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Look at successful programs, they either built the team, and then get a QB, or they get a QB and accept the growing pains.
NOT the Browns! two years . . . need a QB . . . 2 years . . .Need a QB.
05 . . . 3rd rd. Frye fans love it, then turn when they realize he stinks, and we dont have much talent
07 . . .2 #1s . Quinn fans love it, then realized what i predicted, he's not that accurate and we dont have that much talent.
10 . . .3rd rd. Colt, was promised to be developed, beats the superbowl champs and the steelers in his rookie year, and takes a beating with little talent around him.
12 . .. 1st rd. Weeden, like colt, but your trading a stronger arm, for less mobile legs.
So who is your 2014 prospect?
Here's a starting point for the 2014 QB prospects.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2014/QB
Maybe we can check out the receivers too!
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2014/WR
or... OL at these, when they finally realize that our guards suck and we still need a RT
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2014/OT
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2014/OG
Maybe we can look at a kicker to replace Dawson next year since we can't slap the franchise tag on him a third time.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2013/K
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Legend
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Problem is, I'm not crying like a little baby.
I am taking OTHER posters standards, and applying them to our brand new shiny first round qb. Fairly simple concept.
Look - I've been a Browns fan since I knew what football was. I didn't watch football when we had no team (aside from a bit of the playoffs, and the superbowls.)
I am a Browns fan today. I want the team to win as much as anyone.
I also expect MORE out of a first round qb than I did a 3rd round qb what wasn't expected to play. Based 100% on THEIR criteria - I fully expect to finish the coming season 9-7. I fully expect, according to their criteria - that NO receiver will have a pass not thrown in the perfect spot to gain an additional 10 yds or so after they catch every pass thrown to them.
And yes, I'll allow for a minor adjustment here and there.
Long story short - I'll be holding this first round qb to the SAME standards as these certain posters held Colt to last year.
Plus, Weeden has T.R. running.
It'll be a fun year.
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I am taking OTHER posters standards, and applying them to our brand new shiny first round qb.
False.
You're taking what you perceive as other posters standards.
Truth is, you're EXTREMELY exaggerating those standards.
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that NO receiver will have a pass not thrown in the perfect spot to gain an additional 10 yds or so after they catch every pass thrown to them.
You're taking other posters standards, eh?
Posters here expect EVERY pass to be perfect and to get 10 yards after EVERY catch?
Serious question : Do you think you might be overreacting JUST a little bit? 
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If we draft Martin or Glenn at 37, can we just pretend we drafted them at 22 and we got Weeden in the 2nd, complaining would be reduced by 50%.
That wouldn't make any change in my view. I didn't want Weeden under any circumstance.
But, let's say that we do get Jonathan Martin or Cordy Glenn at #37. That just gives Weeden even more protection than McCoy had. Less reason to expect anything less than a playoff game in season #1 with Weeden at the helm.
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This year? Stud back, stud qb - 9-7, 8-8 at a minimum. More than 21 pts. per game. Less than 8-8? We fire the front office, get rid of the coach, and draft a qb next year. Right? Isn't that what we do every couple of years?
Got it. So what happens if we score more than 21 points a game, heck even several more points a game...call it 25 ppg, but our defense "regresses" (a term I'll use loosely since our defense really wasn't anywhere near as good as most people say it was last season), and we only win 6? What do we do at that point?
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It'll be a fun year.
Im looking forward to running 45 times a game with Hardesty and Richardson. We are going to pound the ground this year hopefully.
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss...
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Jacksonville grossly overpaid Robinson who is not better than Little.
Debatable, because I have to see Little hold on to the pass first.
But... but... our receivers are good! They were All-Pros without the accolades! Greg Little even won the Nobel Prize for Physics for reminding everyone that gravity still exists when a football hits him on the hands. Coincidentally, Quincy Morgan won the same prize for the same reason.
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Heckert has 18 guys with Round 1 grades, right?
This is the same guy that had Weeden #13 on his draft board (he ranked in the late 40's by most experts). 
I don't put a ton of stock in to who Heckert thinks is a "1st round grade" at this point.
I'll give him credit for having some stones though. He's essentially stepping out on a cliff for a 29 year old QB, with zero experience.
If Weeden bombs, his seat is going to heat up really quick (and rightfully so).
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The thing I hope everyone knows or at least thinks, is that Weeden being 28 years old,,, there is virtually NO TIME for development. He's gotta come out firing and winning almost from day one. At his age, we don't have the luxury of giving him 2 or 3 years to develop (as if anyone on here would anyway)
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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This year? Stud back, stud qb - 9-7, 8-8 at a minimum. More than 21 pts. per game. Less than 8-8? We fire the front office, get rid of the coach, and draft a qb next year. Right? Isn't that what we do every couple of years?
Got it. So what happens if we score more than 21 points a game, heck even several more points a game...call it 25 ppg, but our defense "regresses" (a term I'll use loosely since our defense really wasn't anywhere near as good as most people say it was last season), and we only win 6? What do we do at that point?
Exactly what was done this year: blame the qb.
We've been "told" all last year that our problem was the qb.
We were told a semi decent qb would have us winning even. Well, we got our first round qb. I expect to win. If our d lets us down? No problem - we'll just score more than the other team.
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He managed to get 700 yards receiving somehow.
From a QB that isn't capable of being a starting QB, right? 
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This year? Stud back, stud qb - 9-7, 8-8 at a minimum. More than 21 pts. per game. Less than 8-8? We fire the front office, get rid of the coach, and draft a qb next year. Right? Isn't that what we do every couple of years?
Got it. So what happens if we score more than 21 points a game, heck even several more points a game...call it 25 ppg, but our defense "regresses" (a term I'll use loosely since our defense really wasn't anywhere near as good as most people say it was last season), and we only win 6? What do we do at that point?
That is still a tangible that you can see. I'd expect better offensive production and with TRich along, we should see that.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](http://i.imgur.com/FUKyw.png) "Don't be burdened by regrets or make your failures an obsession or become embittered or possessed by ruined hopes"
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Weeden will throw for 9,000 yards, 135 Touchdowns, 0 INT's and have a 98% completion percentage.
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So who was your guy at 22, Arch?
Whoever would've made this team better, immediately.
Now I'll be the first to say (and if you check the pre-draft threads, you'll see I didn't say much, if anything, as I don't follow college football a whole lot).
However, my posts are directed not at Weeden - or the team, as much as they are towards 2 specific posters that blamed Colt for everything this year.
I simply will be wrong this season - which will make everyone of us happy - me included. OR, these 2 specific posters will ALSO have to admit they were wrong.
No excuses. Last year was "all Colt's fault". Okay.
This year? Stud back, stud qb - 9-7, 8-8 at a minimum. More than 21 pts. per game. Less than 8-8? We fire the front office, get rid of the coach, and draft a qb next year. Right? Isn't that what we do every couple of years?
Once again a whiny, non-specific non-answer to a direct question.
You don't follow college football, but you are whining about the Weeden pick. Why? Because Colt McCoy somehow didn't get a "fair short"? Bull.
He was a 3rd round longshot. If he had worked out, then great ..... but he didn't. It's now time to move on in a different direction. The McCoy era has mercifully come to an end, and I can almost hear the cheering of the linemen and receivers in Berea. Man, the whole team took such a beating from so many people for the flaws of their QB.
The rest of the team wasn't perfect .... but they started dropping passes this past year. Why didn't they do so the year before? Maybe they got tired of being thrown into kill shots.
I can't wait till next year when a 3 yard pass is a rarity instead of the bread and butter of the offense. I can't wait until an uncovered receiver is actually seen, and is a big play instead of being ignored by the QB. I can't wait to have a QB who will actually throw down the field instead of checking down on ever damn play, even against single cover. 
Man, last year was some of the worst QB play I have seen, and that includes the Quinn and Frye eras. I am glad that it's over with. Hopefully next year will be better. I suspect it will. If I never see another noodle-armed QB wearing a Cleveland Browns jersey it will be too soon.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Jacksonville grossly overpaid Robinson who is not better than Little.
Debatable, because I have to see Little hold on to the pass first.
But... but... our receivers are good! They were All-Pros without the accolades! Greg Little even won the Nobel Prize for Physics for reminding everyone that gravity still exists when a football hits him on the hands. Coincidentally, Quincy Morgan won the same prize for the same reason.
Yeah and how much would you like to wager that those same folks will be the first ones to blame our WR's for an inept offense this season?
Is it their (WR) fault? nope!
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This year? Stud back, stud qb - 9-7, 8-8 at a minimum. More than 21 pts. per game. Less than 8-8? We fire the front office, get rid of the coach, and draft a qb next year. Right? Isn't that what we do every couple of years?
There should be a call, right now, for Lerner to sell the team. He obviously has no idea what the hell he's doing! This ain't soccer, Randy. This is real football!
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This year? Stud back, stud qb - 9-7, 8-8 at a minimum. More than 21 pts. per game. Less than 8-8? We fire the front office, get rid of the coach, and draft a qb next year. Right? Isn't that what we do every couple of years?
Got it. So what happens if we score more than 21 points a game, heck even several more points a game...call it 25 ppg, but our defense "regresses" (a term I'll use loosely since our defense really wasn't anywhere near as good as most people say it was last season), and we only win 6? What do we do at that point?
Well, since he stated that 9 wins, 8 wins at the (absolute) minimum was the bar set, anything lower than 8 wins and the whole thing needed to be scrapped, including Weeden.
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The thing I hope everyone knows or at least thinks, is that Weeden being 28 years old,,, there is virtually NO TIME for development. He's gotta come out firing and winning almost from day one. At his age, we don't have the luxury of giving him 2 or 3 years to develop (as if anyone on here would anyway)
I expect that he takes the team to the playoffs, whatever the record required to do so is.
Andy Dalton took Cincy to the playoffs last year. He was chosen in the 2nd round last year. Since Weeden was taken in the first, he is obviously better than Dalton. Weeden has to prove it by taking the Browns to the playoffs in year #1. Anything less is a complete failure.
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Do you listen to yourself when you talk (type)?
Honestly.
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Legend
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Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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When McCoy's daddy went crying to the press, i said it then "Colt will never take another snap for the Browns". Well now he won't for sure.
I hate to see him go as he was one of the most likeable players that has ever dawned a Browns uniform but his issues were numerous. He struggled to read a defense. He struggled to understand pressure. Struggled with pocket presence. Struggled with NFL throws. He struggled to go through his progressions and he struggled mightily with putting the ball into the receivers hands giving them a chance for any type of yards after catch.
Weeden is an upgrade but he has a number of issues to be resolved before he will be anything close to an NFL QB. Hey when Holmgren said they would probably draft a QB every year until they find their guy, they weren't kidding. WE will be drafting another next year most likely lol
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Jacksonville grossly overpaid Robinson who is not better than Little.
Debatable, because I have to see Little hold on to the pass first.
But... but... our receivers are good! They were All-Pros without the accolades! Greg Little even won the Nobel Prize for Physics for reminding everyone that gravity still exists when a football hits him on the hands. Coincidentally, Quincy Morgan won the same prize for the same reason.
Yeah and how much would you like to wager that those same folks will be the first ones to blame our WR's for an inept offense this season?
Is it their (WR) fault? nope!
I know. It'll be some stupid argument like Hardesty was expected to be healthy but got turf toe on the first play in training camp and was out for the season and he was critical to Weeden's success and that Reggie Hodges hadn't fully recovered from his injury and wasn't punting the ball as far, giving the opponents better field position than expected.
That's the kind of silly crap I expect from them.
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Don't worry, we are going to draft a punter to replace Hodges.
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Don't worry, we are going to draft a punter to replace Hodges.
"We shouldn't need a punter, I expect our first round QB to never not score a TD" - arch and anarchy
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Once again a whiny, non-specific non-answer to a direct question.
Wrong. It was a direct answer to a direct question. I don't follow college ball all that close. Got it? According to what I read on here, Weeden was thought to be a round 2 qb. If not lower.
I have, by the way, watched the vid's on here about Luck, RG, Tannehill, and Weeden. That doesn't mean I know anything any more than YOU know anything.
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You don't follow college football, but you are whining about the Weeden pick. Why? Because Colt McCoy somehow didn't get a "fair short"? Bull.
Dude, take some of your pain pills and try to follow along, okay? Or, maybe quit taking them and try to follow along.
Here's the deal: Drop Colt McCoy from your assessment of me. By that, I mean - let's say John Doe played qb for the Browns last year. I'd have said the exact same things as I said this year. Basically: no running game, terrible receivers..........how do we judge John Doe? It's really simple, actually, if you'd just open your eyes. But no, you blamed Colt entirely. You've called me a McCoy lover, an apologist. You are so far from the truth you look foolish.
What I AM is a realist. You? Not so much.
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He was a 3rd round longshot. If he had worked out, then great ..... but he didn't. It's now time to move on in a different direction. The McCoy era has mercifully come to an end, and I can almost hear the cheering of the linemen and receivers in Berea. Man, the whole team took such a beating from so many people for the flaws of their QB.
See? Those are your words.
I will be holding our FIRST round qb to the exact same standards. If you can't deal with it, perhaps you need to back off. I have a feeling you are worried that Weeden won't get this offense to win. I mean, in the past, you always talk about the qb carrying the team to points and wins. (newton ring a bell for you? Dalton? You know, how you spoke all season about how the qb is THE reason .............)
Well, sir, we got our first round qb. AND a top notch running back. I WILL be holding Weeden to the exact same standards as you held John Q Public qb last year. If you don't like it, tough. They will be YOUR standards, sir, that I hold Weeden to.
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The rest of the team wasn't perfect .... but they started dropping passes this past year. Why didn't they do so the year before? Maybe they got tired of being thrown into kill shots.
Yup. That happened so often.
Oh, by the way - I watch a lot of nfl football. No other qb had a receiver that got hit after they caught the ball, right???????????
But, with YOUR wish, we have our brand new shiny first round qb, so our receivers will flourish and hardly get dirty, right????
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I can't wait till next year when a 3 yard pass is a rarity instead of the bread and butter of the offense. I can't wait until an uncovered receiver is actually seen, and is a big play instead of being ignored by the QB. I can't wait to have a QB who will actually throw down the field instead of checking down on ever damn play, even against single cover.
Me too.
Sad thing is - just because you say receivers were wide open all the time doesn't make it true. Or, did you go to the games and see it for yourself? Or, did you take the 1 or 2 times a game that the t.v. actually showed an open receiver that didn't get thrown to and assume, ASSume, that it happened all the time?
Grab a clue bud - I see wide open receivers on other teams that don't get thrown to. Why? You tell me. Even Aaron Rodgers.
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Man, last year was some of the worst QB play I have seen, and that includes the Quinn and Frye eras. I am glad that it's over with. Hopefully next year will be better. I suspect it will. If I never see another noodle-armed QB wearing a Cleveland Browns jersey it will be too soon.
OH, you'd better hope our brand new shiny first round pick is awesome. Seriously. He'd better hit 95% of the open receivers, or I'll be calling on you. (even though, like you last year, I won't know the play that was called). It will be nice to see our receivers won't get hit, since your brand new shiny first round qb will be throwing darts to the only place that can be thrown. If not, I'll ask you about it.
Hey, bud, you got what you wanted. A brand new shiny qb, in the first round.
Don't back off your standards and expectations now.
Dang, Weeden isn't even a Brown for 24 hours and you're trying to lower expectations of him? Please, child........it's unbecoming.
All I ask is you hold Weeden to the same expectations you held last years qb. And I will hold you to it. It'll be neat to see you be right, as that's good for the Browns. It'll be funny if you have to waffle on your expectations. Sad thing is, with your posting history, there's no in between ground. Every thing was last years qb's fault. This year? We'll see, right?
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I really wish you'd stop saying you're using "other peoples standards" while completely making stuff up. Actually, no I don't ... I hope you keep doing it. This is pure comedy. Arch + Colt McCoy = Mensa + Charlie Frye Anyone remember that guy?
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Oh, and just so you know - I am a BROWNS fan. That means I support the TEAM. Not individual players. You seem to think that implying I'm a Colt guy furthers your agenda. You look foolish doing that, and you couldn't be further from the truth. I've supported every player we have. While I question a play, or a player at times, I have NEVER gone to the extremes you have. You made your bed with your hatred of Colt. Now lay in it. I hope so bad I'm wrong, because that means the Browns will be in the playoffs with our stud back and our first round qb. If the Browns aren't? I'll be reminding you. 
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I really wish you'd stop saying you're using "other peoples standards" while completely making stuff up.
Child, please.
I'm not making things up.
You know it.
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I really wish you'd stop saying you're using "other peoples standards" while completely making stuff up.
Child, please.
I'm not making things up.
You know it.
No, what I know is that you're making a fool out of yourself saying you're using other peoples standards while saying that you expect EVERY pass to get 10 extra yards
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Dude, take some of your pain pills and try to follow along, okay? Or, maybe quit taking them and try to follow along.
WOW nice 
Last edited by Pepper52; 04/27/12 03:21 PM.
"Its too much of a coincidence to be a coincidence"
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No, what I know is that you're making a fool out of yourself saying "child please"
FYP
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Thinking to myself here. If we took Hill at 22 and Weeden at 37 it would have been alright. But since we took Weeden at 22 (assuming Hill at 37, it's a good bet) it's a bad draft.
Hail to Pitt!!!
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What are your expectations for Weeden this year?
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Thinking to myself here. If we took Hill at 22 and Weeden at 37 it would have been alright. But since we took Weeden at 22 (assuming Hill at 37, it's a good bet) it's a bad draft.
i'd be upset either way.
#gmstrong
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Once again a whiny, non-specific non-answer to a direct question.
Wrong. It was a direct answer to a direct question. I don't follow college ball all that close. Got it? According to what I read on here, Weeden was thought to be a round 2 qb. If not lower.
I have, by the way, watched the vid's on here about Luck, RG, Tannehill, and Weeden. That doesn't mean I know anything any more than YOU know anything.
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You don't follow college football, but you are whining about the Weeden pick. Why? Because Colt McCoy somehow didn't get a "fair short"? Bull.
Dude, take some of your pain pills and try to follow along, okay? Or, maybe quit taking them and try to follow along.
Here's the deal: Drop Colt McCoy from your assessment of me. By that, I mean - let's say John Doe played qb for the Browns last year. I'd have said the exact same things as I said this year. Basically: no running game, terrible receivers..........how do we judge John Doe? It's really simple, actually, if you'd just open your eyes. But no, you blamed Colt entirely. You've called me a McCoy lover, an apologist. You are so far from the truth you look foolish.
What I AM is a realist. You? Not so much.
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He was a 3rd round longshot. If he had worked out, then great ..... but he didn't. It's now time to move on in a different direction. The McCoy era has mercifully come to an end, and I can almost hear the cheering of the linemen and receivers in Berea. Man, the whole team took such a beating from so many people for the flaws of their QB.
See? Those are your words.
I will be holding our FIRST round qb to the exact same standards. If you can't deal with it, perhaps you need to back off. I have a feeling you are worried that Weeden won't get this offense to win. I mean, in the past, you always talk about the qb carrying the team to points and wins. (newton ring a bell for you? Dalton? You know, how you spoke all season about how the qb is THE reason .............)
Well, sir, we got our first round qb. AND a top notch running back. I WILL be holding Weeden to the exact same standards as you held John Q Public qb last year. If you don't like it, tough. They will be YOUR standards, sir, that I hold Weeden to.
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The rest of the team wasn't perfect .... but they started dropping passes this past year. Why didn't they do so the year before? Maybe they got tired of being thrown into kill shots.
Yup. That happened so often.
Oh, by the way - I watch a lot of nfl football. No other qb had a receiver that got hit after they caught the ball, right???????????
But, with YOUR wish, we have our brand new shiny first round qb, so our receivers will flourish and hardly get dirty, right????
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I can't wait till next year when a 3 yard pass is a rarity instead of the bread and butter of the offense. I can't wait until an uncovered receiver is actually seen, and is a big play instead of being ignored by the QB. I can't wait to have a QB who will actually throw down the field instead of checking down on ever damn play, even against single cover.
Me too.
Sad thing is - just because you say receivers were wide open all the time doesn't make it true. Or, did you go to the games and see it for yourself? Or, did you take the 1 or 2 times a game that the t.v. actually showed an open receiver that didn't get thrown to and assume, ASSume, that it happened all the time?
Grab a clue bud - I see wide open receivers on other teams that don't get thrown to. Why? You tell me. Even Aaron Rodgers.
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Man, last year was some of the worst QB play I have seen, and that includes the Quinn and Frye eras. I am glad that it's over with. Hopefully next year will be better. I suspect it will. If I never see another noodle-armed QB wearing a Cleveland Browns jersey it will be too soon.
OH, you'd better hope our brand new shiny first round pick is awesome. Seriously. He'd better hit 95% of the open receivers, or I'll be calling on you. (even though, like you last year, I won't know the play that was called). It will be nice to see our receivers won't get hit, since your brand new shiny first round qb will be throwing darts to the only place that can be thrown. If not, I'll ask you about it.
Hey, bud, you got what you wanted. A brand new shiny qb, in the first round.
Don't back off your standards and expectations now.
Dang, Weeden isn't even a Brown for 24 hours and you're trying to lower expectations of him? Please, child........it's unbecoming.
All I ask is you hold Weeden to the same expectations you held last years qb. And I will hold you to it. It'll be neat to see you be right, as that's good for the Browns. It'll be funny if you have to waffle on your expectations. Sad thing is, with your posting history, there's no in between ground. Every thing was last years qb's fault. This year? We'll see, right?
+1
This post was full of beautiful gems but the diamond was this one:
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Hey, bud, you got what you wanted. A brand new shiny qb, in the first round.
Don't back off your standards and expectations now.
Well stated! Bravo!
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,704
Hall of Famer
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OP
Hall of Famer
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What are your expectations for Weeden this year?
My expectations for Weeden ARE much higher than my expectations for Colt McCoy would have been.
Why? Because Colt McCoy sucks.
Weeden - Complete 60+% of his passes. 3,300 yards. 18+ TD's, 14- INT's
What would my expectations have been for Colt McCoy?
55% completions, 2,500 yards, 14TDs, 15INT's.
Because he's not very good.
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Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) Brandon Weeden (Part 2)
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