|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,151
Hall of Famer
|
OP
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,151 |
I am less complaining about the classes.
I am mostly talking about standard of living. You need to have a certain amount of money to live comfortably. If you are living beyond that and have to cut back at some point. I have no sympathy.
If someone is making $350,000 and cant afford their lifestyle. It isnt difficult to cut back. Find a smaller home, find a home in a cheaper area (even of your town), cut back on vacation time, cut back on things. Thats not stressful thats reality. Its less about class warfare to me and more about people struggling to cope with situations that arent dire, that arent difficult. Its adjust and be fine.
If I can survive off the amount I make...then someone making a buttload more than me can survive off what their on.
Luxuries are exactly what they are. Luxuries...not necessities. It you cant live beyond your means. Dont...Dont complain about it, just find whats important to you and work around it. If you cant afford to have a huge house, a huge yacht, living in a super expensive place, sending your kids to an expensive private school...you find whats important, and you work around it. If you want ur kid to stay in the expensive school...cut your housing bills down significantly. Could you kid do just as well at a school charging $15,000? Go there. Sell your yacht. Sell your expensive summer home and time share somewhere else, or rent in the summer, sublet from someone else. Find something else to do. Dont whine and complain and say "could you imagine if you had to do this?" Yes I could, and I would fbe just find having to do so. Would I be happy about it? Nope...but its not struggling...its not dire.
Being overprivileged is like candy to teeth. Unless you really take care of em, itll just rot them.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964 |
Since they have ALREADY DONE IT, I would say YES. If you were not worth the extra money, you would no longer have a job. They started paying you this raise the DAY THE TAX WAS ENACTED.
REPEAT - Same job, Same pay, Same economics all around, the ONLY change being that you are self-employed - Result? You pay the entire tax, just as you are doing now, the difference is that there is no longer any way to fool you into believing that you are not.
It's like most people are infants, anything they don't see no longer exists.
Take away the tax, will you automatically get a raise? No certain answer. Does the company have additional money available for employee pay, the EXACT SAME AMOUNT as the tax? This is without doubt or question true. Is the employees labor worth the additional money? They have already answered this question, yes it is.
Let me put this another way. If your employer was planning on giving you a 6% raise, the day before the tax was enacted, do you think you would have gotten that raise AFTER the tax was put in place?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
If a company can choose between paying their employees more for the same work, or making a higher profit for the same wages, 19 out of 20 of them would go for the higher profits.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419 |
My fault .....I was thinking self employed ........ who pay both sides of the equation.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964 |
Do you think the company would be willing to pay out the SAME AMOUNT OF CASH for the same amount of work? Would they complain greatly about having no additional cost?
When you buy something, do you care how the payment is divided among the store's expenses? Or is it only the actual price you pay? If the way the store spent the money changed, but the price stayed the same, would you care?
When that tax split was enacted, you got a 6%, (7.65% at one time) raise; there is no magic bucket, there is no free lunch.
If you get an income tax refund, do you understand that you have made the Fed an Interest Free loan, and that you should have had the use of that money, spread out on a monthly basis, throughout the year? Or is this a gift from the magic bucket, as well?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
Quote:
Do you think the company would be willing to pay out the SAME AMOUNT OF CASH for the same amount of work? Would they complain greatly about having no additional cost?
I think the company would pay as little as they could to keep the worker. That's what compaies become companies for... to make profits. You do that by increasing revenue and reducing costs.
Quote:
If you get an income tax refund, do you understand that you have made the Fed an Interest Free loan, and that you should have had the use of that money, spread out on a monthly basis, throughout the year? Or is this a gift from the magic bucket, as well?
No, I'm stupid and I believe in magic buckets at the end of rainbows filled with gold coins and skittles.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,186
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,186 |
The whole article is primarily about a bunch of folks that don't know how to manage their money. They may be educated, and make a nice salary, but that's doesn't mean they know what to do with it. It was some of these same bankers, that got us into the financial mess in the first place. Just because you make 350k, doesn't mean you should spend every dime. The whole articles reaks of entitlements, and people expecting to live like kings and queens. These are the same folks that make fun of the individuals that blow their entire income tax return in one weekend. Or the family barely above the poverty line spending $60 at the local burger king...It's all the same to me; people that live way over their means.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,758
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,758 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I'm immensely sick of the class-warfare mentality lately.
I find the same people who complain about class-warfare existing are the same people that are perpetuating it, ie. it's ok for them to do it, but it's bad if it's the other side.
I didn't see how you were complaining that class-warfare exits, but rather the mentality of people claiming class warfare. Semantics, I guess.
But I've heard plenty of Liberals cry that the Republicans are waging class-warfare against the poor, when they really are not doing much to harm or really affect the poor, but then the same liberals complain and try to tax the rich, which does affect the rich. Of course, many people agree with taxing the rich...because it doesn't affect them and the rich ones calling for it like Warren Buffet, still wouldn't be affected by it.
Really? That's weird because I'm complaining about it existing, yet I'm not perpetuating it.
I'm all in favor of everyone just shutting up and being happy with what they have. If they want more, they are free to go out and earn it.
I'm all in favor of everyone getting what they earn.
I'm hugely in favor of people working their tails off and getting as wealthy as they can and enjoying the spoils of their hard work.
I'm completely against people acting and feeling like they are entitled to the spoils of someone else's hard work just because that person has more than them.
I'm completely against people vilifying and demonizing those that have more, even when they have ridiculously huge amounts more.
Last edited by ~TuX~; 03/02/12 03:58 AM.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](http://i.imgur.com/FUKyw.png) "Don't be burdened by regrets or make your failures an obsession or become embittered or possessed by ruined hopes"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
Quote:
The whole article is primarily about a bunch of folks that don't know how to manage their money. They may be educated, and make a nice salary, but that's doesn't mean they know what to do with it. It was some of these same bankers, that got us into the financial mess in the first place. Just because you make 350k, doesn't mean you should spend every dime. The whole articles reaks of entitlements, and people expecting to live like kings and queens. These are the same folks that make fun of the individuals that blow their entire income tax return in one weekend. Or the family barely above the poverty line spending $60 at the local burger king...It's all the same to me; people that live way over their means.
Agreed.
If your making 350k, you learn to live very nicely on 100k or less and put away everything else and retire at 50. or you be stupid, make 350k live like you make 500k, and work til you die.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 61
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 61 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I'm immensely sick of the class-warfare mentality lately.
Who cares?
So what.. the guy makes a buttload of money and lives a lifestyle that his income affords him... and guess what, when the income gets reduced, he has stress. Shocker - it's NO DIFFERENT than anyone else. Take away a significant chunk of my income and I'll be screaming expletives and wondering how I'm going to pull off living the way I've been living... because EVERYONE wants a better quality of life... just because you/we/the author cannot relate to THEIR elevated level doesn't make it any less frustrating for them when they take a hit.
x2  This country has got to get out of this mentality before things get better IMO.
x3
I'm not going to reveal what our family finances are but we're in the top 10% in income....now we've had some pull back in income, we own a house .... that in Cuyahoga Falls would be about 100k .... but in Hawaii it's over $1M (avg home in Kailua is 935k).
Paying that mortgage is really squeezing and is now causing substantial stress.
It got so bad that we were contemplating moving back to Ohio.
Our cars are 12 and 8 years old.
We had to change day care to save money and basically take a scalpel to every single financial decision that we make on a monthly basis.
Our clothing, shoes, jewelery budget is under $1000 a year and most of that goes to our daughter. We accept old clothes, kids toys and other things from friends and we plan on giving our stuff away too.
Every time we visit family in Ohio it's expensive, as in take a vacation to Hawaii expensive, except the other way.
We haven't had a vacation in 5 years (not counting family visits).
Bottom line we make about the same as we made back when we lived in Ohio and we lived like Kings, with a 15 year mortgage in Upper Arlington, South of Lane for those that know the area. Now we live a lot like families in Cuyahoga Falls making 60k a year. Very similar in fact.
Except for our Browns tickets....had to defend those tooth and nail! 
While 350k sounds like a ton of money it really is not.
This is the most ridiculous statement I have ever read on this board. You really need to evaluate your expenses if you are struggling with an income close to that. Its great you make that much money, I like when people make it, that is the American dream. But you need to see a financial adviser if you can't make it work, The mortgage is probably killing you. Best of luck
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,552
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,552 |
I have to admit I was a bit confused. I see a HOFer named PDR and I am thinking to myself how in the heck have I never seen any of PDR's posts? I know I am not around as much as I may have been, but I am here nearly every morning and evening...then I realized it was Phil....cool...I like the PDR....sounds like a can of beer.
The use of the word socialists might have been a bit misleading, so I will attempt to clarify.
It would have been more accurate to say socialist thinking. No, I don't think President Obama is a flat out socialist. But it isn't idiotic to say he leans in that direction, and as a whole the country is leaning that way. More and more are standing in line with hands out, expecting the handout.
I will say I am encouraged with you understanding the term rich doesn't apply to the person making 400K, or even the cool mil...but those are the ones who end up getting stuck paying the bills, so someone considers them rich.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
Guess you missed the part where he lives in Hawaii, where living expenses are pretty high, so 100k is probably the equivilant of someone in Ohio making 40-50k, and he never stated how much HE was making.
The most recent report I saw from the 2010 census said top 10% was 82k+. That's not wealthy.
Last edited by FloridaFan; 03/03/12 10:09 AM.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,521
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,521 |
I would hope he's making significantly more than $82k if he's paying off a $1M house.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,728
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,728 |
Quote:
But you need to see a financial adviser if you can't make it work, The mortgage is probably killing you. Best of luck
I agree. And when I look at myself in the mirror I ask myself the same thing.
I'm a financial advisor. 
Not to go too far into it. Yes our family makes more than 82k.
My wife is in a profession where 30% of her pay comes in the form of an annual bonus and last year they lost their top client significantly impacting that money.
I left a large wirehouse to go to another large wirehouse and I haven't yet reached my goals for bringing clients over thus impacting my income.
When the 1M house was purchased in 2005 we were making roughly double. I was in the middle of a startup that would have, if successful, made me a millionaire a few times over. In December of 2008 it failed.
From there I turned to financial advising.
As to my situation as it pertains to the house we would have to eat a $200k loss if I were to sell.
That's why we're riding out the storm, paying almost $6000 a month in mortgage, electric, water, sewer etc...
The house I own is simply par for the course for my neighborhood (927k, mine I could sell for 975k and eat 6% realtor fees). The house itself is most likely not as nice as the one you're typing in. But that's part of life in Hawaii.
The major down part.
That and $8 a gallon milk.
That's why I can see how this guy is saying what he's saying.
Although trust me I would take 350k a year right now!!!
I know how weird it sounds living in OH or wherever but it's true that it costs significantly, significantly more to live in NYC, SF and of course Hawaii.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Heldawg/rgiii2.jpg)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,391
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,391 |
Quote:
Quote:
The whole article is primarily about a bunch of folks that don't know how to manage their money. They may be educated, and make a nice salary, but that's doesn't mean they know what to do with it. It was some of these same bankers, that got us into the financial mess in the first place. Just because you make 350k, doesn't mean you should spend every dime. The whole articles reaks of entitlements, and people expecting to live like kings and queens. These are the same folks that make fun of the individuals that blow their entire income tax return in one weekend. Or the family barely above the poverty line spending $60 at the local burger king...It's all the same to me; people that live way over their means.
Agreed.
If your making 350k, you learn to live very nicely on 100k or less and put away everything else and retire at 50. or you be stupid, make 350k live like you make 500k, and work til you die.
Bingo. I have no sympathy for people who don't understand how to live WELL below their means. Every decision should be made with that ultimate "what if" thought process. What if I lose my job? What if my income goes down significantly?
Anyone smart stockpiles that cash for a rainy day.
No one "needs" a $1000/year jewelry budget or a $million house(s). They just "want" it because they aren't thinking and feel the need to keep up with the Jones'.
No thanks. I'll happily retire at 50 with everything that's important to me.
------------------------------
*In Baker we trust*
-------------------------------
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 658
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 658 |
Quote:
and called his Porsche 911 Carrera 4S Cabriolet "the Volkswagen of supercars."
I had some sympathy for him until this comment. Now I hope he has to return empty cans for the deposit.
Thomas - The Tank Engine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964 |
So this 6% "tax payment" that the company is making, If it does NOT come from the magic bucket in the sky, and it does NOT come from reducing company profits, then WHERE are these funds coming from?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
 It does reduce company profits. What in the world are you talking about? I was saying if they no longer had to pay that, they would pocket it to increase their profits, not generously pass it on to the employee.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964 |
But, since they would rather pay employees less, as opposed to reduce company profits, think AGAIN where that money came from?
Did they IMMEDIATELY reduce employee wages? No, they didn't do that. Do you really think that they PERMANENTLY reduced company profits to pay this amount? You said yourself they would seek to reduce costs in some other area.
Company profits where very shortly restored by eliminating or reducing the next employee pay raise. Alternatively, by eliminating some jobs.
Some may wonder why this is so important. It is absolutely critical to solving some major problems we have in this country. Because most people don't understand that this cost comes out of their pocket, they are less concerned about whether the money is used wisely or effectively. It comes from the magic bucket, so they don't care about it.
It is similar to many being unconcerned about health care costs. "my company pays for that". No they don't, your labor does. Those premiums are part of your wages.
The tax refund question I asked earlier is one I suggest you talk to several other wage-earners about. I have found a significant number who do not understand that this is their earned wages, and very few who understand the nature of the interest-free loan that they are making.
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Banker is "struggling" on $350,000
salary
|
|
