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Somebody had to say it, right?  Now, I know I'm going to get swarmed with accusations of having a knee-jerk reaction to one game, but the simple truth is that if we go down 0-2 to the Colts next week, we're officially in the pole position for the Luck sweepstakes. I don't know how the season is going to go or how Colt is going to perform, but if I had to wager a guess, I'd say we'll be in the hunt for the #1 pick. I thought so before yesterday. So what do folks think? Is he a slam dunk? Overhyped? Not the right move for the Browns? Do we turn to address the offensive line before we get to the king piece?
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Atlanta had two #1s the year they got Ryan...
Just saying...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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I was at the game yesterday and thought most of the offensive line played like crap, especially the right side. Depending how the college players turn out and how the draft boards gets setup, I would take these positions in order of need: the best RT in the draft, WR, LB. But then again, this year is really young and for all we know some of the rooks could develop into some of our greatest strengths. 
Find what you love and let it kill you.
-Charles Bukowski
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Atlanta had two #1s the year they got Ryan...
Just saying...
No way I trade up for him, but if I have the #1 pick (please no  ) then I take him. No brainer.
Whether it's to keep him or make a team (Giants-Eli-Chargers) pay out the yin-yang for him . . .
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Quote:
I was at the game yesterday and thought most of the offensive line played like crap, especially the right side. Depending how the college players turn out and how the draft boards gets setup, I would take these positions in order of need: the best RT in the draft, WR, LB. But then again, this year is really young and for all we know some of the rooks could develop into some of our greatest strengths.
All three of the above where needs going into this year also .You can only fill so many holes in any given draft .. We are desperate at RT and a rush Line backer ..
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If we have the number one pick then it will probably be apparent that McCoy isn't the answer. So in that case we take Luck and don't look back. But I refuse to believe that we will be bad enough to have the first pick in the draft.
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Stop it.
Exactly.
Looks like the fans haven't changed either...
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I wanna play devil's advocate on this ...
If we are in position to take luck (and I'll make it known that at this point I'll say I don't have a clear opinion on him one way or the other...just so you know)...
Why not make someone else mortgage the farm?
You want to look good? Sure you could grab luck ... or if we are basically in position to take him and either falls a spot to us or we are the worst team ... trade the #1 overall to drop as many as 5 to 10 spots ... and get back that first, as well as another first and a slew of other picks.
You know what might look good? Taking the 2 picks from Atlanta and our 6 or 7 picks *(however many we have after considering the greco trade and do we pay for the wallace trade this year?) And then adding ANOTHER 1st rounder plus a 2nd and then maybe a 2nd or 1st the next year for luck (and maybe even a few more lower picks?) ... then you not only have the equvalency of 4 first round picks in 2 years as well as maybe 3 or 4 seconds in two years ... you also have the mid round picks to play around with and take flyers on guys or manuever back up and find some steals....
It would just depend on how much you like Luck ... but I'd much rather know that with this year we could secure maybe 8 picks in the first four rounds, and another 4 or 5 in the first 3 of next year ... There's your RT, FS, OLB, DE, WR, CB, MLB, RB all in the first four rounds ... and you still have the lower level picks plus all of the 2013 draft picks ... yes we need talent, but we are so close to being the team that waits a little bit and adds talent under H and H instead of the Phil Savage "WIN NOW - Sacrafice the future for it" model.
"Believe deep down in your heart that you're destined to do great things."
@pstu24
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Please, no. To early for this IMO. At least wait til the bye week. Upset too. But if you want to discuss Luck already, might be overreacting. He would be a question mark as well. I will be interested in how the team responds to this loss.
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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Luck is the real deal as a NFL prospect. Plays a pro-style offense, makes reads, plays with WRs who are not superior NFL talent, yet makes that offense hum.
as for the Browns, I am not going to worry about it until later in the season. Just try to catch some Stanford games and enjoy a great player work (errr, play since college players don't get 'paid').
#gmstrong
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You take Andrew Luck and don't look back.
He's a much better prospect than Sam Bradford or Matthew Stafford were and both of those guys are light-years better than Charlie 2.0.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/GraffZ06/browns_factory_sig.jpg) Fear us, for we are the BROWNS, led by the mighty BM! Only in Cleveland.
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As I predicted before Sunday.
Your right on cue, but is this pure football? After all he is still in 'College'.
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Quote:
I wanna play devil's advocate on this ...
If we are in position to take luck (and I'll make it known that at this point I'll say I don't have a clear opinion on him one way or the other...just so you know)...
Why not make someone else mortgage the farm?
When are people going to learn?
Let's say we are in position to take Luck. That means McCoy has not panned out.
You never, NEVER, pass on a franchise QB ... NEVER ... NEVER ... NEVER. You have no chance of winning without one. This whole nonsense of making someone mortgage the farm and giving us all kinds of picks and players because we have all these holes to fill ... yada, yada, yada ... is just crap. A great QB makes everyone, defense included, BETTER. This league is all about the QB. And if we are in a position to take Luck, that means we need one.
No offense meant ... I know this was just devil's advocate. But I only know one absolute truth about the NFL. You cannot win without a great QB.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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I'd argue that college is a more pure form of football than what the NFL is turning into. 
"He who buys what he does not need steals from himself."
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He's a much better prospect than Sam Bradford or Matthew Stafford were and both of those guys are light-years better than Charlie 2.0.
I think I would wait until his final college year is up to say that..
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Quote:
Please, no. To early for this IMO. At least wait til the bye week. Upset too. But if you want to discuss Luck already, might be overreacting.
I'm actually not that upset. I figured we'd win about 3-4 this year. I thought we'd split with Cincinnati, and we still have a chance to do so.
And I don't really see it as overreaction. We're a bad football team. Going into the season, we were very likely to be drafting in the Top 5.
Yesterday was one of the few games we should've snagged. And in failing to so, we've bolstered those chances.
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If McCoy stinks we do everything we can to trade up and draft Luck.
Here's the question...if the Colts finish with the worst record what do they do?
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I'd argue that college is a more pure form of football than what the NFL is turning into.
Just saying that College football goes in the tailgate lot ... in fact there is already a thread for that.
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Take Luck and trade him to the highest bidder?
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Quote:
Quote:
Here's the question...if the Colts finish with the worst record what do they do?
Take Luck and trade him to the highest bidder?
How about drafting him and keeping him, letting him learn from the best and take over after Peyton is fully done in 2-3 years (maybe even earlier...Peyton is 35yo and just had his 3rd neck surgery)
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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A couple posters got this right on the money.
We'll know if we want to take Luck if we're in a position to take him (the 1st spot or top 5 draft order).
I think a more interesting discussion is if the Falcons entire starting roster goes down with injury and THEY net us that high pick. What if we finish middle-of-the-pack with McCoy turning in a decent/positive season overall? Do we package that pick with another pick or two and move up to take Luck even though McCoy wasn't a disaster?
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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I'm not gonna say yes or no here, Andrew Luck is a wonderful player, but can we just enjoy the start of this season, and wait til all 16 games have been played before we talk about this?
I know things didn't look great, but I think McCoy should get more than 1 game into the WCO before we just write him off. It wasn't all him yesterday, like i said in the post-game topic, he got a C- from me, although Little and Moore really let him down on that drive with 4 min left after the Bengals went ahead.
Give the guy time, I have a feeling if we can keep him upright for all 16 games, we will have a great idea of how our situation is.
There won't be tanking in the NFL certainly not with this franchise, and Heckert isn't going to trade up to #1, so let the chips fall where they may.
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If you're in a position to take Luck, you take him. If you're in a position to trade for Luck, you trade for him. Don't overthink it, or you will do something stupid.
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If you're in a position to take Luck, you take him. If you're in a position to trade for Luck, you trade for him. Don't overthink it, or you will do something stupid.
I'm all for it, but I don't think that Heckert is. This team lacks depth in too many areas to mortgage away too much.
It worked for the Giants, but I think Heckert is going down the safe road with this team. They're building it properly and they aren't cutting corners. I am not 100% happy with everything he has done, but he has done enough for me to buy into this.
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honestly...if this team is in a position to take Andrew Luck...that means Colt has been rubblish and we have no real choice but to take him....i say that being the biggest Colt Mccoy Cheerleader there is...
if we are in that spot to take Luck....we would be stupid not to take him...stupid.....we would have to take him....have too.....and while were at it, use our other pick in the 1st for a playmaker at WR...let the rookie QB learn with his future ace receiver at the same time....
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When are people going to learn?
What? Don't take a quarterback with a one-syllable last name? ... Couch, Leaf, Frye, Smith? 
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You aren't addressing the real problem.. we need to see if Bill Cowher is still available.
yebat' Putin
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Please, no. To early for this IMO. At least wait til the bye week. Upset too. But if you want to discuss Luck already, might be overreacting. He would be a question mark as well. I will be interested in how the team responds to this loss.
I think we are overreacting here and will wait to see how we play next week. What I saw in this game was an awful start with a lot of penalties that allowed Cincy to start off with awesome field position. And another score, was a major mental collapse when the defense was still in the huddle. It's hard to come back when you let the other team score 14-0 on bad mistakes, and we did catch up, only to make a few more bad mistakes to allow Cincy to win. I think as the season goes on, these mental errors will correct themselves. It's not because we lack the skill, I saw the Browns stop the Bengal a lot last night. It's the mental errors that killed us. We get past those, we are in for a better season.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](http://i.imgur.com/FUKyw.png) "Don't be burdened by regrets or make your failures an obsession or become embittered or possessed by ruined hopes"
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If McCoy stinks we do everything we can to trade up and draft Luck.
Here's the question...if the Colts finish with the worst record what do they do?
A more interesting situation is what happens if colt gets hurt because he's holding the ball too long?
Wallace is trash so we get a boost in the luck race.
We're trying to throw the ball downfield and he checked the ball down to Trent Richardson and the Indians on the choice.
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I think we are overreacting here and will wait to see how we play next week.
Good point. Making big decisions after the first game of the season under a new coach with a lot of new pieces is just insane... but two games is good. 
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
You never, NEVER, pass on a franchise QB ... NEVER ... NEVER ... NEVER. You have no chance of winning without one. This whole nonsense of making someone mortgage the farm and giving us all kinds of picks and players because we have all these holes to fill ... yada, yada, yada ... is just crap. A great QB makes everyone, defense included, BETTER. This league is all about the QB. And if we are in a position to take Luck, that means we need one.
No offense taken. I completely understand the point of view. ... However ... we could get better with a few extra picks from atlanta ... we catch up to the most talented teams in the league if we steal someone elses draft (or two).
I don't care if it is Manning or Brady ... I would trade them for a pair of 1's and a pair of 2's (possibly) ... I should say I would at least think about it. I would definitely think about it if it's a kid who hasn't played a single NFL snap..
ESPECIALLY if trading the pick to aquire Luck means we could get the best Wideout Possible. Alshon Jeffrey? Michael Floyd? Insert your pick.... we'd also get our own Patrick Willis with the second 1st rounder from atlanta? (Maybe Burflict? Maybe Te'o? they should both be mid level to late first rounders I would think?) ... add in our own version of an Ed Reed (ballhawking FS in the early second to be paired with Ward? We'd still have a 2nd in the Luck package to take a stud right tackle pretty high (and with the extra low round picks we could manuever back into the first if we package picks).
We use the 3rd and two 4ths to add depth on the D-line (maybe one more DE?) and add in a linebacker or two on the outside. We still have a few 3rd day picks as fliers ... and guess what. We would head into the 2013 draft with at least another first from the Luck deal, and maybe more?
If he's the real deal you don't pass on him. But show me a SINGLE player in the last decade that was a sure thing. I know he's projected to be the safest, but projections are what they are.
"Believe deep down in your heart that you're destined to do great things."
@pstu24
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I wouldn't trade Aaron Rodgers for five first round picks.
You say projections aren't sure things; yet you are counting on those other guys. Luck is a much surer thing than any of those players you mentioned, and plays a much more important position. If I don't have Aaron Rodgers, Ben Roethlisberger, Tom Brady or Phillip Rivers, I draft Andrew Luck.
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I wouldn't trade Aaron Rodgers for five first round picks.
If they were 5 top 10 picks hell yes I would trade Rodgers.
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Quote:
I wouldn't trade Aaron Rodgers for five first round picks.
You say projections aren't sure things; yet you are counting on those other guys. Luck is a much surer thing than any of those players you mentioned, and plays a much more important position. If I don't have Aaron Rodgers, Ben Roethlisberger, Tom Brady or Phillip Rivers, I draft Andrew Luck.
I wouldn't sell the farm for ANY college player. The draft is full of first round busts. Luck is a good college player. That is ALL we know right now.
Think ryan leaf, akili smith, joey harrington., jamarcus russel, vince young , they were ALL "sure fire" bets.......the list goes on and on.
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But show me a SINGLE player in the last decade that was a sure thing.
Off the top of my head, Joe Thomas and Julius Peppers.
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I'll go back to my last post. I'm responding to you Deep, as you are one of the most emphatic supporters of drafting Luck, if we're in the position, no matter what.
We could, with a remote possibility, see a good to great season from McCoy, and Atlanta falling apart and giving us a top 5 pick. I know, Atlanta won't fall on its face like that, but crazy things happen. For the purpose of this thread, consider that situation...
Falcons suck, they net us the #4 pick. Do you put a package together to go and get the #1 pick for Luck?
If McCoy turns in a promising season (looks good overall), I'm the GM that watches Luck go to another team, and I cash in on my treasure trove of picks from last season's trade.
Just curious...
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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Gee Phil,, it is kind of a Knee Jerk Reaction. hard to deny it.
It's like you are almost blaming all the teams ills on McCoy and thinking that maybe Andrew Luck will be the answer.
Luck can't make Moore catch that TD with two hands
Luck wouldn't have been on the field when the Bengals scored with a pass to green catching us with our pants down
Luck isn't going to stop Benson
Luck isn't going to avoid the rush when the line doesn't protect
Point is, Luck is only one piece.. the results yesterday might have been the same with him or anyone.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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phil...I would think that an experienced Browns fan like yourself would understand that no QB is going look good if he does not have the time to execute the play.
Offensive football has as much to do with the Offensive line as the QB, RB or WR.
Andrew Luck would not have looked as good as McCoy behind the present offensive line.
If the Browns get lucky enough to be in a position to draft Luck, I would draft and trade him for more draft picks. Then I would draft offensive linemen.
But hey, that's just me...
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
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