|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 |
Quote:
And none of that guarantees that he is going to be able to reduce penalties, make the right play calls, use his timeouts properly or his challenges.. none of it.
Aren't these things that can determined through the interview process? Give the interviewee certain game situations and ask him what he would do in those situations. Ask what he would do on 4th and 1 down 4 points with 6 minutes in the 4th quarter, ask when the right time to use a timeout is, etc.
I feel like Shurmur thinks he is right, he keeps making the wrong decisions over and over again. That is a huge problem. People make the excuse that "we have the benefit of seeing the result." But so does Shurmur and he does the wrong thing all the time.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693
Hall of Famer
|
|
OP
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693 |
Quote:
Since you obviously didn't read the article, let me help you.
Thanks, but I saw the presser, did you? I realize what you're referring to. You obviously still think you can believe what comes out of his mouth. Did you catch the part about relaxing on his deck in California when he got the news about Lerner selling the team? Or the part about spending some time on the beach, maybe Hawaii sipping umbrella drinks? Did you notice that he profusely thanked Lerner for his time here, wished he could have given him a winning product, but never once mentioned the fans. Or how about the fact that the one thing he might have been able to pull off here was coaching, yet he he never seriously entertained that notion, actually doing something that might have gotten the team going in the right direction. Now we're supposed to believe that he misses coaching? If you're waiting for him to start coaching again, don't hold your breath.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693
Hall of Famer
|
|
OP
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
you get a guy who is right where Shurmur was 2 years ago.
No, the new guys gets an owner who cares, a CEO who knows his job, a talented QB, a roster with decent talent, a draft with high picks including a FA period to round out a talented roster, and an entire off season to prepare. Big difference.
And none of that guarantees that he is going to be able to reduce penalties, make the right play calls, use his timeouts properly or his challenges.. none of it.
Basically he has all of the same stuff going into next season that Shurmur has... only probably 2 less years of experience.
And probably sound decision making ability and the support of the owner & CEO.
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 4,753
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 4,753 |
I did not see his presser, I read a few articles that all said pretty much the same thing. I guess that the reporters pulled different information than you're mentioning.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465 |
Quote:
So you get a guy who is right where Shurmur was 2 years ago..
I don't think it's that simple.
Shurmur is as clueless a HC as I've ever seen ... and that's saying something considering I lived through Crennel.
I have yet to see one single thing to make me think 'Hmm, maybe this guy could turn out alright'. Not one.
Mangini, at times, as bad as he was, gave me that thought. So did Crennel. And Butch. And Palmer.
Now, I never thought they were great coaches. But they at least gave me something at some time to say 'Maybe they have something going here', even if it was false hope.
If after 23 games, you haven't given the simplest shred of hope, I don't think it's coming.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
Quote:
Quote:
Right.
I would say Holmgren's biggest failure was letting Mangini stay. He let what he thought was right (letting Mangini stay because he won four straight games) get in the way of the actual right decision.
If Haslam/Banner make the determination that Heckert and Shurmur are the long term answer at general manager and head coach, then they should stay. If they aren't the long term answer, they need to go.
Banner should have a pretty good understanding on how Heckert and Shurmur operate from his prior experiences with them and the system they learned from.
All signs point to Haslam and Banners' minds already made up.
I agree with you pretty much except for the part where u said Holmgren should have let Gini go immediately... I Holmgren did it the right way. Who's to say that after firing Gini he goes to head coach another team and they turn out to win a Super Bowl.. Then he would have looked like an idiot for letting him go w/out seeing for himself what type of coach he was.
yes, he'd get run in the press for being an idiot, but truly the entire organization was never going to be on the same page with Mangini in place. we know that for sure now, but he could have explained it then too.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,979
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,979 |
Quote:
While the timeout then punt was unprofessional, if he decided that he shouldn't go for it, then why compound your mistake by going for it just because you called timeout? Whether or not going for it was the right thing to do is one thing, and it made me irritated as heck, too, but if he decided that going for it wasn't the right thing to do, it's better that he punted it away than going for it just to save face.
Are you aware that before the timout was called because the playclock was running down, they had Oneil Cousins on the field announced as an eligible receiver ...which would indicate they planned to try to run for the first down, and would indicate that the offense, not the punting unit, was in the huddle/lineup.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,456
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,456 |
Quote:
Quote:
Since you obviously didn't read the article, let me help you.
Thanks, but I saw the presser, did you? I realize what you're referring to. You obviously still think you can believe what comes out of his mouth. Did you catch the part about relaxing on his deck in California when he got the news about Lerner selling the team? Or the part about spending some time on the beach, maybe Hawaii sipping umbrella drinks? Did you notice that he profusely thanked Lerner for his time here, wished he could have given him a winning product, but never once mentioned the fans. Or how about the fact that the one thing he might have been able to pull off here was coaching, yet he he never seriously entertained that notion, actually doing something that might have gotten the team going in the right direction. Now we're supposed to believe that he misses coaching? If you're waiting for him to start coaching again, don't hold your breath.
I have not heard any of it nore have I read any of it but this crazyness of him coaching I dont understand at all. The man came here to build a winner. He may or may not have been successful given more time. His time ran out and he is going to help out if Haslam and Banner want him to.
He doesnt have a job anymore so what else can he do or say? Im sure he missed coaching he did it his whole life Alcohalics miss drinking too but that doesnt mean they will go back just because they say they miss it.
I dont get the fan comment? Whats he supposed to say I wanted to thank the fans.
That would sound hollow when alot of fans bashed him at every turn and cant see a big picture if its blocking their front door?
Now alot of us saw it but even some here never saw it until forced to with the owner change. Those are now saying well things were working but......place excuse on how mike failed here.
RANT ON- I dont give a crap if the people in charge never mention the fans until they are holding the SB trophy. Haslam is a fan first guy for sure, but so was Lerner he held conferences with fans to get their ideas and always wanted to please/appease(sp?) the fans. I say muck that, Let the fans figure it out once your done building a winner. I dont need an exec tellimg me im a good and loyal fan.
These guys are doing it for the money (1st and formost, from the top down), the pride, the glory and the press that comes with it. The fans are the groupies that give some of them a reason to hold their heads even higher then they should.Fans are like drunk people in bars, I need attention, I need to be noticed - Rant off
Anyway, back on topic I like alot of you wish Shurmur would give up playcalling. I dont see it happening and I dont see him lasting past this year.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761 |
Quote:
We have the benefit of hindsight. It wasn't the right move.
I'm mostly using that (Holmgren keeping Mangini) as a reason why the new ownership shouldn't hold on to Shurmur (if it is determined he isn't the long term solution).
We have seen that you should get the guys you want in place as quickly as possible. If you keep guys around for the wrong reasons it only results in a wasted year.
Sure, and I agree 100% on keeping Manginin being Holmgren's biggest mistake, because he decided as a coach instead of a president with a LONG TERM plan, we now would be in year 3, not 2 of the REAL re-build...and here's the kicker. Mangini, all personal bias aside...no matter how much you liked or disliked him, just wasn't a FIT...he ran the 3-4 with heavy guys, Holmgren and Heckert come from the 4-3 with speed over size. Even on Offense Mangini preferred grunt OL with run 1st mentality...the WCO otoh is, again, a 180 on that
Now you use this analogy for the current regime and I think it's not accurate...if you dont believe in their COMPETENCE...yes, then fire them...but philosophically they're from the same side....hell, Banner even SAID so in his presser (building through the draft, keeping your own players etc)..that's EXACTLY what Heckert's been doing and Shurmur and staff have done a great job developing those players...I hate Shurmur's gameday management...from play calling in critical situations and philosophy as a whole (too pass happy, although I understand with a QB like Weeden it makes more sense to pass 3 times with 10yds to go then have one shot on 3rd and short, but still he needs more patience with the run)....
that all said, if I was presented with the choice of keeping the entire staff and Heckert OR blowing all things up...I think short and mid term (and I "believe" even long term, mostly because of Heckert) staying Pat (pun intended) is the right thing to do
In a vacuum I want Shurmur fired and replaced but that's not how a president has to think and make decisions..problem is, I don't think neither Haslam nor Banner have the competence to make this kind of decision and they strike me as too EGO-heavy to be as nice as Holmgren was with Mangini....man we fans have to endure some crappy timing aren't we? Back then we needed those 2 hee-haws, now we need a more level-headed decision maker as the situations demanded for those calls...back to my 1st point: we just never get it right here on those big decisions....who knows, maybe we "luck" into a Haslam "gut feeling" call and he keeps the guys, would cut him a lot of slack if he did
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 |
The thing is, if Shurmur and Heckert are kept, they will always be on the chopping block because they aren't Haslam's guys. Continuity is what we need, but continuity with the wrong people is almost as bad as firing the head coach every two years. (Like I said in my earlier post, I'm not saying Shurmur and Heckert will be fired or I want them to be fired. Just think they eventually will be. Also, I think Shurmur is good from Monday through Saturday as well, he just can't make the right decisions on Sunday.) Quote:
[Haslam and Banner] strike me as too EGO-heavy to be as nice as Holmgren was with Mangini
I don't know about the ego thing. They haven't been around long enough for me to make that determination. But I hope they are not nice. This is Haslam's team. If he thinks the current people are not the right people, he has to get rid of them. If he is not on the same page philosophically with them, he has to get rid of them. If he does not get along with them, has to get rid of them.
We need everyone rowing in the same direction. Heckert and Shurmur may have the same team building philosophies as Haslam and Banner, but they might not get along. They might get along, but be bad at their jobs. I'd much rather them fire these guys and get some people that they want then keep around people to be nice.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,960
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,960 |
Quote:
The thing is, if Shurmur and Heckert are kept, they will always be on the chopping block because they aren't Haslam's guys.
Being a new owner (at least a majority owner) does haslam have guys? he wasn't part of the Steelers when "the Chin" was there so he's not one of his guys. I think it was Mourg that said yesterday that the chances of Pagano coming back are good (I heard differently but that's another story) so maybe, since Bruce Arians is a former Steeler coordinator and they've had stuggles offensively since he's left and he's done pretty well with the Colts, he might be a Haslam guy.
But outside of him, who would be a Haslam guy? The answer is, whoever he picks becomes a Haslam guy. So with no experience in that arena, who does he really know.
But here's the thing, Haslam has experience hiring folks, but not for Head Coaching jobs. For that matter, neither does Banner.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
Quote:
But here's the thing, Haslam has experience hiring folks, but not for Head Coaching jobs. For that matter, neither does Banner.
Considering that the average tenure of an NFL coach is barely 2.5 years.... not many people are good at hiring head coaches....
I have long maintained that the problem is that most guys go in looking for a "football guy".. a guy thats great with the Xs and Os.. and that is absolutely not what a HC needs to be. Hopefully Haslam understands that.
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 |
By "his guys" I meant people he hires. Not people he is familiar with in the league.
That might be a good thing for us by the way. Haslam shouldn't have a set roster guys he has to pick from (Holmgren/LaMonte).
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 62
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 62 |
FWIW..... Haslam was spotted at Buckeyes practice today so perhaps the hunt has begun. 
"Nobody in football should be called a genius. A genius is a guy like Norman Einstein" ~Joe Theismann~
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
Quote:
FWIW.....
Haslam was spotted at Buckeyes practice today so perhaps the hunt has begun.
it worked for Paul Brown
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 817
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 817 |
Quote:
Quote:
FWIW.....
Haslam was spotted at Buckeyes practice today so perhaps the hunt has begun.
it worked for Paul Brown
You guys would all go absolutely insane with rage if Paul Brown were HC now. He was not exactly an easy man to like. Many of his players, even the ones who were his friends, hated playing for him. He was a ruthless and driven man who pushed his players for every last measure of performance. I had a friend, recently deceased, who played for him in the Navy and then with the Browns. He considered him a dear friend. And he also hated playing for him. The Cleveland press would erupt in spontaneous combustion if his kind were hired.
What everyone wants now is a super nice guy who knows football perfectly, never makes a mistake, and can transform any bum into an all-pro. Paul Brown was not such a man.
"Let people think this is a dumpster fire," - Mike Pettine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
FWIW.....
Haslam was spotted at Buckeyes practice today so perhaps the hunt has begun.
it worked for Paul Brown
You guys would all go absolutely insane with rage if Paul Brown were HC now. He was not exactly an easy man to like. Many of his players, even the ones who were his friends, hated playing for him. He was a ruthless and driven man who pushed his players for every last measure of performance. I had a friend, recently deceased, who played for him in the Navy and then with the Browns. He considered him a dear friend. And he also hated playing for him. The Cleveland press would erupt in spontaneous combustion if his kind were hired.
What everyone wants now is a super nice guy who knows football perfectly, never makes a mistake, and can transform any bum into an all-pro. Paul Brown was not such a man.
yeah well, back then they could get away with it. Now 90% of your players would probably walk out or request trades if they had to endure that treatment, nevermind the press and the fans views.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
Tom Coughlin? Bill Belichik?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
Quote:
Tom Coughlin? Bill Belichik?
No where near the same as Paul Brown's days of TC and practices. The NFLPA, today's players, and the overall change in society frowns upon that style these days.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
Quote:
Quote:
Tom Coughlin? Bill Belichik?
No where near the same as Paul Brown's days of TC and practices. The NFLPA, today's players, and the overall change in society frowns upon that style these days.
well, if Paul Brown were in the NFL today, he would go right up to that line, probably dance over it a little bit and demand his players don't complain about it.
until he won a SB, people would whine and it'd be news, but once he did, he'd be a great coach.
Coughlin and Belichick great examples of that.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,201
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,201 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Tom Coughlin? Bill Belichik?
No where near the same as Paul Brown's days of TC and practices. The NFLPA, today's players, and the overall change in society frowns upon that style these days.
well, if Paul Brown were in the NFL today, he would go right up to that line, probably dance over it a little bit and demand his players don't complain about it.
and the NFLPA would get called, and then he'd get shut down, the media would crucify him, talk radio would be lambasting him, he wouldn't be given a 2nd chance, and every shot of him on TV would be one where somebody gets to conclude he's a crappy coach because they think he looks confused or clueless... and some coach in Tennesee would publicly wonder "what the heck is going on up there?".
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
he might. until he won a SB. again, same thing happened to Coughlin. the NFLPA stepped in a couple times with him, people called for his job, people complained anonymously to the media. then, he goes and wins a SB and all of a sudden everything is rosy. things start to get dicey again last year, and he wins another SB and noone is talking about how gruff he is being (no, it's he turned over a new leaf  )
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,656
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,656 |
Quote:
then, he goes and wins a SB and all of a sudden everything is rosy. things start to get dicey again last year, and he wins another SB and noone is talking about how gruff he is being (no, it's he turned over a new leaf )
Tom Coughlin is not the same coach he was 10-15 years ago. Yes, he's still firey and still more old school than new, but he HAS mellowed;adapted in order to better deal with today's players.. For better or worse (and I think worse), today's athlete cannot handle coaching styles like Noll, Brown, Lomardi, etc. I'd love nothing better than a guy like those I just listed, but in all honesty, I don't think they could coach that way in today's NFL.
I agree that Coughlin and Bellichick are closer to those guys than they are to being coddlers, but it's still not the same as even 20 years ago.
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,842
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,842 |
jc...
I will be shocked if Shurmur is retained by Banner...I think he's toast.
Who the Browns hire as HC?...that is a problem because of Banner's history of conflicts with coaching staff and players.
Those looking for a high profile replacement...I seriously doubt that a Gruden or Cowher would work under Banner.
Banner has never been in charge of the football side of a franchise. Banner is an experienced "bean counter", but a rookie when it comes to managing the football side of a franchise.
One way to solve the Banner problem would be if Haslam moves Banner back to the business side of the franchise and someone else is hired to run the football side of the franchise. If that happens, high profile prospects like Cowher or Gruden might be willing to come to Cleveland.
But IMO, Shurmur is gone at the end of the season...
One last thing...I sure hope Haslam doesn't get a crazy idea like hiring ex Tennessee Vols head coach, Phil Fulmer.
I understand Haslam's love for his Tennessee Vols...but the Browns don't need a burned out college coach who has no experience coaching in the NFL.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
Quote:
Who the Browns hire as HC?...that is a problem because of Banner's history of conflicts with coaching staff and players.
Maybe.. maybe not.
Quote:
Those looking for a high profile replacement...I seriously doubt that a Gruden or Cowher would work under Banner.
Many coaching jobs have come and gone since those guys left and neither has come back.... if they don't come here, I seriously doubt it is because of Banner....
Quote:
One way to solve the Banner problem would be if Haslam moves Banner back to the business side of the franchise and someone else is hired to run the football side of the franchise. If that happens, high profile prospects like Cowher or Gruden might be willing to come to Cleveland.
It's only the "Banner problem" in the minds of some people like you... the guy hasn't even unpacked the boxes in his office yet and you are already saying it's a problem that needs to be dealt with... no wonder the Cleveland media writes the way it does, people like you are reading it. You are just laying the ground work to blame our next head coaching failure on Banner aren't you? If either of those guys decide to come back next year (Cowher, Gruden, etc) and go somewhere else, then you might have a point.. maybe. But if they stay where they are and don't come back at all.. then you can't blame that on Banner. Or if we go get a college coach or a coordinator not everybody is familiar with, I'm sure you will say that's because it's the best Banner could do. You are already planning your reasons for why he is a failure.. sad.
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,521
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,521 |
Pretty sure that Cowher coming here is contingent on him finding a suitable residence in Strongsville.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Quote:
Who the Browns hire as HC?...that is a problem because of Banner's history of conflicts with coaching staff and players.
What history of conflict with coaching staff are you referring to?
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 5,620
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 5,620 |
Quote:
Pretty sure that Cowher coming here is contingent on him finding a suitable residence in Strongsville.
If it's within walking distance of Cleats then I would be OK with it
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,528
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,528 |
I would assume he's talking about Reid, but I don't know if one incident comprises a history.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
Quote:
I would assume he's talking about Reid, but I don't know if one incident comprises a history.
I would assume so as well since Rhodes and Reid are the only two coaches he's ever been involved with... funny how he was executive VP when Reid was hired but mac won't give him any credit for actually hiring Reid... but then after 13 years, 8 double digit win seasons, 9 playoff appearances, 3 NFC title games, 1 super bowl appearance later... all of the sudden Banner was a big problem.... I sure hope we don't have problems like that. 
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Quote:
I would assume he's talking about Reid, but I don't know if one incident comprises a history.
That's exactly where I was going with it, dude. 
Taking this even further, if Banner did have conflicts with the "coaching staff" (meaning one person  ) but that "coaching staff" has made mistakes with all the power they'd (he'd) received with their (his) new-found power and gets fired, was Banner really wrong?
I think if we are going to judge Banner based on what's happened in Philly, I would say it's too soon to accurately and fairly judge. Why? Because Reid wanted all the control and got it. So let's see what Reid does with it and judge whether or not the Eagles did the right thing by choosing Reid over Banner.
What's going on in Philly? How is Reid doing with absolute power?
He just fired his DC in spite of them reportedly ranking 12th in the league in defense. They came out and got blown out the very next game.
Mike Vick, the $100 million dollar man Reid put into place, is on the verge of being benched by a back-up nobody.
Well, let's just cut to the chase and say that it's becoming apparent that Andy Reid's 14-year run as coach, and 1-year run as the Grand Poobah is about to come to an end. The owner has stated another season of failure won't be tolerated. Unless the Eagles go on a huge tear, and there's very little reason to believe they will, Reid will be fired.
I say if people are going to judge Banner, they need to wait until after the season is over to see how things played out in Philly.
I know the great fear is that he's going to have big input on personnel decisions. Contract negotiations for a new regime does not constitute big input on personnel decisions. If it comes to be that he has a hand in choosing who comes here, then we may have a problem. If it comes to be that he has to approve the deals made on personnel brought here by other people, it's a non-factor. But to judge the overall job Banner did in Philly right now would be selling Banner and the integrity of the judgement process short. Gotta wait until this year plays out in Philly.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761 |
Quote:
I know the great fear is that he's going to have big input on personnel decisions. Contract negotiations for a new regime does not constitute big input on personnel decisions. If it comes to be that he has a hand in choosing who comes here, then we may have a problem. If it comes to be that he has to approve the deals made on personnel brought here by other people, it's a non-factor.
Umm...really? Because Mangini had to "approve the deals made on personnel" intended by Kokinis here too...there's actually a factual story about this I already posted half a dozen times on here. I think it's a BIG problem if Banner has the power "to approve/veto" stuff he has no clue about...be prepared for a muppet GM Toad, because this has all the makings of it
That said, there are 2 no name guys I could be ok with...1 is from within with our Director of College Scouting John Spytek, the other is the Giants' one Marc Ross, who was the Eagles DoCS 10 years ago at age 27, 10 years later and with the draft success the Giants had, he looks like ready for the next step (their FO/GM are what I call "value-whores" on draft day, very similar style to Ozzie, strictly BPA...love the style)...so there ARE ties. So, if H&H absolutely feel urged to change for the sake of their egos I hope they keep the WCO, the 4-3 and promote one of those GMs...that's probably the only "tear down" scenario that will keep me watching Browns football in 2013...otoh, if they do this, it's less consquential of a "tear down" and I might be even more angry why they chose to fire everyone...that scenario would probably be a giveaway that it's all about egos only...we will see.
Oh, and just because Reid might be wrong, that doesn't mean Banner would have done better/be right...logic 101...hopefully
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
Quote:
be prepared for a muppet GM Toad, because this has all the makings of it
You've said this a number of times and I can't take it any more.. it's PUPPET... a leader in title with no real power is a PUPPET.. not a muppet. 
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,201
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,201 |
Quote:
Quote:
be prepared for a muppet GM Toad, because this has all the makings of it
You've said this a number of times and I can't take it any more.. it's PUPPET... a leader in title with no real power is a PUPPET.. not a muppet.
Unless that puppet is controlled by the ghost of Jim Henson, or Frank Oz.... or has ever been associated with Fraggle Rock.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
Speaking of Fraggle Rock reminded me.. I sat and youtubed old Schoolhouse Rock videos for the kids last night...
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761 |
Quote:
Quote:
be prepared for a muppet GM Toad, because this has all the makings of it
You've said this a number of times and I can't take it any more.. it's PUPPET... a leader in title with no real power is a PUPPET.. not a muppet.
Well, he's both.....I know what a muppet is for Britains and that's exactly what I mean....american english isn't a world language, you know?
Google it 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
Quote:
Well, he's both.....I know what a muppet is for Britains and that's exactly what I mean....american english isn't a world language, you know?
Google it
Does this look like Britain to you? Now let's get off this topic and go back to talking about American Football.
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Quote:
Umm...really? Because Mangini had to "approve the deals made on personnel" intended by Kokinis here too...there's actually a factual story about this I already posted half a dozen times on here.
That was a power-hungry coach who controlled the people in the front office.
This is a CEO who handles contract negotiations and sits in a custodial role to make sure that the out-going regime doesn't take insane risks to try and save their asses.
You can't begin to compare the two scenarios.
Quote:
I think it's a BIG problem if Banner has the power "to approve/veto" stuff he has no clue about...be prepared for a muppet GM Toad, because this has all the makings of it
I won't prepare for Ocar the Grouch as a GM  but I do agree that we'll be in trouble if Banner has the power to make moves he doesn't have a history of understanding.
I've seen zero proof one way or another which would indicate he's going to have that power, so I see no reason to fear anything at this point.
I'm just glad that Lerner is finally out of the picture, and that Holmgren the meddler and micromanager is packing his crap up as we speak.
Now as for Heckert, I'd rather he not go anywhere, though I would completely understand if he get shown the door. I view that as a solid trade-off: If losing Heckert meant finally dumping Lerner and Holmgren, hey, that's a trade-off I'd have taken 10 times out of ten.
As for the names you've thrown out there, I've no opinion one way or another. I'll wait until the chips start hitting the table before I see what hand I'd play.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 75,222
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 75,222 |
j/c According to Damon's "Noll comparison"......... I'm thinking he is suggesting seven! 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 1
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 1 |
Shurmur will have to win out and/or make the playoffs to keep his job. Haslem's face said it all during the colts game. Shurmur has continued to prove to us he cannot manage the clock. We weekly have to burn 1-2 TO to avoid delay of games after big plays. And for every well schemed drive we have we follow up with an UGLY 3 and out. He just does not have the make up of a HC in the NFL
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum How Many Wins Will it Take to Save
Shurmur's Job?
|
|
