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I'm going to take two direct quotes from this week. The first is from Shurmur during his weekly press conference before the St Louis game Quote:
(On where this teams falls on a scale of how much they audible compared to other teams)- “It’s hard to say. I know there are some systems where you call the play and run it, there are other systems where the quarterback is at the line of scrimmage with maybe three or four options on a play. That being the case, I would imagine we’re somewhere in between.”
(On if McCoy has audibled at different times throughout the year)- “That’s part of what we do, depending on what play is called and then everybody has situations where you call a play and run it. Then there’s other ones where the play is being run into a look that’s unacceptable and you make a change.”
The second is from Colt McCoy following the game today.
Quote:
Colt just said in his presser that he does not have the option to audible.
So......which is it guys? Can't get your stories straight eh? Either somebody is flat out lying in a major CYA moment, or this team is SO utterly screwed up that the HC and QB don't even know what they are, or are not allowed to do.
Either way. Epic fail.
I still wish I had the terms of the sig bet I accepted way back over the summer when I said we were a 2-3 win team who MIGHT get to 4-5 wins only due to our craptastically easy schedule.
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or this team is SO utterly screwed up that the HC and QB don't even know what they are, or are not allowed to do.
Is this surprising? It's possible Shurmur didn't even know that A.Smith was in the game for the infamous FB handoff. I really believe that.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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If the quote from McCoy is what I think. He said for that particular play there was no audible. Could be wrong thought. Just seems a lot of people on here lately only printing part of quotes or skew facts to prove there point.
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I saw the postgame presser and you're right, he was talking about the specific play.
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Ok thought so. Was listening to the post game while working in the garage and not paying to much attention.
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So now we're supposed to believe there are certain plays Shurmur allows Colt to audible, but NOT others? Shurmur play 1 - "The play is Z wiggle 85 tight...oh and I MEAN it this time...no audibles young man!" Shumur play 2 - "Ohh I dunno I guess the play is X right blue 18....but feel free to improvise man I don't really care THIS time"  I don't buy it. I'm still throwing the BS flag to one or the other.
Last edited by GraffZ06; 11/13/11 10:54 PM.
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I didn't watch much of the game today as I had prior committments but...
I think you're making much ado about nothing. It might've been a formation with no plausible audible.
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Quote:
I saw the postgame presser and you're right, he was talking about the specific play.
I thought Colt was asked if he thought about audibling, and he said that he didn't or wouldn't or something. The way he answered it sounded to me like he would've been chewed out if he did change the play at the line.
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I don't ever remember a time this year where Colt has audibled...
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One of the reporters asked Colt if he thought about changing the play when he saw Smith in there (or something similar), and that's what prompted the answer. I'm pretty certain he was referring to that play.
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Then you must not watch the games. I have seen Colt audible in every game this year. 
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Quote:
One of the reporters asked Colt if he thought about changing the play when he saw Smith in there (or something similar), and that's what prompted the answer. I'm pretty certain he was referring to that play.
Yep. That he didn't is troublesome, whatever the reason.
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Then you must not watch the games. I have seen Colt audible in every game this year.
when did he audible today?
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Quote:
So now we're supposed to believe there are certain plays Shurmur allows Colt to audible, but NOT others?
Shurmur play 1 - "The play is Z wiggle 85 tight...oh and I MEAN it this time...no audibles young man!"
Shumur play 2 - "Ohh I dunno I guess the play is X right blue 18....but feel free to improvise man I don't really care THIS time"
I don't buy it. I'm still throwing the BS flag to one or the other.
I'm surprised this is still a mystery.
Ok, it's like this......
During the game there are situations where the coach/OC has ultimate authority. An example of this can be at the end of a half. Let's say there's only a few seconds left and it's a kneel-down. They don't want the QB checking out of that and calling a Statue-of-Liberty. 
So, applying that to the end of the game, Shurmur absolutely forbade McCoy to change any of the plays to a pass.
In the end, they are both right. Shurmur has given McCoy the ability to audible. I've seen it with my own eyes. However, in that case, McCoy was not allowed to audible, which is exactly what he's saying.
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Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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So Basically I thought this was going to be a discussion on either of two things.
1 The suckage has reached a whole new level since 2006!
or
2 I root for the equivalant of the Minnesota Golden Gophers of the NFL!
I just got done watching the Pat's show what a real offense looks like.
And that ain't a knock on the Browns Players.
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About 9:42 in the first qtr. After.The Josh Cribbs bubble screen. Of course it was the only one I saw in the first half.
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Based solely on what I heard and retained from the Pressers, I think you are making way to much of nothing.. Colt was talking about a specific play that he doesn't have the option to audible on.
By the way,, the second comment that you quoted, isn't an actual Verbatim quote.. Maybe that's the disconnect for ya.
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In the big scheme of how much is wrong, how often STs are cutting our throat, how indifferent we seem to be as related to our losses and repeating the same old offensive horrors, this is not huge at all. It is a symptom, but not the plague we are ginning up here. Shurmur needs a trip to the offensive woodshed IMO.  
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Quote:
I saw the postgame presser and you're right, he was talking about the specific play.
There should never be a play where an audible is taken off the QB's repertoire, except the victory formation - which has been seen all too seldom in Cleveland over the past dozen years.
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Then you must not watch the games. I have seen Colt audible in every game this year.
Really? When?
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Quote:
So now we're supposed to believe there are certain plays Shurmur allows Colt to audible, but NOT others?
Shurmur play 1 - "The play is Z wiggle 85 tight...oh and I MEAN it this time...no audibles young man!"
Shumur play 2 - "Ohh I dunno I guess the play is X right blue 18....but feel free to improvise man I don't really care THIS time"
I don't buy it. I'm still throwing the BS flag to one or the other.
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http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/media-lou...aa-685f51bc1cc1Watch the video of McCoy's presser yourself and decide. The pertinent answer comes at about 2:18 into the clip but the setup for the question comes 2:07 in the clip. Quote:
The question came: Did you think about changing the play, audibling, because you knew that Alex was the fullback in that role?
McCoy: No. No. No.
The follow-up question: Do you have the option?
McCoy: No.
Last edited by anarchy2day; 11/14/11 07:37 PM.
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Quote:
So now we're supposed to believe there are certain plays Shurmur allows Colt to audible, but NOT others?
Shurmur play 1 - "The play is Z wiggle 85 tight...oh and I MEAN it this time...no audibles young man!"
Shumur play 2 - "Ohh I dunno I guess the play is X right blue 18....but feel free to improvise man I don't really care THIS time"
I don't buy it. I'm still throwing the BS flag to one or the other.
Your problem is two fold:
First you quote Shurmur from his press conference and then compare that with a quote from a board member (who misunderstood Colt's answer to a question) and then want to know who's lying as if two team members were quoted saying different things.
Secondly, your comic act above is silly to the Nth degree.
You jumped off on something and presented it in a way that makes no sense and then want an answer to the nonsense. The answer is you don't understand.
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You're right my second quote was from a board member...only because I didn't have the official transcript of Colt's response to give his direct quote at the time. The poster above me just gave it though. So yeah it's not like I'm making this stuff up.
So we have the HC and QB answering the same question with two different answers within the same week. What is there that I don't understand exactly?
Like I said the "well he's allowed to audible SOMETIMES but not others" argument doesn't fly for me. The only time that might make sense is during a victory formation or during the first 10 or 15 plays of the game which are scripted during the week. Of course I'm not 100% positive we even do that.
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Well I gave an example above. Also followed it up saying it was the only one of the half. I don't have the other games on dvr anymore or I would look through them. I never said they audible a lot, just saying because you didn't see it doesn't mean they don't audible.
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I've watched all these games on NFL Sunday Ticket (and rewatched them). I don't remember an instance where McCoy has audibled. Not a single time. He might be out there telling teammates where they are supposed to be on the plays, but I don't think he's given an audible, not even once all season long!
If the front office is intent on drafting a QB to replace him (as many here want them to do), McCoy should thank his lucky stars to get out of this situation. He's smart, he's able to make plays with his feet but he's got a HC that is dumber than a box of rocks and without any talent at critical positions on the team.
Sure, Hillis is hurt. Hardesty is hurt. Brandon Jackson hasn't even seen the field due to injury. We've got Chris Ogbonnaya as our starting RB!
We have Greg Little and Joshua Cribbs as or WRs. We got Massaquoi that doesn't know how to come back for a pass and who is also injured. We have Jordan Norwood that's a #4 receiver at best as our possession guy.
Our TEs could be phenomenal if they'd actually use them as targets effectively. Several of them could be out there in WR roles to help out that squad and be the huge target like Andre Johnson is for the Texans or that Calvin Johnson is for the Lions. But, for some reason, the receivers we have aren't allowed to alter the route or are incapable of reading the safety and altering the route (coming under the safeties when they're playing back or going past them if they creep into the box) and get on the same page as McCoy.
This team won't win another game. They just won't as long as the team has no talent and no competent coaching.
It's a freaking disaster waiting to happen every Sunday.
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I'll go watch that again, but I doubt that your right about it. I firmly believe that he doesn't have the authority to call audibles. I suspect that he was simply making sure that someone was in the correct spot and if he did call an audible, he did so without Shurmur's approval.
He said so, quite clearly, in the post-game presser, that he did not have the authority to call audibles.
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Oh... and if you find any others... I'd be interested to know when you saw those 'audibles' too.
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Quote:
If the quote from McCoy is what I think. He said for that particular play there was no audible. Could be wrong thought. Just seems a lot of people on here lately only printing part of quotes or skew facts to prove there point.
I agree. Half truths can be well you know....
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He didn't audible anything at 9:42 left in the first. If you think he called an audible, you're seeing something that isn't there and I suggest you look again.
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Wll i apologize for calling Anarchy and HotB out. When I was wrong  . rewatchde eveery offensive snap. that was weak in the first qtr. at most he might have changed which side play ran. Only other time I saw a play where McCoy looked like he had an option was he looked like he was going to go under center but then went back into shotgun. Think it was about 9:30 in the 3rd. And even then it looked like it might have been scripted becasue he didn't yell any play changes. Just a swat on the butt to Mack to let him know. Still can't be;ieve he didn't audible once. 
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That bet was with me. You said we'd be lucky to win 2-3 games. If we win another game you lose the bet with me.
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I am going with the not allowed to audible. Shurmur is a control freak who thinks he is smarter than everyone else out there (hence the I will be my own OC/playcaller thing). This is also a huge reason for McCoy's regression this year, as without the ability to audible, many plays are doomed from the start. The QB MUST be able to read a defense and change a play if he sees something, if he is not allowed to do so he will fail (and that is any QB). Since Shurms isn't yelling in adjustments from the sideline (like they do in college), it means the play he sends in is the one that gets run no matter what the D shows (ie no exploiting weaknesses, no getting out of 7 step drops when a blitz is coming, etc).
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So we have the HC and QB answering the same question with two different answers within the same week. What is there that I don't understand exactly?
The main thing that you don't understand, exactly, is that it wasn't the same question. So you were not going to get the same answer from each of them.
The question to Shurmur was in general regarding how audibles work in our scheme.
The question to Colt was regarding a specific play.
To be allowed to audible sometimes and not others makes perfect sense.
If Colt sees that the called play will not work because of what the defense is showing pre-snap then he can change a run to a pass or a pass to a run.
But to decide for himself that he doesn't like the called play, for whatever reason other than what the defense is showing, and so just change it to what he'd rather run is not allowed. There's a big difference.
The first instance is one of the things that made Bernie Kosar so good. The second instance is what Belichick didn't like about Berenie and eventually got him cut.
It is not up to Colt to decide he knows better than the play caller. In this instance the defense didn't show pre-snap that the called play would not work and needed to be audibled to a pass. So he's not to change it.
You can't have your second year quarterback second guessing the OC and doing whatever he wants. On the other hand, he must know when the defense determines that the play must be changed and be smart enough to do that. Colt is and he does.
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Damn near every Head Coach takes audibles off in situations like this at the end of a game. The Coach plays for a FG to win the game, and he doesn't want the QB calling an audible into an INT.
McCoy has been allowed to audible earlier. Maybe the Coach just doesn't like the plays he audibles to?
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This whole thread is much ado about nothing due to things taken out of context being used as absolutes.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Quote:
Maybe the Coach just doesn't like the plays he audibles to?
You can make damn near anything into Colt's fault can't you? 
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Quote:
The question to Colt was regarding a specific play.
No it wasn't. The initial question was on that specific play but the follow-up was not. It was a general question.
Truth is, Colt McCoy isn't allowed to call audibles because Shurmur is a freaking moron.
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Quote:
I'm going to take two direct quotes from this week.
The first is from Shurmur during his weekly press conference before the St Louis game
Quote:
(On where this teams falls on a scale of how much they audible compared to other teams)- “It’s hard to say. I know there are some systems where you call the play and run it, there are other systems where the quarterback is at the line of scrimmage with maybe three or four options on a play. That being the case, I would imagine we’re somewhere in between.”
(On if McCoy has audibled at different times throughout the year)- “That’s part of what we do, depending on what play is called and then everybody has situations where you call a play and run it. Then there’s other ones where the play is being run into a look that’s unacceptable and you make a change.”
The second is from Colt McCoy following the game today.
Quote:
Colt just said in his presser that he does not have the option to audible.
So......which is it guys? Can't get your stories straight eh? Either somebody is flat
ut lying in a major CYA moment, or this team is SO utterly screwed up that the HC and QB don't even know what they are, or are not allowed to do.
Either way. Epic fail.
I still wish I had the terms of the sig bet I accepted way back over the summer when I said we were a 2-3 win team who MIGHT get to 4-5 wins only due to our craptastically easy schedule.
I agree with this post .
Hall of fame QB Dan Fouts opined during the Niner beatdown or which beatdown i can't quite remember was that colt was getting knocked down because the browns seemed not to have audibles of the basic concept of a Hot receiver during blitzes. That Colt was throwing the ball and receivers were not even turning around.
Shurmer is covering his ass. Colt has no audible options, what we run a run about 80% on first down to the same hole for the same results of a yard or two. Great play calling. never seen an audible out of that one. I have never seen a head coach
stand by himself and do no coaching so often since RAC. You see harbaugh going over plays all game with the offense.
Shurmer STINKS and he scapegoats players. My guess he will freeze out Colt even more because he slipped up and told the truth.
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I agree with this post .
Say it ain't so Joe
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