I was referring to predraft opinion. Willis while showing amazing instincts in college, he was small and small linebackers slide due to durability concerns.
Quote: I was referring to predraft opinion. Willis while showing amazing instincts in college, he was small and small linebackers slide due to durability concerns.
I remember pimping Willis even when he was a Sophomore.. and nobody on here knew who he was.. lol.
Of those running backs, here are the only ones I wouldn't take in the first round, in hindsight ...
Ron Dayne Trung Canidate Michael Bennett William Green TJ Duckett Chris Perry Kevin Jones Laurence Maroney Joesph Addai Jonathan Stewart Felix Jones Knowshon Moreno Donald Browns Beanie Wells
Too soon to decide on the 2010-2011 draft RB's.
*Note - I would take Reggie Bush in the first round, but not to be a feature back. If you put him in an offense and find creative ways to get him the ball, he's dangerous and definitely worth a 1st rounder*
Same could be said for LTs with Joe Thomas and Jake Long. Its a dumb argument. I could also use this analogy on QBs with Alex Smith and the 49ers.
Good point with LT's -- don't get the Alex Smith analogy.
I was referring to the 49ers being one of the best teams in the league with a below avg starter at the QB spot. Sort of a reverse LT comparison; Great LTs on a bad team, bad QB on a great team.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
Quote: *Note - I would take Reggie Bush in the first round, but not to be a feature back. If you put him in an offense and find creative ways to get him the ball, he's dangerous and definitely worth a 1st rounder*
Funny you say that. I was thinking about this a while back, comparing him to guys like Hester and Cribbs. They are all dynamic players with great open field moves and speed. They aren't traditional RBs or WRs....more like a mix between PR, KR, scatback and WR.
I think most team would want all three on their roster without question. The thing that hurts Bush was that he was drafted too high (not really his fault).
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Week 12 Rewind: RGIII not only beats OU, he answers scouts' questions
By Rob Rang | The Sports Xchange/CBSSports.com
The popularity of Robert Griffin III is moving well beyond Waco. (US Presswire)
Each week, we rewind the game film to highlight the star-worthy performances that could impact the 2012 draft rankings:
A record-breaking performance Saturday night by Baylor quarterback Robert Griffin III could one day be looked back as his ultimate trifecta. Griffin gave Baylor its first win over Oklahoma in 21 tries; it made him a Heisman favorite and perhaps answered the last question scouts had about his ability to play in the NFL. The 6-foot-2, 220-pound redshirt junior carved up an athletic Oklahoma secondary for a school-record 479 passing yards and four touchdowns -- including the winner with only eight seconds remaining -- in a thrilling 45-38 upset victory.
Considering the gaudy statistics RGIII had been producing all season long -- he entered the game completing 70 percent of his passes with a 29-5 TD to INT ratio -- Saturday's performance wasn't necessarily a surprise. It was, however, confirmation of Griffin's toughness as the Sooners hit the Baylor quarterback early and often. Spread offenses typically limit the decisions quarterbacks have to make, allowing them to get the ball out of their hands quickly with a variety of short routes. Few spread quarterbacks ever develop the poise to handle pressure when they do see it. Most spread quarterbacks are limited to the pocket. Make them move their feet and their effectiveness typically takes a tumble. This is precisely where Griffin III broke the stereotype.
On multiple occasions, Griffin demonstrated his poise and intelligence by throwing the ball away. Griffin erased what could have been a huge momentum switch in favor of the Sooners by collecting an errant shotgun snap, running to his right and firing a pass out of bounds. Plays like these go down in the stat books as just another incompletion, but they prove a quarterback's football intelligence.
Griffin showed that he isn't just an athlete blessed with extraordinary physical skills and an offense catered to his strengths, he's also a thinking man's quarterback. Of course, to be a first-round pick in the NFL, he needs to have those physical skills, as well. Most important, Griffin has a strong right arm capable of making any NFL throw. Some of the most difficult passes asked of pro quarterbacks, in fact, are among Griffin's best.
The fourth-year Baylor product throws a better deep ball than any other quarterback in the country due to his arm strength and extraordinary touch. Spread offenses typically pad quarterbacks' stats because they feature a great deal of underneath routes. Baylor's does too. The quick screen is as fundamental to the Bears' success as it is spread team. But they also attack the field vertically with remarkable consistency. Saturday's win over Oklahoma was the eighth time this season (in 10 tries) in which Baylor has completed at least one pass of 60-plus yards.
Griffin does not possess the textbook technique or experience in the pro-style offense that Stanford's Andrew Luck or USC's Matt Barkley boast. He is however, an undeniably more unique talent who could join the Pac-12 stars as top five picks come April.
• While Griffin answered questions, another Big 12 quarterback -- Oklahoma State's Brandon Weeden -- raised more questions a day earlier about his ability to transition to the NFL. He turned in an uncharacteristically poor performance in a double-overtime loss to Iowa State. Weeden can certainly be questioned for his decision-making and lack of accuracy once forced to re-set his feet. Some will simply blame him for the then-second-ranked Cowboys' upset loss.
More accurately, Weeden and reigning Biletnikof winner Justin Blackmon were matched up against the top cornerback in the Big 12 and Iowa State's Leonard Johnson was up to the task. The 5-10, 202-pound Johnson doesn't get a great deal of national attention, but he will after last Friday's game. The senior was officially credited with five solo tackles, an interception and a fumble recovery. As well-rounded as those numbers are, they don't do Johnson justice. Johnson provided much more physical coverage against Blackmon than the Cowboys' star is accustomed to facing.
Blackmon, NFLDraftScout.com's top-rated wide receiver for the 2012 draft, caught 10 passes Friday night, but was effectively contained by Johnson's tenacious coverage gaining "only" 99 yards and a score despite the game going into double-overtime. Johnson announced his presence with a strong open-field tackle to keep Blackmon a yard shy of a first down on OSU's second drive. The play appeared insignificant as the Cowboys normally convert easily on 3rd-and-1, but this time running back Joseph Randle coughed the ball up, setting the tone early for a gritty effort from the Cyclones.
Johnson was in press coverage when he gave up Blackmon's score in the second quarter. Johnson did not get an initial jam on Blackmon, granting him an outside release. Johnson trailed slightly in coverage but was in good position. A perfect back shoulder fade by Weeden, however, drew Blackmon back to the ball, dipping inside Johnson at the perfect time for the catch and stroll into the end zone.
The play was a perfect example of the old adage that the perfect throw can beat perfect coverage. In the third quarter Johnson's play appeared to be tailing off, as he was called for pass interference for getting his hand around the back of Blackmon. Johnson quickly atoned for the mistake by recovering a fumble, which gave ISU the ball back in position to kick a field goal and narrow the Cowboys' lead to 24-17.
Johnson erased OSU's next possession, snatching a deflected pass for an interception early in the fourth quarter that put the Cyclones in position to tie. A physical and tenacious defender capable in man and zone coverage who shows the maturity to bounce back after plays that didn't go his way, Johnson may have boosted himself into top 75 consideration with his impressive performance.
• Upon Further Review highlights a player whose performance over the weekend significantly altered my earlier assessment.
Entering the season, Clemson defensive tackle Brandon Thompson was graded by many as one of the elite senior prospects in the entire country regardless of position.
The 6-2, 310-pound defender had been overshadowed in the past by Da'Quan Bowers and Jarvis Jenkins, but scouts appreciated his burst off the snap and high-revving motor. It was hoped that Thompson would take the next step this season and turn pressures he had often created into more big plays. But that hasn't happened. Thompson is credited with an impressive 59 tackles through 10 starts for the Tigers, but with only 5.5 tackles for loss and 2.5 sacks, scouts worry that he lacks the sustained quickness to ever be more than a rotational three-technique at the next level.
Saturday's upset loss against North Carolina State won't help Thompson's cause. Limited to four total tackles (three were assists), Thompson was effectively bottled up. The Wolfpack, in fact, recognized Thompson's burst upfield and countered with traps to get the aggressive defensive tackle out of the way, rushing for over four times the yardage (145 to 34) as Clemson for the day. A weak senior class of defensive tackles may be enough to keep Thompson among the first 50 picks of the 2012 draft, but he's been overtaken by Penn State's Devon Still as the country's top senior and there is a host of underclassmen who may also pass him by. web page
For being a true freshman, he's looking good but A LOT of holes and rushing yards for an average PSU team with a crappy QB that didn't seem to be there when Sweat was in the line up
Not saying Shazier but i'm sure some of his inexperience didn't help
I'm coming home, I'm coming home, tell the world I'm coming home
Lemme guess....you'd also wanna sign Chad Mustard and Mitch Burger just so you could crack a few jokes.
The Falcons pick continues to go down, but ours continues to go up. It'll be interesting to see how players move up and down the draft boards to see how we can fill these holes.
I'll tell you what, Candy......if our pick continues to go up, I wouldn't at all be opposed to trying to find a taker so we could move down some and pick up another late 1st or very high 2nd rounder. We just have so many holes that we can't hope to fill them all unless we have a bunch of high picks.....
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
I think we are seeing us at least settle in to our range...we might pivk up a couple of spots, but probably not drop much.
As for the Falcons pick, that's going to drop. It could drop a lot over the next month. Drop so much I wouldn't even consider it trade bait for any of the top picks. It may become trade bait to pick up some 2nd round picks if somebody holds 2 of those.
I think in the end we are going to stick with McCoy and any QB drafted will be the 2nd round variety, so you might as well be discussing who those prospects might be....I hope you do, I enjoy the discussion.
I still like Tanneyhill even if he had a bad last game. You can't just look at "A" game and wrap it all in to that.
I'll play homer here for a moment.....UT Chattanooga had a pretty darn good QB....B.J. Coleman. Was a top prospect out of HS and signed with Tn. Then got caught up in all that Lame Train stuff and decided to get the heck out of there and came here....his hometown.
I think he can be a pretty good developmental guy with IMO a ton of upside.
You head it here first!
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
Why is Barkley considered that much better of prospect than Griffin?
Griffin is the same size (6'3'' to 6'2''ish), has a stronger downfield arm (from what I have seen) and can keep plays alive with his legs.
Their stats are comparable (Griffin's are actually slightly better), against the same competition and he has a much higher ceiling as a pro IMO.
Maybe Barkley is the safer bet, in terms of bust rate but I'd rather aim high and try to get the player who can be a difference maker at the next level. I see no reason in trading up for Barkley if Griffin is going to fall in to your lap in the middle of the 1st round.
Griffin is 6'2" in 2" cleats standing on a hardwood floor at best. Most pundits think he'll measure in at just under 6'. After last season he wasn't even a draftable prospect,a huge upswing after one season always concerns me.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
I find it interesting he wasn't considered draftable last year? I know he wasn't considered a perfect prospect but he still put up some pretty good numbers in his second full year as a starter.
From what I've seen of him, the biggest difference from this year to last is he's really seeing the field beyond 10 yards. He was more of an intermediate thrower as a sophomore but has really been making a ton of downfield, NFL throws as junior.
The thing that impresses me most about him is he's a great decision maker. On a team that lacks elite talent, it's much harder to show that discipline IMO (i.e. forcing too many throws). His TD / INT numbers really reflect that: 75 TD passes, 16 INT's.
I don't think he's a can't miss player but at #11 or #12, his ceiling is so high that I just don't see how you pass on him. Colt hasn't really shown me enough for the Browns to hitch their trailer to him long term.
May be a moot point though. He may play his way in to the top 7 or 8 picks. In terms of the upswing, think Carolina regrets taking Newton? I just think RGIII's jump is a combination of hard work and understanding the position a bit better.
Quote: he's really seeing the field beyond 10 yards....
The thing that impresses me most about him is he's a great decision maker. On a team that lacks elite talent, it's much harder to show that discipline IMO (i.e. forcing too many throws).
I've only watched him in 3 games... some tidbits of others, but yeah, he actually looks at more than one receiver. He doesn't freak out and scramble if he can wait to throw. He's got nice touch and basically unlimited range throwing. He doesn't wing the ball if he doesn't have to but he can when he wants to. There was a play against Oklahoma where he waited and waited, then had to scramble right but kept looking downfield. Just as he got to the sideline he fired an absolute rope 12 yards on the sideline on the move for a completion. He seems to be one of those guys that just "gets" football and has all the physical tools to get the job done. He's definitely a pocket passer with mobility, and not just a "dual-threat" type of QB. He might get some passes knocked down, but he seems to have a great awareness of what's going on around him, which should help finding the throwing lanes.
I only got to see RGIII play one game, but he was impressive in that game. He appeared to go through progressions, had nice touch on his passes, placed the ball well, had a nice compact motion, hit receivers in stride, made quick decisions, and a really decent arm.
Again, that's one game that I saw.
He should make someone a decent backup, if nothing else. he looks like he has potential to be more. He did more things well than not in the game I saw him play.
Speaking of backups, I forget what game it was (maybe the Bears?) that I was watching, but the backup QB was in the game, and I swear that it almost seemed like he started winding up at his hip to throw a 10 yard crossing pattern. It seemed like every pass had this huge roundhouse delivery. I'm not sure how a guy with mechanics that bad makes an NFL team as their primary backup. His throwing motion was an absolute mess.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Weeden could be the head and shoulders best QB talent-wise in the entire draft (he isn't) and he still would be lucky to be a 2nd round pick due to his age.
He'll be 29 next year! He most likely only has ~5 more good years in him. No team will waste the $$ and resources on a top round QB for such few years of return on that investment.
I think he goes late 2nd or more likely 3rd round to be someone's backup QB for the next 5-6 years.
Fear us, for we are the BROWNS, led by the mighty BM! Only in Cleveland.
1. Luck 2. Barkley 3. Weeden 4. Tannehill 5. Jones
Haven't seen enough of RG 3 to compare him....and I think Jones should stay for his SR year, too raw....
I don't know how you have your QB's rated. If you have them rated based on talent it's one thing, but if it's draftability (is that a word?!) it's another rating completely.
I wouldn't have Weeden any higher than a 5th round pick because of his age alone. He's going to be 29 in December of his rookie season coming out of a spread offense. By the time he's hitting his stride, he's going to be ready for the pasture, starting the process all over again.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
Quote: I don't know how you have your QB's rated. If you have them rated based on talent it's one thing, but if it's draftability (is that a word?!) it's another rating completely.
It's a mix of both, but ultimately I have ranked them on predicted NFL success...I had Weeden ahead of Barkley but his bad game against Iowa St. made me realize that he isn't as day 1 ready as Barkley, thus he got demoted. Weeden has problems with pressure and he will face lots of it in the NFL....he still reminds me of Roethli without the pocket awareness and the question is how good Roethli would be if he hadn't the pocket awareness he has...as I said other times: the age really doesn't bother me, he has played as many years of football as most other QBs, even less then most, so his body is "younger" and he should be able to play out his rook contract + a couple of years...sure it'll be no legacy but that's the reason he won't get drafted in the Top 20 most likely....after that he will be a hot commodity for teams that drew a blank in the top of the 1st round....and we could be 1 of those teams.
Whoever we draft, McCoy will start 2012 if the QB isn't named Luck or Barkley imho....I'm not sold on Barkley but I have a feeling we will make a move for him and if it doesn't pan out we will draft Tannehill....I just would like to avoid Jones, he' s the next A.Smith, Gabbert, Bradford, Kolb....a very raw shotgun QB that needs time and can't be rushed on the field....all those QBs needed at least 1 year on the bench but most had to play in their rookie seasons and they could never develop into good NFL QBs, even the ones who got the time (Kolb)....too much projection involved and not worth a top 15 pick
While Tannehill is also a project he has a better feel for his position and that's a start but he also needs 1 year on the bench
Here are some interesting comps from a crazy draftnik (not me, so take it fwiw):
0fer Indianapolis doesnt matter who they play 2-9 St. Louis =49ers, Seahawks, Bengals, Steelers, 49ers 2-9 Minnesota =Broncos, Lions, Saints, Redskins, Bears
This happens every year about this time, people start dropping QB's in favor of other random QB's. And every year come draft time, it ends up being what everyone originally thought.
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/6WV79RV/Browns-Coach-Sig.png)
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif)
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/GraffZ06/browns_factory_sig.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
I know won't shut up about E.J.Manuel in the 4th or Brock Osweiler in the late 4th / early 5th.
It seemed like every pass had this huge roundhouse delivery. I'm not sure how a guy with mechanics that bad makes an NFL team as their primary backup. His throwing motion was an absolute mess.