DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns to Streamline Play Calling

We'll see. It seems like there have been problems all along with getting the plays in on time, but it didn;t really blow up till yesterday. Anyway, should be interesting to see what changes.

This article has some stuff from the Ravens game as well, but I thought that it was more about moving forward than anything else.

Pat Shurmur says Cleveland Browns will streamline play calling after loss to Baltimore Ravens | cleveland.com
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2012/11/cleveland_browns_coach_pat_shu_46.html#incart_2box

BEREA, Ohio -- Browns coach Pat Shurmur said Monday afternoon that the team will streamline its strategy for getting plays called to avoid the problems it had in Sunday's 25-15 loss to the Ravens.

The Browns were forced to burn three timeouts because they couldn't get plays in on time. Quarterback Brandon Weeden, asked about the mix-ups, said, "I have no comment on that."

Shurmur said he and offensive coordinator Brad Childress, who's up in the booth, collaborate on the plays and then Shurmur relays them to Weeden. But the Browns have struggled at times to get the right personnel on the field and get the play called on time.

"We need to be better at that," Shurmur said. "I'll take full responsibility for all of it. We can streamline some things."

He said the club will use this week's bye week to correct that problem and others, such as third-down-and-1 offense and red-zone scoring.

The Browns have tumbled to 31st in the NFL in red-zone offense, just one ahead of the last-place Chiefs. The Browns have scored just six touchdowns in 18 trips inside the red zone for 33.3 percent. Their 18 trips are tied for second-fewest; and their six TDs are tied for fewest.

For comparison's sake, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers have 24 red-zone TDs, and the Denver Broncos have 20.

On Sunday, the Browns made five trips inside the red zone and came away with only five field goals. They failed to take any shots into the end zone, and their lone TD inside the 20 was nullified by an illegal-formation penalty against Chris Ogbonnaya.

Shurmur acknowledged that on a few of those red-zone plays, "There were a couple more that we could've been a little more aggressive or heroic with," but stressed he doesn't want interceptions.

Shurmur also agreed that Weeden needs to improve in the fourth quarter, where he is 32nd among 33 quarterbacks with a 63.2 rating. In the crucial final period, he's completed 54.8 percent of his passes with three touchdowns and five interceptions.

"He needs to get better there," said Shurmur.

Shurmur also said he'd be open to a different play in the fourth quarter, when he went for it on 4th and 2 from his own 28 with two timeouts left and just under four minutes remaining with the Browns trailing, 22-15. Weeden's pass sailed over receiver Greg Little's hands on the play, and the Ravens went on to kick a field goal that produced the final margin.

"I'd consider doing something different if I can guarantee getting the ball back," he said. "I (also) need to give Weeden a better play there."

Shurmur added that on Ogbonnaya's TD-killing penalty, the coaches on the sidelines were shouting at him to take a step back, but that when he tried to do so, it was too late.

He said he's also asking the NFL for clarification the two penalties against receiver Josh Gordon, one for pass interference and one for unnecessary roughness. He said he'll also ask for an explanation on the costly 15-yard roughing-the-passer call against T.J. Ward, who was trying to chop the ball out of Joe Flacco's hand on the game-winning touchdown drive.

This to me means we're going back to Shurmur calling plays.

IMO I don't think he can handle anyone else running HIS offense...

25 games into your head coaching career...

If this means Shurmur is leaving out the middle man, then just put the gun to my head now.

Childress should be making all calls, and relaying them directly to Weeden. i was so irritated at the playcalling and wasting timeouts- which burned us at the end of the half.

So they went into the season knowing they had a clunky and bad play calling system?

It's like these guys are paid to make stupid decisions.

His butt's on the hot seat and it's his offense that couldn't get into the red-zone... i'm not surprised at this at all and actually think it's a smart idea on his part... we'll see if it works or not...

I saw onetime during the game Weeden went to the sideline and said something to shurmur and you could see shurmur go.. I dont know. He should be fired yesterday

Uh-huh.

All the horses have already escaped out the barn-door. It's a little too late to close it now, Pat...

Please,
After looking at this article and the Rich Gannon article, its apparent that Shurmur does not trust Weeds:

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Shurmur acknowledged that on a few of those red-zone plays, "There were a couple more that we could've been a little more aggressive or heroic with," but stressed he doesn't want interceptions.

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- THat is a lack of trust in your QB to make good decisions!!
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2012/11/cleveland_browns_quarterback_b_3.html#incart_river

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"It just seemed like he locked on to his primary receiver and then he's missing the shallow cross or the drag,"

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That means the coaching staff sees he is not going through his progressions on his passing plays. And that sad thing is that people that comment on this board have said the same thing. During this time off, Weeds would be at the training facility with his receivers, working on progressions and routes. They need a few days off and then alot of practice.

Somebody buy that idiot some velcro shoes before he loses his mind trying to figure out how to tie his shoe laces.


Oh crap never mind it's to late.

Too little.

Too late.

This just in, the Browns slogan, "Unite!" has been replaced with:

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"I'll take full responsibility for all of it."

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Pat Shurmur has been on a professional coaching staff for 14 years and been around the sport for about 25 years.

Even if he didn't make the decisions, he watched others do it around him and has sat through meetings to discuss the results. He has seen things work and seen things blow up.

How many 3rd and 1 plays have been run in the games he coached? 1000, maybe more?

If he has failed to absorb the in-game strategies by now then what the heckwas he doing all that time?
If people like us sitting at home on our couch can immediately say WTF? then why is this a hard thing to learn?
Does being in the thick of it now muddle the mind??

The things is he worked (and learned) under Andy Reid for most of his coaching life. Andy Reid is among the worst gameday managers in the league and the Eagles are usually pretty bad in short yardage situations.

eagles have been a pretty succesful team since our return in 99 correct?
Now add to tht you see what other opposing coaches do that are success , so the better football minds adopt a lot of things they see..the NFL is a copy cat league yet our coach can't duplicate successful sets/plays??

The simple fact that this even has to occur tells me that we are more wrecked up than a Football Bat.

Man, I broke my favorite Football Bat in a poker game.

We just found this out? Or has it grown worse as a cancer each week?

I am for Chilly getting a full boat shot! For Shurm to say Weeden is at fault is lame. YOU take the first chunk of blame, then share leftovers. Five trips and no manna. How is that NOT a good chunk his to own. And spare me the crap about guarantees — HC is the wrong business for absolute secure assurances, especially in the fourth when you punt the whole game. And if you don't want picks, score earlier. About 10 fewer pointless plays that force the defense to perform and adjust might help us find the end zone.

Some of this presser just struck me about how lousy it is for him to tell fans what he wants to correct and clarifications he wants and second guessing after the fact (meaning after the loss). Living in fear is not the way of an offensive coach at any level. Why aren't we playing with more confidence? It is a disease you catch from losing when you know your coaches could have done more to put you in a position to win and prepared you for the opponent, and that when you leave the field you have done all you could to win. But this is crap; how long does it take to dissect and analyze another bad run up the middle? Hats off to the defensive front seven. Hope they get overtime pay.

Call a fast vertical game, Chilly. Open it up some. What are we going to do? Post a loss. I am one fan willing to risk it.

Nice, CalDawg! I am fully willing and ready to give Squirmer all the credit he is do. He should take all the blame. How hot is that seat going into bye week? Might just wanna call around the stadium randomly for ideas on the next play. This approach would give more people to blame for his mangled game management.

The Browns are worse than most at short yardage situations and Shurmur is just mind boggling with his decision making here especially of late. Having a Peyton Hillis for those situations would help most teams but not when everyone knows it is Run over LG or shallow crosses (which are super easy to defend in short yardage).

Really if Shurmur wants to save his job then trust in Chilly. Step back and see if Brad can do what you havent been able to do in a year and a half.

If I am Haslam, I would probably just go ahead and fire Pat for his mental meltdown playcalling last week and promote Dick Jauron to HC. I like Shurmur but he is getting worse and not better.

We need to hire some douches as coaches. I am tired of feeling bad when we fire guys that seem like good guys (Shurmur, Mangini, and Crennel).

If we had a guy like Todd Haley, Rex Ryan, or Tom Cable these firings would be much easier to stomach.

I'm with you, Bard.

That seat must be hot if you're throwing your QB under the bus. Weeden didn't play particularly well, but using that as an excuse is poor form.

If anything, that's a sign that he's losing the locker room (or about to...).

... and he's seriously going to call out Weeden for needing some more heroics? Shurmer has no balls, and he's calling out Weeden for not being more heroic!?

Weeden didnt have it on Sunday. He was uncomfortable, it was obvious and he was just having a bad day. Thankfully you are playing the worst run defense in the league and you have your 1st round RB poised to shred their defense and your offensive line is dominating.

So lets throw it on critical downs? That was just bad decision making and honestly, I think the stress has gotten to Shurmur. He has been bitter with the media, taking shots at the rookie QB. The team is still fighting but the head coaches decision making is hurting this team and I havent been able to say that until the last few weeks, atleast first time since the Bengals game disaster.

I love the fight in this team and maybe Shurmur can take this 2 weeks and recharge his batteries, look at what he is doing wrong and really come back and be better. Key is committing to the run and taking the pressure off of your rookie QB.

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Key is committing to the run and taking the pressure off of your rookie QB.

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Amen Mourg, Amen!

I like Tom Cable...

he had his team playing mean and hard

Weeks 1 through 5 we could try and evaluate what kind of coach Shumur could be.

Now in all honesty we are seeing what kind of coach Shumur is when he knows he is about to be fired.

I think at some point you have to assume knowing you are going to be fired is going to lead to extra-lousy performances.

He also punched one of his assistants and broke his jaw.

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I like Tom Cable...

he had his team playing mean and hard

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Cable's nothing but a thug. I really don't want a guy that actually punched his assistant and broke his jaw. He's Rex Ryan with a little more guff to actually back it up, but I still don't think he's good for a team.

Also agreeing, Oobernoober (that IS fun to type!).

Connect your own dots and it gets worse. Calling out a (STRUGGLING!) rook QB as you "develop" him, and send him lousy plays as part of a lame gameplan week after week, and asking for "heroics" when you can't find the end zone with both hands and help would be laughable if it were some other club and not so sorry and pathetic. So push him to fail more, that will help him down the road. Just on time management of games, timeouts wasted specifically, Squirmer is doing more to make any down & distance or game situation tougher on himself and drags Weeden down further. Inexcusable, but I think a piece of the problem is in your post.

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Shurmur said he and offensive coordinator Brad Childress, who's up in the booth, collaborate on the plays and then Shurmur relays them to Weeden.

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I don't know the math exactly but if you back up the time a QB needs at the line to scan the defense and maybe an adjustment, the time it takes to call the play and break the huddle, the time it takes to get the right personnel on the field after the plays is decided up.. you don't freakin' have time to call plays by committee... You need one guy to make a decision and go with it....

Shurmur just keeps seeming like a control freak to me who can't give up the power...

Actually,it's not his system,it's Mike"s.He was just hired to run it.

Yea we have all of those kids from the college spread, damn why arent we running it?

Just a few general thoughts on the subject.

I have no problem with what Shurmur did in this past game.

#1, the timeouts,

The first timout in the first half, whilst listening to the radio broadcast, .. the ref was calling out a penalty and 8 seconds later the Browns were facing near 0 on the playclock, ... if the Refs don't stop the playclock while announcing a penalty, then that's the leagues fault. ( but what are you gonna do?, we can't expect the Browns to get a fair playing field, because we get no respect.

#2 going for it on 4th and 2,

Well, Pat, you did the right thing,... in the wrong situation, ... the right situation would have been for to do it during one of Dawsons fg tries, which means being past the 50 yd line, that's when you go for it on 4th down.
If I have a problem with him going for it on 4th down this week but expect it two weeks before, then I'd be a hypocryte.

#3, and continue on 2, The streamlined plays.
It's apparent the passing seemed, well it seemed anyway there was one play they called over and over, a passing call where at least two players had deeper routes and two more had routes under them, on... either side, so that, during the 4th and 2 play , well there were two options wide, Little who did not get a catch and another player wider running an identical slant route, and I'm guessing an idential slant on the oppisite side of the field too.

Well the fist play I mentioned above, it was just excuted badly on 3rd and 5 for a catch that set up that 4th and 2. Players have to run to the marker before they get ready for the catch, they have to win the battle at the line of scrimmage.

#4, I have no general problem with Shurmur's comment that he " could have been more agressive on more of those red zone opportunities"
It is just a numbers thing, it is just a number that looks bad, average wise, but it doesn't account for , well the 6 seconds or less on the halftime clock this past game.
And if you look there was at least once more in previous games where a similar gameclock situation would make the right game decision to take the 3 pts just before half, or ...
I'm just not going to blame Shurmur for the 6 for 20 in the red zone, I think it's a team, whole team thing.
Either way, going forward, what can we learn from last weeks game.
1, Shurmur got 105 for Trent Richardson, so he's sticking with the run game, which is a growing point for Shurmur
2. Going for it on 4th down with no choice left, ... well it's right to go for it on 4th down, but hopefully when your past the 50, or at least past your own 40 so the opponent has to get ONE first to be in fg range.

We want to see an agressive team that wins, well you want to blame the coach when the players screw it up and the players when the coaches screw it up.

Well the Receivers really let us down in games excluding last week, and the linebackers too. The quarterback made a bad decision on the 4th and 2 call and on a rollout throw away also in the 4th quarter.
sometimes the opponent just gets an advantage on defense, ( i'm thinking the Borwns weren't expecting zone from Balt on def, in the 4th quarter,)
The tv broadcast was pointing out Weeden not finding the open man, ( easier said than done, and he maybe, probably was rattled from earlier hits and just didn't feel comfortable in the pocket.

The team did not, , or has not gotten the turnovers or been turnover focused on defense like it was in the 1st game of the season, and pre-season.

The oppisite of a 2-7 record , a 7-2 record would be a very VERY good football team,

Which means this is a very VERY, not good football team, ( The whole team)
and EVERYTHING has to get better,the fundamentals the determination.
period.

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If I have a problem with him going for it on 4th down this week but expect it two weeks before, then I'd be a hypocryte.

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Completely different situation dude.