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Quote:
And why wouldn't he?
Bringing in Trent Green would be like bringing in Brian Sipe back (when Sipe is in his old age) 
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I didn't know you were playing primarily because the Cowboys would do something like that, hehe. Think Drew Henson and Chad Hutchinson *L*
Rabid 
I heard the Bucs are interested in Schaub.
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If we were close to being a playoff team I would say go with Green. Being that were not, I'd rather get Carr here and compete with Frye. I am not ready to go and draft another QB this year unless we are able to gain picks from somewhere.
Since we're not looking like a playoff team, I'm curious why you feel that bringing in Green would then not be a good choice, but would rather go with Carr?
Neither guy is going to cost a 1st day selection.
Wait, now I get it. You'd like to see Carr become a long-term starter, whereas Green would leave us as still picking a 1st day QB?
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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For a veteran QB Green would be the better fit .
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Something that you may not know......
Green didn't start an NFL game until he was 28. He took exactly one snap the previous year.
So while he's going to be 36, he's only got 6.5 seasons under his belt.
At age 30, he only had 19 starts in his entire career, and before that brutal concussion ended his year, he'd started every game for 5 straight seasons. That's 80 straight.
He's 36, but he's far from an old NFL QB.
Furthermore, guard was our biggest problem last year along with Tucker and his issues. Tucker is straightened out and we just signed a pro-bowl caliber guard, and another viable starter if his neck is right.
This isn't the same line as last year. It's not the Chiefs line, but it's not the Raiders line either.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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You made some great points Toad, but it just makes more sense if we want a QB this year, to go after Carr.
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***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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If we were close to being a playoff team I would say go with Green. Being that were not, I'd rather get Carr here and compete with Frye. I am not ready to go and draft another QB this year unless we are able to gain picks from somewhere.
Since we're not looking like a playoff team, I'm curious why you feel that bringing in Green would then not be a good choice, but would rather go with Carr?
Neither guy is going to cost a 1st day selection.
Wait, now I get it. You'd like to see Carr become a long-term starter, whereas Green would leave us as still picking a 1st day QB?
Exactly. In two years we would be looking for a starter for sure. Since I don't want to draft a QB this year ( the way we are picking now) Carr could buy us time and maybe if we protect him he might be a longer term solution. As much as he has been hit I don't believe he has any injury issues.
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j/c:
Another crazy thread. I'll add to the craziness w/some random thoughts.
---The Texans gave up too much for a guy who has shown some signs, but hasn't produced squat. Most of his success was during pre-season.
---Atlanta got the better of the deal, but it's a risk to put all your faith on Vick. He is still a risk and now they have no one behind him.
---The Texans could still say they believe in Carr and they brought Shaub in to compete for the starting job or be a backup. I doubt it will fly, but they have to say something.
---I think Carr is damaged goods. Not as bad as Timid, but close. He has lost his nerve and his mechanics have regressed. I think it would be foolish for the Browns to trade for him. Under any circumstances.
---I like Trent Green. Very underrated QB. However, the Browns ain't going anywhere next year and Green is aging. Those two big hits he took last year also seemed to take something away from his performance.
---I think this is not the year to trade down. I have always campaigned to trade down. Not this year. We can get a very good player at # 3, no matter what.
---I would not trade Charlie Frye at this point in time. I think it's too early to make a final determination on him and I doubt we would get any value if we traded him. Quit looking for the quick fix. Draft well.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Yahoo! Sports link
Schaub traded to Texans
By Jason Cole, Yahoo! Sports
March 21, 2007
The Atlanta Falcons showed some faith in quarterback Michael Vick while the last vestiges of any hope for David Carr with the Houston Texans seemed to end Wednesday.
The Falcons traded backup quarterback Matt Schaub to Houston for two second-round picks and an exchange of first-round picks in next month's NFL draft. The trade, initially reported by NFL.com, was confirmed by Schaub's agent, Joby Branion.
Schaub had been considered a possible alternative for the Falcons if Vick flops this season under new coach Bobby Petrino. However, Schaub was set to be an unrestricted free agent after the 2007 season, which would have become an obstacle in the Falcons keeping him long term. As part of the trade, Schaub got a new contract from Houston. He boarded a plane for Houston early in the afternoon and will take a physical when he arrives.
In exchange for Schaub, the Falcons received Houston’s second-round pick this year (the No. 39 overall) and in 2008. The Falcons also moved up from the No. 10 overall pick to No. 8 overall in the switch of first-rounders.
Branion declined to give specifics on the contract other than to say, "it's a real deal." By that, Branion implied that the contract indicates that Schaub will be the starter. Carr, who was the No. 1 overall pick in 2002, continued to have middling to poor results last season.
Subsequently, Carr is expected to be traded or released. In five years as the starter, Carr completed 60 percent of his passes for 13,391 yards, 59 touchdown passes and 65 interceptions. The Texans had hoped that Carr would progress under new coach Gary Kubiak.
As for Schaub, he was a third-round pick in 2004 who showed promise in limited action. He has completed 84 of 161 passes (52.2 percent) for 1,033 yards, six touchdowns and six interceptions.
Over the past two years under former coach Jim Mora Jr., there was increasing discussion of playing Schaub over Vick, although the discussion never became particularly serious.
Since taking over the Falcons, Petrino has expressed reserved support for Vick, saying only that he expected Vick to take a stronger role in the calling of plays. Vick has complained over the past two years that he has not been allowed to audible.
With the trade, the Oakland Raiders and Miami Dolphins are the only teams considered to have "open" quarterbacking jobs. The Raiders are debating whether to take JaMarcus Russell of LSU with the No. 1 overall pick. The Dolphins have had discussions with Kansas City Chiefs quarterback Trent Green about a trade and have worked on trying to move up in the first round with an eye on Notre Dame quarterback Brady Quinn.
Jason Cole is a national NFL writer for Yahoo! Sports. Send Jason a question or comment for potential use in a future column or webcast.
**Insert clever signature here attributed to some historical figure that sounds interesting but has been taken completely out of context.
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Something that you may not know......
Green didn't start an NFL game until he was 28. He took exactly one snap the previous year.
So while he's going to be 36, he's only got 6.5 seasons under his belt.
At age 30, he only had 19 starts in his entire career, and before that brutal concussion ended his year, he'd started every game for 5 straight seasons. That's 80 straight.
He's 36, but he's far from an old NFL QB.
Furthermore, guard was our biggest problem last year along with Tucker and his issues. Tucker is straightened out and we just signed a pro-bowl caliber guard, and another viable starter if his neck is right.
This isn't the same line as last year. It's not the Chiefs line, but it's not the Raiders line either.
Yes, I know he didn't start playing until he was older. Lost out on the hole Super Bowl thing in St. Louis because he got injured. The fact he is older does concern me. I know there are examples of older QBs actually playing well but I wouldn't count on it. With age things start regressing. It's harder to maintain your speed and strength when you hit the upper thirties ( I know this from experience). The body also takes much longer to heal. A problem he will have in Cleveland ( even if our line is much improved).
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Petrino is clearing a path to take Brohm next year. Eliminate the fan support for Shaub by dumping him and making a heck of a deal. he is giving vick all the rope he needs to hang himself.
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I think Carr is damaged goods. Not as bad as Timid, but close. He has lost his nerve and his mechanics have regressed. I think it would be foolish for the Browns to trade for him. Under any circumstances.
I might not have seen him as much as you but I disagree. Unlike Couch, he doesn't seem to have medical problems. I don't think he has lost his nerve. A second day pick to bring him in to compete with Frye I think is a good idea. The worst case senerio is Frye wins the job and Carr is our backup. Anderson was no good in college and we should have never even added him to the roster. One good game doesn't make him a pro. In order to trade for Carr he would have to redo his contract. He is not worth what he is being paid now. Most likely to get him we will have to take our chances once he is cut.
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I think this is not the year to trade down. I have always campaigned to trade down. Not this year. We can get a very good player at # 3, no matter what.
I am not an expert on Olineman by any means. I read reports and listen to the arguements of those who seem to know. From what I gather we would be foolish to pass on Thomas.
If he is gone or Phil doesn't want him I think Phil would be foolish not to trade down if he can get a good deal. If Atlanta wanted to switch firsts ( they're 8th now) and throw in both of thier 2nds we can possibly pick up 4 starters the first day. If Quinn doesn't go to Detroit he still will probably be there at 8. Same with Peterson.
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And another thought.....this move by Atlanta gives them two second rounders....this gives them the ability to move up to say....#3 for a shot at Calvin.
I would move to #10 and have a total of 3 second round picks......all high.....#36,39,44
Someone correct me if I'm wrong. Remember, the T.J. Duckett trade with the Redskins? The Falcons got a second and a third.
So, the Falcons have three second rounders and two thirds in 2007. The Falcons have draft picks to burn if they want to. 
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I am not an expert on Olineman by any means. I read reports and listen to the arguements of those who seem to know. From what I gather we would be foolish to pass on Thomas.
let me introduce you to the biggest joe thomas pimp on this board: Vers
We're trying to throw the ball downfield and he checked the ball down to Trent Richardson and the Indians on the choice.
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One word: Why?
Why? Because if we want a QB for the long run, and he has success, Carr is younger and will last longer.
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Dude, are you really buying that injury BS that people trot out? Timid is out of the league because he sucked, both physically and mentally. Especially mentally. I have no problem w/you disagreeing w/me about Carr. Who knows...perhpas he will stud out in a new environment. I don't think he will. We won't know until it plays out, but I can see why you think he might be good. Thomas probably will be there at # 3 and he is the best player in the draft. Keep the pick and land a gem. 
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Atlanta could move to #2 with that deal.....maybe even into the Raiders slot.
For what???...2 Seconds???...Not a chance...
As usual...U under value top 3 slots in a draft...
They wanna come up to 2...Hell even 3 with us...It's gonna cost a 2nd AND a ONE in 2008...
U don't just give away a top 3 player in ANY draft for 2nd rounders...Johnson is who they'd want...HOW MUCH U WANT EM?????
That Value Chart can be tossed when moving into the top 3...
Go Browns!!!
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Hey Peen, well I'm not sure I understand why the Lions become the player in the draft trade up scenario? I think we would be as much or more than they are, considering from what I've been reading in here that it would cost teams a bit less to trade up to our spot and the contract of the player drafted would be a bit less at #3 rather than #2. However, I'm not sure Phil really wants to trade down? So that would put us out of the trade down scenario and put the Lions as the player.
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Ok, I just wanted to know your reasons. 
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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NRTU
Man do I feel bad for Texans' fans... this is funny as hell.
They WAY overpaid for a back-up QB... I can't believe they gave up two 2nd rounders plus swapping 1st. This has to just really tick off Houston fans who wanted Carr gone LAST year and have either Vince or Reggie here...
Who knows with Shaub... personally I was expecting them to go with Rosenfield (or however you spell it). And maybe getting a vet QB but def not with this kind of trade.
Carr can go for a 7th rounder easily IMO... the Texans will not start the season with him on the team... so their PR people better get going try to make the Raiders or Browns or whoever else is looking for a QB into thinking that someone is offering a high second rounder... because they will cut him before starting the season with Carr.
<sigh> Poor Texans...
<><
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Dude, are you really buying that injury BS that people trot out? Timid is out of the league because he sucked, both physically and mentally. Especially mentally.
Just saying Carr isn't broke down physically that's all. I thought Couch was overrated coming out of college (I wanted Culpepper) and I'm not going to start to defend him now. 
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Thomas probably will be there at # 3 and he is the best player in the draft. Keep the pick and land a gem.
If you were picking for us, sure. You're not and I am far from convinced Savage wants him. 
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Just saying Carr isn't broke down physically that's all.
He might not be broken... but he sure is beat up... and I agree with Vers that I don't think he's all there mentally... he had an itchy trigger finger and tried to do too much a lot las tyear... of course with a new team that could help with some of the pressure because all of the fans wouldn't hate him like in Houston.... at least not yet...
<><
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And another thought.....this move by Atlanta gives them two second rounders....this gives them the ability to move up to say....#3 for a shot at Calvin.
I would move to #10 and have a total of 3 second round picks......all high.....#36,39,44
To move up to #2 from #10 would cost 1300 points. That would cost the Falcons both 2nd round picks (980 total points) + their 3rd round pick (220 points). That's a dead-even deal.
To move up to #3 from #10 would cost 900 points, which is both of the Falcons 2nd round picks.
I'm using this an example of why a team wanting Johnson will be trading with us and NOT the Lions.
I wish I agreed with your logic, but what if the Lions look at it this way - they want to trade down, Atlanta's offer to us is going to be the best offered for a Top 5 pick this year, they decide to accept the same offer, Atlanta takes the offer for the higher pick.
Just because the draft value indicates that the Lions should expect more for their pick than we do ours doesn't mean they have to. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see the Lions work out a deal, given that they've been clearly shopping their pick the whole time.
We're... we're good?
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-I think Carr is damaged goods. Not as bad as Timid, but close. He has lost his nerve and his mechanics have regressed. I think it would be foolish for the Browns to trade for him. Under any circumstances.
This is really rather elementary...lol
1) Davis is going with Russell
2) Millen's going with Quinn
3) Draft Thomas and be done with it...
4) Opens up Rnd 2 for a pretty solid Defensive Lineman...
5) Opens up Rnd 3 for either a OG/CB/DL
6) Opens up Rnd 4 for Bush RB Louisville
TRADE THE 5th ROUNDER FOR CARR AND BE DONE WITH IT...FRYE GOES TO #2...
Go Browns!!!
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If Atlanta can trade with us or the Lions for the same deal that'd trade with us (unless they really felt like the Lions would take their man) so that they could pay less for their guy...
of course if they think that the Lions will take CJ then they would go with the #2...
either way... I think it's good for us... if we trade we get a lot of picks and probably still get a solid player at 8... if the Falcons trade up they take CJ and we get a better chance at taking who we really want.
<><
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I think you will be happy with this senario. If we drop to eight we could still get your man with extra picks on top of it.
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I must agree with you and Toad. I love Trent Green as a Brown. If I were Phil I'd be on the phone yesterday trying to pick this guy up. I'm not as well versed as some in what it might take but it seems to me that any 2nd day pick to get TG is well worth the cost.
I also agree that I'd prefer to see us keep the 3rd pick and use it on Thomas. If he's gone I'd go to Johnson if he's still there then to Peterson if both those guys are gone. I'm just not sold on Quinn or Russell.
Just wonder who Phil's sold on........
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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And another thought.....this move by Atlanta gives them two second rounders....this gives them the ability to move up to say....#3 for a shot at Calvin.
I would move to #10 and have a total of 3 second round picks......all high.....#36,39,44
Someone correct me if I'm wrong. Remember, the T.J. Duckett trade with the Redskins? The Falcons got a second and a third.
So, the Falcons have three second rounders and two thirds in 2007. The Falcons have draft picks to burn if they want to.
I have been informed that b/c of a trade involving lelie that the Falcons have only two 2nd rounders. Sorry 
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Does anyone think that David Carr might be cut due to his roster bonus?
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Does anyone think that David Carr might be cut due to his roster bonus?
If they don't trade him he'll be cut simply because they want to cut ties with him....
<><
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j/c
Do you really think ATL would trade up to The lions? the Lions would be stupid to draft another WR. they would loose all fan support (whatever is left) ATL can trade with us and not spend the extra $$$ of a 2nd pick vs the 3rd pick. There is a small possibility that we will pick him and a lot of ppl think Tampa will pick Johnson. There is no need to trade up to the lions cause everyone in the NFL knows that they will not draft a WR. JMHO
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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You really think Millen wouldn't draft a WR???
I think it's unlikely... but with Johnson I could easily see him doing it...
<><
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j/c
Do you really think ATL would trade up to The lions? the Lions would be stupid to draft another WR. they would loose all fan support (whatever is left) ATL can trade with us and not spend the extra $$$ of a 2nd pick vs the 3rd pick. There is a small possibility that we will pick him and a lot of ppl think Tampa will pick Johnson. There is no need to trade up to the lions cause everyone in the NFL knows that they will not draft a WR. JMHO
I dont think its that far fetched for the Lions to take Calvin Johnson. They have no consistent reciever outside Roy Williams and Furrey. Plus, Furrey should be in the slot. I wouldnt be to shocked to see them pick him up.
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You really think Millen wouldn't draft a WR???
I think it's unlikely... but with Johnson I could easily see him doing it...
 riiiiiiight
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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Im hearing Carr to the Raiders for the Raiders forth (which is the first pick of the 4th round)....so if someone wants Carr....they are gonna probably have to pony up more than that.
HACK
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Im hearing Carr to the Raiders for the Raiders forth (which is the first pick of the 4th round)....so if someone wants Carr....they are gonna probably have to pony up more than that.
HACK
If this happens the Raiders could take Thomas number 1 while keeping Moss.
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You really think Millen wouldn't draft a WR???
I think it's unlikely... but with Johnson I could easily see him doing it...
riiiiiiight
Ok... they have a solid vet QB... a handful of solid RBs... and a history of taking first round WRs
You don't think Kitna would love to have someone like Johnsons to throw to? Their offense would actually be pretty tight...
Personally I don't think it's going to happen... but it wouldn't surpise me one bit..
<><
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This is the worst line in this whole thread...
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If Houston coughed up enough picks, I wouldn't mind moving down to their slot and adding Carr.
I kinda think it sounds a little dirty... 
Go Browns !!!!
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And another thought.....this move by Atlanta gives them two second rounders....this gives them the ability to move up to say....#3 for a shot at Calvin.
I would move to #10 and have a total of 3 second round picks......all high.....#36,39,44
To move up to #2 from #10 would cost 1300 points. That would cost the Falcons both 2nd round picks (980 total points) + their 3rd round pick (220 points). That's a dead-even deal.
To move up to #3 from #10 would cost 900 points, which is both of the Falcons 2nd round picks.
I'm using this an example of why a team wanting Johnson will be trading with us and NOT the Lions.
I wish I agreed with your logic, but what if the Lions look at it this way - they want to trade down, Atlanta's offer to us is going to be the best offered for a Top 5 pick this year, they decide to accept the same offer, Atlanta takes the offer for the higher pick.
Just because the draft value indicates that the Lions should expect more for their pick than we do ours doesn't mean they have to. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see the Lions work out a deal, given that they've been clearly shopping their pick the whole time.
No team is going to sell the 2nd pick in the entire draft for less than value of that chart. Ego's are too large, pride is too prominent.
Remember man, they want a top player out of this thing, and there's a big difference between the top 4 players and the guys that are going to be had at 8-10.
Let's just assume for a moment that they really do want a QB or Thomas. They won't get one outside of the 4th pick. They are set at WR and have two capable RB's. Common sense tells us it's the BS story in Thomas or one of the QB's that they really want. If they are going to be enticed into trading down, they won't do it at wholesale. No team would when you go that far down from the second pick.
Now dropping down one spot is a different story, and dropping down 4 spots in the 3rd round is also a different story. Dropping 6 spots in the 1st round is a completely different animal.
They won't take a deal that doesn't match that chart in some way, shape, or form.
Thoughts on Carr.........Good guy to either push or take Frye's job. Probably won't ever be an all-pro but could be a servicable guy while we build the team. That's all that Frye was supposed to be, remember? Same goes for Green, though he's a bonifide guy in this league.
People scoffed at myself and a few others when we were excited about Garcia coming here. Talk said he was past his prime and not good enough. Despite a few more years of age on his body, he proved he still was a very good QB. We blew it by not putting the right system or the right players around him. (Suck it Soup ). Green comes from a system where the TE is the prominent player, and we'll most likely have our 90+ catch TE back again. We'll have an offensive line that while not great actually has some legitimate starters on it. As for Green himself, he's alot like Garcia. He didn't play in this league until late in his career (REAL freakin late. First start at 28? *L*) and has shown he has plenty of game left.
My bottom line is that two seasons of Green WOULD ABSOLUTELY be better than two seasons of Frye, Carr, Quinn, or Russell. With the price being a 2nd day pick, we'd become a viable 8-8 team who's going in the right direction, and we could either put Frye on the bench and let him figure it out, or draft one of the developemental QB's and let HIM sit and figure it out.
I know it's a pipe dream on my part. It looks like the Fish are the team that's going to get Green, and we're going to wish it was us, just like Brees.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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