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Eagles, Colt McCoy: What's taking so long?June, 18, 2012 By Dan Graziano | ESPN.com If we are to believe that the Browns are offering quarterback Colt McCoy for a sixth-round or seventh-round draft pick, the only thing I can think is, "Why haven't the Philadelphia Eagles already done this?" We have discussed the Eagles' frightening backup quarterback situation at length here. Their current plan is to go into the season with Mike Kafka, Trent Edwards and Nick Foles as the backup quarterbacks to Michael Vick, who has only once played a full 16-game season. Neither Foles (who was just drafted in April) nor Edwards played in the NFL last year. Kafka has thrown 16 NFL passes. Now, I'm not saying McCoy is the be-all, end-all here, but he's started 21 more NFL games than Kafka or Foles have combined, and surely he'd be an upgrade over Edwards in that experienced-veteran-backup slot. He's also 25 years old, and it's not out of the realm of possibility that he could grow into a starting-caliber quarterback at some point. He's got experience in the West Coast offense. The Browns' front office and the Eagles' front office are friends. I'm pretty sure the Eagles have an extra late-round 2013 pick from the Brodrick Bunkley trade. This seems to make too much sense not to happen. And maybe it will. But it hasn't yet, and if it doesn't it could mean that the Eagles are sold on Kafka as a worthwhile backup in his third year in their system. It's not completely crazy to think he is. The reason we doubt it is that we haven't seen it, and what we have seen of Kafka has been uninspiring. But if the Eagles believe that third year of development is the key one (and remember, he didn't have an offseason of coaching last year due to the lockout), they may be looking at Kafka differently than we on the outside are. They also saw something in Edwards they liked when they tried him out, and he too has West Coast offense experience. He's three years older than McCoy is, though, and the feeling seems to have been that either he or Kafka would be cut before the season. (Foles obviously won't be cut, since they just picked him.) If they traded a pick for McCoy, the Eagles would have to get rid of Edwards and Kafka (likely trading Kafka) or carry four quarterbacks. And it's possible they don't want to carry four quarterbacks. So I don't know. McCoy to the Eagles for a late-round pick makes sense to me, and I think they should do it yesterday. But it also seems like the kind of thing that would have happened by now if it were going to happen, and it looks as though the Eagles aren't as worried about backup quarterback as their fans are. http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/40132/eagles-colt-mccoy-whats-taking-so-long
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Eagles, Colt McCoy: What's taking so long?
Saints fans should be asking the same thing . . . That's where I'm pulling for McCoy to land. Brees is the guy who could probably help him the most . . .
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well, the eagles just spent a third rounder on foles... so i don't think he's going anywhere. I suppose they could dump kafka if they thought mccoy was a serious upgrade, but I'm not sure that's the case.
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Yeah, I find it odd that the writer assumes McCoy is an upgrade over Kafka or Edwards. Why?
I will say that Edwards is quite possibly one of the worst QBs I've seen play in the last 20 years. But so is McCoy.
I guess McCoy does bring some youth and still of a bit of an unknown in terms of improvement.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Yeah, I find it odd that the writer assumes McCoy is an upgrade over Kafka or Edwards. Why?
perhaps he was comparing the performance of not just the QB play..but the team he was playing on and the teams performance.
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I'd swap McCoy for Kafka. And if we could get a 6th or 7th rounder with him I'd consider it a steal...
Weeden/Wallace/Kafka sounds good to me...
Sorry Thad. Whoever you are...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Yeah, I find it odd that the writer assumes McCoy is an upgrade over Kafka or Edwards. Why?
I will say that Edwards is quite possibly one of the worst QBs I've seen play in the last 20 years. But so is McCoy.
I guess McCoy does bring some youth and still of a bit of an unknown in terms of improvement.
Why? Hmm perhaps, because they weren't jilted by him not being the savior of this franchise (not that I felt he was supposed to be) and they are looking at him objectively as a backup QB ... Something I hope we are doing as well.
Was Wallace any better?
I don't think so and he already knew the offense, so how well does that speak for him? Not well imo and if we send Colt down the road, then we could be one play away from having Wallace as 'the guy". The thought of it makes me ill.
I just find it ironic how outsiders see value with Colt McCoy, but some Browns fans want to tar and feather the poor kid.
I find this hatred of Colt McCoy unbecoming of a Browns fan and quite frankly I am getting totally disgusted with it.
What exactly did he do to deserve such hatred?
Because he didn't turn out to be this franchises savior?
Dumb!
I wanted us to draft Weeden, but I never once thought of kicking Colt to the curb and he was still better then what we have had at the position. Can we do better? Yes, but he was our best option last year.
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They expected McCoy in very shortened off season to throw for 3,400 yards 25 TDS and 11 INTS with guys named Robiskie and Massaqiou as your starters and your 3rd WR a year removed from football.
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I don't hate McCoy. I believe he is a good kid and a good person. But I'm not emotionally invested in him, and when I say he sucks, that's my opinion on his play. No tar and feathering, just the way I saw things. If you take away all the garbage yards and tds it could possibly be the worst production of a QB that started 13 or so games ever. I don't hate McCoy. I don't even dislike McCoy. But I really hated the way he played. Wallace or McCoy? I think it's bit of hyperbole to state how ill you are if Wallace were to be one play away instead of McCoy. It's hard to argue that one is really better than the other. I kind of get what you are saying about bagging on McCoy. But I'm just commenting on his play. There are others on here who like to call him names, etc. Maybe you could pick on them. 
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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They expected McCoy in very shortened off season to throw for 3,400 yards 25 TDS and 11 INTS with guys named Robiskie and Massaqiou as your starters and your 3rd WR a year removed from football.
It was one chapter in his book.
Was he "erratic"? yes.
Was he learning a new offense? yes
Was he a young green horn? Yes
Are his best days ahead of him? Yes
Now just for S's&G's.
Ask those same questions of Wallace who btw could not win the starting QB job last season.
Other then, "was he erratic?"
I can't answer any of the others with a yes!
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They expected McCoy in very shortened off season to throw for 3,400 yards 25 TDS and 11 INTS with guys named Robiskie and Massaqiou as your starters and your 3rd WR a year removed from football.
Pretty much my thoughts. If we had drafted Matt Flynn in 2008, he'd be washing cars right now, instead he just signed a $30 million dollar contract with Seattle... and he's no better than Colt McCoy...
yebat' Putin
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I don't hate McCoy. I believe he is a good kid and a good person.
But I'm not emotionally invested in him, and when I say he sucks, that's my opinion on his play. No tar and feathering, just the way I saw things. If you take away all the garbage yards and tds it could possibly be the worst production of a QB that started 13 or so games ever. I don't hate McCoy. I don't even dislike McCoy. But I really hated the way he played.
Wallace or McCoy? I think it's bit of hyperbole to state how ill you are if Wallace were to be one play away instead of McCoy. It's hard to argue that one is really better than the other.
I kind of get what you are saying about bagging on McCoy. But I'm just commenting on his play. There are others on here who like to call him names, etc. Maybe you could pick on them.
Not picken on you ... You where just conveniently the last post I read.
hyperbole? Nah! It's just that he has shown his selfishness and there is no room for that on any team and especially not my team.
Especially from someone who could very well be looking for a job come September.
You want hyperbole?
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it could possibly be the worst production of a QB that started 13 or so games ever.
GMAB. You think that what we have had around here was better? Then you my friend must have a very short memory.
You might want to rethink that one and while your at it take away their Jamal Lewis and Ryan Tucker's. 
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Alright, maybe that was a bit of hyperbole, but let's not forget how bad it was.
I think the longer time that passes, the more people tend to forget. I've even caught myself sometimes thinking it wasn't bad as I remember when I watch a highlight film or something.
But then I take myself back to those Sundays. The 3 quarter ineptitude. The opposing O not really trying. Then McCoy leading us on a drive in the last two minutes of the game with the score 30-13.
It was bad. Let's not kid ourselves.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Alright, maybe that was a bit of hyperbole, but let's not forget how bad it was.
I think the longer time that passes, the more people tend to forget. I've even caught myself sometimes thinking it wasn't bad as I remember when I watch a highlight film or something.
But then I take myself back to those Sundays. The 3 quarter ineptitude. The opposing O not really trying. Then McCoy leading us on a drive in the last two minutes of the game with the score 30-13.
It was bad. Let's not kid ourselves.
IMO...the Hillis injury really screwed up our offense last year.....and it left too much on McCoy's shoulders...and he just isn't that kind of QB...
The year before...we actually put up points against some very good teams, and we did it running and throwing....McCoy might not have been great---but he served as an effective game manager behind a potent running game.
I am hoping TR can provide that same advantage to whoever ends up our starting QB.....
I don't think many 2nd year QB's will look good throwing the ball 61 times....
I think McCoy is more suited to throwing the ball <30 times a game. And in our case, this past year---we threw it more than that...and had a pretty horrendous running game....
I guess what I am saying is that I don't think McCoy is finished in this league, and he may find himself a home as an effective game-manager-type player where he has the guys around him---most notably, a solid running game to rely on throughout a game...
Yea....the jury is still out...but some people are ready to kick the kid to the curb....
Last edited by Tyler_Derden; 06/18/12 10:16 PM.
I wish to wash my Irish wristwatch......
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Weeden and the offense will get tested right away. the Eagles,Bills,Bengals and Ravens have tremendous front 7's.You better hope that Shurmurs playcalling will evolve past his Pop Warner version playbook from 2011.
Well when your QB has a Pop Warner arm, you call Pop Warner plays......
In case you missed it, in one of his pressers right after the draft, he plainly stated he could open the playbbok up more now.
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Can Shurmur out scheme the coach across the field?
I expect alot of #33 getting the ball. 25-30 touches a game.Weeden isn't good enough to go the Cam Newton route and let him sling it.
LOL
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the better Richardson is,the better off Weeden will be.
Can you name any QB who wouldn't look better with a better running game? Talk about some lame blanket statement that covers everyone. LOL
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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the better Richardson is,the better off Weeden will be.
Can you name any QB who wouldn't look better with a better running game? Talk about some lame blanket statement that covers everyone. LOL
Yes - it does cover everyone doesn't it?
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I honestly believe that the playbook of 2011 had a lot to do with the QB.
Where as, I think the ability or lack there of, of the QB to make his read progressions, having a weaker arm and his innability to read oposing D's, had a lot to do with the playbook.
I guess we'll find out pretty soon now.
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I have said that about previous coordinators who have gone on to do better elsewhere as well. Face it, we've had some really crappy QB play for quite a long time here. There's a reason we have seemingly changed QBs every year for the past 10 or so years. They've all been pretty awful. (with the exception of 2007, but that didn't last)
So riddle me this? If you have a crappy QB that can't even execute the "simplist of plays well", how do you expect a coach to open up the playbook further?
All that would do is lead to more turnovers and far bigger deficits in your losses. If you look at it objectively, we had pretty poor QB play last year and lost 4 games by 4 points or less.
I'm not a big fan of Shurmers, but I at least try to be objective about it. A new offense with little to no time to teach it and implement it? No, that couldn't have anything to do with it.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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In case you missed it, in one of his pressers right after the draft, he plainly stated he could open the playbbok up more now.
Do you think that it would have anything to do with this year, being able to have a full off season to prepare?
#GMSTRONG
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Damanshot
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To some extent yes, but I don't believe that covers it all. When you have a QB with a strong enough and accurate enough arm to stretch the field, that too helps you open up the playbook.
So I feel both factors contribute to his comment. Especially if one considers the timing of the comment. Within a couple of days of the draft.
I think people say what they say for reasons and the timing of their comments often say as much as the comments themselves IMO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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To some extent yes, but I don't believe that covers it all. When you have a QB with a strong enough and accurate enough arm to stretch the field, that too helps you open up the playbook.
So I feel both factors contribute to his comment. Especially if one considers the timing of the comment. Within a couple of days of the draft.
I think people say what they say for reasons and the timing of their comments often say as much as the comments themselves IMO
Not that I think there is much doubt that Weeden will start the season,, But at some point, they are going to have to announce that decision publically. That's when we'll know if we got a problem with McCoy..
#GMSTRONG
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Damanshot
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When you have a QB with a strong enough and accurate enough arm to stretch the field, that too helps you open up the playbook.
Pit I never really thought that much about long throws I just wanted some passing. McCoy was not connecting with the WRs and just ran most of the time. He totally lost confidence in his recievers and started throwing to Watson. IS the problem the QB not being accurate or the WRs not giving the QB confidence? Do the WRs now where to run and when to help out when McCOy is being rushed?
I saw games in person and on TV and the real view of the game reveals that the QB was not prepared to go to a quick out because the WR was not cutting his route short. When the other team knows you have no communication with the WRs then they are free to rush 5-6. The more McCoy was rushed the less he trusted his WRs to help.
I did see McCOy make some fairly accurate throws to WRs but also some throw aways. He did some good things but really didn't have the offense moving. He also had no faith in his Oline. McCOy may not be ready yet but what will happen to Weeden?
I have seen this before...we think a player will make the diference but it is still the team that makes the player look good. How long before Weeden is running scared and not trusting his WRs? I think the Oline picks will help us more than Weeden early. Weeden will need time to develop a system and timing and that means at least 1-2 years.
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Weeden will need time to develop a system and timing and that means at least 1-2 years.
Right, no one is saying drafting Weeden is going IMMIDIATELY turn our offense into a top 10 one (regardless of what other people say others are saying)
But it is felt by some, and apparently the FO, that McCoy's weaknesses could not be over come simply by increasing the talent around him.
Will Weeden struggle? Probably at times yes.
In my opinion do I think he has more potential than McCoy? Yes I do.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Weeden will need time to develop a system and timing and that means at least 1-2 years.
Right, no one is saying drafting Weeden is going IMMIDIATELY turn our offense into a top 10 one (regardless of what other people say others are saying)
But it is felt by some, and apparently the FO, that McCoy's weaknesses could not be over come simply by increasing the talent around him.
Will Weeden struggle? Probably at times yes.
In my opinion do I think he has more potential than McCoy? Yes I do.
Oh hell, weeden will have it much better than McCoy did.. better running game (we hope), better blocking on the right side (we hope), and both Guards have a year under their belt, Little in his second year with reports he's coming in really ready, All the OTA's and Mini's and all of camp to prepare.
And yeah, he's got a better arm and he's apparently accurate. add it all up, and we should be a ton better, even if Weeden, Richardson and Schwartz have some expected rookie struggles. (count on it, they will have those moments)
but with all of that, if the receivers don't hang onto the ball.. we'll be in the same mess.
#GMSTRONG
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and not to mention a more confident defense..
Weeden has a lot more going his way.
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Maybe, but all McCoy had to do was impress enough and he couldn't even do that.
Tough doesn't buy you jack-squat in the NFL.
Side question: Is anyone REALLY waiting for an "official" announcement that Weeden is going to be our starter? Haven't we moved past that bit of semantics yet?
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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and not to mention a more confident defense..
Weeden has a lot more going his way.
Oh and I can't believe I forgot this,, he has an OC that will be there for him and a Special Offensive assistent that the team didn't have last year. it won't all be on Shurmurs shoulders.
Oh man,, let me tell you, with all of that, this offense better click. I mean, I expect moments of complete stupidity to occur.. man,, its just gonna happen. We all know it.
But I expect to see monster strides by mid season.. by then, barring injury, we should see some real progress being made.
And Toad,, you say all McCoy needed to do was show us something and he didn't., But you don't seem to take into account what was missing last year that isn't this year.
I have absolutly no doubt McCoy would look better under these circumstances... better enough? there's the question that I can't answer.....
#GMSTRONG
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Damanshot
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I could be wrong, but I don't think Weeden has signed a contract yet. If I were the Browns, I would make sure he makes it to training camp healthy and has signed a contract before naming him the starter. Once that has happened, the competition should be officially over and Weeden will then get every first team rep to get him ready for the Eagles.
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And Toad,, you say all McCoy needed to do was show us something and he didn't., But you don't seem to take into account what was missing last year that isn't this year.
I have absolutly no doubt McCoy would look better under these circumstances... better enough? there's the question that I can't answer.....
You don't have to. The organization already did. 
Chinchilla, since the new rookie structure is in place, I now consider that topic to also be semantics...thank God. 
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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And Toad,, you say all McCoy needed to do was show us something and he didn't., But you don't seem to take into account what was missing last year that isn't this year.
I have absolutly no doubt McCoy would look better under these circumstances... better enough? there's the question that I can't answer.....
You don't have to. The organization already did.
Cute,, but they don't KNOW they are right.. They think they are right. by the way, so do I....
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Damanshot
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Oh Hell, I fully expected McCoy to get better. Double Oh Hell, I expect McCoy to even be better in spite of the fact he won't be playing! However, it all comes back to one of the oldest rules in the book, which is that if you don't have elite tools, you must have at least one elite trait if you're going to make it as a starting QB, and McCoy doesn't have any. Sure, he could become the next Rich Gannon, but the odds...they are so against that happening...it wouldn't be prudent to have risked going forward with him as the unopposed starter, not if the peeps in the FO wanted to keep their cushy jobs.
Now the really fun part happens...they've hitched their collective wagons to what will be a 29-year old rookie QB who came out of the backyard-Spread.
That isn't exactly the definition I see when I look up the term "job security" in a thesaurus...
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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I think if the FO felt like there was even a slight chance that Colt would improve with better help at RB, WR OL, they would have took a chance and waited till #37 for Weeden. They felt like they couldn't take that chance, that says alot.
Dawginit since Jan. 24, 2000 Member #180
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I think if the FO felt like there was even a slight chance that Colt would improve with better help at RB, WR OL, they would have took a chance and waited till #37 for Weeden. They felt like they couldn't take that chance, that says alot.
It says that they didn't think Weeden would be available at pick #37 (a prudent move imo).
I think that they also knew that with better talent around him and more experience with our system that Colt would look better then he did without those intangibles, but they felt like Weeden will be an upgrade, so why shouldn't they have still taken Weeden even though they knew Colt didn't exactly get a fair shake? <rhetorical question.
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Just saying, If they thought Colt could turn the corner, then, even if they thought weeden might be gone by #37, They wouldn't have minded waiting. But I think they felt the need was greater than the risk. Even if they thought Colt would come around and they could still up-grade with Weeden, They could afford to wait. If they lost out, well no big deal. They would go thru the yr. with Colt and if need be up-grade next draft. This seems like a panic move, but I'm not sure thats what I would call it. I hate to think we would panic, when weve been steady as she goes, concernng the draft anyways. I think were getting there, no reason to start reaching now.
Dawginit since Jan. 24, 2000 Member #180
You can't fix yesterday but you can learn for tomorrow
#GMSTRONG
I want to do it as a Cleveland Brown because that's who I am.”
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Joined: Oct 2006
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Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
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Quote:
Just saying, If they thought Colt could turn the corner, then, even if they thought weeden might be gone by #37, They wouldn't have minded waiting. But I think they felt the need was greater than the risk. Even if they thought Colt would come around and they could still up-grade with Weeden, They could afford to wait. If they lost out, well no big deal. They would go thru the yr. with Colt and if need be up-grade next draft. This seems like a panic move, but I'm not sure thats what I would call it. I hate to think we would panic, when weve been steady as she goes, concernng the draft anyways. I think were getting there, no reason to start reaching now.
This is what I think.. Let's be honest.. Holmgren wanted Colt McCoy.. That was Holmgren's "project" and things didn't work out as expected, especially his rookie year b/c he wasn't suppose to play at all. I think if Colt didn't play his rookie year, Colt would be our starter, and Weeden wouldn't be here. Holmgren would have gave him another year with no one pressuring him on the bench for playing time.
With a new coach in Shurmur, he had no choice to accept Colt, and I'm sure he was positive that Colt would work out. Well 1 season in, and just from Shurmur's pressers, and mannerisms, you can tell he just doesn't get excited about Colt, like AT ALL. So he was looking for "his" guy anyway.. and with the addition of Childress.. they both wanna pick their own guy to die by if things go sour.
I'm hoping Weeden pulls it out and delivers some consistent play at QB, which we haven't had in forever.
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/6WV79RV/Browns-Coach-Sig.png)
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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Yeah, I agree. Let's hope this get's settled once and for all. I am tired of the QB merry-go-round. It's time we finally hit on one.
Dawginit since Jan. 24, 2000 Member #180
You can't fix yesterday but you can learn for tomorrow
#GMSTRONG
I want to do it as a Cleveland Brown because that's who I am.”
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I don't even need a Brady/Manning 10+ year kind of guy...
Just give me a guy that comes in, and doesn't allow people to make jokes about him...
And it'd be cool if he won a Super Bowl or two... Just sayin...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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jc...
I believe Shurmur wanted his own QB, not someone Holmgren picked for him.
For some reason, McCoy and Shurmur didn't seem to click. I know most want to point their finger at McCoy, that's ok.
But looking back at McCoy's 2010 and 2011 seasons, coming away with the feeling that McCoy looked better as a rookie playing in Daboll's offense, than he did playing in Shurmur's WCO.
I felt that McCoy would be much improved in his second season, not really believing he would have much of a problem adjusting to Shurmur's new offense or him as the new OC. But for some reason the improvement did not happen and there might be 50 legitimate reasons why.
There is a possibility that Shurmur is not and was not that hot shot teacher of the WCO that everyone thought he would be. Maybe the duties as HC interfered with Shurmur's ability to teach the offense in the way he would have wanted...who knows. But that offense sucked...especially the play calling at times...being predicable, lacking imagination, calling plays that did not suit the down and distance.
Obviously Holmgren recognized there were problems concerning Shurmur's ability to teach the offense or he would not have sought out and hired offensive coaching help for Shurmur...hiring Childress and Nolan Cromwell this year.
If Shurmur was not confident in McCoy's ability, the best way to solve that problem is find a QB that Shurmur is comfortable with. Shurmur now has his own QB, a guy he wanted, Brandon Weeden and Shurmur now has offensive coaching help, which should allow him the time needed to teach the offense in a way he is comfortable with.
Hopefully Shurmur will do a better job teaching his WCO to his players...he needs to improve too.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
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I just think that it is as simple as they thought Weeden would/will be an upgrade over Colt McCoy regardless of weather or not they felt like Colt would improve. Like any other position on this team save for JT ... If we have an opportunity to upgrade a position via the Draft, then I personally can't second guess them drafting a prospect who they feel will be an upgrade.
Colt should improve and the talent around him would be better, but the question becomes, just how far will/would that take us if we simply passed on a chance to upgrade the QB position this year? By this time next year if Weeden proves to be an upgrade at the position, then I think that we will be one year closer to reaching the goals that this team must reach.
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Quote:
Side question: Is anyone REALLY waiting for an "official" announcement that Weeden is going to be our starter? Haven't we moved past that bit of semantics yet?
You know, I keep forgetting that an official announcement has not yet been made ...
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Rookie
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I think if Holcomb was here, it'd be a different story.
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum McCoy vs Weeden
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