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Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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In all reality, it's going to be tough for Weeden to bounce back and perform this coming week. He is going to get bashed.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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In all reality, it's going to be tough for Weeden to bounce back and perform this coming week. He is going to get bashed.
He's mature, he's a big boy, it's adversity that comes with the job.... What does he expect to happen when he posts a 5.1 QB rating?
yebat' Putin
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From MAC:
I did see some highlights of some of Weeden's pass attempts and I could not help but notice the Browns WRs are still having an issue with getting separation.
Seriously? SERIOUSLY?! 
You're going to watch highlights, then make the conclusion that our receivers weren't getting open?
That's about as sound a judgment as watching highlights in college and then pimping that player as the next Jerry Rice. 
We had receivers open all over the field. Hell, Mass was open...I mean WIDE open...on two occasions where Weeden missed him. Then he was open on a cross but Weeden threw it behind him.
It's just like in years gone by...the receivers are open by NFL standards, and sometimes even by college standards, such as yesterday. We just aren't getting them the ball.
Weeden had "Brady Quinn" windows in college to throw through with that offense. His accuracy was never as good as advertised, and it showed yesterday.
He used adrenaline and nerves as his reason why he missed those passes. I'll remind everyone that Holmgren and Co. said his maturity and time in baseball had prepared him for this.
Bunch of dopes selling people snake-oil. 
28 or otherwise, a rookie from a flag-football league is still a rookie from a flag-football league. If Weeden is ready to start, you start him. If he's not, you don't. What I saw yesterday was not at ALL a guy who was ready to be named the starter...
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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If Weeden is ready to start, you start him. If he's not, you don't. What I saw yesterday was not at ALL a guy who was ready to be named the starter...
But he's tall and he throws the ball 87 mph... what else do you need? 
yebat' Putin
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I took a day before weighing in just because I was so furious yesterday. So I've reflected and tried to find the logical and rational side of this argument. Unfortunately, the rational side is a little too close to how I felt yesterday.
Weeden flat out stunk up the joint.
Horrible, grotesque, disgusting. As said by many, one of the worst performances ever seen by a QB in a Browns uniform and, lets be real, thats saying something.
Now I realize that Weeden, despite the "maturity" that we say is a plus, is a rookie so there will be some that preach patience. I will reluctantly agree a little here. HOWEVER, the fact is that this guy got drafted to be the answer NOW. Due to his age, he is NOT developmental prospect and he must show that he can succeed today if he is going to be our QB for the next 5 to 6 years.
I'm not saying that we pull pin on a first rounder that quick (although yesterday I was...God was I mad). But I am firm in advocating a very short leash. I expect IMMEDIATE improvement next game because really....how could he play worse? If he doesn;t show us why he's the answer, he's done and McCoy starts rest of the year. I know he's got some haters here but, despite his physical limitations, McCoy wins us that game yesterday by avoiding the 3 inexcusable picks that Weeden threw (yes there were 4 but the one wasn;t fully his fault)
Clock is a tickin B-Weed. Make me a beliver or sit the eff down.
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Quote:
Quote:
If Weeden is ready to start, you start him. If he's not, you don't. What I saw yesterday was not at ALL a guy who was ready to be named the starter...
But he's tall and he throws the ball 87 mph... what else do you need?
don't forget he was pimped as one of the most accurate strong armed QB's ever...
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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he is extremely accurate ,,, but it seems crazy to say that after yesterday  lol. i know i'll take heat for this, but with most of his throws being overthrows, i have a feeling it was nerves yesterday more so than he just flat out sucks.
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Weeden was very accurate.... he and Rodgers-Cromartie had great chemistry. Hit him right in the hands every time.
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There is a lot to take away from yesterday.
- First Weeders overthrew a lot of balls.
- Second he made a bunch of bad decisions
- Third he tested a seasoned, tough defense and lost.
- Fourth, he missed open guys because his eyes never left his primary read.
- Fifth, He threw a pretty decent deep ball on a couple of occasions. While the Benjamin down the right sideline INT was on him, if that was Gordon, or a bigger WR you see them stop and cut in front of the DB and grab that ball, Benjamin isnt taht guy.
- Sixth, Play calling did not favor Weeden. We asked him to do things he wasnt ready to do. We have a beast RB, and 2 serviceable RBs behind that beast RB and we didnt develop any rhythm there. We spent no time trying to establish the run game.
- 7th - we have 3 good TEs and we rarely used them. I dont even remember seeing Cameron on the field...he got the evan moore treatment...blech.
Overall,
What we kinda saw from Brandon Weeden was a guy force too much. When he took what was available, he looked good. the screen he threw to TRich was great, the couple slants he hit to MoMass looked good, the out to Watson, the in to MoMass, the cross route to little (his first INT) were all good things.
He did SOME things well, but more things not well. Many improveable things, not many things that he did were flawed in that he cant fix. Thats the plus. The question is will he.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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Weeded is going to get better, just watch.
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Wow Steve....how thick are those orange coloured glasses?
His decision making was abyssmal. If he doesn't show immediate improvement, the draft rap of "poor decisions when pressured" will prove true and we may well be on our way to yet another QB bust.
Honestly, I'm trying to keep level headed but he was SO BAD.
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Quote:
Weeded is going to get better, just watch.
unfortunately we don't have a choice but to watch.
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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All Pro
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Quote:
Quote:
Weeded is going to get better, just watch.
unfortunately we don't have a choice but to watch.
True. There really isn't any viable alternative.
"Let people think this is a dumpster fire," - Mike Pettine
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From MAC: I did see some highlights of some of Weeden's pass attempts and I could not help but notice the Browns WRs are still having an issue with getting separation.
I think coming to this forum is only making this past week worse.
Couldn't get separation?!
You mean like Alex Smith having a picnic in the endzone?
While Weeden overthrows a 15 yard pass by 10 feet?
Putting any of Weeden's crapfest on the receivers is utterly ridiculous.
Go watch the last INT and notice how unbelievably WIDE OPEN Greg Little is over the middle of the field. There wasn't a defender within 10 yards of him.
Weeden sucked. It was his fault. Let's just move on and hope for the best.
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he is extremely accurate ,,, but it seems crazy to say that after yesterday lol.
i know i'll take heat for this, but with most of his throws being overthrows, i have a feeling it was nerves yesterday more so than he just flat out sucks.
You are probably right., he'll say no, but you can't tell me he wasn't a bit on the nervious side...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Thats truth. He was awful....
but there werent many things that he did, that you think...well thats it, throw in the towel on this kid, he's never going to be able to do that, or those things. Much of it was decision making, and with film study, those can improve. Morseo, that is a very good D that we saw, and other defenses are going to struggle more than that.
I'm not saying he was good, I'm saying he did SOME good things, and none of the mistakes he made were uncorrectable.
If he can improve upon it...he'll be fine.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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j/c
He clearly wasn't ready...clearly.
He was so fixated on his first read that one has to believe he was coached to do so.
The number of plays he blew and the open receivers he mºssed is cause for great concern.
I don't know how a young guy like that gets "ready" during the season. I'm afraid it's too late for that this year.
If he plays that poorly in the first half of the Bengal game, they need to bring in McCoy. I'd start Weeden again in game 3 and see if he's settled down...but he was overwhelmed, rattled, and awful yesterday.
I'd feel better if Weeden and Shurmur would just admit that and move on.
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http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2012/09/cleveland_browns_pat_shurmur_b.htmlBEREA, Ohio -- Browns coach Pat Shurmur was asked today at the team's Monday press conference what he'd tell Browns fans clamoring for backup quarterback Colt McCoy. "Clamoring for McCoy? I'd tell them that Brandon Weeden is our starting quarterback and he's going to get better.'' He said Weeden, who threw four interceptions against the Eagles and finished with a 5.1 quarterback rating, needs to throw more accurately. He said he didn't necessarily agree with the notion that Weeden was overly excited throughout the game. He said Weeden, who overthrew receivers all afternoon, just needs to be more accurate with his throws. "Those were high fastballs,'' he said. 
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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The best thing I can say is this: The book is far from having been written on Weeden, but it is quite disappointing that it appears that the first chapter is being written by Edgar Allen Poe.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I'm not happy with the play of Brandon Weeden. I'm not jumping off the cliff or anything but evidently he wasn't prepared to play which begs the question on why in the world he was held out of the 4th preseason game?
Weeden is raw but I seriously question if this coaching staff has the know how to polish him or the ability to coach him up.
Last edited by FreeAgent; 09/10/12 02:41 PM.
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Quote:
The best thing I can say is this: The book is far from having been written on Weeden, but it is quite disappointing that it appears that the first chapter is being written by Edgar Allen Poe.
true,but ... Poe was never this sick and twisted.
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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http://www.ohio.com/blogs/cleveland-brow...-start-1.330136Quote:
Shurmur, however, is confident Weeden is ready for the Sept. 9 regular-season opener against the Philadelphia Eagles.
“I think he’s very prepared,” Shurmur said. “I think he’s had an outstanding camp. I thought he had an outstanding offseason and really he’s kind of improved every day. So for a guy that’s going through this for the first time as a pro, I think he’s very ready.”
~Lyuokdea
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I know, I read that, but obviously that evaluation was incorrect. So if he can't even evaluate that correctly then................
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Seriously?
What the heck else do you expect him to say in the days immediately before the kid's first NFL start??
At some point, whether you believe it or not, you have to come out in full support of the guys you're trotting out onto the field.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Seriously?
What the heck else do you expect him to say in the days immediately before the kid's first NFL start??
I expect him to not name him the starter after putting up terrible preseason numbers and let him learn on the sideline... at least for a few games.
what's the worst that can happen? Drew Breese and Phillip Rivers?
right now it looks more like Ryan Leaf.
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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The best thing I can say is this: The book is far from having been written on Weeden, but it is quite disappointing that it appears that the first chapter is being written by Edgar Allen Poe.
I actually thought it was more Stephen King ......... 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Good thing you didn't PM me and make that wager about the fans calling for McCoy huh DC? I thought saying "No later than week 4" was giving it more than ample time..... 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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what's the worst that can happen? Drew Breese and Phillip Rivers?
I literally camp on here to say the same thing. If Colt McCoy plays bad, in week four you bring in your first round pick who has been watching and learning. If Colt McCoy plays average and the team stinks, you bring in your first round pick who has been watching and learning. If Colt McCoy is good, you have a good starting QB and a guy you like that you drafted in the first round.
There is one big problem with all of that. Brandon Weeden is 28 years old (29 in one month). He has to play right away. You can't sit Weeden for two years because then he is 31 and has never played in an NFL game. Rivers was 25 when he started his first NFL game.
I really don't understand why anyone thought it was good idea to draft a 28 year old in the first round. I fully expect to see McCoy start a few games this season and then when Weeden is "ready" he will come back in.
For Holmgren (it looks like he's probably already gone), Heckert, and Shurmur to survive Weeden has to be good this year.
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Quote:
Quote:
The best thing I can say is this: The book is far from having been written on Weeden, but it is quite disappointing that it appears that the first chapter is being written by Edgar Allen Poe.
I actually thought it was more Stephen King .........
nah, Stephen King is way too cheerful and upbeat.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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For Holmgren (it looks like he's probably already gone), Heckert, and Shurmur to survive Weeden has to be good this year.
yeah he's gone now
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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I fully expect to see McCoy start a few games this season and then when Weeden is "ready" he will come back in.
If and when Weeden is injured will be the only way you'll see Colt.
Once they decided Colt wasn't the answer, they moved on. Weeden won't develop in 6-12 weeks sitting on the bench. That will only happen if he stays on the field.
They hitched their weagons to Weeden and why not?
They won't be here after this season anyway.
I can't say one way or the other about how Weeden will turn out by the end of this season. But then again, neither can anyone else.
But I do agree that Colt is not the answer. Every snap Colt would take on the field will be that much longer that we still won't know how Weeden will turn out and that much longer our team will be starting a QB that is the past, not the future.
I'm willing to deal with the growing pains to see how or if Weeden develops. Because when you know you don't have the answer at QB, you have to move on to the next guy.....
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For Holmgren (it looks like he's probably already gone), Heckert, and Shurmur to survive Weeden has to be good this year.
If Shurmer is here next year, it will show that the new owner is clueless too and we will be stuck in mediocrity at best for quite some time to come....
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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I'd be shocked if Shurmur is here next year as he was Holmgren's guy all the way.
So... pretty much, this is a throw-away kinda year as we aren't actually building toward anything - again.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Seriously?
What the heck else do you expect him to say in the days immediately before the kid's first NFL start??
At some point, whether you believe it or not, you have to come out in full support of the guys you're trotting out onto the field.
I'd expect him to have given the offense another start in the 4th preseason game.
They obviously needed some more time working together.
~Lyuokdea
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I'd be shocked if Shurmur is here next year as he was Holmgren's guy all the way.
So... pretty much, this is a throw-away kinda year as we aren't actually building toward anything - again.
Exactly the way I see it too.
That's why I'm all for starting Weeden as long as he isn't injured and see what happens.
We aren't going to the playoffs no matter who starts. Heck, we're not even going to make it to .500 no matter who starts.
So at that stage, why not find out if he develops?
On one front I do see some optimism with the new regime. Banner is from Philly and they run a similar style of O and the 4-3 D. So while I think there will be some player movement, I don't think the entire roster will have to be blown up to near the degree it has been in times past where new regimes have run totaly different systems.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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he is extremely accurate ,,, but it seems crazy to say that after yesterday lol.
i know i'll take heat for this, but with most of his throws being overthrows, i have a feeling it was nerves yesterday more so than he just flat out sucks.
Weeden is a pitcher playing quarterback.
A pitcher for the most part just needs to throw to his spots... it rewards consistently good mechanics, repetition and decisions all made with tons of time. When Weeden knows where he's throwing the ball and has the time to wind up and deliver, he's extremely accurate. That's how it was in college for him most of the time - nice clean pockets, nice open receivers with tons of space to operate, very few reads and it's why he looks so good throwing one read timing slants. It's the reason Weeden looks like a stud in shorts and why he can hit a clay pigeon with better accuracy than he hit our receivers yesterday. He's not getting pressured or picked off by the Philadelphia Clay Pigeons... the Eagles however...
“If I worked out a quarterback for an NFL team, he'd have to show me 100 throws off his back foot.” - Dan Marino
The problem is, the throws that make a great QB aren't the ones you have all day to make and can go through mechanically with perfection... they're the ones that are rushed, the throws made with less than perfect body positioning, the decisions that aren't scripted, etc. That's where Weeden struggles. He struggled with it in college but he faced it so little that it was masked (not to those who studied him but I digress). He struggled with it in the pre-season but was given the job because of his draft status. He struggled terribly with it on Sunday.
Weeden isn't ready to start in this league by all appearances. His difficulties were highlighted on Sunday for the whole world to see. It's the same reason why it's a damn shame we spent a 1st rounder on him... a 29 year old who is NFL ready? Sure, worth it. A 29 year old who plays like any other rookie? Ugh. The thing is, entering the draft, there was NOTHING to suggest he was more NFL ready than any other 2 year starter aside from reaching and saying that being a 29-year old ex-baseball player somehow makes you NFL ready.
I hope he proves me wrong and bounces back in a big way vs. Cincinnati (I'll be at the game surrounded by Bungles so I kind of need him to ), but I'm not freaking out about just one game. I'm freaking out that the same Weeden I saw in college and the pre-season was on full display Sunday and that he somehow managed to do even worse than I could've imagined.
We're... we're good?
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Browns coach Pat Shurmur was asked today at the team's Monday press conference what he'd tell Browns fans clamoring for backup quarterback Colt McCoy.
There goes our wonderful media again. Trying to stir up controversy that doesn't exist (yet).
I didn't hear anybody "clamoring" for McCoy at the stadium yesterday. There were plenty of groans when Weeden screwed up (understandably), but nobody around me was calling for McCoy. Honestly, despite the dismal showing, I didn't even hear much in the way of booing at the offense. Mostly I just heard excited fans hoping the Browns could hold on for a "W."
I haven't bothered listening to or reading much of the post-game stuff (too predictable), so maybe there's some "clamoring" for McCoy I missed. 
[color:"white"]"Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
-- Mark Twain [/color]
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I know I know (he cant be worse) but I think Weeden will look much better next week. Im actually glad its an away game. He wont have the expectations of a home crowd looking for him to great in his first NFL start or the crazy people booing and calling for Colt McCoy.
I think the whole team wanted to bring that victory home and end the streak of losses the same way that 3 rivers stadium became an albotross around Browns teams until Kosar finally nixed it.
The Knee jerk media will still be there but there should still be alot less pressure.
I do agree with Pit though he needs to play the same as when we gave Colt the starting job. He needed to play because he showed enough in his couple starts to have a closer look. 15 games from now if hes still slinging the ball 10 yds past or over the heads of recievers we will have our answer.
Little needs to make that catch though. I dont know how QB ratings work but if you add in a TD the yds gained 1 reception and take away an INT I think he would have a better rating then the 5.1
It also would add 7 pts to our score. It may have been enough.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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Quote:
There goes our wonderful media again. Trying to stir up controversy that doesn't exist (yet).
I didn't hear anybody "clamoring" for McCoy at the stadium yesterday.
Well they didn't have time to make the signs and the guys outside the stadium haven't had time to make their T- Shirts and hats yet.
From the looks of some other boards, if Weeden struggles in Cincy you can expect it at home for the Bills game.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,704
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,704 |
Quote:
I didn't hear anybody "clamoring" for McCoy at the stadium yesterday.
In the other thread, you said the fans were great where you were sitting. Now you're saying you didn't hear anyone clamoring for McCoy. So I have to ask...
Can we trade seats next game, because your experience sounds much better than mine.
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum The Brandon Weeden Disaster thread
moved - part 2
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