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Just a heads up, Bryce Harper is making his MLB debut tonight against the Dodgers (Strasburg is starting as well). It's on MLB Network. Hopefully they go with the Dodgers feed so the entire country gets Vin Scully.
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Indians win another series. It would be nice to start seeing some sweeps, too. I hope they keep playing strong and not collapse in the middle of July like last season.
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Tigers meltdown continues and Indians continue to be in 1st place (with league worst attendance)
#gmstrong
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It's only 4/30. 
[color:"white"]"Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
-- Mark Twain [/color]
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Hoping for career years from people who would otherwise be unemployed at the major league level is not the way to excite a pissed off fan base...
Crowded elevators smell different to short people...
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Quote:
It's only 4/30.
yeah, might as well get upset early. no reason to enjoy anything. 
I fully realize that we've had the easiest schedule in MLB and that things are going to get tougher. still, I am going to enjoy the Tigers going 2-8 in their last 10. I am going to enjoy the Indians winning a series against a team that signed Pujols and CJ Wilson in the offseason and expected to be one of the more obvious playoff contenders.
I don't get why people can't enjoy the little things.
#gmstrong
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I know....it's been a crappy, cold April. Attendence will pick up with the weather.
Outside of them being in first, there isn't much "buzz" with the team. Kipnis provided that late last year. This year....who is the main draw?
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif) “...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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Legend
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Pronk is back!
Lowe is 4-1
Hannahan had another hot April start. Santana has been the best hitter on the team. Shelley and Choo have hit well (outside their BA).
They have played well overall. Again, against a weak schedule. But, we have the worst overall attendance and it isn't just the weather (or other cities would be similar). People just assume things will be bleak and there's no reason to cheer or show up. So, they don't.
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Quote:
yeah, might as well get upset early. no reason to enjoy anything.
I fully realize that we've had the easiest schedule in MLB and that things are going to get tougher. still, I am going to enjoy the Tigers going 2-8 in their last 10. I am going to enjoy the Indians winning a series against a team that signed Pujols and CJ Wilson in the offseason and expected to be one of the more obvious playoff contenders.
I don't get why people can't enjoy the little things.
I think you have to be realistic about attendance in April/early May. Except for the years when the Tribe was pretty much a lock for the playoffs, April/May have never been great attendance months for us. The weather is crappy, kids are still in school and, to top things off, the economy still sucks and people just don't have $100 to spend on a baseball game.
I've been to a couple of games because I really like going to the ball park to watch a game. In addition to being a Tribe fan, I just like baseball in general. I completely understand, however, why the average fans are staying away right now. You have to really like baseball to want to go to Progressive Field right now. ::shrug::
[color:"white"]"Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
-- Mark Twain [/color]
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that's fair. I just remember last year where the attendance barely picked up over the summer and the attendance is worse this year so far. along with all the negative feedback I hear.
but, I could be allowing that to bias my POV too much. hopefully, I am.
#gmstrong
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To be honest, you're concern going forward is certainly valid. Unfortunately, it wouldn't surprise me to see attendance only improve marginally UNLESS we are actually in contention for a pennant come Autumn.
You have to remember, however, that, despite the Browns' crappy record since they returned from the dead, Cleveland is STILL a football town and much less of a baseball town. When we were setting all kinds of attendance records in the 90's, we had some bonafide star power that were the talk of the town (not only locally, but nationally). Today, we've got a handful of nice players, but few real stars. Couple that with a team that really isn't competitive from year-to-year and the enthusiasm level is really hard to jack up like it was in the 90's.
I a way, we're the reverse of Cinci fans. Cinci has life-long, die-hard Reds fans, but Bengals fans jump on and off the bandwagon depending on how the wind is blowing on any particular day.
Cleveland fans, on the otherhand, hang on every move the Browns make but it takes a Dollar Dog Night to bring in more than 10,000 fans for a weeknight game (if it isn't cold and/or rainy).
It is what it is, unfortunately. Worse yet, the Dolans still realize a tidy profit with this status quo, so don't expect it to change unless the league changes or we enter into another unexpected Golden Age of hitting on a large percentage of our prospect choices for a period of time.
[color:"white"]"Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
-- Mark Twain [/color]
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Those are great points.
As far as the team goes, if they just went out and got themselves a legitimate bat.
I think you need to fill that hole at 1b. All the good teams seem to have a good hitter there. We have Casey Kotchman. That's unacceptable. I'm sorry, it just is. If you truly want to contend, you have to do better than Kotchman.
I think the Damon signing is nice, and it will help, but fans don't buy into this team.
We have good pitching, and a good bullpen, but you can't win on those things alone and that's how it seems from the outside.
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There are 30 year old Reds fans who remember their last championship. A Cleveland Indians fan would have to be 70 to remember ours. The Reds have signed their two best players to long term contracts (Votto - 10 yrs; Phillips - 7 years); when was the last time that happened here? Cleveland may very well be more of a football town than Cinci, but 455 straight sellouts says that Indians fans will show up if they have a reason to - a good, entertaining product on the field, and hope for the future.
Last edited by Dave; 04/30/12 11:20 AM.
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Right or wrong, Tribe fans are tired of seeing all their good talent shipped out of their before or while they're in their primes. It's not all on the Dolans, but they have to take their blame. Seems like every time we have something good going, someone else is trying to reach into our cookie jar.
Everyone talks about what was going on when the Tribe sold out 455 straight games, but even with the Browns gone they don't play legitimate games until September anyways, and the Cavs are done by April or early May if they have a good year.
The fans showed up because the product was outstanding.
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Quote:
the AL Central is awful.
once again, thank you Mr. Jacobs for navigating us away from the AL East and into the Central.
#gmstrong
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2nd String
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Anyone who knows anything about the game knows this team isn't going anywhere, which is why no one is showing up.
Hafner is already cooling down because he needs two months rest for every 5 games.
No one on the team, including Mr. April, is still batting above .300.
Jimenez is a time bomb waiting to implode.
We've had an easy schedule.
We have no outfielders that would start on a top fifteen team outside of choo, who is injured.
Our first baseman wouldn't start for the Columbus Clippers.
Our Ace has been shaky.
We haven't hit a homerun since the Clinton Administration.
Did I miss anything? First place at this point is about as big a mirage as they come. I see no reason for fans to become emotionally and financially invested in this team.
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Quote:
Quote:
the AL Central is awful.
once again, thank you Mr. Jacobs for navigating us away from the AL East and into the Central.
Right because if we were in the east, no way could we compete with the division leading Orioles. 
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
Quote:
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the AL Central is awful.
once again, thank you Mr. Jacobs for navigating us away from the AL East and into the Central.
Right because if we were in the east, no way could we compete with the division leading Orioles.
We'd been in fourth place in the central, and three games behind those orioles.
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Quote:
Quote:
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the AL Central is awful.
once again, thank you Mr. Jacobs for navigating us away from the AL East and into the Central.
Right because if we were in the east, no way could we compete with the division leading Orioles.
well, we'd be in 4th place instead of 1st at the moment 
#gmstrong
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
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the AL Central is awful.
once again, thank you Mr. Jacobs for navigating us away from the AL East and into the Central.
Right because if we were in the east, no way could we compete with the division leading Orioles.
We'd been in fourth place in the central, and three games behind those orioles.
I assume you meant "East"....but ok lets look at the other divisions too. We'd be 2nd in the AL West, 4th in the NL East, 2nd in the NL Central and 2 in the NL West.
If your arguement would be accurate, I would think we would have to be 4th or worse in all the divisions. But we're not.
And really, it doesn't make a difference. The Indians are in the AL Central and that's all that matters. As of today, they're a full game in 1st place.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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I did mean East.
My original point was that in 1994, Dick Jacobs helped convince MLB to move us from the AL East to the AL Central. The AL Central has been a much easier division. We are in 1st place in this division. If we were in the AL East, we'd be in 4th.
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Practice Squad
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The AL Central is like the SEC. The best teams beat up on each other and make their record look worse then they are. Yes??? Anyone??? I tried.
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Quote:
The AL Central is like the SEC. The best teams beat up on each other and make their record look worse then they are. Yes??? Anyone??? I tried.
Ha ha ha ha,,,nice try. 
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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Quote:
I did mean East.
My original point was that in 1994, Dick Jacobs helped convince MLB to move us from the AL East to the AL Central. The AL Central has been a much easier division. We are in 1st place in this division. If we were in the AL East, we'd be in 4th.
If we were in the AL east, we would have played a completely different schedule so it's hard to say where we would be. Each team has only played a series against 5 or 6 other teams, some easier and some harder..
Does the Central suck? Well as of now I think you would have to say it does... if you look at the interdivision records, when the east and west play the central, their record this year is 45-29 and there is only one team with a losing record against the Central to date... Even considering the limited sample, I think that it is leaning in that direction. 
But then neither the Tigers or the White Sox are playing up to where they were expected and that, to me, is far more important than how we compare to the Orioles... which I brought up as a joke because I think they have some decent pitching and while I don't think they will make the playoffs, are an improved team from previous years.
yebat' Putin
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I know you brought up the O's as a joke. I just continued it with a snarky comment anyways, I would argue the White Sox are playing right where they were expected to be. almost all places had them either just above or just below the .500 line. they are a flawed team that lost alot of pitching from last year at this time. the Tigers, well yeah, they will get better but it's still pretty funny that the MLB "dream team" from the offseason is struggling. the Angels too.
#gmstrong
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Well if I had a dream for the Indians, it would have been to be Texas, not the Angels. Even though I think that the Angels will be there late in the year...
yebat' Putin
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Well if I had a dream for the Indians, it would have been to be Texas, not the Angels. Even though I think that the Angels will be there late in the year...
Texas is the team for the Indians to emulate. the 2010 version that made the playoffs based on drafted and minor-league traded talent and rode it to the WS on a $64mil payroll (roughly the same as ours from this year)
of course, to keep that team together they had to double the payroll and they added some other pieces once they sold the team to investors and they banked a huge Dallas-market local TV deal.
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of course, to keep that team together they had to double the payroll
And that could be a problem. 
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
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of course, to keep that team together they had to double the payroll
And that could be a problem.
...and the Rangers have yet to pay their best everyday player (Josh Hamilton is a UFA at the end of the year). Their payroll is only going to get higher.
If they can continue to be the best team and have deep playoff runs, great for them. If they fail to win it all, they become the late 90's and early 00's Indians (great story, big stars, lots of wins, huge payroll, tons of fans & no titles).
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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Quote:
Anyone who knows anything about the game knows this team isn't going anywhere, which is why no one is showing up.
if the attendance keeps going at the current rate (I think it will pickup some, but it needs to pickup alot), then I do think the Indians moving will become a hot topic and a reality in the next 5-8 years.
not only are the 1st place Indians last in attendance, but they are an eye-whopping 6200 people below the 2nd last in attendance per game.
http://espn.go.com/mlb/attendance
that is ~14K per game for the Indians
~20K per game for the Mariners/A's
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There is no way the A's should be outdrawing anyone with that dump. I have never been to Jacobs' Field, but I have been to the Oakland stadium and I don't see how anyone goes to there games. I am assuming Jacobs' Field is better. (On the flip side, I have also been to Safeco and people probably just go because the stadium is so nice.
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Jacobs field is a gem of a ballpark. It's clear that this is between owner and fans.
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Jacobs field is a gem of a ballpark. It's clear that this is between owner and fans.
Exactly. Whether they are right or not, the reason fans aren't showing up is a conscious decision on their part NOT to support this team. It's not like the pre-Lebron Cavs, where it was just that nobody cared. In this case, the fans DO care, but they are making a decision to not support the Dolans. At least in part.
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So is it time to call this Ubaldo trade a bust. What a friggen head case.
Crowded elevators smell different to short people...
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Hall of Famer
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Yeah, the jury is still out on him...
For those of you still complaining about Dolan, I'll say it again. Your anger should be pointed towards Selig and his inability or lack of desire to institute a hard salary cap.
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If our infield could catch a fly ball, turn a double play or remember to cover the base on a ground ball that would've been a 1-run 3rd inning.
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Legend
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Quote:
Your anger should be pointed towards Selig and his inability or lack of desire to institute a hard salary cap.
Small market teams can't do anything in baseball. Teams can't re-sign any of their player. For example Joey Votto, Alex Gordon, Ryan Zimmerman, Brandon Phillips, Ryan Braun, Troy Tulowitzki, Evan Longoria, Matt Moore, Joe Mauer, Andrew McCutcheon, and Cameron Maybin would never re-sign with their current teams.
Do people actually still think baseball needs a salary cap? Have a well run organization and you win (Rays). Have a poorly run organization and you lose (Mets, Dodgers).
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For that last inning yes, but this is a running theme with him. Zero mental toughness. One of the big things I look at for a pitcher is how often they can shut down the other team after your team scores. Especially scratching across a tough run. Nothing kills momentum faster then clawing for a run or two and having the pitcher go out and give up 4 in the next half. To me that screams a lack of focus, cause god knows he's got the raw stuff.
I understand my stance goes back to that i hated the trade from the beginning, but he hasn't done much of anything to change my mind either.
Crowded elevators smell different to short people...
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Legend
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It's usually not a good idea to trade for a player who mysteriously lost five miles per hour off his fastball.
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