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He created this pathetic mess, he doesn't deserve to be rewarded for his ineptitude by making millions of our hard earned dollars. Send his over-rated ass back to Seattle now.  Flame away, Chumley lovers.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Legend
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Yes let's fire him and start this process all over again until we fire the next guy.
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A little too early for this. We're not ever going to find a better replacement than Holmgren.
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Browns football seems to be a double edge sword !
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Well thats what we've been doing anyways. Might as well get a head start. 
oioioioi
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Id rather see him coach. At least work more with McCoy.
Not even sure what to think of Shurmer. Looks confused, worried, lost and pretty darned incompetent!
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Quote:
Yes let's fire him and start this process all over again until we fire the next guy.
Exactly. Let's waste away the next 10 years.
I want the Cleveland Browns to be my pallbearers so they can let me down for the last time.
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I think you should schedule an appointment with him and fly to Berea and let him have it!
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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No, but Shurmur needs to be replaced with a real coach. I still think he was just a last minute hire because we needed a body to fill that spot.
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I would give him another year or so to find the qb, and head coach. It's obvious that schurmur and mccoy aren"t the answers.
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We don't need a fire Holmgren thread---we need a burn down Cleveland Stadium thread!!!!
I wish to wash my Irish wristwatch......
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I could get on board with a fire Shurmur thread. Holmgren, not so much.
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OP
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And I think you should move to L.A. and wait for a new team to root for.
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Besides the fact you're obviously venting, this wouldn't make any sense.
Lerner is still paying some combination of Kokonis, Savage, Crennel, and Mangini. If you whack Holmgren we keep paying him. The Browns are on a budget, so if we killed off more contracted employees we don't have money to spend in free agency.
Beyond that, we just changed offensive and defensive schemes this year. You don't blow up a new program 8 games in.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Quote:
I could get on board with a fire Shurmur thread. Holmgren, not so much.
"Dammit! Where did I put that "lock thread key"!?
I would be happy with having somebody go into the locker room and throw a few chairs around.
And maybe push the coach a few times.
Is Bobby Knight available? 
Einstein could not even fathom the mathematical improbabilities of the Browns woes.
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I have yet to read one real reason or compelling argument for retaining his services. Not one post stating that he's the best qualified person out there, doing a great job leading the organization, has the team and staff on the right track, is putting all the right pieces in place, or has a workable plan. It's all about starting over, being a moronic notion, or too expensive a proposition. News flash folks, those aren't reason for keeping him, they're merely excuses for not firing him.
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Quote:
Besides the fact you're obviously venting, this wouldn't make any sense.
Lerner is still paying some combination of Kokonis, Savage, Crennel, and Mangini. If you whack Holmgren we keep paying him. The Browns are on a budget, so if we killed off more contracted employees we don't have money to spend in free agency.
Beyond that, we just changed offensive and defensive schemes this year. You don't blow up a new program 8 games in.
It makes perfect sense there is a difference between building a program and having a tough year, and being incompetent.
Holmgren so far has made major boneheaded incompetent decisions. Lerner has every right to fire him with cause
The mistake would be to continue to pay him...can him a take that contract to court...kok settled....so would holmgren....the browns are getting ripped off
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Because he thinks he is just so smart!
You didn't know? Holmgren thinks he is smarter then everyone. Problem is this time he outsmarted himself lol
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At least he got rid of quinn, if he didn't we would be getting treated to all short passes and checkdowns. Wait....
We're trying to throw the ball downfield and he checked the ball down to Trent Richardson and the Indians on the choice.
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Some of which may have been completed.
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Quote:
Lerner has every right to fire him with cause
Do you honestly know what the term "with cause" means, because if you did, there's no way you could make that statement with a straight face.....
And Cal, again, you don't blow up a program 8 games in. That isn't a reason not to fire him. That's a reason to keep him.
I think he flubbed BIG TIME with McCoy, but Lerner wanted to keep Mangini, so he did.
I think Holmgren should get one more off-season with Heckert before we can say for sure he's a stooge.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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And I think you should move to L.A. and wait for a new team to root for.
Haha, touché.
Got a room I could rent?
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Quote:
Quote:
Lerner has every right to fire him with cause
Do you honestly know what the term "with cause" means, because if you did, there's no way you could make that statement with a straight face.....
And Cal, again, you don't blow up a program 8 games in. That isn't a reason not to fire him. That's a reason to keep him.
I think he flubbed BIG TIME with McCoy, but Lerner wanted to keep Mangini, so he did.
I think Holmgren should get one more off-season with Heckert before we can say for sure he's a stooge.
By all means, feel free to think that, but I don't care where we are in the season, eight more games, scratch that, eight more losses aren't going to change anything. Forget the decision to fire Mangini, forget the bonehead move of bringing in Delhomme, forget the ridiculous decision to blow up the D when it was the O that needed the influx of talent, forget all that. The insistence of drafting then starting Colt this year and the hiring of Shurmur as HC, and making him the OC as well was beyond poor judgement and simple mismanagement, it was ineptitude on a major scale. I don't need any more evidence of his boobery, nor do I want to see what he screws up next with his massive ego that drives his clear lack of judgement.
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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This is moronic.
Understatement of the year.
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This is moronic.
The thread or the Browns?
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Quote:
Quote:
This is morecic.
Understatement of the year.
fixed it..
"Going from 4-12 to 6-10 isn't good enough. I believe we are going to be better than that. We're going to be a lot better than that." - Mike Holmgren (3/15/12)
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Quote:
I have yet to read one real reason or compelling argument for retaining his services.
he hired tom heckert.
you had a good run Hank.
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Saying something like this used to a guy tossed from here but at the risk of being obvious...... Quote:
The Official Fire Holmgren Thread
This is the most idiotic thread and title ever posted on here.
I'm going to say something I never, ever say.....If you don't like it - leave - quit watching. Anything but post this moronic crap on here.
It's so irritating to read the same 3 or 4 guys whine and moan after every game and then all week long until the next game.
At the risk of alienating the remaining people on here that will talk to me I must say, again, that if anyone thought this team was winning more than 6 game this year they were either fooling themselves or they are morons.
This team is playing pretty much to their skill level.
Unfortunately, some of the posters on here can't make that claim...... 
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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That's why I'm not upset. I had no expectations today. Houston is a way better team and way better coached. My only gripe is Shurmer.
"Going from 4-12 to 6-10 isn't good enough. I believe we are going to be better than that. We're going to be a lot better than that." - Mike Holmgren (3/15/12)
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Yes I know what it means
I doubt Lerner is stupid enough to not have an out in that contract....if not Lerner really is dense.
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KOB, seriously, you can't fire an NFL exec "with cause" when your only gripe is that he has failed to produce a winner. 
If he got caught screwing Lerner's secretary on his desk, THAT would be with cause.
If he got caught putting in 30-hours per week, THAT would be with cause.
If he got caught sending the playbook to Tomlin, THAT would be with cause.
If he hires Heckert and Shurmur and we don't win?
That isn't "with cause." C'mon. Wake up.
As for "having an out" in his contract......what "out" do you think exists?  The only "out" is if he wants to fire a guy and they work out a settlement. No Team President is going to sign a contract to run the team with a series of "you can be fired without pay if you win less than 6 games in your second year" addendum's 
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Quote:
I have yet to read one real reason or compelling argument for retaining his services.
here's one: Houston, San Fransisco, and even possibly the Raiders. They all might be playoff teams at the end of the year. Blow it up because we have lost to playoff caliber teams? you should have to type a random combination of letters to clear security before posting irrationally like this
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We beat playoff teams last year and blew it up.
I'm just sayin' ..........
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Besides the fact you're obviously venting, this wouldn't make any sense.
Lerner is still paying some combination of Kokonis, Savage, Crennel, and Mangini. If you whack Holmgren we keep paying him. The Browns are on a budget, so if we killed off more contracted employees we don't have money to spend in free agency.
Beyond that, we just changed offensive and defensive schemes this year. You don't blow up a new program 8 games in.
+1
With any rebuild, it takes time. Tear it down and then comes the slow process of finding pieces to win.
IMO, the defense isn't that far off. The offense is awful but guess what, we have 6 whole picks in the first four rounds, we can fix a lot of issues with them.
Everyone that is upset, take a deep breath and relax. If this process is too much to handle, go root for another team (or just stop rooting for this one). We will win, it will take time.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif) “...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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true 
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I really want to know when the excuses stop.
Herman Edwards said it best " you play to win the game! When your no longer doing that get out! Retire! "
Holmgren, heckert, and shurmur can take their excuses and flush them with the rest of their personal garbage.
Excuses are for losers. The fact is there is not motivator in this organization....there is no one these guys can rally around.
I will not resort for settling for losing.....
Jamal Lewis had it right when he said: "I'm not cut from this cloth" he was meaning the cloth of a loser...the man expected to win....he didn't pray he would win, or hope he would win, he expected to win no excuses.
I can see the writing on the wall....6-10 next year at best and Lerner will then have no choice but to can this crew
These excuses for losing has got to stop....losers make excuses, winners expect to win.
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"Expect to win" has been a motto of mine since I was young. I expect to win at anything I do, be it work or play.
You're right man.....this making of excuses, or looking for "reasons" why we should excuse this display are lame.
You know, it isn't the record so much that bothers me. It's the way we lose.
We look like a HS team....I'm serious.
I'd bet money that either LSU or Alabama could hold us under 18 points...and might even win the game.
I know they have better coaching.
What exactly did Pat do to earn a head coaching job??
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Quote:
..
Quote:
The Official Fire Holmgren Thread
This is the most idiotic thread and title ever posted on here.
Fire Holmgren? STUPID!
They have to keep Holomgren, Schurmur, and Heckert. Period!
This team is finaly showing signs of LIFE,
I just hope they can figure it out before they lose the good players, Cribbs, Mike Adams, and such
To RETIREMENT! like ( I can't beleive I'm about to say this) Andra Davis.
I Hated that guy until his last 2 years. with a capital Hate!
Fire Holmgren Thread? NO!!!
 what is wrong with you.
Wake up and delete this thread.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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