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To me, it is kind of like paying cash vs using your credit card: You can give me $10 (Pick 22) now and we will trade you #2 for #4 or you can wait and give us $50 (next year's 1st) next year.
I agree with hasugoher that next year's pick is much more likely to be top 10 than 22-32.
As an aside: How would you feel if that 2013 pick turned out to be the #1 overall?
If we keep all of our picks I don't see that as a likely scenario.
As I have already stated ... I am not in favor of trading up two selections and trading away our picks either. so I am not advocating giving away our 2013 first round pick. I am saying that the value is less in a trade this year, then that of the 22nd selection this year.
Nobody gave the Bengals a chance to make the playoffs last season and they did ... It can happen.
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Hopefully 2013's 1st won't be the #1 overall but it could happen. Much more likely than it being #32.
You are probably right that this year's #22 is worth more in trade than next year's 1st. At least to NFL peop[le but I disagree with them. Our society values the now reward much more than future benefits. Even when those future benefits are worth more. This explains why some people get rich and others live in debt.
I am not debating with you whether or not we should or shouldn't trade multiple picks. I am debating with you which pick I would rather us trade if we do.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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I'm not saying we absolutely will have to give up #22 (though I believe it to be a very strong possibility)
Why?
First, to Steve:
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***edit*** All that being said, and to give you a definitive answer your are looking for, I don't think we will have to trade up. Washington would be fools to go all-in into what they know will be a losing battle (i.e. a bidding war with us.)
Don't worry man. If it does happen I'm not gonna go "nanny-nanny boo-boo, told ya so!" You qualified your answer prior. Was just curious how you really felt.
Fl, because I think it could easily go something like this:
We offer our 1st and a 2nd. A team comes along offering their 1st, a second, and picks next year, or maybe even a 1st next year. I don't believe our 1st and next year's 2nd would do the trick, so our best deal is our two firsts and we're done. No team can overcome that.
As for the mid-rounder...well...those have such a small chance of success that we throw it in as a deal-sealer.
I'm not predicting that's how it'll play out, but that's the scenario I feel stands a real chance of happening.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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If we're giving up #4 and #22 they better keep their hands off of this years 2nd and 3rd round picks...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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The Rams have to also be thinking about the Vikings sitting at no. 3. If the Rams hold out for the moon and they get no takers, the Vikings would gladly trade.
I still stand by that no trade will happen until draft day.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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The Rams have to also be thinking about the Vikings sitting at no. 3. If the Rams hold out for the moon and they get no takers, the Vikings would gladly trade.
I still stand by that no trade will happen until draft day.
But you still have the problem with the drop off in talent after 6. Since neither the Rams or the Vikings are in need of Richardson, dropping to 6 is a real risk they can't get one of the considered elites other than the RB. Without a deal from us, staying in their current slot is the only way one of the considered elite players of need is guaranteed to be theirs.
With the Vikings in high need of Kalil or Blackmon, I don't think them dropping down to 6 is that much of a sure thing.
#GMSTRONG
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Good points. I guess I was thinking more that there's a possibility that the Vikings value getting more picks than any particular player (though I doubt it).
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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If you're Stl or Minnesota, basically you're comparing getting one of the "elite" talents in this draft, versus possibly a 1st round pick next year...
If I'm Stl, I stay at 2, grab Kalil, and protect my 50 million dollar man... Unless they think a guy like Rieff is worth taking at 6, and how he compares to Kalil etc...
There are so many ways this could go it's crazy...
March 13th can't get here fast enough...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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As of right now, what exactly are the offers from Cleveland and Washington?
"Going from 4-12 to 6-10 isn't good enough. I believe we are going to be better than that. We're going to be a lot better than that." - Mike Holmgren (3/15/12)
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As of right now, what exactly are the offers from Cleveland and Washington?
Do we know if there are offers from either club? Why would they be making offers this soon at all?
#GMSTRONG
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Don't really know, and noone REALLY going to say... Plus even if they did say now, you wouldn't put your FINAL offer on the table two months before the draft...
From what they've put out, all we know really is Cle doesn't wanna give up the #22, and Washington doesn't wanna give up their 2nd rounder...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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As of right now, what exactly are the offers from Cleveland and Washington?
Do we know if there are offers from either club? Why would they be making offers this soon at all?
Exactly.
This whole draft thing...........ugh.
It went from "anything for luck", to "get barkley or griffin", to "anything for griffin", to "not quite so much for griffin, but maybe tannehill", to "what is going on", to "gee, we don't know".
And I started off with "we don't know".
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Don't really know, and noone REALLY going to say... Plus even if they did say now, you wouldn't put your FINAL offer on the table two months before the draft...
From what they've put out, all we know really is Cle doesn't wanna give up the #22, and Washington doesn't wanna give up their 2nd rounder...
Yeah, it's all speculation, but if I'm running the show, then I'm waiting to see what the others might offer first ... otherwise we might just be jumping the gun and might not have to ... especially this early. Any team would be stupid to commit now before FA, because we could have a very different set of circumstances before the Draft.
Also we might be a better value for a team (Miami or other) looking to trade up for Griffen.
Without a trade he won't go 1, 2 or 3.
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We offer our 1st and a 2nd. A team comes along offering their 1st, a second, and picks next year, or maybe even a 1st next year. I don't believe our 1st and next year's 2nd would do the trick, so our best deal is our two firsts and we're done. No team can overcome that.
So you would rather offer the 4&22nd ect... selection then the 4&37th ect... no team can offer more then that this year and what ever they can offer next year , so too can we.
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what ever they can offer next year , so too can we.
Along with the near-guarantee that our pick will be a pretty high one! 
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Hopefully 2013's 1st won't be the #1 overall but it could happen. Much more likely than it being #32.
You are probably right that this year's #22 is worth more in trade than next year's 1st. At least to NFL peop[le but I disagree with them. Our society values the now reward much more than future benefits. Even when those future benefits are worth more. This explains why some people get rich and others live in debt.
I am not debating with you whether or not we should or shouldn't trade multiple picks. I am debating with you which pick I would rather us trade if we do.
I don't know if I would call it the now reward ... yes we have a good chance with the picks we currently hold to improve this team overall this year, but we earned those picks to put ourselves in the position to fill many holes this year.
he, he I think that we have waited long enough already.
Besides I'm always more optimistic this time of year for next season
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I guess what I was getting at was..what if maybe they wait to see what Washington offers. Let's just say for argument's sake that H&H are not as enamored with Griffen as Washington or say Miami, etc. We bring the price down from the Rams to our 4, 37 and the late rounder that was presumed on the table because we are eyeing a Coples or Richardson or Tannenhill or someone else. They know they could get that guy lower and know the Rams will take less to stay at 4. So we trade with the Rams knowing we can take Griffen and have no problem doing so or holding him for Ransom. We ask Washington for the same package to move up(assuming they get shut out in Free Agency). We would get the 6, 39, the mid rounder and a first next year or trade with Seattle and get a package of a bigger magnitude to move down further and get one of those guys. I think Washington will be picking very high again next year.
"Going from 4-12 to 6-10 isn't good enough. I believe we are going to be better than that. We're going to be a lot better than that." - Mike Holmgren (3/15/12)
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So you're saying, trade up to 2...
Then see if Washington will trade up to 2?
Why wouldn't St Louis just trade with Washington in the first place?
If anything, they'd trade with Washington, then try and trade with us to get back up to 4...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Because once you trade down to six you immediately take yourself out of the running for any of those guys they covet(speculation). You control nothing at that point and could throw their whole draft into a funk. We could trade our pick to Dallas for all they know to come up and get Claiborne. By trading with us they get high picks and if they trade with Washington they could lose out and any trade up would lose any leverage..We have a pretty good hand too and Heckert already won the first game of Poker last year. It's all just hypothetical, just playing scenarios.
"Going from 4-12 to 6-10 isn't good enough. I believe we are going to be better than that. We're going to be a lot better than that." - Mike Holmgren (3/15/12)
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I'm really hoping Manning signs with Washington, then we can kick back, put our feet up on the desk, because I seriously DOUBT either STL or MIN are going to fall back to 8 or beyond, nor do I think anyone is going to pay the price to move up that far...
We can either sit at 4 and take RG3, or see if anyone wants to move up to 4 to grab him...
That's basically only if Washington grabs either Flynn or Manning though, if they don't, I think Snyder and Shannahan go all in on Griffin...
Which sucks for him, because I don't think any player can survive in that environment(that being the Redskins)
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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I'm really hoping Manning signs with Washington, then we can kick back, put our feet up on the desk, because I seriously DOUBT either STL or MIN are going to fall back to 8 or beyond, nor do I think anyone is going to pay the price to move up that far...
We can either sit at 4 and take RG3, or see if anyone wants to move up to 4 to grab him...
That's basically only if Washington grabs either Flynn or Manning though, if they don't, I think Snyder and Shannahan go all in on Griffin...
Which sucks for him, because I don't think any player can survive in that environment(that being the Redskins)
I don't think anyone will pay the price to come that far up for him and "If" Washington doesn't sign one of those guys, they will sell the House. This is it for Shanny, if he get's Griffin or not he is on the Hot Seat. Most believe Tannenhill needs to sit a year so they are down to Griffin as a Savior. Not sure how you can think that he will not survive that environment and be optimistic that coming here will be any different though?
"Going from 4-12 to 6-10 isn't good enough. I believe we are going to be better than that. We're going to be a lot better than that." - Mike Holmgren (3/15/12)
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Theres just something about the Redskins for the passed 10 years or so... It just seems to suck the life out of players...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Your point though just may be mute
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Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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The quiet, mute one.  (Sorry ....... I just couldn't resist) 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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don't worry it's all in the passed now
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don't worry it's all in the passed now
like kidney stones?
#gmstrong
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I think he meant that the point could be moo. You know like if a cow said it, no one would pay attention.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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Cows, source of methane. Are they related to GM? 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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As of right now, what exactly are the offers from Cleveland and Washington?
Do we know if there are offers from either club? Why would they be making offers this soon at all?
I can see both clubs inquiring about what the Rams would ask for in return for moving up to that spot and deciding if they want to pursue it. If the Rams demanded the #4 and #22 from the Browns along with other picks, I think the Browns laughed at them over the phone.
If they were demanding the #6 and next years first from Washington along with additional picks, I think the Redskins probably laughed at them.
I think the Rams are finding out that they can't get what they thought for the #2 overall. They might be able to trade out of the spot, but they won't get anywhere what they want. They could probably work a deal to move down to Miami for an additional 3rd and probably not much more.
Maybe RG3 is all that and a bag of chips and queso dip, but he's not going to be in high demand from those that have been talked about as the potential suitors. Even if the Browns are very interested in RG3, they probably figure that they might be able to get him at #4 without surrendering anything.
The Colts aren't likely to take him (if they select anyone other than Luck, they're insane) and neither are the Rams or Vikings. Both might try and trade out to another team, but the Browns likely won't give up much of anything to either the Rams or Vikings while picking at #4. Depending on the outcome of the Gregg Williams fiasco, Washington may lose a pick or so and not be willing to give up anything else just to move up to get RG3. Furthermore, the Redskins could very well target another QB in the draft or try to acquire one during free agency.
The Dolphins aren't likely to move up, seeing as they have some animosity with St. Louis for pulling Fisher out of their coaching staff. Seattle is a division rival.
It looks to me, that RG3 could have a Brady Quinn moment on draft day. Sure, some team might move up to get him, but it's not likely to be to St. Louis at #2 and it could even be a team that we're not even considering or only tangentially considering as a long-shot to make such a move.
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The Redskins were said Thursday to face a number of obstacles in their bid to sign Peyton Manning, as Washington and several other NFL franchises began their courtship of the free agent quarterback.
“There are a few significant issues” for Manning and his representatives as they evaluated the Redskins’ interest in him, one person familiar with the discussions said. That person, who spoke on condition of anonymity, stopped short of saying that Manning would not play for the Redskins.
But another person with knowledge of the team’s deliberations said the Redskins probably had a better chance to complete a trade with the St. Louis Rams for the second overall choice in next month’s draft. The No. 2 draft pick would position Washington to select Heisman Trophy-winning quarterback Robert Griffin III of Baylor.
Redskins officials declined to comment.
The Redskins were in contact with Manning’s representatives, several people familiar with the situation said, speaking on the condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the discussions. There was speculation that Manning’s deliberations about a new team could move quickly toward a possible resolution next week, and some within the league continued to regard the Miami Dolphins as the front-runner to sign him.
Among the other teams said to be in pursuit of Manning were the New York Jets, Arizona Cardinals, Seattle Seahawks, Kansas City Chiefs and Denver Broncos.
The hurdles faced by the Redskins include their 11-21 record in Coach Mike Shanahan’s two seasons and their current lack of a sturdy offensive line and reliable group of wide receivers.
Manning would have to play his home games in an outdoor stadium with the Redskins. He would have to jump conferences from the AFC to the NFC and would have to play two NFC East games per season against his brother, New York Giants quarterback Eli Manning.
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The hurdles faced by the Redskins include their 11-21 record in Coach Mike Shanahan’s two seasons and their current lack of a sturdy offensive line and reliable group of wide receivers.
Washington Post
You mean that you need a line and receivers too? I thought if you were an elite QB you can make Robiskie an All Pro.
"Going from 4-12 to 6-10 isn't good enough. I believe we are going to be better than that. We're going to be a lot better than that." - Mike Holmgren (3/15/12)
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It definitely means that a 35 year old QB with his choice of destinations is going to find the strongest team to play with.
Why wouldn't he?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) ESPN: Rams to trade #2 pick
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