|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 5,109
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 5,109 |
Quote:
Quote:
Yep, It's pretty hard to explain things that there is no proof of. I agree.
and it's impossible to prove that god does not exist, yet you act like it's a fact that he doesn't 
Just like you can't prove aliens weren't at Thanksgiving. 
(Someone will get this.)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 Likes: 1
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 Likes: 1 |
Stuffing! Alien Technology!
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
Are you going to marry an alien surfer now?  lol
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248 |
Quote:
Quote:
Homosexuality is not natural
The animal kingdom disagrees with you.
The animal kingdom also has lots of instances of beastiality, so I guess we should legalize that too?
But seriously, back to the original statement ... Does it though? I've heard this argument a lot, and I honestly wonder what kind of studies have been done to actually confirm this. Sure, there are lots of instances where an animal gets so horny it will screw anything that moves. But have there been any documented cases or studies where:
A) An animal will ONLY attempt to mate with an animal of the same gender, and not with the opposite gender if given the opportunity?
B) The animal will go so far as to become a lifetime mate in replacement of what would otherwise be a mate of a different gender?
C) It occurs at a population percentage anywhere close to what we see with humans?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 Likes: 1
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
The animal kingdom also has lots of instances of beastiality, so I guess we should legalize that too?
What?
Unless you're considering Humans a part of The Animal Kingdom, then that makes no sense...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248 |
Sorry, is that not the word? Xenophilia maybe?  Or are you saying that different species in the animal kingdom never have cross-species relationships?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433 Likes: 11
Hall of Famer
|
|
OP
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433 Likes: 11 |
Addendum: Please no arguments about people marrying/having sexual relationships with children, toasters, animals, or other inanimate objects. This poll question only considers consenting adults over the age of 18 who wish to be married to their same sex partners.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248 |
Quote:
Addendum: Please no arguments about people marrying/having sexual relationships with children, toasters, animals, or other inanimate objects. This poll question only considers consenting adults over the age of 18 who wish to be married to their same sex partners.
YOU'RE the one who dragged the animal kingdom into it. Now if you ignore the first part of my post ... do you have some actual data to back up your assertion, because it is something I'm legitimately curious about.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
I've seen dogs trying to hump peoples' legs ..... so I would guess that they aren't too choosy ....... 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433 Likes: 11
Hall of Famer
|
|
OP
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433 Likes: 11 |
Wiki on Homosexuality in Animals Head down to the bottom of the page with all the references listed. It's a wide spectrum.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248 |
The first few sentences sort of gave an answer to questions I posed: "Although homosexual behavior is very common in the animal world, it seems to be very uncommon that individual animals have a long-lasting predisposition to engage in such behavior to the exclusion of heterosexual activities. Thus, a homosexual orientation, if one can speak of such thing in animals, seems to be a rarity.
Although, these are some interesting studies. Thanks for the link.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280 |
I got this from your wiki page... Quote:
Researchers found that disabling the (fucose mutarotase) FucM gene in laboratory mice – which influences the levels of estrogen to which the brain is exposed – caused the female mice to behave as if they were male as they grew up.
The FucM gene... that's classic.
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195 |
Perhaps we should all just be like my clown fish.
They can change gender at will.
Then everyone can be happy!
#GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433 Likes: 11
Hall of Famer
|
|
OP
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,433 Likes: 11 |
Quote:
The FucM gene... that's classic.
I wish I could be a bored researcher!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195 |
Quote:
Quote:
The FucM gene... that's classic.
I wish I could be a bored researcher!
Aren't most researchers pretty bored?
#GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 45
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 45 |
Quote:
I've seen dogs trying to hump peoples' legs ..... so I would guess that they aren't too choosy .......
That's actually a dominance thing used to set the pecking order in a pack, it's really a common sight among wolves and other canines.
And yes, I know you're joking, but thought I'd toss that fun fact out there.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280 |
Quote:
Quote:
I've seen dogs trying to hump peoples' legs ..... so I would guess that they aren't too choosy .......
That's actually a dominance thing used to set the pecking order in a pack, it's really a common sight among wolves and other canines.
And yes, I know you're joking, but thought I'd toss that fun fact out there.
Wolves come down out of the woods and hump peoples legs to show dominance? Sounds like some kind of wolf gang initiation.
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 Likes: 147
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 Likes: 147 |
I don't know why it is such a big deal.
If you feel morally it's wrong, then don't do it. But in the end it is not for me to judge. No one answers to me for their actions, they will one day stand before God and then they will be judged. But all the while, it is said that I should love thy neighbor as I love thy God.
Does that not mean I treat them with respect and kindness, regardless if I agree with their choices or not?
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
Almost every law we have (outside of traffic laws, and maybe a few others) is a moral judgement in one way or another.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,964 |
NRTU
I'm just wondering if, in the interest of equality and non-discrimination, a person who is totally blind (as opposed to legally blind) should be able to get a driver's license?
Rules and restrictions don't matter if someone is offended by them, right? Everyone absolutely MUST be treated equally, and if you don't think they should get a driver's license, that must mean that you hate all blind people and want them to die, correct?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280 |
Quote:
I don't know why it is such a big deal.
If you feel morally it's wrong, then don't do it. But in the end it is not for me to judge. No one answers to me for their actions, they will one day stand before God and then they will be judged. But all the while, it is said that I should love thy neighbor as I love thy God.
Does that not mean I treat them with respect and kindness, regardless if I agree with their choices or not?
I'm glad that you have been able to distill it down to such simple terms, sometimes I wish I could do that. Thus far, I have not been able to and there are still aspects of it (for and against) which prevent me from doing that.
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,119 Likes: 134
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,119 Likes: 134 |
Quote:
I'm just wondering if, in the interest of equality and non-discrimination, a person who is totally blind (as opposed to legally blind) should be able to get a driver's license?
Did you ever drive up to ATM an notice the Brial pad? 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
Brial?
Did you mean Braille ....... the touch method of reading used by blind people?
I would assume that they build all ATMs the same, and since some are inside a bank foyer, and others might be on the side of a bank away from a driving area, then they would have a legitimate need for a Braille pad.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,949 Likes: 763
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,949 Likes: 763 |
Yes, they should be allowed to marry. They will, however, have to start a whole extra other battle to get the right to have a divorce 
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
One of the very first lesbian couples to marry in California saw their marriage end in divorce shortly thereafter. They were the activists who went to the courthouse every year trying to get a marriage license, only to be denied year after year. They finally married in June of 2008, right before the proposition banning gay marriage was voted on .... only to divorce in Jan 2012. Shame is that they had been a couple for almost 20 years prior to getting married. It's almost like their desire to get married was one of the things that bound them together, and when that was gone, they lost something vitally important to their relationship. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/08/gay-divorce-la_n_1263881.html
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,119 Likes: 134
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,119 Likes: 134 |
Quote:
One of the very first lesbian couples to marry in California saw their marriage end in divorce shortly thereafter. They were the activists who went to the courthouse every year trying to get a marriage license, only to be denied year after year. They finally married in June of 2008, right before the proposition banning gay marriage was voted on .... only to divorce in Jan 2012.
Shame is that they had been a couple for almost 20 years prior to getting married. It's almost like their desire to get married was one of the things that bound them together, and when that was gone, they lost something vitally important to their relationship.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/08/gay-divorce-la_n_1263881.html
Relationships started or born out of working closely on a project often turn south at some point after the project ends..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,802
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,802 |
Quote:
The animal kingdom also has lots of instances of beastiality, so I guess we should legalize that too?
But seriously, back to the original statement ... Does it though? I've heard this argument a lot, and I honestly wonder what kind of studies have been done to actually confirm this
I think the argument is more of a bare bones opposition to the claims religious folks make about people "choosing" to be gay rather than being born that way. You pose some good questions, though, so I'll try and give them an answer or two...
Quote:
A) An animal will ONLY attempt to mate with an animal of the same gender, and not with the opposite gender if given the opportunity?
B) The animal will go so far as to become a lifetime mate in replacement of what would otherwise be a mate of a different gender?
C) It occurs at a population percentage anywhere close to what we see with humans?
A. Not sure what the Excel (see what I did there  ) data would look like on it, but Wiki shows cases of that with the black swan and rams seem to do so on an exclusive basis.
B.) Again, the spreadsheet and data I have are limited, but it seems the bottlenose dolphin has those relationships and animals with "bachelor groups" like bison, antelopes, etc. will pair bond with the same sex even though the opportunity presents itself with members of the opposite sex. Aside from that, humans are in a minority of species who put a premium on monogamy. Of about 5,000 mammal species, only 3-5% form lifelong, monogamous bonds.
C.) Depends on the animal. They run the gambit from a lesser to a far greater extent. One of the animals we know of with exclusive homosexual orientation (rams) has it occur in 8% of all males (I just found interesting given the general "10% of the population is gay" idea).
It doesn't have much ado with marriage, but our understanding of the animal kingdom and research into that thus far was instrumental in the striking down of the last remaining sodomy laws in this country. From the earliest pilgrim settlements, American statutes, and judicial opinion, sodomy was regarded as "the crime against nature" and seen as "abominable" and "detestable". Seeing it so prevalent in the animal kingdom kicked the legs out from under it in our lawbooks.
End of the day, the momentum is rolling heavily in favor of "the gay movement" (which I'd define as tearing down the demonization and lack of understanding against those persons and building up of allowing people to be honest and integrated into society as they are). We didn't coin the term "homosexual" until 1868, institutionalized gay people well into the 20th century, made it legally allowable to fire them under ground of "sexual perversion" from gov't jobs in 1953, and our own APA didn't strip it of its mental disorder status until 1973. A lot of progress has been made in a little over a hundred years. The gay marriage laws basically separating how a gay couple has to go about its tax forms and other documents from heterosexual couples is the last legal hurdle in the way of a fuller assimilation into society.
Last edited by 4yikes2yoshi0; 05/19/12 04:01 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
Something like 31 states have completely banned gay marriage, most using a Constitutional amendment. I would hardly call that momentum heavily in favor of gay marriage.
As far as I can tell, 9 states allow gay marriage, and 2 others have proposals to allow gay marriage. The remaining states have some statute or law that bans gay marriage.
Further, 2 populations typically more stridently against gay marriage are the Black and Hispanic communities. These are 2 segments of the population that are increasing more than any other. This does not bode well for the future of gay rights, as these 2 voting blocks typically vote against gay marriage initiatives.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,802
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,802 |
Quote:
I would hardly call that momentum heavily in favor of gay marriage.
Context. Take a step back and look at what's happened. In less than one hundred years, the gay rights movement (should've been my terminology to start rather than "Gay Movement") has gone from having their sexual practices outlawed (the "crime against nature" via sodomy laws), being stigmatized as having a mental disorder, and being fired from gov't jobs for their sexual orientation, all the way to there being no more sodomy laws on the books, the APA releasing homosexuality from mental disorders, and to actually being able to marry in almost double digit states now. How is that not significant progress and an indication of momentum now that the proverbial rug (tying homosexuality to being an unnatural, depraved social ill) has had its feet swept out from under it?
Obama coming out and saying he's in full support of same sex marriage is a pretty clear indication of how public opinion has shifted on this in the last decade alone. Check the latest Pew Research data on it. More Americans are in favor than opposed. I have a lot of gay friends who talk about how pleased they are that he (BO) really "gave it heavy consideration, evolved, and made a strong stance" when he knows he needs to do this to rally up the base support and that he's very attentive to what the publics' views on this have been. Otherwise, he would have been more ballsy about being in favor of same-sex marriage to start the process.
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
Formerly 4yikes2yoshi0
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195 |
Quote:
Further, 2 populations typically more stridently against gay marriage are the Black and Hispanic communities. These are 2 segments of the population that are increasing more than any other. This does not bode well for the future of gay rights, as these 2 voting blocks typically vote against gay marriage initiatives.
Upon further review...
The NAACP announced Saturday the 103-year-old black civil rights group is supporting same-sex marriage.
The group's board of directors made the decision at a meeting this weekend, saying it was a "continuation of its historic commitment to equal protection under the law."
The decision follows President Obama's recent support of gay marriage, a move that threatened to divide key parts of the Democratic voting base -- the gay and black communities.
web page
#GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
The NCAA might support it, but overall, and by enormous margins, Black voters do not. The NCAA is a straight line arm of the Democratic Party. http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-05...-civil-marriageA Pew Research Center poll conducted in April showed 39 percent of African-Americans favor gay marriage, compared with 47 percent of whites. The poll showed 49 percent of blacks and 43 percent of whites are opposed. This is in Baltimore, one of the more liberal states in America. If you look at where gay marriage has seen approval, it's mainly been on the more liberal East Coast. In North Carolina, it's 20-27% of Black Voters who approve of gay marriage, depending on who you ask. Their initiative still failed badly. http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0512/76446.htmlOverall, every time there has been a vote n gay marriage, Black voters have voted overwhelmingly against it. There might be a short term, temporary attitude change for some Black voters because of President Obama's change of heart ...... but it is interesting that he didn't "come out" before the NC vote where his leadership might really have been demonstrated. One thing I have always found to be bizarre about the Black vote is this .... Black voters vote lockstep with the Democratic Party, and have for years. They did even when the Democrats had former KKK members as candidates. The Democrats have embraced all of these social issues that disagree with most Black voters. Abortion, gay marriage, restraints on religions, and so on ..... these are NOT causes championed by Black voters. Typically, these are issues that Black voters vote overwhelmingly against when they get the chance. However, they continue to support the Democrats, even as the Democrats support causes that they do not believe in.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,119 Likes: 134
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,119 Likes: 134 |
I honestly believe that in time, same sex marriage will be a none topic. probably not in my lifetime,,
In the 70's,, if you were gay, you were an outcast. simple as that and I don't think that back then, the thought of same sex marriage was even on the horizon. (I don't remember it at least) now it's front and center. who would of thought in 1970 that this discussion could even ever occur. Unthinkable.
All studies and articles you post to the contrary, I think it's inevitable that same sex marriage will eventually be recognized.
if you go back in time, there is a history of things that were once thought untouchable. Slavery, interracial relations, General Motors ever having to file bankruptcy.
It's gonna happen.. it will eventally be accepted.
Look at me for instance. I accept same sex marriage as a fact of life.. I believe it's not my business to concern myself with who someone falls in love with.. As for My dad,, my guess is he couldn't or wouldn't have.. and his father.. NO FREAKIN WAY.
Hell, my grandfather would have found it difficult (maybe impossible) to marry a woman that wasn't Italian...LOL
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280 |
Quote:
The NCAA might support it, but overall, and by enormous margins, Black voters do not. The NCAA is a straight line arm of the Democratic Party.
NAACP....
In the end, a lot of those individuals may be opposed to it but if forced to vote between their wallet and their morals... well we all know which one is going to win that.
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
Quote:
Quote:
The NCAA might support it, but overall, and by enormous margins, Black voters do not. The NCAA is a straight line arm of the Democratic Party.
NAACP....
In the end, a lot of those individuals may be opposed to it but if forced to vote between their wallet and their morals... well we all know which one is going to win that.
Wow ..... major typo. 
For the record, I have no idea how the NCAA feels about gay marriage ...... or much of anything else either.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,976 Likes: 356 |
It was a pain medicine induced type.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280 |
Quote:
For the record, I have no idea how the NCAA feels about gay marriage ...... or much of anything else either.
As long as a coach, university official, agent, or booster doesn't provide a gift, provide the limo, contribute toward the honeymoon, or send flowers, they are probably ok with it.
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
Quote:
Quote:
For the record, I have no idea how the NCAA feels about gay marriage ...... or much of anything else either.
As long as a coach, university official, agent, or booster doesn't provide a gift, provide the limo, contribute toward the honeymoon, or send flowers, they are probably ok with it.
also, if a recruit is getting married, the coach may attend the wedding but at no time may they congratulate the couple.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 43
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 43 |
I'm Orthodox Catholic, so from a personal standpoint, I am opposed to gay marriage. But from a legal standpoint, and a human rights standpoint, I believe all citizens should be able to enjoy the same rights and privileges. So I voted "yes" they should be allowed to marry.
Despite the fact that it conforms directly with my personal views, I am opposed to the Defense of Marriage Act. Just as we don't need to be creating legislation and altering our Constitution to accommodate gays, we also don't need to be enacting legislation or changing our Constitution to prevent them from living their lifestyle.
But I also want to point out that there is no place for marriage (homosexual or heterosexual) in our government and in our Constitution. As long as people have the same basic human rights, which they do, the government should not be involved.
What a lot of people fail to realize is that marriage is a ritualistic union between the participants and the sanctioning body. For instance, I am an Orthodox Catholic, if I get married in an Orthodox ceremony, my marriage will not be recognized by the Jewish faith. Should I be petitioning the Jewish community to recognize my marriage? No, of course not. First of all, it would never happen and second of all, it shouldn't happen. They have every right to believe what they believe, and I have a right to believe what I believe. If I want Jews to recognize my marriage, then I need to take the necessary steps to meet the criteria set forth by that sanctioning body.
If gays want to be married, all they really need to do is form a sanctioning body. They can call it the "Church of Same Sex Marriage" or any other name they see fit, and within that sanctioning body, their marriage would be just as legitimate as mine is.
Unfortunately, this debate isn't about human rights or equality. Because gays already have the same rights as the rest of us. Laws were passed in 2009 that require hospitals, insurance companies and other municipalities to recognize same sex partnerships in the same exact way they recognize traditional partnerships. If you are a gay person in the hospital, the power is now in your hands to authorize anybody you want to make critical life decisions and enjoy visitation. The same applies to the tax code. Gays can now file jointly and list dependents according to the same criteria as hetero couples. So the human rights aspect of this discussion was solved a long time ago. Like I said, this isn't about equality anymore, it's about acceptance. And unfortunately, it doesn't seem like the gay community will be satisfied until we not only accept them, but celebrate their choice. And that is where I start to have a problem with their agenda being jammed down my throat.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 67,787 Likes: 1344
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 67,787 Likes: 1344 |
Quote:
If the people of that state have voted then that state has made their choice. Everyone has a vote. Not everyone will be happy with the end result, but the choice is made.
Majority rule only works if you're also considering individual rights. Because you can't have five wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for supper.
Larry Flynt
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk K-9 Consensus Marriage Equality
|
|
