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there is not a player in the league i would take over Kyrie, even if Kyrie is not as good as them. the thing is, he will be as great as any of them, and he already loves Cleveland
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I don't care how talented Westbrook is. I would take Kyrie over him in a heart beat. At least Kyrie isn't a selfish ball hog.
there is not a player in the league i would take over Kyrie, even if Kyrie is not as good as them. the thing is, he will be as great as any of them, and he already loves Cleveland
http://www.youtube.com/v/8DnKOc6FISU&feature=player_embedded#!
Cleveland Browns, Space Browns ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/iVP5Po2.png)
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There's a short list of guys playing right now that I'd take over Kyrie, he's definitely not one of them, and the more I think about it, Lebron isn't either.
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I don't care how talented Westbrook is. I would take Kyrie over him in a heart beat. At least Kyrie isn't a selfish ball hog.
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You guys are starting to sound like the delusional Kobe fans out here in L.A.
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There's a short list of guys playing right now that I'd take over Kyrie, he's definitely not one of them, and the more I think about it, Lebron isn't either.
What?
Kyrie is 19 years old with upside (there are injury issues, I get it) but for the Cavs, they're at least a few years at the very least away from serious contention and Lebron is getting close to 30. What's gonna happen when he loses a bit on his first step and loses some of his overall athleticism, what is he going to hang his hat on?
I dunno why you thought that was so funny?
The only players in the league, when you factor in EVERYTHING I would take over Irving right now would be Durant, possibly Kevin Love, and Derek Rose although I would think twice about him with this latest injury.
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there is not a player in the league i would take over Kyrie, even if Kyrie is not as good as them. the thing is, he will be as great as any of them, and he already loves Cleveland
really? name someone.
Durant? Kyrie's younger and plays the most important position on the court.
like i said, name someone.
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plays the most important position on the court.
PG is NOT the most important position on the floor in the NBA.
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there is not a player in the league i would take over Kyrie, even if Kyrie is not as good as them. the thing is, he will be as great as any of them, and he already loves Cleveland
really? name someone.
Durant? Kyrie's younger and plays the most important position on the court.
like i said, name someone.
I had this discussion elsewhere recently. I think Kyrie had an amazing rookie year and certainly can move up quickly. If we think of this as a "5 year window" (if we go any further it gets really, really murky), then this is how I would rate it:
I think 'at this moment' the list looks like:
1. Durant
2. LeBron
3. Chris Paul - he just makes 'everyone' better.
4. Westbrook - best 2way PG. CP3's injuries have limited him on defense a bit and Westbrook has taken over as best PG defender. and, his offensive reputation is still mostly based on last season, not this one. He made huge strides in sharing the ball and involving others (and as a result, shoots better himself too).
---huge dropoff----
Dwight - back injury on a big man is trouble
Wade - his style/body won't likely age well
Rose - obviously knee injury is worrisome for his style
Kobe/Duncan/Garnett/Dirk/Nash - just too old for any long-term reliance
Tony Parker - interesting. he is limited on defense, but unlimited on offense. how much of it is Pop's system in SA though? A decent argument for Kyrie over Tony can be made.
Kevin Love - I just get this nagging feeling he's a bit hype. I mean, the Twolves did have talent and he does limit them on defense and they finished under .500. Belongs in the discussion for sure though.
Al Jefferson / Marc Gasol / L.Aldridge - great big men that can contribute on both ends. Hibbert might get into this group next year.
Irving - right now below all of the above for next season (take out Rose for his injury and possibly Dwight when we learn more about his) and ahead of the old guys for the 5yr window IMO. but, has every opportunity of rising quickly. there can be an argument in a couple years. Irving's defense isn't there yet and he really doesn't make the guys around him better like a Chris Paul can (again, this is yet. he certainly has the tools).
#gmstrong
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plays the most important position on the court.
PG is NOT the most important position on the floor in the NBA.
If you have a great center, which those are rare, I'd take that over a great PG.
Although pure PG's that have the skill set like Kyrie are also pretty rare. They're either combo guys or just guys with great PG skills but can't score.
Wing players seem to rule the NBA these days though.
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that's debatable
Name the top 5 PG's in the NBA.
Name the top 5 wing players in the game.
Which list of players has had more successful teams?
I rest my case.
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Only 2 PG's have won a Finals MVP in the last 20 years.
Chauncey Billups in 04
Tony Parker in 07
Kobe has as many Finals MVP's in the last 20 years as ALL point guards.
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Irving, while good, is still an unfinished product. I would take LeBron, Durant, Westbrook, Rose, Rondo, Blake Griffin, CP3, Deron Williams, and Kevin Love over Irving. And probably Bynum, Wade, Josh Smith, Carmelo, and Parker too.
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Blake Griffin?
the others make sense, but I am starting to question Deron Williams after his time in Utah and NJ.
#gmstrong
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that's debatable
Name the top 5 PG's in the NBA.
Name the top 5 wing players in the game.
Which list of players has had more successful teams?
I rest my case.
lol
How many of those wings also had a good big man?
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Are you saying figuratively or literally? I was saying literally. I like Kyrie over those players. He already likes Cleveland. With any of those players, they could bolt, just like one of them did ....
and that was my point. I would take Kyrie over any player because we already have him w years on his contract and he likes cleveland. also, we have a point guard teaching coach, so that would eliminate most of those players.
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LeBron loved Cleveland for awhile, too.
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Blake Griffin has averaged 20/10 his first two seasons in the NBA...and he still doesn't know how to shoot.
Put Williams on a good team and he is a top ten guy in the league. The Jazz traded him because they knew they wouldn't be able to re-sign him. He did tank it for the Nets, but many NBA players have tanked because they are in situations they don't like *cough*KobeLeBronHowardPierce*cough*
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my concern for Deron is that he has regressed the last 2 seasons. it could just be situational, but I don't think you can just say he's a top10 player (heck top15 or even 20 player) without some pause (was it Sloan's system that helped him thrive that much? that is the question)
Blake is a 20/10 guy, yeah. But, he's a liability at the end of games (FT%), he is not a good defender at all (neither 1on1 nor as a help defender), and he can't shoot from the outside.
He's this generation's Dominique Wilkins (pure athlete). That creates excitement and sells tickets. But, I'd take a guy like Kyrie over him.
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One of the arguments for Irving is his potential. Griffin just finished his second NBA season. I'd say there is room for him to grow as well.
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didn't kyrie have one of the best 4th quarter averages in the nba? you have to account for that too
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yes he does. I just disagree that he would be ahead of Kyrie if a team was building a franchise. That's all.
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if there was a fantasy franchise draft (like in the sports games), LeBron would probably be #1. I get that, but I am saying I wouldn't take him over Kyrie. It's just a personal thing 
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I wouldn't take Griffin over KI. Griffin is crap away from the rim, and it's probably wrong to assume, but I don't think he'll ever put the work in to have an away-from-the-basket game.
He's also one of those tweeners that always gets exposed in the playoffs. There's always a team that can void those guys out.
I wouldn't take Rondo over him either, Rondo has 3 hall of famers around him and never gets doubled. His jump shot is an atrocity as well. I like how he plays, but he'd be another guy in Kyrie's situation.
Rose? I'd go back and forth on that, the ACL scares me, because if you're having this conversation, you have to factor in age, wear, and injuries, and the ACL scares the crap out of me. I think KI has a chance to be a better PG than Rose, but he will never sniff the way Rose can dominate a game with scoring. He's too damn strong.
I wouldn't take Westbrook either. Deron Williams is a good argument.
Carmelo? Pass.
I would pass on Dwyane Wade, he's approaching 30, and has a ton of wear on his body.
Bynum is still young, his injury history and attitude scare me. I mean if you can't play consistent under Jackson for all those years (you can never say that guy showed any type of stabilized game) with Kobe freaking Bryant as your teammate, you're gonna show it in Cleveland? Probably pass.
Josh Smith? No.
Tony Parker, age and wear, pass.
CP3, I go back and forth on it. Irving's first step is as good as CP3.
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and it's probably wrong to assume, but I don't think he'll ever put the work in to have an away-from-the-basket game.
Huh? It's probably wrong to assume...but let's do it anyway. If Griffin makes the Olympic team he should improve a lot.
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When talking about things that don't directly involve your everyday life, like basketball, assuming is perfectly fine.
I don't think he'll put the work in that needs to be done to create a game that doesn't involve dunking and getting easy transition points.
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I don't think he'll put the work in that needs to be done to create a game that doesn't involve dunking and getting easy transition points.
Even though he is known for his dedication off the court?
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I don't think he'll put the work in that needs to be done to create a game that doesn't involve dunking and getting easy transition points.
Even though he is known for his dedication off the court?
I just don't see it, I hope I'm wrong because I like the guy as a player.
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I give Blake a pass against San Antonio. The Spurs are just a methodical killing machine.
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Stephen A. Smith SNL skit
http://www.youtube.com/v/cTRrNA6B2KI&feature=youtu.be
Anyone else find it hilarious that when ESPN talks about a game they are broadcasting, they won't let anyone who is doing the game pick a side so that they don't show bias, but they let Stupid A. Smith basically act like one of us crazed fans on their airwaves about his Knicks?
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It's fun making points that make no sense.
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It's fun making points that make no sense.
The whole argument is about who you would rather have. It's all opinion.
We disagree.
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Right, but you have also said you don't think Blake Griffin will end up being a great player because he won't work hard. When, in fact, he is a very hard worker. That doesn't make sense.
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Right, but you have also said you don't think Blake Griffin will end up being a great player because he won't work hard. When, in fact, he is a very hard worker. That doesn't make sense.
There's working hard, and then there's going the extra mile to enhance your game. I've seen enough guys who don't do it, some even put the work in and they can't do it.
He's 2 years in, 3 if you count the injury and he's not very good away from the rim. He's still great at what he does, but I haven't seen any sign yet that he's going in that direction.
Said the same about Dwight years ago. I'm sure Dwight works hard, but his game away from the basket is a joke.
All NBA players work pretty hard, otherwise they wouldn't be there. Rosters are small and the circuit for getting players is bigger thant he NFL when you factor in Europe.
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Kyrie Irving probably won't be any better than he is right now. He has limited upside.
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Kyrie Irving probably won't be any better than he is right now. He has limited upside.
I think his shot will improve, he doesn't need to get any quicker or be better around the basket he's already as good as it gets.
He's gonna get a little bigger, but his frame is always going to be small, like I said he will never have the power that Derek Rose has.
Irving's biggest job over the next few years is to improve his shooting, which isn't horrible but can be better, and to start making guys better, because a few of the guys on the Cavs are part of their future plan, and there will be 2 incoming 1st round picks this year to bolster that.
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It's fun making points that make no sense.
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Kyrie Irving probably won't be any better than he is right now. He has limited upside.
Hey Sperg, I think he left out the purple font just to mess with you 
#gmstrong
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