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What did they say?
They pretty much said if you can't beat em'... sign'em.. and now the browns dont have to worry about him hurting us anymore. they said with lewis and droughns.. they have power, but probably still won't do much. they said lewis's best years were behind him.
they didnt mention anything though about the upcoming draft, and how they might get peterson. they just mentioned a lewis/droughns tandem.
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Ok,, did some research,, Out of a possible 39 games, he missed 8 due to injury,, that's not really so bad over a 3 year period when you really think about it. By the stats I was looking at, he must have missed most of another game also because he only carried like 4 or 5 times for a -4 yards... Last year was his worst year by far when he missed 7games but came back for the bowl game against Boise State.. His production went way down in his second year,,, from 1925 yards in his first to 1108 yards in his second.. Yet it looks as if he only missed all of one game and most of another,,, Big drop,., His drop from 1108 yards in his second year down to 935 yards in his last year seems pretty reasonable given that he missed all those games last year.. Last year, 7 games, 935 yards on 188 attempts for an average of 4.9 per carry... again, not bad at all,, in fact, pretty good. I guess all the stats really prove is that in college, when he was able to play, he was simply amazing,,,,, I think we kinda all knew that. SO, my conclusion is that it isn't as bleak a situation as I once thought, but still,, if your gonna take Peterson, you better have a back capable of taking over.. So the Lewis signing now makes even more sense to me... I still want Thomas  Mr. Hardhead,,,, Yup, that's me  Oh, My source is ESPN,,,, http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/profile?playerId=161717
Last edited by Damanshot; 03/08/07 10:55 AM.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I understand some want to look at it as a way to spin things...I am not doing that.
If Phil wants Peterson, he isn't going to pass the guy because he has Reuben friggen Droughns in the wings.
If he wanted Peterson,he wouldn't have went out and signed a feature RB. Pretty simple really when you do the math.
He's too smart to spend a #3 pick on a kid who gets injurred every year in the NCAA. Phil didn't get to where he is by being less than smart and realistic.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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My Gawd....I hate repeating myself ( Where is the bang-my-head-against the wall smiley....)
just for you 
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Clicking, pit. Here's to Jamal having one more big year left in the tank. If not, it's only a one-year deal so we're not mortgaging the future. I'd love to see him get a new life in Cleveland. Hopefully this will take us out of the AP "sweepstakes" because I have a lot of doubt about him. IMO, Phil doesn't want him, but we'll see. I can't wait til the draft is over because people will stop pimping their 'boys'. Joe Thomas, or trade down!
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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Lewis signing doesn't shed light on the # 3 pick..what MAY is what I heard on Rizzo just now that the Browns (from his unspoken source..lol) have fallen out of love with RD due to him not losing weight and having a bad year..
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Clicking, pit.
Here's to Jamal having one more big year left in the tank. If not, it's only a one-year deal so we're not mortgaging the future. I'd love to see him get a new life in Cleveland.
Hopefully this will take us out of the AP "sweepstakes" because I have a lot of doubt about him. IMO, Phil doesn't want him, but we'll see. I can't wait til the draft is over because people will stop pimping their 'boys'.
Joe Thomas, or trade down!
Jeez people, he's 27. You guys make it sound like he has one foot in the grave. Let's just hope he stays out of prison. 
When will this end?
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Lewis signing doesn't shed light on the # 3 pick..what MAY is what I heard on Rizzo just now that the Browns (from his unspoken source..lol) have fallen out of love with RD due to him not losing weight and having a bad year..
No surprise. When holes were there he was too slow to get to them, and he fumbled too much.
Lewis is an upgrade, just how much remains to be seen. I'm weary of the wear and tear on him but optimistic that he was slowed by bone spurs and should be faster this year.
Remember the feet!
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The back that draws all the comparisons to Jamal Lewis is Michael Bush. Bush wouldnt be able to carry a full load this year so he sits behind Lewis watches and learns. Makes sense to me lol yes I am manipulating situation to justify the drafting of Bush lol. atleast i am honest about it lol
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The back that draws all the comparisons to Jamal Lewis is Michael Bush. Bush wouldnt be able to carry a full load this year so he sits behind Lewis watches and learns. Makes sense to me lol yes I am manipulating situation to justify the drafting of Bush lol. atleast i am honest about it lol
Lewis is a purebread power back. Bush is not a push it between the tackles and break tackles kinda back, he's more of a big quick finesse back who is 250 lbs. and harder to tackle than he should be. Bush's style is nothing like Lewis', he's just big like Jamal.
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The back that draws all the comparisons to Jamal Lewis is Michael Bush. Bush wouldnt be able to carry a full load this year so he sits behind Lewis watches and learns. Makes sense to me lol yes I am manipulating situation to justify the drafting of Bush lol. atleast i am honest about it lol
I'm not overly familiar with Bush, but from what I have read I think he'd be a better fit in our division than AP. I don't expect him to drop to us in the second, though.
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My Gawd....I hate repeating myself ( Where is the bang-my-head-against the wall smiley....)
just for you
That is freaking awesome Atom.....I love you
I am going to use that all the time now
Go Browns!!![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/BrowniePoints/AndersonSnowPic.jpg)
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The back that draws all the comparisons to Jamal Lewis is Michael Bush. Bush wouldnt be able to carry a full load this year so he sits behind Lewis watches and learns. Makes sense to me lol yes I am manipulating situation to justify the drafting of Bush lol. atleast i am honest about it lol
There may be more truth in that prediction than you think........ We'll know in 51 days...
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I understand some want to look at it as a way to spin things...I am not doing that.
If Phil wants Peterson, he isn't going to pass the guy because he has Reuben friggen Droughns in the wings.
If he wanted Peterson,he wouldn't have went out and signed a feature RB. Pretty simple really when you do the math.
He's too smart to spend a #3 pick on a kid who gets injurred every year in the NCAA. Phil didn't get to where he is by being less than smart and realistic.
You mean a feature back who got like 3.6 ypc and no big runs on a team with a better line than the Browns....one that we only signed to a one year contract.
This signing is nothing more than upgrading what Droughns would've been this season - the other back on our roster not named Adrian Peterson.
Plus if we don't draft Peterson it will be Quinn....and it would have nothing to do with this signing.
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The back that draws all the comparisons to Jamal Lewis is Michael Bush. Bush wouldnt be able to carry a full load this year so he sits behind Lewis watches and learns. Makes sense to me lol yes I am manipulating situation to justify the drafting of Bush lol. atleast i am honest about it lol
I'm not overly familiar with Bush, but from what I have read I think he'd be a better fit in our division than AP. I don't expect him to drop to us in the second, though.
it goes with my theroy... I still think we will go DE/DL in the first and OL in the 2nd and then an RB in the 3rd. Regardless, There are too many good backs to be had next year... this years seems to be thin with plenty of questions from durability to ability...
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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Plus if we don't draft Peterson it will be Quinn....and it would have nothing to do with this signing.
I think almost all of you guys are underestimating the chances of drafting a defender....esp. Branch i think is high on Phil´s list..why? no word about him yet 
Seriously, Thomas and Branch are my Top 2...Branch preferably in a tradedown scenario
Remember last year it was the pass rusher...this year it could be the run plugger...seemed to be the major needs last season since Phil asked Crennel "the question"....what have we done so far to help our run stuffing?...Right, nothing....
Overall, we have to admit Phil is doing a good job on it since even Browns fans see 4 or 5 different possibilities and have no clue about his intentions
Thomas, Peterson, Quinn, Branch, Russell, (even CJ or Adams)....nobody really knows right now
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Some of you have a one tracked mind that won't be derailed untill late April. But I plan to be here to see the train wreck.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Again I ask the question that nobody will answer.
Who are these magical RB's that are going to be in the draft next year.
I spend waaaaay too much time scanning the boards and I keep seeing this thrown around.
To me it seems like the same old regugitated statement.
Someone typed it, it is now the gospel as long as it fits my agenda statement.
Can you tell me who these guys are?
Last year they said we should wait and draft a tackle this year because the draft will be deep at tackle. We see how that turned out.
Players get hurt, have down years, stuck on a losing team, have other players competeing for more time.
In essence "[censored] Happens"
We don't know who is going to be considered a top quality RB next year until next year gets hear.
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I don't expect him to drop to us in the second, though.
OK, you're probably right, but then every year a couple of studs drop WAY down due to need. Hutchinson went like #21 overall, D McAlister was roughly #20, A Rogers down to the #20 range.....
Pat Kirwan wrote an article about the glut of quality veteran RB's still available and how it would bump RB's farther down the draft boards. Makes sense and Kirwan seems to always have his head in the game.
If nothing else it put us in a position where we are ready to make a move IF the opportunity presents itself. Not to mention, that it frees up Droughns for a trade (a la Faine).
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RBs slanton, mcfadden, rice, hart appears to be the big 4
last year was the year to get the OT namely cough cough McNeil next years will have the likes of Jake Long and Sam Baker maybe Michael Oher (best college tackle in football this year even as a sophmore)
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Reuben Droughns is due a $1.75 million roster bonus on March 17. He also is due a $1.25 million base salary, which means he is a $3 million player if the Browns keep him. That might have been the figure that Lewis agreed to. He had a standing offer of between $1.5 million and $2 million on the table from the Ravens. So the Browns might be thinking that they are better off replacing Droughns, whom they have severely soured on, with Browns-killer Lewis for one year. That might not interfere with plans to take Oklahoma running back Adrian Peterson with their first pick in the draft.
Posted March 08, by Ben Maller http://www.benmaller.com/nfl_rumors_notes
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Go Browns
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Again I ask the question that nobody will answer.
Who are these magical RB's that are going to be in the draft next year.
I spend waaaaay too much time scanning the boards and I keep seeing this thrown around.
To me it seems like the same old regugitated statement.
Someone typed it, it is now the gospel as long as it fits my agenda statement.
Can you tell me who these guys are?
Last year they said we should wait and draft a tackle this year because the draft will be deep at tackle. We see how that turned out.
Players get hurt, have down years, stuck on a losing team, have other players competeing for more time.
In essence "[censored] Happens"
We don't know who is going to be considered a top quality RB next year until next year gets hear.
The running back class of next year has become the battle cry of the Peterson detractors. The class looks to have a ton of solid backs, but only 1 elite back in Darren McFadden...and Peterson is an elite back.
Truth be told, if Peterson was in next years class, chances are he'd still be the top prospect. If any back is on Peterson's level it's McFadden...and I'd still probably have Peterson ranked ahead of him. You think Peterson runs upright? Watch McFadden, he runs just as high as Peterson does, if not higher...
Shoot, I like McFadden's sidekick almost as much as I like McFadden. Felix Jones has Warrick Dunn writen all over him
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Go Browns
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Pit...I don't think a 1 year deal on an aging RB nullifies any interest at all on a future Franchise RB...I also don't think these guys put alot of weight in forward looking drafts...Way too much can happen to blow the best laid plan to hell...
I want no part of Peterson...Not cause he's a RB...Cause he DOES have an injury history...
There's only 3 players in this draft for us...
Thomas
Quinn
GO DOWN
"Go Down"...He's the NEW GUY...lol...
Also interesting is the quote from Savage not wanting to get involved with McGahee due a long term deal desired...WHY????????????...Peterson...YUCKO............
Go Browns!!!
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We're pretty sure the Bronco's could use another fan.........i can see the contradiction already....as soon as J.Lewis scores his 1st td.....you'll be the 1st one screaming "TOUCHDOWN".......how silly is that!!!! Btw, what's in your closet?
What in the heck is with all you people?!
Personal attack followed by another personal attack?!
I have been a Browns for for a great many years since I first got into football around 94'. So don't be sitting here with your little trash-talking man. Sure, I live in Colorado and unlike you, I have to undergo the trash from the Bronco fans that I am surrounded by. Look at you, you live in Ohio. Your parents are likely Browns fans, yes? Your parents give you a big ol' pat on the back for being a Browns fans and it feels you with pride knowing that your family and parents approve of your feelings. Me, I'm not so lucky. I have Bronco fans for family and parents. They tease and chide me every chance they get because I CHOOSE to be a Browns fan and I made that choice over a decade ago when I was a little 10 year old boy. I say I am more loyal than those of you who don't have to deal with being chided like I do.
All this because I don't agree with the Jamal Lewis signing?
Again you are making ASSumptions again...I never personally attacked you...so you don't know me, my family or where I am from so stop ASSuming again....
Obviously you choose to ignore me...I don't know why...well maybe I do...cause I speak with reason, logic and intelligence.....but then again your the guy who holds it against Jamal Lewis for doing his Job and running all over the Browns(What's a RB to do )......Jeez
I was talking about BrOwNsKiEs or however it is spelled.
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Go Down is a draft prospect? Funny, that's my girlfriend's nickname. Just clickin on you Pit as I feel the need to respond to the event. On the surface, I don;t like it. We're ditching a guy who's had one bad season for a guy who's had two bad seasons in a row. Plus there's the character issue. I mean, who DIDN'T make fun of Jamal when he got locked up for a few months. Granted, Lewis is still young and maybe can make a comeback. But if he does, be prepared for him to be unaffordable the following year. However, on the plus side, I'm glad its only a one year contract that roughly equals what we would have had to pay Rueben incl/ his roster bonus. This of coruse, presumes that Rueben is going bye bye which I can't understand how he won;t be. It doesn;t have sense to have both these guys on the same team as are the same type of runners who both need multiple carries to get going. We're better off using Lewis with harrison as a switchup speedback (assuming we can teach the kid how to block) The way I figure it, its a weak RB crop this year but a deeper one next year (I believe...if anyone knows otherwise, lemme know). I figure that maybe we have Jamal for a year...if he makes a comeback, we try to resign and have a legit ground threat. If he blows, we look to our first pick as an RB? I'll support Jamal as he is now a part of my team...but there's ALOT of skepticism with this one.
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I think it does DnD.
Why?
Because IF you are willing to sign a "feature back" which IS what Savage called Lewis,why invest #3 in a RB? I mean IF we were to draft Peterson,we wouldn't need a "feature back". Our current back-ups could spell AP. Wouldn't a #3 overall draft pick be your "feature back"?
I mean do you seriously believe that we go out and sign Lewis to be our "feature back" while our #3 overall draft choice rides the pines? And don't you feel Lewis was given at the very least some garuntee he would get "the oppertunity" to be our feature back and reach his incentives?
Don't you feel Lewis would NOT have signed if he weren't given SOME garuntees of reaching his incentives? It just makes no sense to me that Savage signs someone,proclaims him as a "feature back" then everyone just seemingly ignores the obvious.
But to me,it's just the exclamation point on the tri-fecta.
1. Injury history
2. Upright running style
3. He signed Lewis and proclaimed him a "feature back".
Just the icing on the preverbial cake IMO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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How can u call a ONE YEAR RB a Featured Back???...
This has "Spell Me" written all over it...Whether it be Droughns or Peterson...
Savage saying he's a Featured Back gets blown outta the water with a lousy 1 year deal...
Go Browns!!!
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Michael Bush
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Michael Bush
That makes a lot more sense to me Mourgn
I can't see spending a #3 on a guy to "spell someone" for a season.
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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If he wanted Peterson,he wouldn't have went out and signed a feature RB. Pretty simple really when you do the math.
I don't know. Lewis is really past the point of being a feature back...or doesn't have that long .
You also have to look at the fact they are somewhat different runners. Lewis is now more of a power back than the break-away guy he might have been 3-4 years ago.
I would see AP and Lewis a better compliment to each other than Droughns and Lewis....kind of the same type player.
I don't know if there is an indication in all of this that points to AP as being the selection, but I don't see anything that points to him not being the selection.
Even the move of keeping Reuben or dropping him leaves the option open....but I will say keeping him might close things a bit on the AP option.
And that isn't good if a trade is what we really seek.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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IMO
Lewis is exactly what Phil Savage said he wanted to avoid. Stop gap players.
I hope we take Joe Thomas, but I can see taking peterson, too.
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"Go Down"...He's the NEW GUY...lol...
That guy might be Gaines Adams...a top talent that is flying a little low IMO.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Mav, you know how much I respect your opinion, but I'm not able to go with you on this one. Any draft class is somewhat predicated by which underclassmen declare and which pull back, so its clearly "potential" at this point to some degree. It always is. That being said... Quote:
The running back class of next year has become the battle cry of the Peterson detractors. The class looks to have a ton of solid backs, but only 1 elite back in Darren McFadden...and Peterson is an elite back.
I have a few problems with this.
1. Google it. The 2008 RB class is being discussed by places that have nothing to do with us or Peterson. Some require subscriptions, but there are enough that are free to get the point across.
2. Peterson is not a consensus elite back. Being "Elite" is beyond basic talent in my eyes. Someone might be willing to take the risk or even feel those risks are over-stated. Time will tell.
3. The McFadden comment confused me. What will be at the top of the draft next year compared to Peterson is somewhat irrelevent, unless you think we'll be there again. I don't. All indications are that there will be at least a very servicable/feature back available mid first of 2008.
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Truth be told, if Peterson was in next years class, chances are he'd still be the top prospect.
You keep coming back to talent while the question marks around AD have nothing to do with talent. Waiting another year and incurring another injury would have potentially dropped him like a rock by substantiating existing concerns. On the other hand, playing an injury free season could have had him going #1. He came out in a weak RB class where his question marks would still allow him to be a top 10 candidate. In a stronger class - even superior talent might not have been enough to elevate him to that status. In the end, each of our opinions will be based on our views of Peterson (pros vs cons) and the other options available to us (waiting until next year, etc). I just have a strong preference to wait on a RB - especially considering our division.
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"They had it before you, They had it during you, They"ll have it after you're gone."
Al McGuire on Kentucky basketball tradition.
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IMO
Lewis is exactly what Phil Savage said he wanted to avoid. Stop gap players.
I think we have to at least consider the possibility that Savage is thinking of Lewis as more than a stop gap player..
It's possible that he's looking at this year as an evaluation year for Lewis with the intent to draft his feature back either this year or next then tuning to Lewis to be his Bettis type player,, you know, short yardage/goalline! That's not the worst thing that could happen!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Charlie... Well why didn't you say "brownskis" or whoever instead of the finger pointing and we crap...... I still have yet to see one logical reason why you don't like Jamal....Yeah cause he ran "all over the browns" and he got in trouble in the law for stuff he did before he played a down in the NFL....Crucify him...Crucify him
Go Browns!!
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,069 |
I'm really interested to see how Bush does in the NFL. He was pretty tough in Louisville.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,531
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,531 |
Quote:
Quote:
IMO
Lewis is exactly what Phil Savage said he wanted to avoid. Stop gap players.
I think we have to at least consider the possibility that Savage is thinking of Lewis as more than a stop gap player..
It's possible that he's looking at this year as an evaluation year for Lewis with the intent to draft his feature back either this year or next then tuning to Lewis to be his Bettis type player,, you know, short yardage/goalline! That's not the worst thing that could happen!
Yup, and the one year deal is to cover our asses in case Lewis continues to deteriorate.
I have to wonder though...
In 2004, Lewis had ankle problems which required surgery in the offseason. Still ran for 1000 yards in 12 games
That offseason, he was jailed. He was out of shape and couldn't get the rehab he needed, which explains his down '05 season. You try getting ready for a season without a proper training regimen. Those jail weights have nothing on the workout facilities in the NFL.
2006 he had bone spurs in his foot that he recently had surgery to remove. Still ran for 1,132 yards. Not impressive, but if the bone spurs are what slowed him down, it explains it. He looked slower this year, not Droughns slow, but not breakaway fast either.
The main question is, is he damaged goods? Or is he FINALLY healthy and able to get an offseason under his belt to get in shape and get proper rehab?
I pray for the latter, cuz he'll run roughshod on people if that's the case.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,199
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,199 |
here is a good link... http://nfl-draft-site.blogspot.com/2007/02/2008-mock-nfl-draft.html1. Darren McFadden, (JR) RB, Arkansas The Raiders should be set at quarterback with JaMarcus Russell on board and McFadden is a supreme talent, probably the best running back to enter the NFL Draft since LaDainlan Tomlinson. here are some backs... there might be one or 2 that delcared... Chauncey Washington, USC Darren McFadden, Ark. Ray Rice, Rutgers James Davis, Clemson Steve Slaton, West Va. Jamaal Charles, Texas Arian Foster, Tenn Brandon Ore, Va.Tech Ian Johnson, Boise St Allen Patrick Oklahoma Ahmad Bradshaw, Marshall Marshawn Lynch, Cal Mike Hart, Mich. Darius Walker, ND Alley Brossard, LSU Yvenson Bernard Oregon State Rafael Little, Kentucky
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 305
All Pro
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All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 305 |
danglet,
I'll try to respond to you the best I can...
- I don't think Savage can operate under the assumption that he'll just wait on a RB because next year's class is stacked with (solid IMO) RBs. Too many variables btw now and then. I believe it's become the "stylish" post on the various message boards I frequent - "We can wait until next year to get a back"...with the uncertainty surrounding this Coaching staff and Front Office...I don't know if next year is being discussed at all...
- IMO, and in regards to this years draft class, I see 5 elite prospects - Thomas, Peterson, Quinn, Russell and Johnson. This is pure preference based, so anyone could easily say Peterson isn't elite. IMO, he is...
- I think, mentioning what is at the top of next years draft is relevant. If we pass on Peterson and have a decent season we wont be in a position to draft someone of his talent...if you need/want it and can get it now...DO IT!...I don't know if that's what Savage will do, but it's no secret the running game was terrible last year and he's is trying to address it...
- IMO, Peterson's injuries are a bit overblown. I don't consider Peterson more of an injury risk than I do Joe Thomas. Both players have had injuries, in fact Thomas' injury was much more serious than anything Peterson has dealt with. I think Peterson's problem was over-usage (and stupidly diving in the endzone) as opposed to him being injury prone...he had a TON of carries his Freshmen year - that's a lot for an undeveloped body to handle. I think a year in the League splitting carries and building his frame and those injury questions are answered, but again my opinion.
I hope that helps clear up where I'm coming from.
As a side note: I know people have stated in this thread that picking up Lewis is a clear sign that Peterson is out of the question....I see it entirely differently...
If I'm Savage and I'm thinking about drafting Peterson - I have a capable guy in the stable who can split carries with the young man (sorry, that's not Droughns). New England, Dallas and Indianapolis have successfully utilized a Rookie and a Vet ground attack, IMO that's what we're shooting for...
Read my sig guys, I'd prefer Thomas, but Peterson is a special player that deserves consideration. I've past the point of pimpin any one player, because there is about 5 guys who we could realistically take at 3 that will help this team immensely...
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