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Every week, it seems that Brad Childress’ press conference delivers some peculiar nugget about his eccentric, old-school coaching style. This week’s special: He never had seen Josh Gordon play before he officially became a Cleveland Brown:
(On what he saw in Gordon before they picked him in the Supplemental Draft)- “I never saw a snap of him. I got off a cruise boat and somebody said, ‘We signed Josh Gordon,’ and I said, ‘Who’s Josh Gordon?’”
(On if he’s being serious of about not knowing who Gordon was)- “Honestly, yeah. That was Tom (Heckert) and Pat (Shurmur).”
(On where he went on his cruise)- “Where did I go? What do they call it? Western or Eastern Caribbean, I can’t remember right now. I don’t know my islands very well, but it was my wife and I.”
Childress did also mention that Gordon has evolved and improved significantly lately, but it wasn’t clear what the coach’s initial expectations may have been. Never change, Chilly, never change.
Link
Didn't see this posted anywhere. If I missed it, feel free to remove.
While it's certainly not the end of the world this just looks bad and has an all too familiar "Cleveland Browns-esque" incompetence feel to it. I'm certainly glad they brought Josh in, but so much for the whole staff coming together, doing extensive research and discussions and everyone being on the same page.
Thoughts?
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Yeah, that's definitely unacceptable.
I'm disappointed to read that.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Yeah, that's definitely unacceptable.
I'm disappointed to read that.
Hang on, I've got Haslam on the line. He wants to get your full take on this. 
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I'm lost. Why would it matter that an assistant coach who happens to be on a cruise when the supplement draft is taking place hasn't seen a player? It's not like he can give an opinion on the player when he isn't even there when they scout the guy.
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I'm lost. Why would it matter that an assistant coach who happens to be on a cruise when the supplement draft is taking place hasn't seen a player? It's not like he can give an opinion on the player when he isn't even there when they scout the guy.
If a team drafts a guy (with a 2nd rd. pick no less) and the offensive coordinator hasn't even seen the player, doesn't even know the player - there's an issue somewhere.
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I'm lost. Why would it matter that an assistant coach who happens to be on a cruise when the supplement draft is taking place hasn't seen a player? It's not like he can give an opinion on the player when he isn't even there when they scout the guy.
If a team drafts a guy (with a 2nd rd. pick no less) and the offensive coordinator hasn't even seen the player, doesn't even know the player - there's an issue somewhere.
You could be right but I dont see it as a big deal. The kid didnt play last year, Applied for the sup draft this year. So that means Chilly would have had to been scouting him 2 years ago (the only year he played I think) which he wasnt even here.
Its a non-issue to me. Its Heckert and the scouting staffs job to identify these guys.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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I'd rather Chilly not know who the guy is because he's doing his job on a weekly basis and not just going, "I saw this guy make an awesome catch on Sportscenter last night. Put him on the top of the big board!" Add in that he hasn't played in a year, and who could blame him for not knowing who he is? Coaches shouldn't be too involved in scouting, if at all.
Non issue, really.
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
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I'd rather Chilly not know who the guy is because he's doing his job on a weekly basis and not just going, "I saw this guy make an awesome catch on Sportscenter last night. Put him on the top of the big board!" Add in that he hasn't played in a year, and who could blame him for not knowing who he is? Coaches shouldn't be too involved in scouting, if at all.
Non issue, really.
To you and nick - I think the issue could be that even if Childress hadn't seen a single snap of him, didn't know who he was - he IS our o.c........and the team drafted an offensive player .......without even CONSULTING the offensive coordinator? Without even saying "hey, coach, we're thinking of drafting this guy, what do you think?"
Lack of communication.
OR
Childress is our o.c. in name only.
I don't know much about the island or islands he was on/at - but I just have to think that they have phones there............
Bottom line, it just seems odd that we drafted an offensive player and our o.c. had exactly no input, and no knowledge about it.
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Childress is our o.c. in name only.
That's my guess. Still not sure what he does here. We know its not playcalling.
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I don't think Chilly is complaining, he came back with a new present under the tree.
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!
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How would Chilly know who Gordon was if the kid had not played in 2 years? Tom Heckert and the scouts were doing their job. It isn't that complicated
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Your OC shouldn't be in the dark about players that are being scouted and potentially targeted.
It's called communication. Communication is the king to success in all walks of life and business.
It's not that complicated to understand why this should be disappointing at best and concerning at worst (to what level I have no idea).
There have been several stories about Haslam the successful business man. A common theme runs through those stories ... communication ... he's mentioned group think ... he's mentioned listening to those he's put in charge at the top ... he's gone into stores and communicated with store level managers and employees and listened to their suggestions. Communication can be a make or break for success sometimes.
I think this is disappointing to read. It's almost like Chilly is kind of on the outside. The truth is he should be a part of these discussions.
I'm not ready to hang anyone for this or blast them for it. It's just disappointing to read something like this to me.
Hopefully, it's not symptomatic of something bigger.
CalDawg, can you pass this message on please? Thank you much.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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I'm lost. Why would it matter that an assistant coach who happens to be on a cruise when the supplement draft is taking place hasn't seen a player? It's not like he can give an opinion on the player when he isn't even there when they scout the guy.
exactly... doesn't bother me at all...
<><
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doesn't bother me..
i just want him in the game.
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doesn't bother me..
i just want him in the game.
yes and yes
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Hopefully, it's not symptomatic of something bigger.
CalDawg, can you pass this message on please? Thank you much.
He said, "Rish who?" Then said he doesn't really care, he just wants to win.
For your peace of mind, this is only symptomatic of Chilly being on a cruise, Gordon declaring on July second, and the draft being held 10 days later. Nothing to see here, move it along. 
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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For your peace of mind, this is only symptomatic of Chilly being on a cruise, Gordon declaring on July second, and the draft being held 10 days later. Nothing to see here, move it along.
Exactly.
If anything it shows that Heckert, Shurmur and the scouting staff were on top of things. Seems to me that's a good thing.
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You may be right and it's much ado about nothing.
I'm ok with that perspective and having my mind changed. That's the beauty of keeping an open mind.
Plus, you're a good dude Otto. I tend to listen more when you type.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Haven't read this thread yet...saw, this...
hilarious...good job Brad. Great scouting...
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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Haven't read this thread yet...saw, this...
hilarious...good job Brad. Great scouting...
Good chance once you do you will feel its nothing.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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I'm lost. Why would it matter that an assistant coach who happens to be on a cruise when the supplement draft is taking place hasn't seen a player? It's not like he can give an opinion on the player when he isn't even there when they scout the guy.
exactly... doesn't bother me at all...
+1
I want the GM and scouts evaluating talent while our coaches coach our current players. If the GM needs to ask the OC his opinion on a WR for the supplemental draft, he's a moron with no sack. He either passes the grade or he doesn't. That's their job.
Not only do I not have a problem with it, I want the two sides doing their own jobs.
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but when the OC is on his 2 week vacation with his wife in the Bahamas and a WR files for the supplemental draft on day2 of that vacation, it is imperative that Holmgren himself fly out there and make sure to ask Childress his opinion even if Chilly wouldn't have scouted him since he his only year in college was a sophomore and NFL HCs (which he was at the time) don't bother with non-eligible for draft players (that's the scouts)
we.must.have.outrage!!!
now where is that purple font button
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I'm lost. Why would it matter that an assistant coach who happens to be on a cruise when the supplement draft is taking place hasn't seen a player? It's not like he can give an opinion on the player when he isn't even there when they scout the guy.
If a team drafts a guy (with a 2nd rd. pick no less) and the offensive coordinator hasn't even seen the player, doesn't even know the player - there's an issue somewhere.
That might be case if it was the regular draft. But this was a supplemental draft that the NFL decided to have while Childress was vacationing on a cruise ship. What were the Browns supposed to do tell Childress to come home and give his opinion on some WR they might take even though A. He's not the head coach. B. He doesn't even call the plays and C. Its Heckert's job to scout the players and bring in the right people?
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It's a total non issue, great job Browns, great job Childress. Noway should Heckert be trying to gain a consensus before pulling the trigger. That would just leave too much time for 2nd guessing and missed opportunities. full stop! There has to be a better way. 
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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How would Chilly know who Gordon was if the kid had not played in 2 years? Tom Heckert and the scouts were doing their job. It isn't that complicated
Right here. How many on here really even knew who Josh Gordon was until almost right before we drafted him?
I'm quite sure Chilly doesn't have the final say on who is drafted and in the chain of command, he isn't all that high up.
I think it's H&H who assemble the talent, not the OC. They are given the talent to work with by their bosses.
Much ado about nothing IMO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Glad I could talk you down off that ledge.....
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I'm not sure I see the issue here. Unless I totally misunderstand things, Brad Childress reports to Shurmur who reports to Heckert, who's job it is to find talent and get it on the field for Childress and shurmer to coach and teach how to play the game. Is there anything wrong with what I just said? No. So why do they NEED to consult Childress about a second round, Supplimental draft pick who, I might add, has started to show signs of being a star in the league. Now, couple that with this little tidbit of info Quote:
(On what he saw in Gordon before they picked him in the Supplemental Draft)- “I never saw a snap of him. I got off a cruise boat and somebody said, ‘We signed Josh Gordon,’ and I said, ‘Who’s Josh Gordon?’”
Childress was on a cruise (read that as a vacation) when the decision was made. I'm ABSOLUTLY sure they would have shown him film of Gordon if he were here. But there is no real reason to do so.
Let me repeat, it's heckerts job to get talent and thus far, with few exception, he's done a pretty good job. So again, I don't see the issue.
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It's a non-issue to me.
It's not Chilly's job to pick players. It's Chilly's job to help coordinate the offense.
Let the personnel men do their job, and let the coaches coach. I wouldn't be the least bit upset if Shurmur told the press that he wasn't involved with Gordon or never saw him play. It's not his job to approve or disapprove. He's just a coach. The professional personnel men have their job to do. Let each guy do the thing he's supposed to do instead of the thing he's less qualified to do.
That's how Holmgren has gotten himself into this mess. He's fancied himself a personnel man when his track record of that has been a failure. He was a HOF coach but as it turns out he should have left it there. In that vein, I don't want our coaches deciding which players to take. It's their job to coach the players the personnel men acquire.
Too many chef's in the kitchen cause problems. This is not an issue to me.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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j/c
Well, it seems the consensus here is that this is no big deal - and I want to say, I didn't think it was a BIG deal, but I thought it seemed odd that an offensive coordinator not only had no clue what the team was thinking as far as the supplemental draft, but also had no clue or never been in on talks about "hey, there's this guy we might decide to get, here's his name. "....etc. That type of thing.
Not that Childress' opinion would've swayed the team one way or the other, it just seems odd to me.
Like I said, the consensus here is "so what?" So, I stand corrected. I am not, and never have been, involved in exactly what happens, who makes decisions, etc. All I have is my common sense, which apparently failed me here.
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Arch, I'll tell you something I read in this thread which I hadn't considered. It's a good point. Gordon most likely wasn't on the draft radar of most teams, and therefore wasn't heavily scouted. That would have made the timing of Chilly getting involved less-likely.
After thinking about this a little more, it would be prudent to really analyze what Chilly's role is with the Browns.
I could be wrong here as I'm going off memory, but I think the hierarchy is Holmgren, then Heckert, then Shurmur, and then Chilly, whom Shurmur brought in to help with the offense. I may be looking at this wrong, but that gives me the indication Chilly wasn't brought here to help with personnel decisions at all, and that his sole job is to be the architect and orchestrate the offense so that Shurmur can concentrate on other things. With the way I saw things laid out, knowing that Shurmur is still calling plays, Chilly isn't on the same level as most of the other OC's in the league because they call plays. So to me, Chilly falls somewhere between a normal OC and the QB's coach. That's somewhat of a low-hanging fruit, and I wouldn't want that guy having a say in who is brought in and who isn't. Just too many opinions muddying up the waters.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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I would think that if the element of time not being a factor, which it seems regarding Gordon and the supplemental draft it was, then Chilly would be asked his opinion as would be others on that side of the ball.
Chilly, having been an OC and a Head Coach, is not likely to be considered "low-hanging fruit" on any team's staff regarding anything having to do with offense, including player evaluations.
It sure reads to me that the timing of Gordon coming out, the execution of the draft and Chilly's vacation made it difficult to involve him at all. Regardless, as you or someone has already said, there are those whose job it is to choose players and those whose job it is to coach them.
In an organization like this one, "The Packer Way", everybody's opinions count as information and food for thought but the final decision is done by those whose job it is to make the final decision. To not consider other's opinions is a dangerous "Butch Davis-like" mistake.
Due to the timing Chilly was simply out of the loop.
That's how I see it and it's no big deal one way or another.
Now, if he never had a say regarding any player being considered I'd count that as disrespect toward a guy with vast experience at the highest levels and a severe oversight by an organization claiming to be on the same page throughout the chain of command.
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Chilly, having been an OC and a Head Coach, is not likely to be considered "low-hanging fruit" on any team's staff regarding anything having to do with offense, including player evaluations.
I don't know that his past has any bearing on the job he was brought here to do. If he was brought here to carry gatorade bottles from the locker-room to the bench, his input in personnel decisions wouldn't be required.  While a gross over-exaggeration my point is that I don't think he was brought here to give the input he had when he was a HC or a play-calling OC. I think he was brought here almost in the role of a WCO-specific consultant whose sole job was to help install an offense where Shurmur would still be calling plays.
I think a guy who makes a great example of this is our very own Gil Haskel. He was Holmgren's WCO guru for years, having installed and run his offenses at various places. Even with all that knowledge, Haskel wasn't brought here to help pick players for the offense.
It just depends on what role a guy is hired to do. I could be wrong, but I don't believe Chilly was brought here to give tons of input on players. I think he was just brought here to take the load off of Shurmur as it pertains to the offense.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Isn't it the job of the OC to design the offense? Aka, design the plays, the routes, the blocking schemes? It's also his job to put a "game plan" in place during the week for an upcoming opponent. We know Shurmur helps and actually calls the plays but still. That is unless Chilly's role is significantly less than that, as Toad suggested....in which case you could ask wtf it is he DOES here?
To that end, the OC should have an idea of the skill-set of each of his players and the best way to utilize their skills to our advantage. Part of that is having a big picture for the type/scheme of players we have, so they can all complement each other like a well oiled machine, to help implement and successfully accomplish those goals and schemes.
How it makes "no difference" whether the guy who plans your offense knows anything about the skill-set or how a player would fit into his scheme and offense or not, is beyond me.
I KNOW it's not his job to acquire players. It's not his job to scout players. But man...if it was my job to acquire players I'd sure as heck want to make sure the players I was actually picking would a) fit in with the other players b) fit in with the coaches c) have a skill set that fit in with the coaches schemes. Because after all, as a FO guy, your success is dependent on the performance of the players and coaches. Phil Savage did a great job of acquiring "talent". Too bad it never jived with anything the coaches wanted. That worked out GREAT for all involved.
I know he was on a cruise, but man how hard is it to pick up a phone and send a guy a few videos and scouting reports and get a "hey give us your general thoughts on this guy in the next couple days" type of thing? Sure, his opinion could get over-ruled, but I'd think that line of communication should at least be explored.
Maybe that's just me though....
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I'm with you Graff and that was kind of my point.
But I really don't know how NFL teams operate.
Most on here are suggesting that NFL team coaches and scouts/GM operate in a vacuum, completely independent of each other.
That seems odd to me.
In relation to Gordon specifically, I can see how the timing would be a factor, however.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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I'm sure Childress would have been asked his opinion had he been in Cleveland but with him being on a cruise and not having a big say in the choosing of players i find this a non-issue.
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