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The debate continues as fans try to hash out the future at the QB position...
...rarely do young QBs "not improve" in year two playing in a new offensive system...it's hard to believe McCoy would not also improve if he played another season in the Browns offense.
...if the Browns draft another QB and hand him the ball, the Browns are back to square one with another, younger QB trying to learn while playing in Shurmur's offense...if the Browns do spend a 1st round pick on a QB, fans should not expect miracles from the 2012 QB draftee, either.
...with so many needs at almost every position, can the Browns afford to spend either first round pick on a QB?
I'm not sure what the Browns will do or should do as attempt to answer some of the questions I posed above.
...let the debate continue...
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Quote:
The debate continues as fans try to hash out the future at the QB position...
...rarely do young QBs "not improve" in year two playing in a new offensive system...it's hard to believe McCoy would not also improve if he played another season in the Browns offense.
I don't think that any QB would improve under any system run by Shurmur.
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...if the Browns draft another QB and hand him the ball, the Browns are back to square one with another, younger QB trying to learn while playing in Shurmur's offense...if the Browns do spend a 1st round pick on a QB, fans should not expect miracles from the 2012 QB draftee, either.
But they would expect miracles from a rookie QB. They really can't come to grips with the truth that it's the coaching and offensive play calling that's the problem.
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...with so many needs at almost every position, can the Browns afford to spend either first round pick on a QB?
Ask many of them and not only would they spend one on a QB, but they would agree to give away three first round picks to get an untested rookie.
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I'm not sure what the Browns will do or should do as attempt to answer some of the questions I posed above.
I have my thoughts about what they should do, but I'm not sure at all that they will do it.
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The simple fix is to try and sign Drew Brees...and if we still think Colt can do it let him learn from the best. There was alot of comparison between Colt and Drew....I never saw it as I think Colt is nothing more than career backup.
Brees has nothing left to prove, has his ring, and maybe willing to come and try to turn another franchise around before he hangs up the cleats.
if they dont want to go FA route, then they need to pull the trigger in the draft. Colt hasnt shown enough IMO to warrant another season as the starter. A career back up started and looked just as good if not better than McCoy. His passes where on time, and for the most part right on the money. Colt is always a yard short, and second late. If he cant play better than the back up then whats the point of keepin him around. He is here on the cheap and very expendable.
RG3 would excell in the WCO....his play style is taylor made for it, and he has the legs to get out of a bad situation. He is a mix between Cam Newton and Michael Vick. If we can get him we need to do it! He is going to be exciting, and I could see him being a great NFL QB!
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Brees isn't leaving New Orleans. He loves it there, loves playing in the dome, loves the team, his coaches, and the whole area.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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This is really the big question. On one hand, we can see that Colt probably isn't going to be a superstar. And when will you ever have a high pick (No. 4) to spend on a potential franchise QB and still have another pick in the first round to build depth?
On the other hand, those two picks could yield a stud WR and much-needed help on the offensive line. Then, if we can strike gold with that early No. 2 like we did with Sheard, well...
I wish I knew what genius Holmgren really thought of McCoy's skills, and if he thought one of the next tier QBs, like Tannehill might fall to us in the second round and be a solution.
Two other points: Right now, I am for making nice with Hillis and writing this off as a mullligan year. We know he can play (catch, rush and block) and he's been humbled. Let's sign him. I also think the answer at the other cornerback might just be Skrine. I thought he was a real sleeper last year, and he looks like he's ready to emerge.
My dream draft scenario: 1(A) Blackmon, 1(B) Best Available RT, 2 Bookend for Sheard.
I would even trade down yet again if I thought we could still net Michael Floyd instead of Blackmon and get another high pick.
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The simple fix is to try and sign Drew Brees...and if we still think Colt can do it let him learn from the best. There was alot of comparison between Colt and Drew....I never saw it as I think Colt is nothing more than career backup.
If the Browns land Brees, it's not likely that Brees will even listen to anything that Shurmur has to say and I'm not sure that any OC would have more football smarts than Brees has. It's likely that he'll be calling audibles every play.
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I would love to see somebody else call the plays that will finish a game for us. Entire series of Hillis up the middle repeatedly shows little game sense. Our sideline has had a large role in some of the stinkers this season, esp. Shurm IMO. 
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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I pretty much gave up on Colt when he threw the ball to Mack. You either have an elite QB or you don't. We don't.
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Brees isn't leaving New Orleans. He loves it there, loves playing in the dome, loves the team, his coaches, and the whole area.
I kind of agree with you. More to the point, though, is IF he leaves N.O. it sure won't be so he can play in Cleveland, no matter how much money we offer.
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Exactly.
People need to just remove the name Brees from their offseason vocabulary. There is quite literally _ZERO_ chance of it happening.
I would also like to take a moment and make the same statement about Manning. _ZERO_ chance.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Quote:
I would love to see somebody else call the plays that will finish a game for us. Entire series of Hillis up the middle repeatedly shows little game sense. Our sideline has had a large role in some of the stinkers this season, esp. Shurm IMO.
I would like to see colt given a selection of plays he is free to choose, I think Shurmer has brain lock as the game progresses.
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Hmmm...
McCoy: "Let's see...I can run:
A) The 4-yard curl to Watson
B) The 4-yard out to Mass
C) The 4-yard screen to Hillis
D) The 4-yard slant to Little
Decisions...decisions..."
Like Shurmur or not, you don't hand over the keys to the offense to a 2nd year guy who has pretty-much fallen out of favor.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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C) The 4-yard screen to Hillis
4 yards would be an improvement over our recent screens! 
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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RG3 would excell in the WCO....his play style is taylor made for it, and he has the legs to get out of a bad situation. He is a mix between Cam Newton and Michael Vick. If we can get him we need to do it! He is going to be exciting, and I could see him being a great NFL QB!
That's really not true at all - at least as our WCO is designed.
Remember how we throw less deep-balls than any other team in the league?
Remember how we have 0 receivers who can stretch the field?
Remember how the only "plus" throw that RG3 has is the deep ball?
Sure, he could fit into the offense, but you need to make some changes in the WR corps, and in offensive philosophy.
A good hint that we're thinking of RG3 is that we get DeSean Jackson, or another burner, in FA.
"When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God." Leviticus 19:33-34
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Wallace threw deep 6 or 7 times in the Arizona game. (out of 31 total pass attempts) He completed 3.
I don't think it's 100% the design of the offense.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I kind of agree with you. More to the point, though, is IF he leaves N.O. it sure won't be so he can play in Cleveland, no matter how much money we offer.
I agree with you but that goes not only for Brees, but for every FA available. We can bring in as many Pashos quality players at whatever position. We won't be able to bring in anyone worth earning the paycheck they'd be given.
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Quote:
Hmmm...
McCoy: "Let's see...I can run:
A) The 4-yard curl to Watson
B) The 4-yard out to Mass
C) The 4-yard screen to Hillis
D) The 4-yard slant to Little
Decisions...decisions..."
Like Shurmur or not, you don't hand over the keys to the offense to a 2nd year guy who has pretty-much fallen out of favor.
So, you blame McCoy but Watson, Massaquoi, Hillis and Little have to do something with the ball once they catch it - which is always a iffy proposition in itself.
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Remember how the only "plus" throw that RG3 has is the deep ball?
Nope. Don't quite remember that one, Lucky. 
He's got a live arm and is accurate to all levels.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Sure, why not...It's almost Christmas.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Brees isn't leaving New Orleans. He loves it there, loves playing in the dome, loves the team, his coaches, and the whole area.
LOL.. Yea I brought up Brees the other day (Jokingly)... Why would Brees leave the situation he's in to come here and potentially languish in obscurity for the rest of his career?
He's not a coach or a GM, he doesn't NEED to prove he can turn a team around, I'm sure he wants to be in a situation where he can retire with 3 or 4 good chances at a ring, not become part of a rebuilding process.
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
Quote:
Remember how the only "plus" throw that RG3 has is the deep ball?
Nope. Don't quite remember that one, Lucky.
He's got a live arm and is accurate to all levels.
I disagree - though I should have added the short passing game in. He throws an excellent (and accurate) short ball. And he hits receivers in stride. He throws a great (and accurate) deep ball, with a good amount of air under it.
But he rarely, if ever, makes any throws in the intermediate passing game. Part of this is the offense of course, but the 10 yard outs and the 15 yard hooks aren't there. He doesn't hit receivers moving forward on seems up the middle. I know part of it is the spread offense - but I also suspect that it's partly due to his arm mechanics (getting under the ball so much), and partly due to his height (harder to remain in established passing lanes to get those intermediate level throws).
I want to see him show that he can gun the ball 25 yards on a line (accurately) and I don't really see that.
This is my biggest concern with him. If you don't have an intermediate game, you will get murdered by the Cover-2 in this league (which also lends itself to having the necessary QB spy).
If anybody can show me the footage that says otherwise, I'd love to watch it. I've only watched been able to pause/rewind the Baylor/Oklahoma game so far, but I came away unimpressed. What else should I watch?
Last edited by Lyuokdea; 12/21/11 02:44 PM.
"When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God." Leviticus 19:33-34
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Quote:
Quote:
Remember how the only "plus" throw that RG3 has is the deep ball?
Nope. Don't quite remember that one, Lucky.
He's got a live arm and is accurate to all levels.
...and they play great pass defense in the Big 12, right Toad?
After watching some video of RGIII, I could not help but notice how "wide open" RG's receivers were, so I looked up the NCAA pass defense stats of the Big 12 teams.
The Big 12 teams ranked toward the bottom half of the NCAA rankings...in short, the Big 12 is horrible at playing pass defense. When we see the stat line of QBs playing in the Big 12 or we watch video of a Big 12 QB, keep in mind the level of competition those QBs are facing.
Just something to keep in mind when we watch video of Big 12 QBs.
GM strong...
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Remember how the only "plus" throw that RG3 has is the deep ball?
Nope. Don't quite remember that one, Lucky.
He's got a live arm and is accurate to all levels.
...and they play great pass defense in the Big 12, right Toad?
After watching some video of RGIII, I could not help but notice how "wide open" RG's receivers were, so I looked up the NCAA pass defense stats of the Big 12 teams.
The Big 12 teams ranked toward the bottom half of the NCAA rankings...in short, the Big 12 is horrible at playing pass defense. When we see the stat line of QBs playing in the Big 12 or we watch video of a Big 12 QB, keep in mind the level of competition those QBs are facing.
Just something to keep in mind when we watch video of Big 12 QBs.
I guess that Toad thinks that the Browns receivers get open, much less wide open, on a regular basis.
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I guess that Toad thinks that the Browns receivers get open, much less wide open, on a regular basis.
Or that our WRs will be "covered" by Sheldon Brown on a regular basis.
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
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Well, I am willing to say, right now, that I think that RG3 will be an outstanding NFL QB. Other people disagree. In time we'll see who s right, and who is wrong.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Of all the 3rd round QB's since 1999 only 1 of them is any good and that is Matt Schaub.
The rest are either career backups or out of the league.
According to Pluto when he was drafted, the Browns brass only viewed him as a backup anyway.
Time to cut our losses, move on and find a QB with the accuracy of an FBI sniper and the arm like the rifle that sniper uses. I'm done trying to develop QB's without superior physical skills. It's all we've done since '99.
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Quote:
Of all the 3rd round QB's since 1999 only 1 of them is any good and that is Matt Schaub.
The rest are either career backups or out of the league.
According to Pluto when he was drafted, the Browns brass only viewed him as a backup anyway.
Time to cut our losses, move on and find a QB with the accuracy of an FBI sniper and the arm like the rifle that sniper uses. I'm done trying to develop QB's without superior physical skills. It's all we've done since '99.
So because most 3rd stringers aren't starters, that is proof positive that McCoy won't be either? Generalize much?
I don't ever remember reading Pluto saying that's how McCoy was thought of? Can you please show me that article.. I guess I just missed it.
As for cutting our losses and finding a better QB,, would you mind sharing your expertise on this matter. How would you go about it?
Just a dumb question for you Ammo,, But let's say you do manage to find this QB somewhere (and I suspect you already have an idea who you want and a way to get them) Do you think the WR's we have now are going to make that new QB look good or bad and if it's bad, will you be back here next year at this time saying we need to find another QB?
Lots of questions. But you made the statement, back it up with something more.
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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NFL.com has up to date stats, for rookie QBs.
web page
I took the rookie stats and compared them to McCoy's QB stats web page
Rk..Player..Team..Pos..Comp..Att..Pct...Att/G...Yds....Avg...Yds/G...TD...Int..1st...1st%...Lng..20+..40+..Sck..Rate..
1...Newton...CAR...QB...283...475...59.6...33.9...3,722...7.8...265.9...17...16...158...33.3...77T...62...8...32...82.3..
2...Dalton.....CIN...QB...260...441....59.0...31.5...3,012...6.8...215.1...18...13...137...31.1...84...44...10...21...81.0..
3...Ponder....MIN...QB...146...268....54.5...29.8...1,757...6.6...195.2...13...12....86....32.1...72...23....4...28...72.3..
4...Gabbert..JAC...QB...178...352....50.6...27.1...1,924....5.5...148.0...11...10....93...26.4...74T...21...4...36...65.6..
18..McCoy...CLE...QB...265...463....57.2...35.6...2,733....5.9...210.2...14...11...144...31.1...56...26...5...32...74.6..
CONCLUSION...McCoy might not be as bad as some proclaim, especially when we compare Colt's supporting cast, compared to the rookies supporting cast.
Last edited by mac; 12/22/11 09:52 AM.
GM strong...
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Rk..Player..Team..Pos..Comp..Att..Pct...Att/G...Yds....Avg...Yds/G...TD...Int..1st...1st%...Lng..20+..40+..Sck..Rate..
1...Newton...CAR...QB...283...475...59.6...33.9...3,722...7.8...265.9...17...16...158...33.3...77T...62...8...32...82.3..
2...Dalton.....CIN...QB...260...441....59.0...31.5...3,012...6.8...215.1...18...13...137...31.1...84...44...10...21...81.0..
3...Ponder....MIN...QB...146...268....54.5...29.8...1,757...6.6...195.2...13...12....86....32.1...72...23....4...28...72.3..
4...Gabbert..JAC...QB...178...352....50.6...27.1...1,924....5.5...148.0...11...10....93...26.4...74T...21...4...36...65.6..
18..McCoy...CLE...QB...265...463....57.2...35.6...2,733....5.9...210.2...14...11...144...31.1...56...26...5...32...74.6..
what is this?? who's ranking-- it makes no sense. I've just started my first cup of coffee-- but I can't wrap my brain around this one. Colts numbers look better then Gabbert and Ponder...... and a shade behind Dalton. yet ranked 18, what am i missing here???
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big... I edited my post to better explain what I did.
The #18, is Colt's standing among "all" QBs in the NFL.
The number preceding the names of the rookies, is how the rookies rank compared to other rookie starters.
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one thing to note is that Cam's rushing prowess to get 1st downs and TDs need to be somehow shown. that is a HUGE part of what makes him valuable to that team.
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Quote:
one thing to note is that Cam's rushing prowess to get 1st downs and TDs need to be somehow shown. that is a HUGE part of what makes him valuable to that team.
Good point. Very few QBs will have the ability he has in those areas.
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nolo...I'm not concerned about Newton's rushing ability or stats. This comparison should be judged in the context of the threads title...Is it too soon to give up on McCoy?
There are some that believe all the Browns need to do is use their 1st round pick to draft a QB...thus, giving up on McCoy, and all we be fine on the offensive side. Looking at how the NFL rookie QBs performed...what would the Browns gain by drafting another QB to replace McCoy?
Other than Andrew Luck, there is no one in the upcoming draft that makes me believe the Browns would be making a worthwhile upgrade at the QB position if they drafted a QB in the first round. And, to be honest, Andrew Luck may not be as great as I picture him..it is an unknown.
I look at the stats and take into consideration the surrounding cast McCoy played with and honestly, I'm having a very hard justifying the use of our #1 pick to draft "another" QB.
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Quote:
...and they play great pass defense in the Big 12, right Toad?
That's a legit factor, no doubt about it, which led directly to this quote from you: Quote:
After watching some video of RGIII, I could not help but notice how "wide open" RG's receivers were
Problem is, you were watching highlight video's.
Gotta be careful when watching highlights. You can only take so much from them, since by very definition they are only positive plays.
Lucky for you there are video's out there that don't show highlights. These video's show all of his offensive plays in any given game, not just the highlights.
So, Mac, if you REALLY wanna see him play without the benefit of a filter, here's a video of every one of his offensive plays against #14 TCU. Don't ask me who the Hell the guy talking Bosnian is
People need to ignore the quick-hitters. Those don't tell anyone anything about him. What people need to focus on are the throws where the receivers are hit in stride, regardless of how "wide open" they are.
For those that don't wanna sit through the entire 8 minute reel, I'll time-stamp the throws which are "NFL throws." This will filter out all the bubble-screens, quick-hitters, and option runs. HOWEVER, if you have the time, you should watch ALL the video. That will show every one of his plays, good, bad, or ugly. The time-stamps are just to show examples where he's hitting people outside of the college-sized windows which made people like Brady Quinn 1st round busts:
The following are the time-stamps where he isn't throwing through 5-yard windows:
1:02
1:32
1:54
3:05
The back-to-back plays at the 3:53 mark
4:45
AGAIN, people should watch the entire reel. It just shows every play Griffin either ran the ball or threw the ball in the game.
There's another one out there from Oklahoma which is more telling, but I can't locate it.
These are just two games. Nobody should draw any conclusions about his overall game from such a small sample. HOWEVER, there are throws in this game which show he isn't like Brady Quinn was, where he got to throw through these huge windows. There are accurate strikes to all levels of the field, which was the basic premise here.
In summary, Griffin has NFL accuracy to all levels. TCU and A&M
edited since I couldn't embed just the vids. Had to use the linked site.
Last edited by OverToad; 12/22/11 11:38 AM.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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yeah, he was awesome in the oklahoma game. Not as good in the UT game IMO... the first half of that game is the worst I've seen him play. BTW, he's moving up Mel Kiper's board, too. (Who the hell is Mel Kiper, anyway?) http://espn.go.com/blog/ncfnation/post/_/id/56202/rg3-reaches-a-new-high-on-draft-boardsRG3 reaches a new high on draft boards December, 22, 2011 Dec 22 10:30 AM ET Email Print Comments By David Ubben Baylor quarterback Robert Griffin III says he's still undecided on what he'll do after the season. The Bears junior and Heisman winner's decision seems to be getting more and more difficult as the NFL hype builds. [+] EnlargeRobert Griffin III Jerome Miron/US PresswireRobert Griffin III is moving up the draft boards. He moved up four spots on Mel Kiper's Big Board to No. 7 Insider, just one spot behind USC's Matt Barkley. "Not buying any talk he'd be higher on some boards than Luck, but his altered delivery has resulted in better accuracy on downfield throws," Kiper writes. "Great kid, underrated passer, big-time athlete. No ill effects from 2009 knee injury. Remarkable numbers." But so much for being stuck behind Barkley. Todd McShay debuted his first mock draft Insider in anticipation of the real thing next April, and he has Griffin going seventh to the Washington Redskins, a spot ahead of Barkley. "Finding a quarterback is a must for the Redskins, and this will be an interesting call if Griffin and USC's Matt Barkley are still on the board," McShay writes. "Barkley would make sense, but it might be hard for Washington coach Mike Shanahan to pass on a dynamic athlete like Griffin." There will be plenty of talk come the combine on RG3 vs. Luck and Barkley (if Barkley and RG3 both declare, which isn't quite a given), but it's a debate no one thought would be happening even just a month or so ago. Goes to show how quickly things can change. "While I've heard some scouts and evaluators discusss Griffin in the same class as Andrew Luck, I'm not willing to go that far," Kiper wrote. "I still think Luck is, by far in fact, the likeliest play for any team drafting No. 1 overall this spring." Here's what McShay had to say about a few other Big 12 talents in his mock first round. No. 9 Carolina Panthers: Justin Blackmon, WR, Oklahoma State: I'm not a fan of taking wideouts in the top 10 unless they are in the elite category -- think Calvin Johnson and A.J. Green -- and Blackmon is not in that class. However, the Panthers will be searching for weapons to put around QB Cam Newton, and Blackmon is clearly the top receiver on the board. He has outstanding body control to make all kinds of catches, and it will be interesting to see whether the Panthers pull the trigger. No. 16 Seattle Seahawks: Landry Jones, QB, Oklahoma: The Seahawks have a clear need at quarterback, and while Jones' stock has dropped a bit and he may return to school, he still has first-round tools. He did not play well down the stretch, but his supporting cast is partly to blame, and if he can regain his confidence Jones' natural ability is impressive. No. 30 San Francisco 49ers: Kendall Wright, WR, Baylor: The 49ers need to continue adding weapons on offense, and Wright is an explosive athlete who can stretch the field vertically, create after the catch and also contribute in the return game. No. 32 Green Bay Packers: Ronnell Lewis, LB, Oklahoma: Clay Matthews is the team's only legitimate edge-rushing threat, and he needs some help. Lewis might be better off returning for his senior season to continue his development, but if he enters the draft he flashes the kind of explosiveness that could help take some pressure off Matthews.
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even if the Browns select a QB in the top5 picks, there is still a decent chance that McCoy is the starter week1. it is pretty common actually for the incumbent to remain the starter initially as we have seen in these threads.
McCoy would then get his last shot at making a Brees-like career saving ascension. otherwise, he would likely be replaced by the rookie mid-year.
as for what the Browns would gain: they would gain a better chance at finding their franchise QB because if Colt falters, the heir apparent is already on the team learning the offense. They would gain a QB with a higher pedigree of skills. They would gain the fact that 1st round QBs have a much lower bust rate than QBs from other rounds.
in the rookies first year, no it might not help us that much. that's not the point. the point is that if Colt doesn't show he can be a franchise guy in year3 (year2 of the WCO), then there's a good chance that we need to move on anyways. might as well have that guy on the roster.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
Problem is, you were watching highlight video's
toad...actually, that is not the case. There are some complete game videos available so you don't have to rely on highlights. Here is one I watched...
note...I first posted the video using the youtube feature...but it did not play it well..kept stopping for me...so I removed it and posted the link instead...that seems to work fine for me.
.. here is the link to Oklahoma vs Baylor...
web page
Last edited by mac; 12/22/11 01:11 PM.
GM strong...
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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Quote:
NFL.com has up to date stats, for rookie QBs.
web page
I took the rookie stats and compared them to McCoy's QB stats web page
Rk..Player..Team..Pos..Comp..Att..Pct...Att/G...Yds....Avg...Yds/G...TD...Int..1st...1st%...Lng..20+..40+..Sck..Rate..
1...Newton...CAR...QB...283...475...59.6...33.9...3,722...7.8...265.9...17...16...158...33.3...77T...62...8...32...82.3..
2...Dalton.....CIN...QB...260...441....59.0...31.5...3,012...6.8...215.1...18...13...137...31.1...84...44...10...21...81.0..
3...Ponder....MIN...QB...146...268....54.5...29.8...1,757...6.6...195.2...13...12....86....32.1...72...23....4...28...72.3..
4...Gabbert..JAC...QB...178...352....50.6...27.1...1,924....5.5...148.0...11...10....93...26.4...74T...21...4...36...65.6..
18..McCoy...CLE...QB...265...463....57.2...35.6...2,733....5.9...210.2...14...11...144...31.1...56...26...5...32...74.6..
CONCLUSION...McCoy might not be as bad as some proclaim, especially when we compare Colt's supporting cast, compared to the rookies supporting cast.
That's some conclusion.
We'll see what Heckert, Holmgren, and Shurmur think after this season is over. I suspect that they will not be 100% in agreement with your conclusion .......
If a QB cannot create big plays, then he is just a placeholder. McCoy is a placeholder.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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This board will be going crazy in the first few days after the season as we await the press conferences to see what the Browns brass thinks. I think those who expect a clear cut answer as to whether or not McCoy is the guy will be disappointed at that point. As a matter of fact, the answer likely won't be truly known until draft day. If I was running the team, that's how it would be for me. Why give any other team a clue as to where your draft ideas lie?
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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1st String
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McCoy may just be a placeholder, but that doesn't mean he cannot be a placeholder again next year with a couple of first round draft picks to help out the O at WR/RB/OL. I just don't see this team drafting a QB at #4/5 (unless Luck is there), as Holmgren's entire legend would be tarnished if that QB didn't pan out. Get another year out of McCoy (who is all too happy to take a beating every week), draft some upgrades to other spots on the O (and I wouldn't be surprised if we traded back to someone wanting to move up for Barkley/RGIII), then with a better O in place (and hopefully a safer line), maybe go after that QB next year where it will be easier to develop him with a better surrounding cast.
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Is It Too Soon To Give Up on Colt
McCoy #3...
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