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On a personal note....I wish you could make a game. I enjoy sitting with you.
I'll tell you what..We make the play-offs.. and I will let you buy my ticket and sit with you 
Seriously..you don't know how bad I miss it...If I can..I will...and thanks for the times we did .. 
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Absolutely ! Since I like to prognosticate careers  , here goes: Haden: AllPro CB in peak years, pretty good to above AVG after that Ward: above AVG to good SS for 2-3 peak years, improved vs pass, though still AVG at best, big play hitter....career will fade quickly due to injuries, think Bob Sanders Hardesty: 3-4 decent years as AVG across the board #2 RB/spot starter with spurts of being a workhorse, think DeAngelo Williams McCoy: will have a 10+ years NFL career, will be replaced in CLE midseason 2012, will bounce around the league and "compete" for teams with no franchise QB, will eventually find a home and become an efficient game manager for a mid-level team, think Pennington/Orton/Garrard...will always be considered "not good enough", bottom tier starter/high tier backup Lauvao: AVG at best RG, his inability/inconsistency to pass block will be his downfall as a starter and isn't good enough (rather AVG at best for a RG) run blocking to continue starting, will be replaced sometime 2012 in CLE, will not re-sign and bounce around the league for 2-4 more years as versatile #7/#8 OL Mitchell: too raw, will never make it...if he doesnt get opportunities on this WR corps he won't elsewhere....may pull a Frisman Jackson and tease the fanbase for a month but ultimately he is who I thought he was (yes, I din't like him as a prospect and didn't like the pick, even in the 6th) Taylor: will develop slowly into a solid, above AVG to good DT, maybe get some PB/AP recognition in peak years, building block next to Rubin FOR YEARS Sheard: similar to Taylor will slowly develop into a quality WDE, little less high end upside than Taylor but will be an AVG to above AVG DE, with maybe 1-2 good years sprinkled in....another building block Little: will be #1 Browns WR no later than 2012, maybe even late this season, as we lack anyone as talented with the willingness (Massa just doesn't want the pressure, he's content to be just a complementary player) to become great...will have some nice seasons here, 80+ catches, 1k+yds...ego will flash and derail his career somewhat going forward, will get tendered once the rookie deal has ended, either will play 1 more year or get traded, won't get paid by Browns...think BE/A.Bryant-light (not as much of a headcase) Cameron: will either become the next Jimmy Graham or our of football in 2 years, middle ground would be another Evan Moore and that seems to be the most realistic outlook as of now, will replace A.Smith next season and flash here and there....this season is a redshirt year for him Marecic: there will be fans with his jersey in the stands 2-3 years from now, you heard it here 1st....he's a football player and Brownsfans will love him, ST demon and versatile WCO FB Skrine: solid nickel-CB with #2 spot starting ability, think Devon Holly with more speed...will be a top 3 CB for the Browns for all of his rookie contract, will make S.Brown expendable after this season Pinkston: AVG starting G with some RT versatility for years, not flashy but steady, our Kemoeatu...Womack/Hicks-like career Hagg: tbd, seen nothing of him yet so who knows
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Sheard: similar to Taylor will slowly develop into a quality WDE, little less high end upside than Taylor but will be an AVG to above AVG DE, with maybe 1-2 good years sprinkled in....another building block
No, no, no ... we will leave him on the strong side.
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Lauvao: AVG at best RG, his inability/inconsistency to pass block will be his downfall as a starter and isn't good enough (rather AVG at best for a RG) run blocking to continue starting, will be replaced sometime 2012 in CLE, will not re-sign and bounce around the league for 2-4 more years as versatile #7/#8 OL
= Our Kemoeatu 
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McCoy: will have a 10+ years NFL career, will be replaced in CLE midseason 2012, will bounce around the league and "compete" for teams with no franchise QB, will eventually find a home and become an efficient game manager for a mid-level team, think Pennington/Orton/Garrard...will always be considered "not good enough", bottom tier starter/high tier backup
So who does your crystal ball or magic 8 ball say will replace him in 2012?
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On a personal note....I wish you could make a game. I enjoy sitting with you.
I'll tell you what..We make the play-offs.. and I will let you buy my ticket and sit with you
Seriously..you don't know how bad I miss it...If I can..I will...and thanks for the times we did ..
As I said, I enjoyed it.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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The guy we draft/sign or trade for in the offseason...
I had another crazy idea a couple of days ago: bring in Chad Henne....he improved a lot this season but nobody has noticed since they lost...I don't think he's franchise QB material but he'd be a buy low candidate who could have value down the road and I feel bad for him being a Daboll/Sparano victim....if H&H refuse to draft a QB high, I hope they at least bring in some serious competition and Henne is as good as it gets on the QB market
#gmstrong
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Disagreements:
Lauvao - I still think he can be above average.
Taylor - He will be very good. Think Kris Jenkins in his prime.
Sheard - He's a strong side end. I don't see the burst to play on the weak side.
Hardesty - I think if he holds up, he's a starting caliber running back, not just a backup. The key is if he holds up.
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand that's it. Well said for the most part.
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Django...just say no to Chad Henne. My parents are big fins fans and I pay a lot of attention because of it. He is worse than Bad DA was for us. He has no touch, not a very good feel for the pass rush (as he makes terrible decisions when there is any semblance of pressure), and has NO touch. If you need evidence watch any fade route he's thrown all career. Chad is bad...id take Tyler Thigpen if we want Miami castoffs.
To the above posters...
While we say there are no "should wins" with this team...frankly thats just not true. We're a .500 team, regardless of who we beat, so we should beat the teams that are below .500, simply. Especially the Jags and Rams. Seattle off the bye without a healthy TJack...They arent scary in anything, TJack was just starting to get himself together and make the offense decent, but with Whitehurst (who i actually think is worse) theyre not better. Yea they beat the Giants but the Giants often implode upon themselves if you let them, and Seattle let them. Also they beat AZ at home 13-10. Their 3 losses have been a 24-0 drubbing to Pitt, 33-17 to SF before they hit their peak, and a 30-28 loss to ATL where they outscored ATL 21-6 in the 2nd half...
They havent beaten anyone of consequence yet. Theyre not too different from us. Those are 3 games that we should win, a game at home should help as they gotta travel...although they did play on the road and beat the Gaints, its hard to do that often.
Whats the point of playing if they arent should wins...this is how teams win, by believing they should win. If they dont feel like they should win, theyre not gonna be a good team. Its been part of the reason the team hasnt been that good so far, its the reason were making so many mistakes. Were not playing with any confidence. As fans, thats been lacking too. We're moving in the right direction, everyone seems to agree on that. We should have that positive attitude going into games.
We should beat the Seahawks, Jags, and Rams...and should be able to challenge Houston, Oakland, and San Fran. None of them have been beating the world down on offense, especially with Andre Johnson out.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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I disagree on Henne. He was good this year (except in the red zone, which is a pretty big issue). I like him a lot more than Colt, but I still wouldn't have interest in him.
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To build on Django's post, one other thing to consider is the talent present before those players were drafted.
It would be one thing for Phil Taylor to come in and start if he were drafted by the Steelers or some team with a extremely high level of talent already present on the team. The Browns didn't have a whole lot of talent, so our first-rounders pretty much have to start.
I'm not saying that's the whole reason. I'm just saying that's part of it.
True that, oobs... but it does speak to Heckert's ability to instantly upgrade a team through shrewd dratfing. If he's as good going forward as he's been during the last 2 drafts (and there's no reason to believe he won't be-) the future looks pretty danged bright for us. I say this because I'm having trouble remembering the players his draft picks have replaced. That in itself should tell you something. (Maybe it really only tells you how much I've had to drink since I got off work- hehehe)
Case in point- anyone watching Joe Haden still miss Eric Wright?
When I think of the past draft disasters this team has had since The Return, I can't help but feel pretty optimistic about the next 3 years or so.
If you're finally going to "build a team through the draft," your GM becomes your team's MVP from Jan through April. Based on what I've seen so far, we copped ourselves a pretty danged good player at that position.
Can't wait to see what he has cooked up for this next draft.... well, yes I can- there's a lot of football left to played this season!
"too many notes, not enough music-"
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this is all players though, right?
Yeah, it's the 53 man roster and it's dated Sept 4th.
It's split into Offense, Defense and Special Teams and notice our special teams is ranked 8th. That's likely due to Dawson and Maynard. Without Dawson that number probably drops significantly.
Still, it's showing us as the 8th youngest 53 man roster. I didn't look up a year earlier but I think Holmgren said we gave up over 200 years in age so I'd bet we would've been a lot higher on that list.
Starter wise we may be younger still as you mention. But since everybody plays I think total roster age is more accurate. Eighth youngest is pretty dang young.
Just look at the Steelers as the oldest in the league. They probably have a handful who tip the scale and skew the age a bit but still. They won't get younger too quickly because they won't be drafting and playing a bunch of rookies over two or three years. When our young guys are in their prime the Steelers will collectively have more hair growing out their ears and noses than Polamalu has on his head and he will have a bald spot.
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Anyone watching Sheldon Brown still miss Eric Wright?
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I disagree on Henne. He was good this year (except in the red zone, which is a pretty big issue). I like him a lot more than Colt, but I still wouldn't have interest in him.
Wasn't he also dead last in 3rd down conversion %?
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Anyone watching Sheldon Brown still miss Eric Wright?
You slipped that in before me...
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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I disagree on Henne. He was good this year (except in the red zone, which is a pretty big issue). I like him a lot more than Colt, but I still wouldn't have interest in him.
Wasn't he also dead last in 3rd down conversion %?
If Daboll calls for a bomb on 3rd and 1 with the ball on their side of the field...no wonder. I really think he could be made look quite good with proper coaching....he has plenty of arm and good enough accuracy that can be worked with
I'd prefer a high draft pick but if we don't go that route I'd be all for bringing Henne in with that Quinn extra pick
#gmstrong
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Ive seen enough from him to think no way. Look at how the analysts of the NFL view it. Colt is up and coming, Henne is toast, singed, burnt, and stinky toast.
He has value as a backup but nothing more. Having a big arm doesnt make a good QB, and accuracy? I dont know about that, he can throw a slant (which is better than DA) and can throw a deep ball near a WR, but thats about it. He's not nearly as accurate as youd think. He has a career QB rating of 75.7, has thrown 31 TDs and 37 INTs while completing 60% of his passes.
Color me unimpressed, his completion percentage is his only saving grace. But if you want to see a QB that cant manage a pocket, or make a good throw under pressure, then by all means, bring Henne in...if you wanna see poor fades (which we learned from DA, adding touch is really tough), bring him in.
If it came to Henne or Colt...you couldnt give me a draft pick and Henne to replace Colt
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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If Daboll calls for a bomb on 3rd and 1 with the ball on their side of the field...no wonder.
Coaches don't usually call a bomb on 3rd and 1, they call a pass play which usually has deep, intermediate and underneath routes, with an outlet receiver.. if Henne chooses to try the most difficult of those by percentage and fails, then that's on him.
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I'm not so sure about that...for years Henne was criticized in MIA for being captain checkdown and he was slinging the ball around a lot more from what I've been told and seen and he looked much better playing that style as it suits him more
again, I don't really want him as our QB as I think he hasn't got it upstairs to be consistently good but he could be a Eli/Romo type QB and that upisde is MUCH better than Colt's imho and his actual play is at least as good too...what you guys forget when talking about media perception of Henne and Colt is EXPECTATION
In MIA they expect to be a PO contender pretty much every season...in Cleveland everyone would throw a party if we finished 8-8...and since we had crap at QB for years media is talking up a guy like Colt who pads his stats in garbage time and keeps TO at a minimum = he doesn't seem to lose games the obvious way...I really think most media that say nice things about colt just watch his highlights or stat sheet and not the entire game...let's be honest: who other than a brownsfan would watch 3h of Browns football if he has 6 other games running? Us diehards know more about Colt than those talking heads....same with Henne, just the other way around...he had a terrible stat line in 1 of his games and I watched it and he made pretty good throws all game...he upped his game considerably...if somehow MIA cleans house completely (who knows: maybe they get Luck now with Henne on IR) and starts over at QB too, I'd seriously consider Henne as a nice buy low value grab...QBs always have value
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In MIA they expect to be a PO contender pretty much every season...in Cleveland everyone would throw a party if we finished 8-8
I think you mis-typed. Did you mean that in MIA they only care about the Dolphins if they are a playoff contender?
because the on-field recently hasn't been any better than our beloved Browns. we have both been to the playoffs once since 2002 and both have missed the playoffs via a tiebreaker once during that span.
they have had more 7-9 type seasons, but we never had a 1-15 year.
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Curious again, Using Henne saying he has a ceiling of Eli/Romo...What's Colt's ceiling?
I think the safe bet is to say his "ceiling" or more likely career path from what we say around here is Chad Pennington who has a career 90.1 passer rating has thrown 102 TDs to 64 INTs and has completed 66% of his throws and has a YPA of 7.2
Colt in his career to this point (albeit a small sample size) has played 12 games and has thrown 12 TDs and 12 INTs (and 0 lost fumbles plus 1 rushing TD). He has thrown as many TDs this year in 4 games as he threw in 8 games last year, and has thrown 1/3 the amount of INTs in half as many games.
He has in his brief career accounted for more TDs than Turnovers and is averaging just shy of 250 ypg this year. Those arent world beater numbers by any stretch.
But to even put a ceiling on Colt is ridiculous. Furthermore, if his ceiling is anywhere near Chad Pennington, we'll be fine for the forseeable future. Chad was good and efficient everywhere he was, and thats what you want from a starting QB...Thats what Colt is.
Its amazing how much a team's shortcomings can "expose a bad QB."
If you think that Colt cant get it done...watch how he's worked with Evan Moore this year. Every throw Colt has sent his way has been an NFL caliber throw. The 2 TDs, the 4 other passes going for first downs and his one other catch. Watch those. All 7 of his catches are NFL throws made exactly how everyone wants them. Its interesting because all his catches are the throws weve been looking for from a QB. Include some of his missed catches, the deep ball he tried to 1 hand, the fade route he didnt battle for, among others. When he throws to Evan he is decisive and makes good crisp solid throws.
Most of Greg Little's catches have been the same way. His TD passes to Ben have been very good throws as were his well placed TD throws to Cribbs and MoMass.
Theyre inconsistent, but that is what learning is about. Inconsistency and flashes. It will come together, and I think youll start to see it this week. Mark it down. Strides on Sunday
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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I think the safe bet is to say his "ceiling" or more likely career path from what we say around here is Chad Pennington who has a career 90.1 passer rating has thrown 102 TDs to 64 INTs and has completed 66% of his throws and has a YPA of 7.2
What's his PO record again? Penny was the best game manager in his peak years but got owned by better Ds year in year out
Colt's ceiling is Penny/Orton/Garrard but I really don't even see him getting there....in many ways he is very similar to Wallace
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You confuse me so much. We both share the same feelings about Mccoy.
Howevet you still want average at best QBs like Henne and Weeden?
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I completely disagree on his ceilings...interestingly enough though, each of those 3 have a career winning record (although Orton's has trended downward and is now .500)
Pennington 44-37
Orton 33-33
Garrard 39-37
Saying he has a ceiling there, why wouldnt we be happy to have that. All 3 have started games in the playoffs and all 3 have won a game. Thats more than any QB since the return.
Dont fix what isnt ailing you. We have so many other worries
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It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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Because django - in his consummate, all knowing knowledge of nfl qb's, has decide McCoy is not the answer, and damn anything else. You either agree with him, or you know nothing.
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and Wallace is 6-12 as a starter and has never been named a starter anywhere.
I just dont see how 10-15 people here can have the knowledge that Colt is ultimately going to bounce around the league and never be a good NFL starter when we have a front office that says he is our guy, a coach that says he is our guy, a team that backs him and talks him up, and analysts that all say he has a bright future...
I dont get it...
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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I just dont see how 10-15 people here can have the knowledge that Colt is ultimately going to bounce around the league and never be a good NFL starter when we have a front office that says he is our guy, a coach that says he is our guy, a team that backs him and talks him up, and analysts that all say he has a bright future...
I dont get it...
I don't either. At the beginning of the season they did the right thing by removing all doubt and naming him the starter... during the season you build him up and say nice things to him unless he sucks so bad that he needs pulled, which he hasn't, at the end of the season you re-evaluate and see where he is and where you think he can go.... That's what a FO and staff SHOULD do and that's what we are doing...
Throughout that process I will continue to root for the guy and hope that the staff knows what they are doing and what they are seeing.... If at the end of the season we use our first pick to draft a QB then I will assume that they decided he's not the guy and I will feel bad for him because I really like the kid but in the end I will still root for the new guy just as hard... if he's still the guy going into next season, I will assume the FO and staff see something worth keeping and I will continue to hope they know what they are doing.. what other choice do I have?
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We are in a pretty good situation in my opinion. Colt either plays really well or we go out and get a quarterback in this upcoming draft. Nothing complicated about the situation.
I think we will see 4 maybe 5 quarterbacks go in the first round in this draft and we could have the buying power to go get whichever one we want.
I believe Atlanta could easily end up a 5 win team and if Colt doesn't step it up we will be a 4 or 5 win team as well. So hope this staff is doing thier homework on QB as well as the other positions.
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You confuse me so much. We both share the same feelings about Mccoy.
Howevet you still want average at best QBs like Henne and Weeden?
I'm pretty sure I've made it clear that I consider both as "compromise" or fall back plans...I want a franchise QB drafted in the 1st round
I like Luck (no chance) and Weeden, not seen enough of L.Jones, Barkley or Tannehill yet...somewhat like Griffin (great CFB QB) but he's raw and a high upside/low floor project...don't consider Cousins, Foles, Lindley franchise QBs
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You confuse me so much. We both share the same feelings about Mccoy.
Howevet you still want average at best QBs like Henne and Weeden?
I agree.
I'm not sure Colt is going to be all that good, but I'd take him over Henne.
JMO
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Watch Landry Jones, I like him a lot. Strong arm, good size, okay mobility, accurate deep ball.
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I think Jones and Barkley are both potential top five picks. It's a great draft for teams in need of a quarterback.
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Watch Landry Jones, I like him a lot. Strong arm, good size, okay mobility, accurate deep ball.
Just finished watching those 3 vids on Luck, Jones and Barkley....man, we need this Luck dude, he's the real deal
http://www.youtube.com/v/ufkE8pGAkGs&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/v/aLms-PwGvys
http://www.youtube.com/v/t8buzXhW6X8&feature=related
Some thoughts:
- this is a 2010 vid, but Jones NEVER reads the D or goes through progressions, not even the 2nd guy...he pretty much throws it to 1 guy only on every play of this vid and never looks elsewhere...he has a nice spiral but he's a big time project, mechanics need completely refined...if he still is the same this season I would not
- Barkley lacks some arm but he looks much more like a NFL QB than Jones....he's a pocket passer reading the D going through his progressions
- Luck is incredibly good...I'd give up a lot to get him...like 3 1sts and a couple of middle rounders, he'd be worth it but whoever has the #1 pick would be stupid NOT to pick him
- from what I saw in those vids I would not draft Jones with a top 15 pick, maybe a late 1st gamble if checks in character, work ethic and brains
- Barkley looks readier than Jones but probably has less upside but he's worth an early selection
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Legend
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 17,284 |
Barkley is ok, but sometimes he makes incredibly silly mistakes.
Landry has improved because of his WRs. Stills and Broyles are monsters because of his deep ball.
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
I held back my vomit long enough to watch the OU/UT game (don't care for either team) so I could watch Landry Jones and I really wasn't that impressed. the ran away with the game and I remember him making one good throw deep right but apart from that he wasn't doing anything special.
I'm not saying he's bad... I've only seen him play the one game but it was nothing special IMO.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
When I see Chad Henne, I see Tim Couch. And all the Fish fans I know don't see a legit starter. He's got the tools. I just don't know if he has the mind.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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