DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Jauron and his 4-3

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and said nothing about jauron

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Why would he? He's never played for him and probably has never even met him.

I think you are giving Matt Roth more credit than he deserves. There is no way he was that thought about his comment.

Given your track record, I'm happy with your disdain.

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The browns, minus Ryan, Roth, Rogers will not fare so well

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Ryan I understand. But Rogers and Roth (Rogers especially) had a minimal impact last year. Both of them are unimportant parts of our future team.

I think we've lacked competitive cohesion so long that any changes made will make little difference in one season. As for rather Ryan or Juaron is better, I simply can't say.

I do think now that the pieces are in place with exception of a true OC, that we will finally have some coaching continuity. Shumur will get a minimum 3 years unless the Big Show gets axed.

With that being said, I think that Heckert will now make or break this team. We have experienced coaches on both sides of the ball, Shumur will take direction from Holmgren. All we need now is steady improvement of the talent.

When guys like Nick Sorenson(sp?) no longer make the team year in and year out, we might be competitive. Not that I dislike Nick, I just feel that we tend to keep mediocre players and let real talents go for too many reasons. I can't believe that the guys who talk the loudest and do the least on Sunday are the real talents. But those who play well yet have big loud egos shouldn't be shipped out quite so quickly.

Then again it's hard to say who the real talents are on a 5-11 team, egos or not!

Should we start calling Roth Prime Rib

1. Rogers was a 32 Year old player who has hit the top of his career and won't make it another 2 years. We won't be pushing for a championship by then. Why not get younger now? Pay what ..$7 million to a guy who made 17 tackles? That's slightly under 500k per tackle ..and some people think we overpaid Delhomme. Why not get a younger guy who *should* be with the team for a decade.

6th best Dtackle? In relation to what? The other "experts" mock drafts? And TJ ward was the 8th best rated safety ...

As far as what I was saying about break the bank I don't think you understood my post.

Any free agents are either going to come with baggage or they will cost a lot of money. We don't want the baggage so unless we wanted a TO, Plaxico, Randy Moss.. we would have to pay a LOT of money to get a quality gamechanger.

We do have needs but we can't worry about bringing them all in through free agency.

Remember this: If a player hits free agency it's because the last team didn't think so highly of him in the first place ...

So what does that mean? We could still bring in some free agent help ... but to think that in a division with PIT and BAL that we can go from perennial 4-12 bottomfeeders to 12-4 divisional champs in what has been less than 2 whole seasons is a little bit of a stretch. It takes time and right now we are building .. not reloading.

Rogers did block a few kicks, but he hardly contributed on downs one through four. And as others have mentioned he was far too expensive for the production and effort he was likely to give.

Roth will be an unrestricted free agent. He has stated his desire to continue playing in a 3-4 defense. Even if wanted him back he probably wouldn't re-sign. It is best for both parties if he goes elsewhere. There will be other league average defensive ends available in free agency who have played in the 4-3.

j/c

Joe brings up some interesting points. some of which i agree with. Well, actually most of it.

1. our WRs are no sure bet
2. the LB corps needs a player or two ( or three)
3. we are short at safety by a player or two
4. the DL is a mess
5. colt is a mystery
6. we need another RB
7. We need a back-up tackle

I'm not in agreement with Pahos being a bum, nor DQ. Rogers had to go as he is just collecting a paycheck and is another Haynesworth in many respects.

At this moment b/c of the above and the fact that systems are being changed without an opportunity to practice we could be in the running for the andrew Luck sweepstakes.

The best possible scenario IMO is if Colt plays very well but we still manage to loose a lot of games by close margins and have the #1 overall.

Atlanta needs to implode too.

What's the point Line. The team needs lots of reworking,, it needs upgrading at a ton of positions. we all know that..

RT, RG, S, LB, DL, another CB.. and it wouldn't hurt to have another RB and a top flight WR.

Joes suggesting that keeping Rogers and Roth would have allowed us to go after a top Olinemen.. maybe that's right.. maybe not. Bottom line is we need all kinds of upgrades and they aren't going to happen in one or two years.

Roth doesn't like this system or so its been reported and Rogers is 32 and hasn't contributed much in 2 years. I don't see him getting any better and I also don't think he's worth the money anymore. Time to move past him!

Building an NFL Team is kinda like trying to eat an Elephant.

How do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time.

That's what Heckert seems to be doing.

Joes constant bashing of every change is getting annoying at best. For better or worse, these guys seem to have a plan and a direction. One full year, one off season FA Market and 2 Drafts just aren't enough to get it done.

I wanna know who his next ham sandwich will be.,

Some i agree with some i dont.

Taylor probably played more reps against Oklahoma than Rogers played last year. He lost a lot of fat and gained strength and his conditioning dramatically improved. I thought he was a solid top 15 and I didnt see a whole lot of difference between Dareus and Taylor. Dareus has better feet but Taylor has better hands. He has the most violent hands of any DT I have seen in some time.

Rogers just never practiced and rarely played. We weren't going to pay him another 7 mil for 16 tackles.

Linebackers will see more change and Poz would be an excellent addition. I think Gocong is probably gone (to dallas).

RB we have a lot of options and looking at the undrafteds, i am glad we didnt draft one. Pickup Westbrook as a cheap vet option and maybe a guy like Derreck Locke and we really improve the talent and depth.

Safety Whitner and Huff would be the two best options.

RT Doug Free would make our line maybe the best in football. I dont like him as a LT but the dude can play RT.

I really like Benard, man DE is interesting as there will be expensive options and I think Benard can be a 12 sack guy if given the opportunity to play more.

Receiver I actually hope we dont add anyone else so we can see if Receiver was the biggest problem or an idiot OC being the biggest problem lol

Browns defensive coordinator Dick Jauron is waiting to solve several mysteries

by Nate Ulrich on June 14, 2011

in Cleveland Browns,Dick Jauron,NFL

Dick Jauron, the Browns' new defensive coordinator, has extensively studied film from last season, but he still has questions about his players. Those questions won't be answered until the NFL's lockout ends and Jauron is able to see his team in person.

In a phone interview this morning, Jauron reviewed some of the mysteries he'll need to solve as he guides the Browns' conversion to a 4-3 defense:

Jauron said he considers Scott Fujita, D'Qwell Jackson and Chris Gocong his starting linebackers. Earlier this offseason, Browns General Manager Tom Heckert called Fujita "an ideal Sam linebacker." Heckert said Jackson could play Will linebacker or Mike linebacker, and Gocong could play all three linebacker spots in a 4-3 scheme. Jauron, though, wouldn't commit when asked if Gocong would be his middle linebacker. "We've talked about that," Jauron said. "We've talked about him at Will. We've talked about him at Sam. We've moved the three of them around in our own minds and in our own meetings. And then after you do all that stuff for a long enough time, you come to the conclusion that we're just gonna have to wait and see how it works out when we get them here on the field."

Jauron hopes defensive tackles Ahtyba Rubin and rookie Phil Taylor are versatile enough to play right and left tackle, as opposed to one-technique and three-technique. "It's still to be determined," Jauron said. "But ideally, that's what we would like to do. Then you can just slide them. But if it doesn't work out that way, we don't have issues with moving a guy. You'll see teams do it at times with certain movements on offense. They'll just get up and they'll both move and assume the three and the one once the offense has set the formation. But it's a lot better if you can slide."

Jauron said he doesn't know if Marcus Benard, who primarily played outside linebacker in pass-rushing situations in former Browns defensive coordinator Rob Ryan's system, can become an every-down defensive end in a 4-3 scheme. "We really like a lot of things about him, but we'll have to wait and see," Jauron said. "Obviously, he's done some really good things in the pass rush on tape. … We'll need to get him in and work with him and see where it goes. But he's a tough guy, has skills, can contribute in a lot of areas on a football team, so we're excited about it."

Jauron praised seventh-round pick Eric Hagg's production at Nebraska, where Hagg played a hybrid safety-linebacker position. Jauron thinks he knows what spot Hagg will fill in the NFL, but some experimenting is needed to be sure. "We're gonna put him at safety and probably strong to start with and then just let him compete and see where it goes," Jauron said. "We'll work him in the sub package, but you've got to be a little bit careful. Again, we've had no offseason time with these guys (because of the lockout). We've got to see how they embrace the package, especially the young guys, the rookies, because everything will be totally new for them. So we'll look at him first at strong safety, and then move him from there."

Here are some other highlights from the interview with Jauron (the rest of the interview will appear in the Beacon Journal and on Ohio.com later this week in a question-and-answer format):

On what was appealing about joining the Browns: "I'd had a relationship, obviously, with coach (Pat) Shurmur's uncle Fritz," Jauron said. "I'd played for him and I had coached with him, and so I had met coach Pat a number of times a on and off through the years. So I felt like I had a connection there. And obviously with (Browns President) Mike Holmgren, I had worked for him in Green Bay and really had great admiration for him, always had great trust in him, knew a number of people that were on the staff, (Holmgren's senior advisor) Gil Haskell being one of them. I've been lucky to be in the league as a player and a coach. I've been with a number of the old franchises. This franchise had an interuption, but it's one of the classic franchises. It has traditional rivals, and I really like that. And the fact that they haven't been as good as they would like to be, you'd always like to feel like you're a part of building something and helping it succeed."

On his defensive assistants: "I've had a background with (senior defensive assistant) Ray (Rhodes)," Jauron said. "He was a defensive coordinator for coach Holmgren in Green Bay when we were there, so I've known Ray for a long time and just think the world of him. He's got great football knowledge. He's a great guy. He's a great team guy. That's been a tremendous addition. (Linebackers coach) Bill (Davis), I only knew by reputation and the same with (defensive line coach) Dwaine (Board), but great reputations. People that I know that have worked with them spoke so highly of both of them. They're quality guys and obviously outstanding coaches. (Defensive backs coach) Jerome (Henderson) was a holdover who's very impressive to me. I remember him as a player. I remember him when he came out of college. He had a great career. He's a very, very solid person, a tremendous guy to have on a staff, and I think he does an outstanding job with the secondary. And (defensive assistant) Chuck (Bullough) and I, I've known Chuck for a long, long time. I played for his dad (Hank) and coached for his dad. I watched Chuck play and then worked with him in Chicago. He's got football in his blood, and he's just an outstanding coach. So really coach Shurmur did a great job. I believe in hiring these guys, and I really feel comfortable with all of them."

On his philosophy on blitzes and coverages: "Ideally, we'd like to pressure more than we cover," Jauron said. "You've got to be able to make the quarterback uncomfortable. It doesn't mean you have to pressure a certain percentage all the time, but you've got to put doubt in their mind. You've got to have a high percentage of pressure or at least a very good mix that keeps people off balance."

On his impression of the Browns' defense from watching film: "They certainly play hard," Jauron said. "There is a nucleus of tough guys we believe that we can build on, and we're looking forward to starting that."

On drafting cornerback Buster Skrine, pictured left, and Hagg: "I really like both of them, and obviously they're different," Jauron said. "Eric's a really smart, inside player. They play at the highest level of college football in the country at Nebraska, and he was a performer for them game in and game out. He just seemed to make plays. He played some in their sub package at their nickel or dime positions, which is interesting to us. It shows he can move around. He can handle different positions, and he did a nice job there. We're excited about seeing him. And Buster, Buster's got a number of things: He's very, very athletic, he's a tough guy and he can run. You just can't teach speed. He can really run. Again, two really good picks, we thought, that can come in and help us and I think help us right away."

On if the left defensive end is typically more of a run stopper than a pass rusher in a 4-3 defense: "Yeah, you'd make that generalization in a 4-3, just because obviously most offenses are more right-handed than left-handed," Jauron said. "The tight end is more generally on the defense's left, so generally (the left defensive end) is a bigger, more physical player, and the right defensive end is generally a little bit smaller, maybe faster. But, ideally, you'd like them to be even obviously in terms of pass-rush ability. You'd like to get two great pass rushers off the edge anytime, and you'd like them as big as they can be with great pass-rush ability. But it's very, very hard to find."

On if the Browns need to add depth at linebacker because of injury concerns surrounding Fujita and Jackson: "I see it that way on every team I've ever been on," Jauron said. "Linebackers and tight ends, everybody plays a physical position in a football game. But linebackers, they're involved in both ends of everything. They're huge on special teams. They've got to contribute everywhere. It's tough. They take a lot of hits over the course of a year."

On his coaching style in terms of motivating players: "I don't need to describe my style," Jauron said. "I don't really think a whole lot about my style. I just kind of am who I am, and I coach that way."

On if the Browns are targeting certain positions on defense that they hope to address once free agency begins: "We've talked about it, yeah," Jauron said. "We've done all our reports on the guys that we were assigned to look at. We've sat down and we've talked about those guys with Tom (Heckert), and, of course, Mike (Holmgren) is certainly aware of it, too, and coach Pat (Shurmur). We have certain people in certain areas that we target, but it's certainly not appropriate for me to talk about that."

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Linebackers will see more change and Poz would be an excellent addition. I think Gocong is probably gone (to dallas).

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I hope you meant to say Roth and not Gocong is going to Dallas.

Rob Ryan really likes Gocong, and if Dallas comes calling bye bye Gocong.

Agreed. Gocong doesn't have a place in a 4-3 defense. A guy I would like to see the Browns target is Dashon Goldson. He's a pretty good young FS, and it appears that SF isn't going to re-sign him.

I hadn't seen that. Goldson is a west coast born&bred guy who has never lived anywhere else so I suspected we had no shot at him. If SF doesn't want him, then I wouldn't mind him at all (if we get 1 of Weddle/Goldson/Whitner I'll be very happy)

Wouldn't Whitner and Ward be redundant?

personally, I look for this team to stink this year...3-13...4-12 something to that effect.

however, we have revamped our entire coaching staff and changed O and D schemes...and it just takes time to find players to get everything working.

so now that were on this path...i just hope the city of Cleveland gives Holmgren and company the 4 years needed to buold this thing....even though im not the biggest Holmgren and Shurmur fan....they deserve 4 years to build something here, and im just going to sit back and watch and give them a fair chance...I just hope the city of cleveland and the media does too...because im tired of starting over every 2 years....lets just ride this thing out and see where it goes.

What about Michael Huff?

I know he won't come here. Just wanted to throw is name out there because he is a much better fit than Whitner.

A lot of what we do in free agency will depend on the new restricted free agent rules. Eric Weddle is probably the best safety available but the Chargers love him. Hard to see him leaving there.

I know the Buccaneers cut him, but is Sabby Piscitelli salvageable? I know almost nothing about him.

Not sure about OSI ... I know he could be pretty good, but he's already 29. Would it make sense to pay him top 5 money and then only have him for 3 or 4 years? I mean he could get us over the hump while we bring in younger players and could contribute for another 3 to 5 I would suspect ... but he won't be around long term.

Like I said ... according to this wants top 5 money.

http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/news/story?id=6667679

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2011/06/16/browns-lb-maiava-recovering-hopeful

Browns LB Maiava recovering, hopeful

Posted June 16, 2011 @ 1:30 p.m. ET
By Mike Wilkening

Speed is Kaluka Maiava's game, and he knows it. That's one reason why the Browns' third-year linebacker is looking to play at 225 pounds this season in Cleveland's newly installed 4-3 scheme.

Given his wheels and build, the Browns' decision to scrap the 3-4 could be a boon to Maiava, who played in a "40" front at USC.

"I was really excited when I found out we were going to the 4-3," said Maiava, who expects to play on the weak side in Dick Jauron's scheme. "I'm hoping for the best."

Maiava's 2010 season ended after only two games after he tore the anterior cruciate ligament and meniscus in his right knee, but on Wednesday, he told PFW that he's about "90 percent" recovered from his injuries.

"If I needed to go next week, I could go," said the 24-year-old Maiava, who will be checked out by the Browns' medical staff once the lockout ends " … I'm just being really careful."

Missing most of 2010 caused Maiava to look inward. Hawaii is his home, and in the past, he would have been in Maui in the offseason, with leisure on his mind. Instead, he's working out twice a day, five times a week, in Oahu.

As Maiava sees it, his offseason training wasn't what it needed to be.

"You've really got to prepare for the worst so you can play the best," he explained.

In the morning, Maiava emphasizes football skills in his workouts. In his evening workouts, mixed martial arts are the focus.

"After every workout, I'm just dying. Totally spent, but it's totally satisfying," Maiava said of the MMA training.

As a rookie in 2009, Maiava appeared in all 16 games (three starts) and notched 45 tackles and 2½ sacks. He hoped to build on that last season. Instead, he was left to deal with a "very humbling" set of circumstances, as he put it.

Maiava, who never before had suffered a season-ending injury, aims to bounce back.

"Hopefully I fight back from this and have a successful career," he said.

sweet, so even if he doesn't improve and is just bench-fodder, at least he can backup his teammates if a brawl breaks out.

web page


Browns LB Maiava recovering, hopeful

By Mike Wilkening

Speed is Kaluka Maiava's game, and he knows it. That's one reason why the Browns' third-year linebacker is looking to play at 225 pounds this season in Cleveland's newly installed 4-3 scheme.

Given his wheels and build, the Browns' decision to scrap the 3-4 could be a boon to Maiava, who played in a "40" front at USC.

"I was really excited when I found out we were going to the 4-3," said Maiava, who expects to play on the weak side in Dick Jauron's scheme. "I'm hoping for the best."

Maiava's 2010 season ended after only two games after he tore the anterior cruciate ligament and meniscus in his right knee, but on Wednesday, he told PFW that he's about "90 percent" recovered from his injuries.

"If I needed to go next week, I could go," said the 24-year-old Maiava, who will be checked out by the Browns' medical staff once the lockout ends " … I'm just being really careful."

Missing most of 2010 caused Maiava to look inward. Hawaii is his home, and in the past, he would have been in Maui in the offseason, with leisure on his mind. Instead, he's working out twice a day, five times a week, in Oahu.

As Maiava sees it, his offseason training wasn't what it needed to be.

"You've really got to prepare for the worst so you can play the best," he explained.

In the morning, Maiava emphasizes football skills in his workouts. In his evening workouts, mixed martial arts are the focus.

"After every workout, I'm just dying. Totally spent, but it's totally satisfying," Maiava said of the MMA training.

As a rookie in 2009, Maiava appeared in all 16 games (three starts) and notched 45 tackles and 2½ sacks. He hoped to build on that last season. Instead, he was left to deal with a "very humbling" set of circumstances, as he put it.

Maiava, who never before had suffered a season-ending injury, aims to bounce back.

"Hopefully I fight back from this and have a successful career," he said.

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I think linebacker may provide the best camp competition this year. The only position that i really see as fairly secure is Fujita at sam and thats if he can come back fully healed. Mike should be very competitive with DQ, Gocong, Titus Brown (I may be his only fan lol) and there is a strong chance we bring in someone more familiar to Jauron or Rhodes.

Maiva, i thought was our best coverage backer even as a rook but major knee injury is a lot to recover from. He should provide good competition for the Wil spot. Again I would not be shocked if we bring in an outsider.

I could see a guy like Poz come in and get the nod in the middle. How about keeping benard as a rolling blitzer or maybe at Sam and slide fujita into the middle? I could see a Wesley Woodyard coming in and being an ideal starter for Jauron at either Wil or Sam.

I would love to be at camp this year. It is going to be an exciting time.

You don't think Jackson is a lock to start if healthy?

That might be the biggest "IF" we ever discuss around here.

I really don't and I like DQ a lot. Before his pec tear, I thought he was looking really slow and his coverage ability had slipped a great deal. Jauron has tended to favor guys that really run to the ball and I know that is what DQ did in college but I wonder if he still has it.

I know he had Earl Holmes and had success with him but Earl was one of the most underrated players the past decade.

Hell I think Jauron would be happy with 5 linebacker/safety hybrids. Its why i do believe we will bring in Whitner and continue to add speed to our linebacker corpse. ( couldnt resist lol)

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Building an NFL Team is kinda like trying to eat an Elephant.

How do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time.

That's what Heckert seems to be doing.

Joes constant bashing of every change is getting annoying at best. For better or worse, these guys seem to have a plan and a direction. One full year, one off season FA Market and 2 Drafts just aren't enough to get it done.

I wanna know who his next ham sandwich will be.,

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My constant bashing of every change? wow straw man you set up.
I agree you eat an elephant one bite at a time yet you don't invite in MORE Elephants to eat.
Rogers had injury problems last year we all agree on that yet teams were lined up to sign him, by pushing him out the door we MAY have wasted our ability to eat the Elephant one bite at a time.
1) say we keep Rogers and try to squeeze another year and we take Carimi
mark RT off the board and maybe we can CUT Pashos if he shows up as poorly or injured again.
NOW we are eating the Elephant by taking a position of CRITICAL need and turning it into a strength. then that domino give mcCoy another second or two to pass and in turn helps our young receivers get open. That is how you eat the elephant one bite at a time.
2) I still maintain Rogers will have a solid year and we did not have to overreact and go DT. say we have that #3 we blew to move up. another bite we could have taken is a safety or RB or the Mathews kid.

I complain when I think we are NOT eating the Elephant and herding more in the door. My constant complaining is a result of rarely agreeing with the musical chairs method of running a team in the same division as solid front offices in Pittsburgh and Baltimore. We not only get drilled we often look like a bad division2 team playing Ohio State.

Yes to eat an Elephant One bite at a time.
1) you do not make delusional statements regarding the strength of the WR corps; It makes knowledgable fans cranky.
2) you do not make bad trades or dump players for no compensation: It makes this fan wonder about the front office.
3) you don't make preposterous statements that Jake Delhomme is still a top QB with a lot of good football left: that makes me spit up.
4) you don't trade an uneven Jerome Harrison for a worthless Mike Bell: it makes you look insane.
5)You don't rush to hire yet another rookie HC.
6)You don't play make believe and pencil in chronically injured players as hardesty, Pashos, and DQ as top contributors.

We Finally agree Daman. Your analogy or eating an elephant one bite at a time is great. I just don't think you eve can when you keep making moves that invite more elephants into the dining hall.
Heckert is By far, the most capable GM we have ever had..yet getting Zilch for Rogers is a very curious move, as was drafting no Rbs yet drafting a FB( another elephant invited in).

I am not the Gm
If I were1) jake is gone asap unless he takes a cut for the minimum.
2) we resign Roth for depth at DE.
3) we sign a RB and not pretend we can rely on bell, Hardesty and give Hillis real help.
4) we sign gaithers at RT from Baltimore, while he was also injured I think he is a significant upgrade from Pashos, whom I doubt can stay injury free.
5) we sign lbers yes two. DQ and GoCong are not starters and DQ may not even have the frame to play in the NFL.
6) we get a free safety.
If we got a solid RT maybe our lacking group of Wrs have the time to get open but right now this are is in critical denial. Until it is addressed we are in the St. Clair Zone.