal unit that wouldn't give opposing QB's many windows to throw through. If we could generate any semblance of a pass rush, there would be nowhere for them to go.
Just because we drafted a CB high last year shouldn't exclude us from drafting one this year, especially when he might be the best player in the draft. The Browns need impact players at the top of the draft regardless of position. The only three positions I wouldn't use a high pick on this year are RB, LT, and QB. The only reason I say QB is because I don't feel there are any guys in this draft that would warrant that high of a pick. Colt has all the tools to succeed in the WCO. I'd give him a year and see how he takes to the offense before we truly think about taking a QB high.
Haden is obviously primed to be an elite corner, but other than him there are a lot of questions with our DB's. Sheldon Brown isn't going to play forever. Eric Wright is clearly better suited to be a nickel. With Peterson and Haden, you wouldn't have to worry about the DB's for at least the next 5-6 years (longer if both remain healthy/are resigned).
We obviously need help on the DL, at WR, RG, RT, and so on. However, when you are picking in the top 10, you can't pick solely based on positional needs because you'll inevitably end up passing on more talented players. Sure, if Tom Brady is your QB you wouldn't draft a guy like Andrew Luck (I know he's not in this draft). That being said, it's not like Haden is the only CB on the field. At times we will have 4-5 CB's on the field. If two of those guys are elite, then that gives us a huge advantage over anyone we are facing.
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I just saw that as well ... great link.
The thought of picking up the 28 ... ALSO means that we could still use the 17 as is ... but then potentially use the 28 on a solid player who falls, or we could end up trading THAT pick to a team who wants to jump into the first for a QB. Which could net us another second and a third or more?
I'm not going into the specifics (too many scenarios), but I would love to pick up a mid and a low "1" for a high "1"
"Believe deep down in your heart that you're destined to do great things."
@pstu24
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I know. As much as I'd love to have Peterson - the thought of being able to pick up a Cam Jordan or Aldon Smith at 17, then a Muhammad Wilkerson or Aaron Smith at 28 plus someone at 37 is way more beneficial to the team overall than Peterson.
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Quote:
I just saw that as well ... great link.
The thought of picking up the 28 ... ALSO means that we could still use the 17 as is ... but then potentially use the 28 on a solid player who falls, or we could end up trading THAT pick to a team who wants to jump into the first for a QB. Which could net us another second and a third or more?
I'm not going into the specifics (too many scenarios), but I would love to pick up a mid and a low "1" for a high "1"
Could also mean we use the #17 plus a 3rd or 4th to get up to the 11-14 range to possibly draft a guy like Jones or Cam Jordan. As you said, that trade would give us a lot of flexibility and would let us possibly pick up three impact players within the first 40 picks.
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Legend
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Quote:
I know. As much as I'd love to have Peterson - the thought of being able to pick up a Cam Jordan or Aldon Smith at 17, then a Muhammad Wilkerson or Aaron Smith at 28 plus someone at 37 is way more beneficial to the team overall than Peterson.
+1
Even when we drafted Thomas, I was hoping for the same type of scenario. The drafting team has a better chance of finding an impact player by increasing their picks in the first few rounds. And even if they don't become stars, two very good starters is a nice "get" also.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif) “...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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Legend
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My question is this, has any team ever drafted 2 players at the same position in the first round in 2 consecutive drafts?
Little late to the party, but San Diego drafted Quentin Jammer first in 2002 and then Sammy Davis in 2003. They also used their 2nd round pick on a DB as well.
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All Pro
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Eh, I'd much rather take a damn near sure fire pick with Peterson than trading down and having two picks on less potential impact players.
Wise words spoken by sages
From SkyTel to BlackBerry pagers
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I would love that trade. First off, I think Fairley may fall to the Vikings. throw in a 3rd and that 17 and we get one of the big 3 in my eyes at least lol. vikings can fall back to 17 and get Mallett.
So we get Fairely, lose our 3rd but gain the 28th another very very tradeable position. Hey Cinn you want Dalton, lets talk, hey Jacksonville want Ponder, lets talk.
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From The Boston Globe: Quote:
ESPN reported that the Patriots have shown an interest in moving up. A league source said the Patriots have spoken to the Browns about the sixth pick and Quinn would be the likely target, although receiver Julio Jones and cornerback Patrick Peterson cannot be discounted.
The Patriots could package the 17th and 28th picks to move up. Or the 17th, 60th (second round), 74th (third), and perhaps a late pick.
Ooh Wee!
If that were to happen I would be very excited. Especially if could some how finagle pick #33 off them. Picks 17, 33, and 74. Yes please! Then hold that 33rd pick for ransom.
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this predraft rumor is spreading like wildfire.
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Legend
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Also, this from Peter King: Quote:
Now the Browns could sit where they are in the first four rounds -- at overall picks 6, 37, 70 and 102 -- but I'd be very surprised. I'm told GM Tom Heckert has an itchy trigger finger this morning, and is looking forward to dealing out of number six if the Browns' preferred pick is not there. If Gabbert's there, as Mayock and Gosselin project he will be, there's a chance the Browns could get a good extra pick (from Tennessee, moving up two spots) or more (from a QB-needy team down in the round). Cleveland could be the team that thinks it could turn its first-round pick into a good second-rounder in this draft, a first-rounder next year, and something else.
Remember a couple of things about Cleveland: Heckert learned from working under Trader Andy Reid, and he's not scared of losing out on a player by moving a few spots. Club president Mike Holmgren, from observing Bill Walsh and Ron Wolf and from his own beliefs, loves to wheel and deal too. Heckert and Holmgren strongly trust their gut about players. Say they want a pass-rusher and franchise receiver badly. They're the types who's say, "We'd rather have Titus Young and Brooks Reed this year, and an extra one next year, than Robert Quinn or Julio Jones this year.'' The Browns could end up sitting tight, but if their guy or guys aren't there, they'll move.
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Legend
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Quote:
Is Gabbert a better prospect than McCoy? Yes he is, 1 is considered franchise QB material, the other clearly wasn't by the entire NFL 3 times
True enough, but there have been a few very good QB's that didn't get drafted in the 1st, 2nd or 3rd round.. SOme even later than that.
I am still trying to figure out how Tom Brady fell so much.. Every team passed on him 5 times.. amazing.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I say that we make the deal with both New England and Minnesota and end up with three first rounders this year 
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Legend
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Quote:
Quote:
Is Gabbert a better prospect than McCoy? Yes he is, 1 is considered franchise QB material, the other clearly wasn't by the entire NFL 3 times
True enough, but there have been a few very good QB's that didn't get drafted in the 1st, 2nd or 3rd round.. SOme even later than that.
I am still trying to figure out how Tom Brady fell so much.. Every team passed on him 5 times.. amazing.
It isn't amazing if you saw his combine. It was horrible.
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Is Gabbert a better prospect than McCoy? Yes he is, 1 is considered franchise QB material, the other clearly wasn't by the entire NFL 3 times
True enough, but there have been a few very good QB's that didn't get drafted in the 1st, 2nd or 3rd round.. SOme even later than that.
I am still trying to figure out how Tom Brady fell so much.. Every team passed on him 5 times.. amazing.
It isn't amazing if you saw his combine. It was horrible.
Ahh,, well, what's that tell you about the combine?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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My IDEAL situation :
Gabbert and Peterson are BOTH still there at #6. You know San Fran is taking Gabbert at 7, if he's there.
Let San Fran, Minnesota, and Tennessee all get into a bidding war with each other for our pick.
San Fran gives up their #7 and 2nd round pick, to move up one spot (to prevent us trading with one of the other two). They take Gabbert.
We pick up another 2nd, and draft Peterson at 7.
Hey, if you're gonna dream ... Dream big.
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I say that we make the deal with both New England and Minnesota and end up with three first rounders this year
you mean like this:
http://www.draftcountdown.com/features/Value-Chart.php
#6 + #70 = 1840pts
#9 + #40 = 1850pts (w/ Dallas)
#17 + #28 + #60 = 1910pts (w/ NE)
#6 = 1600pts
#12 + #43 = 1670pts (w/ Minn)
I like the NE trade the best because we then have the ammunition to actually get back into the 1st round if someone drops we really like (#37+#60 =~ 20th overall selection). 3 1st round picks from our 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round picks (possibly Watt, Carimi, and Liuget)
#gmstrong
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How about we trade down with SF, Tenn or Wash who want to grab Gabbert. We get their 1st and 4th this year and their 1st next year. Then we trade down again with NE who wants Quinn. We get their #17 and 33.
We turn #6 into #17, 33 a 4th this year and pick up a 2nd 1st next year coming from a team starting a rookie QB (or a stop gap veteran). I would give up Peterson for this.
If you want to dream, Sf trades up 1 spot to make sure they get Peterson then Washington jumps Tenn to get Gabbert then NE jumps up to grab Quinn. I don't even know how to calculate all the picks in that scenario but we could end up with #17 and 33, SF's 2nd (#45) and Washington's 1st next year. Then we trade #33 to a Qb desperate team for their 1st next year giving us 3 2012 1st rounders when all is said and done. Makes my head spin but ...
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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Quote:
Now the Browns could sit where they are in the first four rounds -- at overall picks 6, 37, 70 and 102 -- but I'd be very surprised. I'm told GM Tom Heckert has an itchy trigger finger this morning, and is looking forward to dealing out of number six if the Browns' preferred pick is not there.
He should be willing to deal out if their preferred pick isn't there..I would ..trick is who wants to come up..for all the noise happening right now,the reality is ,nothing could happen.
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for all the noise happening right now,the reality is ,nothing could happen.
I have a feeling that, for all the noise happening right now, the reality is that nothing will happen.
JMHO
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Quote:
My IDEAL situation :
Gabbert and Peterson are BOTH still there at #6. You know San Fran is taking Gabbert at 7, if he's there.
Let San Fran, Minnesota, and Tennessee all get into a bidding war with each other for our pick.
San Fran gives up their #7 and 2nd round pick, to move up one spot (to prevent us trading with one of the other two). They take Gabbert.
We pick up another 2nd, and draft Peterson at 7.
Hey, if you're gonna dream ... Dream big.
I like...I really like.
Man, your different avatar threw me for a second. 
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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Legend
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Quote:
Is Gabbert a better prospect than McCoy? Yes he is, 1 is considered franchise QB material, the other clearly wasn't by the entire NFL 3 times
McCoy> Gabbert
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McCoy > Seneca > Gabbert
I almost put Jake in there. I just didn't have the heart for that one.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
Is Gabbert a better prospect than McCoy? Yes he is, 1 is considered franchise QB material, the other clearly wasn't by the entire NFL 3 times
I don't understand why someone who only manages 16 TDs on 475(!) passing attempts and has below a 2:1 TD/INT ratio in a conference that doesn't play defense in an offense that doesn't run the ball is a top 10 pick.
Call me crazy.
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
Quote:
Is Gabbert a better prospect than McCoy? Yes he is, 1 is considered franchise QB material, the other clearly wasn't by the entire NFL 3 times
I don't understand why someone who only manages 16 TDs on 475(!) passing attempts and has below a 2:1 TD/INT ratio in a conference that doesn't play defense in an offense that doesn't run the ball is a top 10 pick.
Call me crazy.
College stats don't tell the whole story, but they should raise some red flags.
Here's Gabbert's rankings from 2010:
QB Rating: 69th
YPA: 87th
TDs: 59th
Yards: 21st
Completion%: 33rd
let's compare him to my 2 favorite QBs in this draft (Dalton and Kaepernick)
Andy Dalton
QB Rating: 5th
YPA: 9th
TDs: 17th (on 160 less attempts)
Yards: 35th (see above quotes)
Completion%: 15th
Colin Kaepernick
QB Rating: 19th
YPA: 19th
TDs: 34th (on over 100 less attempts)
Yards: 27th (see above quotes)
Completion%: 22nd
http://espn.go.com/college-football/stat...Rating/count/41
#gmstrong
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