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Maybe the workers feel they are better off looking for another job.
Then quit and let somebody else who might be willing to do the job for less take it.. why take 12,000 non-union people down with you?
I agree that the company was probably about to suffer this fate anyway.. but why be the ones who drive the final nail in the coffin?
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
Quote:
Maybe the workers feel they are better off looking for another job.
Then quit and let somebody else who might be willing to do the job for less take it.. why take 12,000 non-union people down with you?
I agree that the company was probably about to suffer this fate anyway.. but why be the ones who drive the final nail in the coffin?
They didn't have to go down according to their own CEO. He needed help, he needed concessions, he needed the unions to form a partnership with Hostess.. Teamsters agreed, Bakers union didn't
But your right, even if the end game is closing the doors, they could have probably saved their jobs for a few more years anyway. but now,, it's pretty much over unless someone buys up the assets and tells the unions to go to hell.
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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J/C...
I find it almost amusing how many around here have the attitude of "they should take the concessions and look for another job". I don't work for Hostess, never have, but maybe you should take concessions and look for another job in whatever you do. It's so easy to tell others what they should do from a keyboard and this board is great at it.
I have worked for a company before (non-union, problems started in early 2008) - in a job that I loved and could have done forever happily - where little things started to go away... then hours went away... then layoffs... then "reorganization"... then more hours cut... then a $3+ pay cut... then a BIG final layoff. All the while I was looking for another job but nothing worked out.
It never ceases to amaze me how many of you have it all figured out - and love to tell others what to do. This and the Wal-Mart thread are amazing.
btw - Twinkies can go... but I'm crestfallen about no more Strawberry Pies.
"If it weren't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college"
GO ROCKETS
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I heard the broccoli plant was going on strike...better hurry and get some.
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I would never quit unless I found something better or at least close to. At the very least you get unemployment til you find something else. I know I read a few articles where the workers have given in a few times before, and felt this time they couldn't give that much. Say you're making 40k with good benefits. Now a few years later your healthcare is more expensive, you're pension is just about wiped out, and instead of making 40k, you're making 32k. I might be able to manage, because I'm single, and don't have any kids or mortgage. But I could see where that could devastate a family that was use to a better standard of living.
It's just not this board, but plenty of people continue to label union workers as stupid, lazy, and overpaid. You could find those types in any field for that matter.
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They didn't have to go down according to their own CEO. He needed help, he needed concessions, he needed the unions to form a partnership with Hostess..
He got how much bonus money as the company dwindled?
Its a two way street.
The workers are expected to take one for the team, but management has earned pay the company can't afford.
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most of us have been there. and it's not going to work out for everybody. but, it's not going to work out for anybody if everyone is fired on day1, which is what happened.
it's just looking at a terrible situation and trying to find the best path. nothing more. and, having a group of 6K end up deciding the fate for the other 12K that already agreed to the concessions isn't fair either. it's how it works sometimes, but that stinks too.
#gmstrong
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When the economy turned, the company I work for saw a huge decline in profits (Building industry), started laying off people and when they got to the minimum we could run on, they still weren't cutting it. The 2 owners took a paycut to $2500/mo each (yes 30k a year), and then started cutting pay for those of us that remained.
I personally took nearly a 35% cut. About 10% of that was company profit bonuses so I expected that. It was tough at first, but as things got worse in the economy I was thankful to just still be working and able to pay my bills. My wife who is on strictly commision saw a HUGE decrease to the point a couple months she brought home $600 for the month.
Things got really tough for the company, but our bosses are good with money and the company has excellent credit, and we weathered the storm. I'm thankful I stayed and didn't decide to look elsewhere or be forced to.
Things are looking up, business is growing slowly, we are in the black again, and just last month had our best sales since early 2008, still 1/4 of what we were doing during the boom.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Local story on Hostess Quote:
FORT MYERS -
A federal judge is ordering Hostess to "work it out" with the unions. In the meantime, 18,000 people who rely on the company are still out of work and we talked to one local employee who says he's filing for unemployment. But do striking workers qualify?
The area seems to be gray one. But according to Demand Media, who has researched similar situations, every worker could qualify.
From near liquidation to ordered mediation, Hostess employees wonder if they'll get back to work.
"I haven't heard anything since the phone call on Thursday afternoon; but I am expecting to get a letter of termination once everything is finalized," said Hostess employee Ed Natal.
Natal worked at Hostess Brands Inc in Fort Myers for over 10 years. He was one of the more than 15 local employees laid off.
With no money coming in, he and a handful of others turned to Florida Works and unemployment options.
"I filed for unemployment benefits and I am waiting for the answer," Natal said.
In a right to work state, Natal was a voluntary member of the Hostess' baker union. But he stayed on the job and never joined the picket line.
"Those that were working that didn't strike would be entitled to unemployment like myself," he said.
So we wanted to know if everyone at Hostess - union and non-union members – will be eligible to file.
The answer, more than likely, is yes.
According to Demand Media, "Most states pay unemployment if you lose your job due to a lockout resulting from a strike."
A lockout, officials explained, meaning you can no longer work at your job and are technically unemployed.
But companies do have the right to question eligibility. We asked Hostess if it would allow all its employees to file for unemployment.
Officials with the company responded they "can't comment on that at this time."
Hostess and the union will sit down to talk once more. The meeting was prompted by the request of a federal judge.
"We all tend to worry about stuff - especially when you're not employed; but I have faith that something will happen and it will happen real soon," said Natal.
Mediation between Hostess and one of its biggest unions - the Bakery, Confectionery, Tobacco and Grain Millers Union - will take place Tuesday.
LINK
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Quote:
Quote:
They didn't have to go down according to their own CEO. He needed help, he needed concessions, he needed the unions to form a partnership with Hostess..
He got how much bonus money as the company dwindled?
Its a two way street.
The workers are expected to take one for the team, but management has earned pay the company can't afford.
I NEVER SAID THAT,, DO NOT PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH.
it's a two way street, both have to give up something or it doesn't work. But these damn unions want the company CEO's to make no more than they do.
What about the many company CEO's that have said,, I'll forego my salary for a year? What say you to that.,
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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How come no on eis worried about their Ding Dongs?  
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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I heard the broccoli plant was going on strike...better hurry and get some.
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How come no on eis worried about their Ding Dongs?
Too busy with their Ho-Ho's.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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J/C...
I find it almost amusing how many around here have the attitude of "they should take the concessions and look for another job". I don't work for Hostess, never have, but maybe you should take concessions and look for another job in whatever you do. It's so easy to tell others what they should do from a keyboard and this board is great at it.
I have worked for a company before (non-union, problems started in early 2008) - in a job that I loved and could have done forever happily - where little things started to go away... then hours went away... then layoffs... then "reorganization"... then more hours cut... then a $3+ pay cut... then a BIG final layoff. All the while I was looking for another job but nothing worked out.
It never ceases to amaze me how many of you have it all figured out - and love to tell others what to do. This and the Wal-Mart thread are amazing.
Do you think ownership or management was raping the company or do you think that maybe they needed to make cuts to stay viable? Its unfortunate it didn't work out for you, BUT YOU SAY YOU WERE LOOKING JUST LIKE MOST HERE ARE SAYING! You didn't quit and go looking. That's all they are saying here. Take the cuts or eat cat food for the rest of your life .... or take the cuts and work and start job hunting while getting a paycheck. It may not work, but at least you aren't eating cat food.
But these idiots go scorched Earth policy and put everyone out since they didn't get theirs. Its the way of this country anymore. Score a big point for the Union. 18,000 unemployed!! That will show those evil business owners. We will get Twinkies again...unfortunately they'll be made by foreigners.
"My signature line goes here."
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I heard something like 600 Hostess drivers in NE Ohio alone are now unemployed because of the strike, and ensuing shutdown.
I don't know how many in Ohio overall. I also don't know for sure whether or not Hostess has any baking facilities in Ohio.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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When the economy turned, the company I work for saw a huge decline in profits (Building industry), started laying off people and when they got to the minimum we could run on, they still weren't cutting it. The 2 owners took a paycut to $2500/mo each (yes 30k a year), and then started cutting pay for those of us that remained.
On the other hand - Hostess is planning to give $1.75M in bonuses to it's top 19 executives as part of it's liquidation ($92k/person on average)
Earlier this year, (when everybody knew the company was failing) - Hostess increased the salary of it's chief executive from $750k/year to $2.5M/year, and gave 9 other executives pay raises between $90k/year and $400k/year
http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/11/19/1215811/hostess-executive-bonuses/
Last edited by Lyuokdea; 11/20/12 05:04 PM.
~Lyuokdea
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Quote:
Quote:
When the economy turned, the company I work for saw a huge decline in profits (Building industry), started laying off people and when they got to the minimum we could run on, they still weren't cutting it. The 2 owners took a paycut to $2500/mo each (yes 30k a year), and then started cutting pay for those of us that remained.
On the other hand - Hostess is planning to give $1.75M in bonuses to it's top 19 executives as part of it's liquidation ($92k/person on average)
Earlier this year, (when everybody knew the company was failing) - Hostess increased the salary of it's chief executive from $750k/year to $2.5M/year, and gave 9 other executives pay raises between $90k/year and $400k/year
http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/11/19/1215811/hostess-executive-bonuses/
While that is ugly and abhorrent, that is hardly enough to tank a company that large. That is NOT the reason the company is in trouble.
I am surprised that the bankruptcy courts are allowing the bonuses as part of the liquidations.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Why wouldn't they just reduce their salaries by 8%? Isn't that better than not having a job?Oh yeah, that's right, because closing was a foregone conclusion so they figured they'd milk the teat for all it was worth until they had to close down. Now the union folks have given them a convenient alibi to throw up their hands and say "we tried, it's their fault" instead of just owning up to having a failed business they knew they had no shot of saving.
Maybe if I was smart enough to read Ayn Rand's "tome" (lol) I'd understand the business savvy move this really is.
Last edited by clevesteve; 11/20/12 09:35 PM.
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i agree the top executives should be in line for paycuts to keep this thing going too. no bonuses, etc.
it definitely should cut both ways.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
While that is ugly and abhorrent, that is hardly enough to tank a company that large. That is NOT the reason the company is in trouble.
I am surprised that the bankruptcy courts are allowing the bonuses as part of the liquidations.
Sort of true - though in this case, there were only 5k striking employees. Rolling back those bonuses for the execs gives them a ~1.5% pay increase per person (assuming their total benefits amount to about 50k/person/year.) That's not huge, but this thing was apparently close to passing, and a 18% pay reduction sounds better than 20% cuts.
More importantly though, the motion of cutting executive pay and giving some back to the employees could have made a more important statement that would have got them to sign on.
I'm not saying the executives have to always give up pay raises - but it wasn't that only one side wasn't interested in negotiating.
Maybe both sides just knew Hostess was doomed, and they were both trying to get as much as they could before the castle walls fell.
~Lyuokdea
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Maybe both sides just knew Hostess was doomed, and they were both trying to get as much as they could before the castle walls fell.
When the castle is burning, grab all the loot you can on the way out the door.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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When the castle is burning, grab all the loot you can on the way out the door.
Exactly.
~Lyuokdea
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I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Moon pies and a yoohoo... the official breakfast of the south.. and the single biggest reason the SEC is as good as it is. 
yebat' Putin
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Just clicking
Just caught a glimpse of the news this morning.. I was almost sure I heard that they are planning on selling off the product line and name to another company. If that's the case, then it will be what I predicted, Hostess Twinkies and the rest of the product line will continue and some of the 18,500 people will either find work with the new company or be out on the streets..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Not necessarily. It will depend on what the bankruptcy court.determines and what type of language was in the union contract. If you buy a company, you are buying their contracts and debts too.
King
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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Quote:
SARASOTA COUNTY -
A Sarasota company wants to rescue the Hostess brand.
Hurst Capital LLLP. filed paperwork with a bankruptcy court in New York stating it plans to make a multi-million dollar bid to buy the brands and assets of Hostess, the bankrupt baker of iconic goodies like Twinkies, Ding Dongs, Ho Hos and Wonder BRead.
The local investment company is headed by 26-year-old twins Austin and Zach Hurst who believe they can use technology and social media to revive the brand.
Hostess brands announced last week they would liquidate the company, laying off more than 18,000 people and shutting down plants in 22 states.
LINK
Tech and social media to revive the brand? I don't think the brand is the problem. Sounds like 2 kids with more money than brains. or they know they have no shot, but it was a chance to get their new upstart Hurst Capital name in the national media.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Quote:
Quote:
SARASOTA COUNTY -
A Sarasota company wants to rescue the Hostess brand.
Hurst Capital LLLP. filed paperwork with a bankruptcy court in New York stating it plans to make a multi-million dollar bid to buy the brands and assets of Hostess, the bankrupt baker of iconic goodies like Twinkies, Ding Dongs, Ho Hos and Wonder BRead.
The local investment company is headed by 26-year-old twins Austin and Zach Hurst who believe they can use technology and social media to revive the brand.
Hostess brands announced last week they would liquidate the company, laying off more than 18,000 people and shutting down plants in 22 states.
LINK
Tech and social media to revive the brand? I don't think the brand is the problem. Sounds like 2 kids with more money than brains. or they know they have no shot, but it was a chance to get their new upstart Hurst Capital name in the national media.
Investment capital firm -- they likely intend to use social media and technology to pump up the perceived value of the company, perhaps even make it somewhat profitable, then unload it for a tidy profit. I doubt that they intend to permanently get into the cupcake business.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I agree, my point was...Is Hostess really a struggle brand NAME? Everyone knows Hostess, the brand. That's not what the problem is with the company.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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I agree, my point was...Is Hostess really a struggle brand NAME? Everyone knows Hostess, the brand. That's not what the problem is with the company.
I think they may be thinking that with the use of social media, they can capitalize upon the current upsurge in popularity - and perhaps may even be thinking that they can REALLY increase marketing and social media efforts in Colorado and Washington.
Add in that it'll be a new company, with no union ties/contracts, and non of Hostess' current baggage, they can probably become really profitable really quickly.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Not necessarily. It will depend on what the bankruptcy court.determines and what type of language was in the union contract. If you buy a company, you are buying their contracts and debts too.
King
Not really,, you can buy intellectual property as well as real property without buying the company debts or union contracts.
In the end, the unions don't own the company,, the union workers don't own the company. bottom line, Twinkies DO belong to the company. it's an asset..
Now, how the money they receive for it gets divided up, that seems destined to be determined by the courts.. I'd suspect that there will be lawsuits and that money will go to pay for those after all debts are paid.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Not necessarily. It will depend on what the bankruptcy court.determines and what type of language was in the union contract. If you buy a company, you are buying their contracts and debts too.
King
If the company is sold, yes, you are correct.
If the company enters into liquidation and sells brands and assets, then no - no debts or contracts carry forward. Those are dissolved in bankruptcy and the proceeds from the asset sales go to pay off creditors and shareholders.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... No More Twinkies?
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